[Article] Government abolishing 457 visas, Malcolm Turnbull says

ambasite

"We are an immigration nation, but the fact remains: Australian workers must have priority for Australian jobs," he said.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-04-18/government-abolishing-457-visas/8450310

stickman1019

Good idea in theory but looks like a re-badging. They have tried to re-form this visa a few times nothing ever seems to do the trick really.

Worried a bit, I'm doing a PhD in science and was planning on going to Australia for a postdoc. Unclear yet if proposed changes would affect me but it seems like it would so far...

catbear

stickman1019 wrote: »

Good idea in theory but looks like a re-badging. They have tried to re-form this visa a few times nothing ever seems to do the trick really.

That was my initial thought too but police clearance and work experience checks are involved too.

From contacts still in WA the job market has gotten really tight so it's a good move politically.

stickman1019

Look I think they have tried to implement reforms previously like the labour market testing and advertising for Australians Only first.
I have a feeling like the previous measures they will be very easy to get around and to find loop holes in. 
+1 for the Police clearance. Work experience I can see the holes in that straight away false work experience and the like.

Yours contacts in WA are right; the WA economy is not in a good space at the moment housing market is still on the way down and employment is on the rise with city wages going back to pre-boom levels for a lot of professions.

Hey piratequeen were you hoping to come on a 457 (Reserch based) or utilizing a student visa?

mandrake04

catbear wrote: »

That was my initial thought too but police clearance and work experience checks are involved too.

From contacts still in WA the job market has gotten really tight so it's a good move politically.

Also a tougher transition to residency, removing the pot of gold from the end of the 457 visa rainbow is what would have fixed all the problems years ago.

In fairness in the last 8 years the whole 457 process was a joke, great to see it replaced with something with some integrity.

jackbhoy

stickman1019 wrote: »

Look I think they have tried to implement reforms previously like the labour market testing and advertising for Australians Only first.
I have a feeling like the previous measures they will be very easy to get around and to find loop holes in. 
+1 for the Police clearance. Work experience I can see the holes in that straight away false work experience and the like.

Yours contacts in WA are right; the WA economy is not in a good space at the moment housing market is still on the way down and employment is on the rise with city wages going back to pre-boom levels for a lot of professions.

Hey piratequeen were you hoping to come on a 457 (Reserch based) or utilizing a student visa?

The big change for me is their plan to have ATO cross ref TFN details on 457 with income. This alone would stop most of the rorting where companies sponsor people to do X (e.g. Chef, Manager) and then they actually do Y (wash dishes, drive a taxi). Apparently if taxable income does not match market rate for that 457 job class they will get a please explain from BP.
Personally I agree with stopping some of the ridiculous rorts around 457 and student visas but the rhetoric around this one smacks of populism and Trumble and Dutton trying to swing the right of their party and Pauline mob back to their side.

jackbhoy

Deleted User wrote: »

Worried a bit, I'm doing a PhD in science and was planning on going to Australia for a postdoc. Unclear yet if proposed changes would affect me but it seems like it would so far...

I don't think this would be a major (new) blocker. The biggest issue will be small number of post-doc vacancies and large number of grads looking to fill them, both domestically and international. My partner is doing one here but she completed her Phd in Aus so probably helped a lot.

MarkY91

I plan to go for 2 years. My uncle said it won't affect me. Only people looking to stay for over 2 years

artemis268

This is great news. Australia should take care of its own first.

stickman1019

stickman1019 wrote: »

Look I think they have tried to implement reforms previously like the labour market testing and advertising for Australians Only first.
I have a feeling like the previous measures they will be very easy to get around and to find loop holes in. 
+1 for the Police clearance. Work experience I can see the holes in that straight away false work experience and the like.

Yours contacts in WA are right; the WA economy is not in a good space at the moment housing market is still on the way down and employment is on the rise with city wages going back to pre-boom levels for a lot of professions.

Hey piratequeen were you hoping to come on a 457 (Reserch based) or utilizing a student visa?

A 457, I think. I'll be finished my PhD next year so no longer a student, afaik the most common visa used for postdoctoral researchers was the 457.

jackbhoy

jackbhoy wrote: »

I don't think this would be a major (new) blocker. The biggest issue will be small number of post-doc vacancies and large number of grads looking to fill them, both domestically and international. My partner is doing one here but she completed her Phd in Aus so probably helped a lot.

Yeah the competition is a problem everywhere, of course! I have a few connections over there already and was hoping on sorting out a position that way rather than applying for open calls, but depending on how strict they are with the policy of advertising jobs to Australians first that might not be possible? It's unclear yet whether PhD years will count in lieu of work experience as they did under the 457, too.

ChikiChiki

Im currently on a WHV the last 3 months in Sydney but would be looking to stay in Oz longer than the two years. This is a concern but I will just have to work a bit harder. Really don't want to return home for a while.

Interesting to note NZ have effectively done the same today.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/19/new-zealand-restricts-skilled-worker-visas-in-kiwis-first-approach-to-immigration

jackbhoy

Deleted User wrote: »

jackbhoy wrote: »

I don't think this would be a major (new) blocker. The biggest issue will be small number of post-doc vacancies and large number of grads looking to fill them, both domestically and international. My partner is doing one here but she completed her Phd in Aus so probably helped a lot.

Yeah the competition is a problem everywhere, of course! I have a few connections over there already and was hoping on sorting out a position that way rather than applying for open calls, but depending on how strict they are with the policy of advertising jobs to Australians first that might not be possible? It's unclear yet whether PhD years will count in lieu of work experience as they did under the 457, too.

If you have contacts that will be far more fruitful than going through front door once a role is advertised. My partner spoke to the research group here while she was back in Dublin working in industry as her research was very closely aligned. She ended up getting support from Prof. here for PhD scholarship, would never have happened without that previous relationship. Competition is fierce here but would suggest making contacts in groups that are quite aligned to your research area.

Australian Unis have a huge cash cow in international students, mostly from Asia. Many of them use that as a pathway to PR and Unis are very willing to take their $$$ and spoon feed them through degrees and post grad programmes. Will be interesting to see if this changes as well or if 457 changes impact job prospects for some of those.
When you apply for postdoc it is likely most of competition will be from these guys rather than Aussie citizens so it might not be as big a disadvantage as other job types. Good luck anyway.

rightyabe

See Malcolm Turnbull is trying to increase the number of years you need to be a PR to get citizenship from 1 year to 4 years..could come in today?

aido79

rightyabe wrote: »

See Malcolm Turnbull is trying to increase the number of years you need to be a PR to get citizenship from 1 year to 4 years..could come in today?

Yeah looks like it might be coming in from today according to this:

http://www.border.gov.au/ReportsandPublications/Documents/discussion-papers/citizenship-paper.pdf

"The Government will introduce new citizenship related legislation into the
Parliament, informed by responses to this paper, by the end of 2017.
The package of reforms will apply to applications received on or after the
Government's announcement on 20 April 2017."

If so I'll have to wait until next year to apply even though I've been here for 9 years already. I'm sure I'll be much better citizen by then.

rightyabe

Yeah I'm just 4 weeks off applying..now it's 3 years and 4 weeks..fml

Chocolate fiend

rightyabe wrote: »

Yeah I'm just 4 weeks off applying..now it's 3 years and 4 weeks..fml

19 days off applying here

rightyabe

Reading on pomsinoz some say maybe those already on PR might not be affected..only gossip yet but seems harsh on poor folk like me waiting a few weeks. Lol

Cake Man

Chocolate fiend wrote: »

19 days off applying here

3 weeks myself, I'm fcuking sick

Noo

rightyabe wrote: »

See Malcolm Turnbull is trying to increase the number of years you need to be a PR to get citizenship from 1 year to 4 years..could come in today?

Ugh what! Thats a pain in the ass! I'll be in Australia 10 years before I qualify!

catbear

All the existing visa users shouldn't be affected.

rightyabe

Bloody oath we shouldn't be:)

stickman1019

read conflicting stories in the media Is this effective immediately if so very harsh!!

catbear

stickman1019 wrote: »

read conflicting stories in the media Is this effective immediately if so very harsh!!

I read that it was effective for all new applicants for the new 457 (whatever it's called) but the existing arrangements would be grandfathered.

Morshlac

shi*e news.....most people i know over have already got the citizenship but my brother for instance is on 457 and eligible to apply for PR in a couple of months.

I'm assuming he can still apply for PR but he'd have to wait another 4 years to be eligible for citizenship so be there for 8 years total before could apply

Chocolate fiend

rightyabe wrote: »

Bloody oath we shouldn't be:)

I'll be well salty if we are :-)

jackbhoy

rightyabe wrote: »

Bloody oath we shouldn't be:)

Now you just need to demonstrate "Australian values"; whatever the fark that means. Malcolm has sold his soul for short-term political gain. Dutton is just a thick Queensland copper so expect nothing better but this populist xenophobia from Turnbull is so disappointing.

Chocolate fiend

jackbhoy wrote: »

Now you just need to demonstrate "Australian values"; whatever the fark that means. Malcolm has sold his soul for short-term political gain. Dutton is just a thick Queensland copper so expect nothing better but this populist xenophobia from Turnbull is so disappointing.

One of the new sample questions is:
When is it acceptable to strike your spouse?

rightyabe

Chocolate fiend wrote: »

One of the new sample questions is:
When is it acceptable to strike your spouse?

Obviously only when your two goon bags down and she's off her leash..

Peregrinus

Well, I'm reminded of the multiple-choice test I had to take when exchanging my Irish licence for a WA licence. The questions were along the line of

Q. You are driving along when you drop your lighted cigaretted into your lap and set your trousers on fire. Do you:

(a) . . . scream, panic and steer into oncoming traffic?

(b) . . . extinguish the fire by emptying your gin-and-tonic onto it?

(c) . . . slow down and stop as soon as it is safe to do so?

You didn't need to have spent too much time studying the Rules of the Road to work out which answer was the acceptable one.

And it will be the same with this extended citizenship test. Even the existing test functions mainly as an English language test; success in the test is closely correlated with linguistic background. This extension of the test won't change anything. The notion that you can test whether someone embraces "Australian values" (or any values) by asking questions like this is too silly to bother refuting.

rightyabe

Yeah sure anyone can tick the box that is the "right answer" but that doesn't mean they will follow what it says...

Also heard a interview Peter Dutton did on triple J and he was asked what are Australian values..he said the usual old crap bull **** answer...blaa blaa blaa and the interviewer said basically aren't they they values of every other westernised nation..

brandnewaward

Well I've got a massive Rabbitohs tattoo on my forearm , thats my Australian values and integration into the community proved..... I should get my passport handed to me personally by Turnbull

Noo

New citizenship legislation in front of parliment this week, lets see how this goes...

AngryHippie

It sounds like the labour shadow cabinet are dead set against the level 6 english and a few of the other developments Dutton is proposing.

He's a goon anyway. don't be surprised if the amendment falls over