Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Mitch Connor

paulbok wrote: »

If true, I'd see it as United taking the player Atletico want to replace Griezemann to ensure he can go to Atletico next year in a swap +€ deal.

I just can't imagine that is a way United will look to do business. I would also be very disappointed if we did. I want United to sign players to play, and be important parts of the team - not as business transactions to position themselves for future transfers.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

Really? Care to expand and offer more insight as to how you came to that decision?

I don't watch the French league, and didn't watch Lyon in europe so I cannot at all comment on the guy - his stats look good though.

My gut would say though (and I know this is totally uninformed and a generalisation of epic proportions....) that if he was that good, he wouldn't still be at Lyon - someone would have looked to buy him (and done the work to actually do it) already. The french league isn't great and Lyon aren't what they used to be - it is not the same, imo, as Veratti at PSG imo.

Then again, Drogba was kicking around in France at an older age than him, and had rubbish stats in comparison at the same ages) and he went on to be be one of the best players the premiership has had.

At the money being spoken about, maybe it is a case we could get him in and still have room for a significant signing in the role I envisaged for Griezman - as I don't think Lacazette would alter the style of the United attack in the way Greizmann would have (and we needed).

My totally uninformated Premier Leaguer opinion would have me wanting Lukaku far more than Lacazette, and I don't think Lukaku would significantly improve our style either.

I can't think of any player we could get that would change our style in the way Griezmann could have - a pacey, skillful, creative, finisher, from the wing position. We are going to hear crap linking us to Bale and Ronaldo (I would see Ronaldo as a central signing these days to be honest, or from the wing with zero of the defensive work) but I don't think we will get either. We 'need' someone like Greizmann, Sanchez, Bale, Neymar - none of them are coming to United this summer. Don't know if there are young prospects - such as Sane (obviously City ain't selling him to us!) could have been last summer. Maybe that Memphis fella at Lyon....

Lord TSC

Agree with most of your analysis Mitch.

On the point of "why is he still at Lyon", as someone who has had Lacazette on his radar for a few years, it's always surprised me he stuck there as log as he did. Every summer, I thought he would get a move to a bigger team, and this summer looked to be it with the move to Atletico.

He wouldn't be my first choice (that's Lukaku) but he certainly isn't the dud many seem to be painting him as, just cause he's not a top name. He'd be good for 20 goals a season up front, but I'd agree we'd need a talisman signing for the wings.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

Agree with most of your analysis Mitch.

On the point of "why is he still at Lyon", as someone who has had Lacazette on his radar for a few years, it's always surprised me he stuck there as log as he did. Every summer, I thought he would get a move to a bigger team, and this summer looked to be it with the move to Atletico.

He wouldn't be my first choice (that's Lukaku) but he certainly isn't the dud many seem to be painting him as, just cause he's not a top name. He'd be good for 20 goals a season up front, but I'd agree we'd need a talisman signing for the wings.

been watching a youtube video so I feel I am an expert now.

What i saw was some great speed, strength and touch, good finishing too.

My big question though... if he is that good, and worth 40-50million.... why the feck has he not been capped for France since 2015. Not like they have an array of stunning forwards ripping the top leagues to shreds.

Lord TSC

He's with the national team at the moment, but can't answer on that front. Don't know much about him on a national level. Who'd be France's options. Would it be Griezmann, Giroud and....is there a third?

paulbok

Lord TSC wrote: »

He's with the national team at the moment, but can't answer on that front. Don't know much about him on a national level. Who'd be France's options. Would it be Griezmann, Giroud and....is there a third?

Martial?

Lord TSC

paulbok wrote: »

Martial?

He's not had that many appearances for France, has he? I meant strictly players who have got caps already.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

He's with the national team at the moment, but can't answer on that front. Don't know much about him on a national level. Who'd be France's options. Would it be Griezmann, Giroud and....is there a third?

Benzema, Kevin Gremiero (probably spelled very wrong)

When you have Greizmann and Benzema, for example, i'm not saying he should be first choice or he is rubbish - but to have not got even a sub appearance in 2016 or 2017 (so far)? Seems like there is something to be questioned.,

DARK-KNIGHT

what about Wesley sneijder? those links haven't gone away have they??

HigginsJ

Lord TSC wrote: »

He's with the national team at the moment, but can't answer on that front. Don't know much about him on a national level. Who'd be France's options. Would it be Griezmann, Giroud and....is there a third?

Well Benzema would have been a big part of it up till recently and that Gameiro chap at Sevilla.

StringerBell

Hococop wrote: »

Seems Munich bound

Chilean FA seem to have spilled the beans on that one alright

Mitch Connor

Peresic talk in Italy again this morning - apparently GDS saying a fee has been agreed.

Cookiemunster

HigginsJ wrote: »

Well Benzema would have been a big part of it up till recently and that Gameiro chap at Sevilla.

Gameiro plays for Atletico. Joined them last summer.

beno619

I dont see a point in Perisic, we need an out and out right sided winger.

Weve far too many 10's and inside forwards.

bucketybuck

beno619 wrote: »

Weve far too many 10's and inside forwards.

We have far too many underperforming 10's and inside forwards, I would have little problem replacing a few of them.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Benzema, Kevin Gremiero (probably spelled very wrong)

When you have Greizmann and Benzema, for example, i'm not saying he should be first choice or he is rubbish - but to have not got even a sub appearance in 2016 or 2017 (so far)? Seems like there is something to be questioned.,

HigginsJ wrote: »

Well Benzema would have been a big part of it up till recently and that Gameiro chap at Sevilla.

Benzema! I knew I was forgetting a big one.

beno619 wrote: »

I dont see a point in Perisic, we need an out and out right sided winger.

Weve far too many 10's and inside forwards.

Perisic is a left winger mainly, isn't he? Personally, I'm happy we're signing a winger instead of shoving strikers or #10s out wide. Jose has obviously identified Perisic as a top target, given the speed that its happening, and I'm willing to trust Jose's judgement on this one.

Cantona's Collars

I feel really old seeing pictures of Bebeto's son signing for Sporting.

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

Really? Care to expand and offer more insight as to how you came to that decision?

Seen him play a good few times. Dont think he is clinical enough in front of goal. He is 26 now, 8 seasons at lyon, would have moved on a long time ago if he was class, but hes not good enough for a top club in europe. Giroud played ahead of him for france a lot and he is nothing special.
Will probably end up with someone like west ham or liverpool

bangkok

Would be very happy with perisic. A very hard working left winger with a great left foot and an excellent cross. A strikers dream

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Will probably end up with someone like west ham or liverpool

Literally was going to Champions League semi-finalists Atletico if it wasn't for the transfer ban, so seems destined for a bigger (if not top) club.

kstand

Perisic would be an excellent singing and solve the problem we have faced with the left wing for the last few years.

Mitch Connor

What positions do people think United should be going for this summer? Was just thinking about it there and I feel United still need a massive overhaul to be at the level required.

IMO….

We need a right sided attacking threat - I thought this was going to be Greizmann but that seems a dead one now and rumours are United aren’t looking at that position as a priority - which is something I fear to be honest. I like Mata but we need to change the dynamic of the attack by swapping him for a pacer, skilful player with good movement. United’s front line movement is too static and slow.

We need a striker - if Mourinho isn’t going to gamble on playing Rashford through the centre, we need a striker with Rooney likely to be going and Ibrahimovic injured/going.

We need a defensive/deep midfielder. Carrick is 36. We sold Schneiderlin. We sold Schweinsteiger. We desperately need to reinforce midfield. We have Herrerea, Pogba, Fellaini and Pereira (Imo) along with maybe Mkhitaryan, Mata and Lingard who could taking more attacking roles in the centre but no specialist (Imo) deep midfielder and we are desperate for one.

We need a centre back - can’t trust Jones or Smalling, don’t think Mourinho does either - but he seems reluctant on Tuanzebe and Fosu-Mensah. We need at least one senior centre back.

We arguably need a left back. I’d still like to see shaw given a proper go there - but he is consistently getting injured and Mourinho seems to fecking hate him. Darmian is solid there but no forward threat at all. Blind is similar in that respect.

IMO - We HAVE to get a right sided forward, a striker, a defensive/deep midfielder and a centre back. I’d be ok with no LB signing if Shaw isn’t sold and is given a proper chance at the position without Mourinho attempting character assassination after every match.

As for the who….. FECK KNOWS.

TheDoc

adox wrote: »

Yeah I agree that the standard of keeping has dropped over the last few years. The amount of keepers that have little or no command of their box is shocking tbh. I do have sympathy with them with regards to shot stopping and nearly always punching or parrying the ball instread of trying to hold it, with the "new" ball but the amount of crosses or balls into the box that are punched(when they do bother to come for the ball)instead of held is a joke.
Also Peps seeming insistence on prioritising a keeper that is good with his feet over a good keeper is really laughable.

De Gea is a great keeper of this era and pulls off saves at times that he has no right to but the sight of a ball coming into his six yard line or nearer and he's rotted to his line drives me bonkers.

Still think it would be a huge loss if he did leave. A bigger loss than many seem to be anticipating.

Oh yes, he would be an immense loss. While he isn't great at commanding his box or easing pressure, his concentration and focus is what makes him an incredible keeper. He doesn't "need" to get involved, he just makes the saves when he has too.

It is an immeasurable thing for a team or defence to know the last line of defence, is pretty ****ing epic.

Mitch Connor

kstand wrote: »

Perisic would be an excellent singing and solve the problem we have faced with the left wing for the last few years.

If Jose isn't going to play Rashford through the centre (and hasn't played him much on the right) then I don't want a left winger taking that spot from him!

Could sign a striker, play Rashford off him and Peresic left side. Attacking left sided threat from Peresic and attacking right sided threat (with Rashford playing more centrally than right) coming from Valencia.

Lord TSC

Priority

Striker
Creative Winger
Defensive Midfielder
Center Back

Additional

Full back (probably Left side to replace Shaw)
Backup striker (someone in the ilk of Hernandez)


After that, one in, one out. Goalie if DDG goes, #10 if/when Rooney goes, etc.

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

Literally was going to Champions League semi-finalists Atletico if it wasn't for the transfer ban, so seems destined for a bigger (if not top) club.

Doesnt make him any better though... torres signed for them as well and he was a laughing stock at chelsea and milan.

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

been watching a youtube video so I feel I am an expert now.

What i saw was some great speed, strength and touch, good finishing too.

My big question though... if he is that good, and worth 40-50million.... why the feck has he not been capped for France since 2015. Not like they have an array of stunning forwards ripping the top leagues to shreds.

Lacazette has has plenty of people in pure outcry for him to get into the national team. Just tended to be the manager preferring certain players or whatever. For example Gignac going to the Euros, when clearly Lacazette should have been there.

From the lose following of had in terms of the transfer stories, he has been linked a fair bit with bigger clubs but has just opted to stay with Lyon. At 26 hardly a bad call, the clubs interested in him have gone higher each passing window, as he continues to score goals for Lyon.

I've always just gathered he personally has decided to stay with Lyon, not that there hasn't been interested clubs.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

Priority

Striker
Creative Winger
Defensive Midfielder
Center Back

Additional

Full back (probably Left side to replace Shaw)
Backup striker (someone in the ilk of Hernandez)


After that, one in, one out. Goalie if DDG goes, #10 if/when Rooney goes, etc.

If/When Rooney goes would we not be better looking at Mata/Mkhitaryan and Pereira to play #10 - don't see a need to spend there other than an actual striker. Rashford, Martial, Striker, Winger, Mata, Mkhitaryan, Pereira, Lingard.

Rashford, Martial and Striker for the central point position - all the others (and Rashford/Martial) could play off the wing positions or #10.

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

Lacazette has has plenty of people in pure outcry for him to get into the national team. Just tended to be the manager preferring certain players or whatever. For example Gignac going to the Euros, when clearly Lacazette should have been there.

From the lose following of had in terms of the transfer stories, he has been linked a fair bit with bigger clubs but has just opted to stay with Lyon. At 26 hardly a bad call, the clubs interested in him have gone higher each passing window, as he continues to score goals for Lyon.

I've always just gathered he personally has decided to stay with Lyon, not that there hasn't been interested clubs.

Was reading a piece earlier that indicated his best form comes in a 442 with a forward partner, and doesn't do as well as the point in a 433. Don't know if it is true (ESPN piece from early 2016) or if he has developed better since then. If 433 is a problem for him its a clear no-go really.

bangkok

TheDoc wrote: »

Lacazette has has plenty of people in pure outcry for him to get into the national team. Just tended to be the manager preferring certain players or whatever. For example Gignac going to the Euros, when clearly Lacazette should have been there.

From the lose following of had in terms of the transfer stories, he has been linked a fair bit with bigger clubs but has just opted to stay with Lyon. At 26 hardly a bad call, the clubs interested in him have gone higher each passing window, as he continues to score goals for Lyon.

I've always just gathered he personally has decided to stay with Lyon, not that there hasn't been interested clubs.

Didnt he nearly go to west ham last season?

Mitch Connor

bangkok wrote: »

Didnt he nearly go to west ham last season?

Nope.

They wanted him but reports say he had no interest in signing for them. Rejected Newcastle and Spurs too at some point, apparently (though not last season that I can see)

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

What positions do people think United should be going for this summer? Was just thinking about it there and I feel United still need a massive overhaul to be at the level required.

IMO….

We need a right sided attacking threat - I thought this was going to be Greizmann but that seems a dead one now and rumours are United aren’t looking at that position as a priority - which is something I fear to be honest. I like Mata but we need to change the dynamic of the attack by swapping him for a pacer, skilful player with good movement. United’s front line movement is too static and slow.

We need a striker - if Mourinho isn’t going to gamble on playing Rashford through the centre, we need a striker with Rooney likely to be going and Ibrahimovic injured/going.

We need a defensive/deep midfielder. Carrick is 36. We sold Schneiderlin. We sold Schweinsteiger. We desperately need to reinforce midfield. We have Herrerea, Pogba, Fellaini and Pereira (Imo) along with maybe Mkhitaryan, Mata and Lingard who could taking more attacking roles in the centre but no specialist (Imo) deep midfielder and we are desperate for one.

We need a centre back - can’t trust Jones or Smalling, don’t think Mourinho does either - but he seems reluctant on Tuanzebe and Fosu-Mensah. We need at least one senior centre back.

We arguably need a left back. I’d still like to see shaw given a proper go there - but he is consistently getting injured and Mourinho seems to fecking hate him. Darmian is solid there but no forward threat at all. Blind is similar in that respect.

IMO - We HAVE to get a right sided forward, a striker, a defensive/deep midfielder and a centre back. I’d be ok with no LB signing if Shaw isn’t sold and is given a proper chance at the position without Mourinho attempting character assassination after every match.

As for the who….. FECK KNOWS.

There is what I think we need, there is what I think Mourinho thinks he needs, and then there is what we can get. All three varying things

I'd say it's likely obvious we need (not specifically in prio)

CB
LB
CM
DM
ST

I think if Mourinho can get a grip on managing our attacking players properly, and those players also get going, there is enough talent at our disposal to have an effective frontline with a new striker. We must not forget there is a serious amount of talent that was wasted/not used properly this season. And Jose must do better with what he has. I don't see more then 4 signings this summer, and they might be tough to get over the line.

Centre Back
Jones as a backup CB, constantly injured, isn't reliable. You need a backup CB actually ready to play. I think its time to cut the chord.
Smalling I'm maybe at the point of accepting worked well only under Van Gaal cause he just got him, and vice versa. He's reverted back to his unreliable ropey self.
So I think those two could and maybe should make way for a new starting CB, with then Bailly,Rojo and Blind. I tend to think of a squad having four CB's, but this season might have freaked Jose and he will look for a 5th.

Left Back
The Shaw issue is obvious. He probably has this coming season as his last chance to impress. But I imagine a new LB is coming into the first team and Shaw will need to earn his spot, and maybe time is on his side, but Jose clearly isn't waiting. With Blind and Rojo (both look poor in that role) and Darmian filling in(actually looked ok) I'd say a new LB is required unless Darmian has earned the spot in Jose's eyes.

DM
Carrick unfit for purpose. Hererra there really just because of Carrick unreliability. Don't think Jose see's him as a first team DM next season and was just filling a hole.

CM
After the stupid release of Schneiderlan and Schweinsteiger we saw what can happen with injuries. Having only Fellaini,Herrera,Carrick and Pogba as CM's is silly. Need at least one more or even two. (Someone remind Jose Blind is a CM)
While not necessarily a immediate first team upgrade in this spot, we just need cover. But I think Hererra needs to have another high quality season. He is the likeliest to be replaced in the near future in this midfield.

ST
Pretty obvious this one. I don't see Jose making a dramatic overhaul to tactics or shape, so it needs to be a mobile, focul point striker that can manage dealing with 1-2 CB's and provide good linkup play to wide players, while finishing his own chances. Lukaku looks the most obtainable person at the moment that fits the bill. Personally I'd be delighted, as that fella's career has for some time being pointing one direction, and that is world class striker. At 24 his best years to come.

Squad also needs some suppliments in terms of just squad members. Can see Rooney, Smalling,Jones and Young leaving this summer. Worried for Martial. So there needs to be some numbers there with a CL campaign that really can't be an embarassment like the Van Gaal one. Considering Jose god exposed this season for his poor squad management and it was highlighted as a "wow you got lucky" in his last title win, he might do well imo to ditch his "I only work with small squads" and learn to work with a slightly bigger one

TheDoc

bangkok wrote: »

Didnt he nearly go to west ham last season?

Nah West Ham were just being utterly ridiculous last season, as their owners tend to be. They did attempt some big striker signings, all of which the players involved had no interest in going.

Trigger

bangkok wrote: »

Doesnt make him any better though... torres signed for them as well and he was a laughing stock at chelsea and milan.

Your arguement was that if he was class a top team in Europe would sign him.. you were shown that a top team in Europe were signing him(Arsenal also looking at him apparently) but now that's not good enough?

Your moving the goalposts so far they are in the middle of the road

It's like saying none of the wingers we ever sign will ever be good enough because we signed Bebe before

bucketybuck

Mitch Connor wrote: »

What positions do people think United should be going for this summer? Was just thinking about it there and I feel United still need a massive overhaul to be at the level required.

Some people think the squad is fine but I said this during the season, I would happily see 7/8 of that first team replaced and I think you will see it happen over the next few windows.

There are very few positions in our first team that couldn't be improved upon and that need to be improved upon if we want to win leagues and CL's.
We need at least one striker and to my mind we need two, we need a consistent threat from both wings, left and right, we need a holding midfielder and we need further depth in midfield as a whole, we need a left back, we can improve at right back, we can improve in central defence, and we all know the score with the keeper.

We could add one of two players and make do, but why should we make do? If there is such clear and obvious scope for improvement in the quality of our players then that should be our aim.

20 Times 20 Times

Sky breaking that news we are interested in Varane. Do you think is attainable ?

Cantona's Collars

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

Sky breaking that news we are interested in Varane. Do you think is attainable ?

Madrid won't do a deal unless it involves DDG.

Cookiemunster

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

Sky breaking that news we are interested in Varane. Do you think is attainable ?

After the last few weeks, Sky are gone down to Indykhalia levels when it comes to rumours in my opinion.
And it's looks like Pepe will be off this summer, so it'll be himself and Ramos as first choice center halves next season. So no, not obtainable.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

If/When Rooney goes would we not be better looking at Mata/Mkhitaryan and Pereira to play #10 - don't see a need to spend there other than an actual striker. Rashford, Martial, Striker, Winger, Mata, Mkhitaryan, Pereira, Lingard.

Rashford, Martial and Striker for the central point position - all the others (and Rashford/Martial) could play off the wing positions or #10.

Actually, yeah. Pereira had completely slipped my mind, and Mata would be a grand first choice #10. In addition, I wouldn't be shocked if we dropped the #'10 position in a lot of games in favour of a three man mid anyway.

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

Sky breaking that news we are interested in Varane. Do you think is attainable ?

/r/RedDevil just banned Sky as a source on United news. Unless they have pictures of a player holding a jersey, you're better off just ignoring everything they say...

DM_7

SAF needed time to put together his 08 team. It took a few seasons to get it all togther.

Bringing in Hargreaves and Tevez was a great upgrade in quality in one summer. United had already recruited Evra, Vidic, Rooney, Ronaldo, Park, VDS, Carrick. Adding to Neville, Scholes, Giggs, Brown etc.

United will need more recruitment (over a few summers) to get anything like that level. Pogba, Miki and Bailly was a great start. Another trio like that and I would be delighted

This summer I think the priorities are up front, a wide forward and another defensive midfield player.

For example Perisic, Lukaku and Fabinho. A goal poacher for the squad as well.

Quandary

varane is a quality player. I would have thought of him more a Pep style centre half than Jose but I'd be delighted if we signed him.

For a moment I thought you typed Veratti

Veratti would be a dream in the middle for us.

Mitch Connor

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

Sky breaking that news we are interested in Varane. Do you think is attainable ?

Would take anything Sky say, without it being in multiple other locations, with unhealthy doses of salt.

I think United/Mourinho would love Varane - think his best spell at Madrid came under Mourinho.

I do think if a bid was accepted he would be interested in signing for Mourinho - but getting a bid accepted is another matter. Surely Zidane/Madrid see him as a big part of their defence into the future. He played a fair chunk of games for Madrid this season so it doesn't appear he is on the fringes of the side, as I feel we would need him to be. No talk of them going for some other CB so..... I don't think Madrid will have any interest in selling him so I see no chance of us getting him. He won't be pushing for such a move and I don't think Madrid would care even if he did!

bangkok

astradave wrote: »

Your arguement was that if he was class a top team in Europe would sign him.. you were shown that a top team in Europe were signing him(Arsenal also looking at him apparently) but now that's not good enough?

Your moving the goalposts so far they are in the middle of the road

It's like saying none of the wingers we ever sign will ever be good enough because we signed Bebe before

I just dont think he is clinical enough to be considered a class striker. If he was good enougj there would be a load of clubs after him. As mitch pointed out earlier he has been linked with newcastle spurs and west ham before.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/Sport_Witness/status/870593164943511552

"Seen at least one report saying today's Corriere dello Sport says Man United have agreed a Perisic fee. Have checked, it doesn't."

Quandary

bangkok wrote: »

I just dont think he is clinical enough to be considered a class striker. If he was good enougj there would be a load of clubs after him. As mitch pointed out earlier he has been linked with newcastle spurs and west ham before.

Is this still Lacazette you're talking about? He has scored 91 goals in his last 129 appearances for Lyon.

Fair enough it's the French league but still, his goal scoring has been impressive and on the up for the last couple of seasons.

Giggsy11

bangkok wrote: »

I just dont think he is clinical enough to be considered a class striker. If he was good enougj there would be a load of clubs after him. As mitch pointed out earlier he has been linked with newcastle spurs and west ham before.

He nearly joined Atletico this season only for them getting transfer ban, Dortmund, ManUtd, Arsenal, Liverpool are all interested. If that's not enough clubs chasing a player then not sure what is.

bangkok

Giggsy11 wrote: »

He nearly joined Atletico this season only for them getting transfer ban, Dortmund, ManUtd, Arsenal, Liverpool are all interested. If that's not enough clubs chasing a player then not sure what is.

Being interested in a player and actually signing a player are 2 different things. There is obviously doubts about his ability or he would have been signed 2 or 3 years ago

bangkok

Quandary wrote: »

Is this still Lacazette you're talking about? He has scored 91 goals in his last 129 appearances for Lyon.

Fair enough it's the French league but still, his goal scoring has been impressive and on the up for the last couple of seasons.

So to had bafetimbi gomes, he came to england with swansea and was back in france quick enough.

Quandary

bangkok wrote: »

So to had bafetimbi gomes, he came to england with swansea and was back in france quick enough.

No he didn't!

Gomes scored 60 odd goals in his last 150 or so games for Lyon.

Big difference between the two players when it comes to style of play also.

Giggsy11

bangkok wrote: »

Being interested in a player and actually signing a player are 2 different things. There is obviously doubts about his ability or he would have been signed 2 or 3 years ago

Only 1 club can sign a player, so yeah this season he will be signed by some club.