Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

SteM

pjohnson wrote: »

Note to self mind peoples sensitivities they take offence ridiculously fast.

Oh, you're one of those lads. I get it.

Lord TSC

bucketybuck wrote: »

Did I miss a few months or something, isn't it still just one week since our season ended? Isn't everybody in football chilling on a beach somewhere?

We could wait another month before making a move and still claim that we got our business done early, so never mind the twitter rubbish and calm the jets.

By the way, pep might be linked with dozens of players but I don't see any of their new players holding scarves at a press conference, do you?

While I agree with you, City have Silva offically confirmed, and Benfica have officially confirmed Ederson as well.

Mind, City are potentially more desperate than us to get their stuff done early too, given Pep had such a bad season for him....

RobertKK

Lord TSC wrote: »

IlL say this.

The timing between the announcement of the transfer ban, and the speed we got this briefing out makes me belief that United were prepared for this eventuality. I'd imagine that the short window between the two means Griezmann was upfront about this option early, so I'm hoping it's not coming as a surprise to the club. A disappointment, sure, but not a surprise.

Ducker saying we are monitoring Ronaldo, but my guess is that's just playing off the interview last night.

With Rooney most likely leaving, Ronaldo only needs 119 goals to become the top scorer at United ever if he did return.
There were claims he was interested in a return in 2013, but with Fergie retiring it changed his opinion.

It is very unlikely, unless Real Madrid want to spend really big and see Ronaldo as being on his last legs in terms of a massive transfer fee.

pjohnson

bucketybuck wrote: »

Did I miss a few months or something, isn't it still just one week since our season ended? Isn't everybody in football chilling on a beach somewhere?

We could wait another month before making a move and still claim that we got our business done early, so never mind the twitter rubbish and calm the jets.

By the way, pep might be linked with dozens of players but I don't see any of their new players holding scarves at a press conference, do you?

I believe Bernardo was presented his jersey rather than a scarf.

Cantona's Collars

astradave wrote: »

Every Journalist reporting we have cooled interest now, AM might not be playing ball with accepting the fee instead of the release clause.

Definitely briefed.Griezmann does seem at odds with José having a 'classic CF' in his teams and I can't see him changing his policy to accommodate Griezmann.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

While I agree with you, City have Silva offically confirmed, and Benfica have officially confirmed Ederson as well.

Mind, City are potentially more desperate than us to get their stuff done early too, given Pep had such a bad season for him....

City are highly unusual in having such big level activity done already. Sure, I would love United to have already announced Greizmann, Bellotti, Lindhoff and Fabianho - but with just 7 days having passed since our last game i'm not surprised we haven't.

Mitch Connor

zerks wrote: »

Definitely briefed.Griezmann does seem at odds with José having a 'classic CF' in his teams and I can't see him changing his policy to accommodate Griezmann.

Maybe Greizmann was planned to play from the wings rather than through the centre - or off a central striker.

It never seemed likely to me that we wanted AG as a direct replacement for Ibrahimovic as a lone striker. Not sure why some people assume it had to be that, either.

yabadabado

I can't believe there isn't more talk of Lukaku.He fits the bill of what is needed in attack and is a realistic signing.
Everton want 100m but anything around 60m is a good deal for both sides.He won't sign a new deal so is only going to lose value if Everton hold onto him.
I would be delighted if he was the big signing of the summer tbh.

Pro. F

bangkok wrote: »

A lot of united fans would be happy to give romero a chance in goals if de gea left. Romero is not top quality. Yet the same fans woulnt be happy for rashford to be our no1 striker. Strikers and midfielders win games simple as that. Scoring goals is the hardest thing to do in football hence why they go for the most money.

Why should I care what a lot of United fans think?

Goalkeepers win games a lot more than midfielders do. They are directly involved in the number of goals conceded. Midfielders are not directly involved in the number of goals scored or conceded.

Lord TSC

yabadabado wrote: »

I can't believe there isn't more talk of Lukaku.He fits the bill of what is needed in attack and is a realistic signing.
Everton want 100m but anything around 60m is a good deal for both sides.He won't sign a new deal so is only going to lose value if Everton hold onto him.
I would be delighted if he was the big signing of the summer tbh.

If we could only get one player, Lukaku would be it for me.

bucketybuck

bangkok wrote: »

A lot of united fans would be happy to give romero a chance in goals if de gea left. Romero is not top quality. Yet the same fans woulnt be happy for rashford to be our no1 striker.

Romero is 30 and had 12 clean sheets and zero defeats from 18 games he played. Thats good.

Rashford is 19 and had 5 league goals from 35 games played. Thats bad.

Should I explain further?

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

If we could only get one player, Lukaku would be it for me.

Kane. Neymar. Greizmann. Can think of a few that would come before Lukaku. Great goalscorer but lacks the link up game imo. Doesn't bring others into the game well.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Kane. Neymar. Greizmann. Can think of a few that would come before Lukaku. Great goalscorer but lacks the link up game imo. Doesn't bring others into the game well.

I don't even consider Kane or Neymar tbh, because I think they are unobtainable. If we go down that route, I'd put Messi and Ronaldo above them. Griezmann, sadly, looks unobtainable too.

Imo, we need a goal scorer and I think Lukaku has a proven track record of scoring goals, and in a far inferior team to Kane too. I genuinely would choose Lukaku over Kane right now, given all factors involved.

bangkok

Pro. F wrote: »

Why should I care what a lot of United fans think?

Goalkeepers win games a lot more than midfielders do. They are directly involved in the number of goals conceded. Midfielders are not directly involved in the number of goals scored or conceded.

Cant agree with that.

For example chelsea this season, you are trying to tell me courtouis won more games for chelsea than kante did or navas won more games for madrid than kroos did? Simply not true

pjohnson

Lord TSC wrote: »

I don't even consider Kane or Neymar tbh, because I think they are unobtainable. If we go down that route, I'd put Messi and Ronaldo above them. Griezmann, sadly, looks unobtainable too.

Imo, we need a goal scorer and I think Lukaku has a proven track record of scoring goals, and in a far inferior team to Kane too. I genuinely would choose Lukaku over Kane right now, given all factors involved.

If we do pick Lukaku I fully expect we need to endure more whinging and moaning over our style of play.

Pro. F

bangkok wrote: »

Cant agree with that.

For example chelsea this season, you are trying to tell me courtouis won more games for chelsea than kante did or navas won more games for madrid than kroos did? Simply not true

Almost certainly. Replace those 'keepers with journeymen and their results would suffer a lot more than if you did the same with those midfielders.

pjohnson

bangkok wrote: »

Cant agree with that.

For example chelsea this season, you are trying to tell me courtouis won more games for chelsea than kante did or navas won more games for madrid than kroos did? Simply not true

I believe Ian Holloway had the same mindset as you and he got relegated.

Giggsy11

pjohnson wrote: »

If we do pick Lukaku I fully expect we need to endure more whinging and moaning over our style of play.

Lukaku is not crouch, he can dribble and when one on one with CB he is very dangerous with his pace and strength.

Cantona's Collars

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Maybe Greizmann was planned to play from the wings rather than through the centre - or off a central striker.

It never seemed likely to me that we wanted AG as a direct replacement for Ibrahimovic as a lone striker. Not sure why some people assume it had to be that, either.

It would be an odd one seeing as we have other's for that position. The bones of €100 million and still Jose would want a big CF.

bangkok

Pro. F wrote: »

Almost certainly. Replace those 'keepers with journeymen and their results would suffer a lot more than if you did the same with those midfielders.

I wouldnt consider navas world class anyway. Kasper schmeichel in goals they still win the league. Take out kroos and put in someone like fellaini they lose the league and are not in champ league final

sReq | uTeK

Pro. F wrote: »

Why should I care what a lot of United fans think?

Goalkeepers win games a lot more than midfielders do. They are directly involved in the number of goals conceded. Midfielders are not directly involved in the number of goals scored or conceded.

Did you overlook the assists metric? Or the Like of Deli Ali and Frank Lampard and their goals contribution.

Every position is just as important as the next, however it varies wildly on the team and managers style of play.

HigginsJ

Pro. F wrote: »

I very much doubt there'd be 10-12 'keepers we could sign who'd be good enough. I know that that is how it's commonly perceived, but it seems the opposite to me. I think people just worry unnecessarily about the quality of strikers and incorrectly assume that 'keepers are good enough. When you look at the top teams you rarely see them with strikers that aren't good enough, but it's more often the case that their 'keepers aren't of the required quality.

Thats fair enough but I would think that there are enough good ones out there that are not already at top clubs for us not to have to worry unduly.

Aside from Agentina's 1st choice keeper, I would be confident in any of Oblak, Leno, Navas, Handanovic, Donnarumma, Muslera or Schmeichel starting in goals for us.

I'm sure there are others that I am forgetting who would be ready to step in & while DDG is undoubtedly in the top 2 in the world I don't think the drop off is such that it would be that huge of a difference. That being said I would hate to lose DDG, it would be great to think that he could stay at the club for the next decade but for me it is a matter of when not if he goes home.

One keeper that I would love us to sign is Mattia Perrin. I think he is great and if it were not for Donnarumma I think he would be the new Italy number 1 (in 40 years time when Buffon hangs them up).

I just don't see the depth there in goal scorers at the moment.

Pro. F

bangkok wrote: »

I wouldnt consider navas world class anyway. Kasper schmeichel in goals they still win the league. Take out kroos and put in someone like fellaini they lose the league and are not in champ league final

I disagree with every idea and reference in this post.

RockSalto

GSPfan wrote: »

Clears the way for another whopper transfer deal somewhere else too.

Gareth Bale, come on down!

Yeah, but don't hurt your back on the way down, Gareth!!

Nalz

Pro. F wrote: »

I disagree with every idea and reference in this post.

The replace with Schmeichel comment may not be the worst thing I've ever heard.


Imo

duffman13

People comparing ourselves to city for transfers are mad. United had a final to contend with that was going to hugely impact our summer buying. City had there season wrapped up 3 weeks ago basically and could actively start approaching players.

If we rock around to 1st of July and we haven't got two signings of be a little worried. City are an unusual case, if it's to be believed they could be looking to sign upwards of 8 players, they need to work incredibly fast!

bangkok

Nalz wrote: »

The replace with Schmeichel comment may not be the worst thing I've ever heard.


Imo

You could have put the majority of good keepers in goals for barca when they had that class team with xavi inestia messi etc and they still would have dominated

Pro. F

Nalz wrote: »

The replace with Schmeichel comment may not be the worst thing I've ever heard.


Imo

I disagree with the idea that Schmeichal isn't an excellent 'keeper. And the use of the term "world class" to differentiate amongst players is meaningless.

Pro. F

bangkok wrote: »

You could have put the majority of good keepers in goals for barca when they had that class team with xavi inestia messi etc and they still would have dominated

Pointing to one of the greatest collection of outfield players that has ever been assembled doesn't help your argument to be fair.

Pro. F

HigginsJ wrote: »

Thats fair enough but I would think that there are enough good ones out there that are not already at top clubs for us not to have to worry unduly.

Aside from Agentina's 1st choice keeper, I would be confident in any of Oblak, Leno, Navas, Handanovic, Donnarumma, Muslera or Schmeichel starting in goals for us.

I'm sure there are others that I am forgetting who would be ready to step in & while DDG is undoubtedly in the top 2 in the world I don't think the drop off is such that it would be that huge of a difference. That being said I would hate to lose DDG, it would be great to think that he could stay at the club for the next decade but for me it is a matter of when not if he goes home.

One keeper that I would love us to sign is Mattia Perrin. I think he is great and if it were not for Donnarumma I think he would be the new Italy number 1 (in 40 years time when Buffon hangs them up).

I just don't see the depth there in goal scorers at the moment.

Good list of goalies. But it's easy enough to make a similar list of strikers who would do the job: Lukaku, Belotti, Immobile, Dost, Benteke, Morata, Andre Silva. And that's without including other strikers who'd score enough but might not fit our style playing as CF: Mbappe, Griezmann, Werner, Aubameyang, Icardi.

ericzeking

If the keeper f*cks up it is nearly always a goal. If anyone else on the field f*cks up there is at the very least a goalkeeper to pick up the slack. The importance of the job has been underestimated since time began.

Another point, if DDG goes, we don't necessarily need the flashiest most technically gifted keeper to replace him. We need someone who has the mentality to cope with immense pressure and can keep his concentration to make just a couple of saves when it really matters, he aint gonna be battered with shots week in week out.
In that sense I think Goalkeeper is one position where fans will be p!ssing into the wind even more when it comes to making suggestions of who to sign.

Remember Eric Steeles reports on the young DDG...he went to matches to watch what he was doing when the ball was up the field, to see how he carried himself, how he responded to different scenarios, good and bad.

darrenw5O94

Sky Sports are reporting that United have cooled their interest in Griezmann

pjohnson

Fletch set to leave WBA for Stoke. Really nice to see Fletcher come back so strong from his illness.

HigginsJ

Pro. F wrote: »

Good list of goalies. But it's easy enough to make a similar list of strikers who would do the job: Lukaku, Belotti, Immobile, Dost, Benteke, Morata, Andre Silva. And that's without including other strikers who'd score enough but might not fit our style playing as CF: Mbappe, Griezmann, Werner, Aubameyang, Icardi.

Could be just me but I'd have more faith in the keeper transferring his ability than some of those strikers, that being said we have had some pretty poor keeping in the last 25 years when the keeper wasn't Schmeichel, VDS or DDG, which backs up ericzeking point about the mental side of the game.

I'd still be more confident in one of the keepers listed to come in and replace DDG than the strikers listed (outside of Lukaku, Griezmann & Kane) being able to replace Ibra's production.

Mitch Connor

ericzeking wrote: »

If the keeper f*cks up it is nearly always a goal. If anyone else on the field f*cks up there is at the very least a goalkeeper to pick up the slack. The importance of the job has been underestimated since time began.

Most keepers should not fcuk up though. Most PL level keepers won't, unless they are suffering confidence/form issues. There will be exceptions but you should be able to rely on your keeper to be *solid* at least.

What separates the absolute best keepers isn't that they don't fcuk up - its that they pull off saves you couldn't expect them to and stop goals that *should* have gone in.

DDGs save vs Chelsea (Mata free kick) for example is a big one that comes to mind. Conceding that wouldn't have been a fcuk up - DDG saving it was the difference a world class keeper makes.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/JamesRobsonMEN/status/870274073850413056

https://twitter.com/JamesRobsonMEN/status/870274467641032704

Very pessimistic from MEN.

And now we have contacted Lukaku..... According to this fella.

https://twitter.com/Malachians/status/870279868772081664

Mitch Connor

IMO we needed Greizmann to improve our attacking play - movement, creativity, interplay etc. Replacing Ibrahimovic with a traditional number 9 and not getting Griezmann (or similar) to help alter the attacking play will not help United to improve to the required level, imo.

I'd be happier with Martial, Rashford, Griezmann leading the line next season than Rashford, Lukaku, Mata - for example. I'd fear a similar style of attack which just didn't prove good enough - particularly at the end of the season imo.

DM_7

Lukaku and Perisic instead of Ibra and Griezemann?

TheDoc

Pro. F wrote: »

I very much doubt there'd be 10-12 'keepers we could sign who'd be good enough. I know that that is how it's commonly perceived, but it seems the opposite to me. I think people just worry unnecessarily about the quality of strikers and incorrectly assume that 'keepers are good enough. When you look at the top teams you rarely see them with strikers that aren't good enough, but it's more often the case that their 'keepers aren't of the required quality.

Much harder to find a great keeper then a great striker imo.

While De Gea is a really, REALLY good goalkeeper, he is nowhere near the all time greats. Like nowhere near. Nor is Neuer.

There has been a change in the new wave of goalkeepers, that as a former goalkeeper, is a bit upsetting. But if a more "old method" keeper crops up again, he still stand out massively. If Gianluigi Donnarumma keeps up, he will be the best of the lot, and proper brilliant.

Billy86

pjohnson wrote: »

Fletch set to leave WBA for Stoke. Really nice to see Fletcher come back so strong from his illness.

Definitely. Been a fan of his even back when everyone hated him (when he played in the three man midfield with Keane and Scholes), was such a pity what happened to him only a little after he really began to come good but he's such a typical 'Fergie' player - low profile, hard working, excellent pro, no ego issues, and it's great to see him back in full swing. He hasn't missed a single league game in either of the last two seasons!

jayo26

In no way should our forwards be weaker then last year a striker and a wide player should be priority before even looking at midfield or defence.

bangkok

TheDoc wrote: »

Much harder to find a great keeper then a great striker imo.

While De Gea is a really, REALLY good goalkeeper, he is nowhere near the all time greats. Like nowhere near. Nor is Neuer.

There has been a change in the new wave of goalkeepers, that as a former goalkeeper, is a bit upsetting. But if a more "old method" keeper crops up again, he still stand out massively. If Gianluigi Donnarumma keeps up, he will be the best of the lot, and proper brilliant.

Neuer and de dea would be world class keepers in any era

HigginsJ

TheDoc wrote: »

Much harder to find a great keeper then a great striker imo.

While De Gea is a really, REALLY good goalkeeper, he is nowhere near the all time greats. Like nowhere near. Nor is Neuer.

There has been a change in the new wave of goalkeepers, that as a former goalkeeper, is a bit upsetting. But if a more "old method" keeper crops up again, he still stand out massively. If Gianluigi Donnarumma keeps up, he will be the best of the lot, and proper brilliant.

Who do you class as all time greats? And what do you mean by "old method". Players will change with the times and the laws of the games now are much different to back in the era. At this point in time DDG & Neuer are the 2 best and Buffon is probably still not a million miles away despite his age. That is all that can be really judged.

Billy86

bangkok wrote: »

Neuer and de dea would be world class keepers in any era

Absolutely, that seems really revisionist or biased toward the past. I doubt he will, but if DDG stays at Old Trafford for another decade at the level he has been playing for the last 5 years he is our best GK ever, above Schmeichel and VDS.

bangkok

Billy86 wrote: »

Absolutely, that seems really revisionist or biased toward the past. I doubt he will, but if DDG stays at Old Trafford for another decade at the level he has been playing for the last 5 years he is our best GK ever, above Schmeichel and VDS.

Now theres an argument....... dont think there has been or ever will be better keeper in one on one situations than peter schmeichel was. We are very lucky to have had such great keepers at the club (apart from taibi)

jimmytwotimes 2013

bangkok wrote: »

Neuer and de dea would be world class keepers in any era

De Gea in the 50's with Peter McParland trying to break him up?

jimmytwotimes 2013

http://therepublikofmancunia.com/bombs-and-bungs-the-story-of-andrei-kanchelskis-united-exit/

Saw this on reddit, dunno if posted here before. The strange end of Andrei Kanchelskis' time at United.

RockSalto

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

De Gea in the 50's with Peter McParland trying to break him up?

If De Gea was in the 50's he'd be of that time so I'm sure he'd have adapted his game to handle that part of it.

bangkok

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

De Gea in the 50's with Peter McParland trying to break him up?

How about a keeper in the 1950's running out and breaking up messi..... now that would be messi

The_Kew_Tour

Would not be pessimistic about the targets at all.

Im confident we will get the right players. AG is replaceable for a target too.