Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

The_Kew_Tour

Sand wrote: »

That's basically the same problem as last season though. Defensively sound, very structured, very hard to score against, not scoring enough goals.

Structured last year?

Every time our opponents attacked last season they looked like they could score.

DDG saved us from few ass whopping spree last season.

We conceded 4 at Stoke

caviardreams

Lithium93_ wrote: »

Thank god for that Fax machine

It should be preserved for all time in the OT museum :D

Sand

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Structured last year?

Every time our opponents attacked last season they looked like they could score.

DDG saved us from few ass whopping spree last season.

We conceded 4 at Stoke

The complaint was the LVG style of play was too structured, too robotic right?

And we only conceded 31 goals for the rest of the 37 games. Joint best in the league that season. Opponents scoring wasn't the problem then or now.

The_Kew_Tour

Sand wrote: »

The complaint was the LVG style of play was too structured, too robotic right?

And we only conceded 31 goals for the rest of the 37 games. Joint best in the league that season. Opponents scoring wasn't the problem then or now.

Yep because DDG saved our asses on number of occasions.

Agree that it was too robotic though. Robotic is perfect word for United last season. When I say Structured I mean more defense in and organised in that department then further up the pitch here anyway.

Jayop

This season...(all stats per game)

DeGea
Shots against - 9.24
Saves - 2.06
Clean Sheets - 0.42

Lloris
Shots against - 8.97
Saves - 2.2
Clean Sheets - 0.5

Courtois
Shots against - 8.28
Saves - 1.94
Clean Sheets 0.42


For comparison here's DeGea from last year....
Shots against - 11.15
Saves - 2.35
Clean Sheets 0.44

So last year DeGea had almost 2 shots per game more to deal with and 0.3 more saves to make per game but kept more clean sheets.

He was playing better last year than he has done this year. A few times we've conceded and he's been slightly at fault. That said he'd still top class this year and his stats are just slightly behind those of Lloris and Courtois who are in the top two sides in the country.

Trigger

Goalkeepers stats like that mean very little tbh, they don't take into account the standard of save made. Now last year DeGea was pulling off wondersaves near every other game to keep us in matches, this season have been standard saves with a couple of wondersaves here or there

Jayop

astradave wrote: »

Goalkeepers stats like that mean very little tbh, they don't take into account the standard of save made. Now last year DeGea was pulling off wondersaves near every other game to keep us in matches, this season have been standard saves with a couple of wondersaves here or there

I don't dispute that, and I did say that he was playing much much better last year.

Although a keeper that's having more thrown at them will have a much bigger chance to make big saves. That's why you see guys like Foster or Forester look good playing for small sides. Can pull super saves out of the bag every now and again, but the true differentiator is being able to pull the save out when you've been scratching you're hole for the last 80 minutes.

Hococop

Another nice finish for ronaldo

Lithium93_

103 Champions League goals for Cristiano Ronaldo, that is quiet bloody impressive.

mewe

Ronaldo really is a phenomenon. Even if the athleticism side of his game isn't what it once was (but still very good!), he still has the technique and the killer instinct.

Jayop

He's got what we're missing and I don't just mean his talent. It's that absolute need to win. Insatiable.

Lithium93_

https://twitter.com/GFFN/status/859515551890243584

Breaking | AS Monaco have rejected an €85m offer from Manchester United for Kylian Mbapp?, according to Gianluca di Marzio.

AS Monaco have told Manchester United they want between €120m and €140m for Kylian Mbapp?. (Gianluca di Marzio)

Monaco midfielder Fabinho is at the top of Manchester United's summer shortlist, according to Gianluca di Marzio.

Jayop

FFS, I read that as accepted the bid.

Credible source??

Lithium93_

Jayop wrote: »

FFS, I read that as accepted the bid.

Sorry for raising your hopes, only to cruelly dash them :pac:

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Credible source??

I've seen others here post Di Marzio stuff regarding transfer,s so I'm guessing he is.

Trigger

He has been pretty spot on with United over the last couple of years.

Alf Veedersane

€85 million for Mbappe.

Jesus.

Lithium93_

Jayop wrote: »

He's got what we're missing and I don't just mean his talent. It's that absolute need to win. Insatiable.

I know it's beating the already dead horse of the 14 draws and what could've been this season, but was thinking if United had Ronaldo & Chicharito not been moved on for absolute peanuts, they'd be sitting higher up than 5th.

On another note, the £80 million Real forked over for Ronaldo in 2009, United should've chanced asking for more.

But that's enough reminiscing.

Alf Veedersane

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

€85 million for Mbappe.

Jesus.

Did Utd leave you 5 million to play around with?

Alf Veedersane

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Did Utd leave you 5 million to play around with?

They're more than welcome to give me five mil to play around with.

JamboMac

I honestly hope we don't try and sign mbappe, i know he has done great for monaco, but it's the french league and yes he is young 85 - 140 million. If that's serious then i am flabergasted. We need to let martial and prove themselves first rather than splashing out on a potential great.

Also saw though today chelsea turned down the chance to sign him, so don't know what to believe.

Trigger

Mbappe said he wants to play for Real Madrid so if we did sign him there would be no doubt he would be angling for a move to Spain after a year or 2

yabadabado

The figures mentioned for Mbappe are crazy no matter how well he has done this season.United only bought Monaco's best young player 18 months ago who needs to be given a fair crack at CF.
For the money mentioned United could probably buy a new CB DM and right winger positions that need improving most imo.
No point buying that type of player if the rest of the team isn't functioning which I think has been so what a problem with Pogba this season.

RobertKK

yabadabado wrote: »

The figures mentioned for Mbappe are crazy no matter how well he has done this season.United only bought Monaco's best young player 18 months ago who needs to be given a fair crack at CF.
For the money mentioned United could probably buy a new CB DM and right winger positions that need improving most imo.
No point buying that type of player if the rest of the team isn't functioning which I think has been so what a problem with Pogba this season.

Pogba has been one of the most under rated players for United this season. I don't think there has been any problem with Pogba, except some fail to fully see the positive effect Pogba has on games.

DARK-KNIGHT

I just cannot wait to see pogba dominate next season and shut the nay sayers up......

Korat

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

I just cannot wait to see pogba dominate next season and shut the nay sayers up......

Unfortunately he's on a hiding to nothing for the next few years because even if he wins POTY people will say thats the minimum you'd expect for a world record transfer

thelad95

Pogba will always be judged unfairly against the transfer fee we paid for him.

Had we got him for 35 million, people would be singing his praises as a great value signing right now.

scudzilla

Lithium93_ wrote: »

https://twitter.com/GFFN/status/859515551890243584

After the money we paid for Pogba we're gonna get screwed for every player we go after now

beno619

RobertKK wrote: »

Pogba has been one of the most under rated players for United this season. I don't think there has been any problem with Pogba, except some fail to fully see the positive effect Pogba has on games.

You don't think there have been any problems with his performances this season ?

adox

RobertKK wrote: »

Pogba has been one of the most under rated players for United this season. I don't think there has been any problem with Pogba, except some fail to fully see the positive effect Pogba has on games.

Hate this sort of condescending post.

yabadabado

RobertKK wrote: »

Pogba has been one of the most under rated players for United this season. I don't think there has been any problem with Pogba, except some fail to fully see the positive effect Pogba has on games.

You think Pogba has played to his full potential this season .

Leroy42

Jebus, when you see the fare that the Madrid teams, Real especially, offered up last night along with the other CL games, Utd and the EPL as a whole has a major problem. So all the massive amounts of money they have spent (and yes I know that Real spent even more), but in terms of a return on that spend, the EPL is not performing.

Real and Athletico are are a totally different level. Even Chelsea are nowhere close to that standard. Spurs, IMO, are closest to it in terms of ability to play.

Now of course Madrid don't play like that every game, and you sometimes have to grind out results and over a course of a season you will get good and bad games, but how many really great games does the EPL throw up each year? Can any of the top EPL teams really hope to be able to compete at that level?

Not sure what the solution is. It seems, to me, that the lower teams in EPL have got better, certainly there are very few push over games. But they appear to have got better at not being beaten, rather that better as a whole. Everything seems to be aimed at avoiding risks, reducing football to a series of standard moves. The utility player, consistent but not particularly good, is far more valuable that a Messi or Ronaldo who can be world class, but can also spend 89 minutes fannying around.

From a Utd perspective, its pretty depressing that we can't even be top in a such a poor league. Even after we achieve that, we have another massive mountain to climb to get back to the top table in Europe.

Still, CR7 is some player. He'll never make of course, show pony with no fight. Can't see him doing it on a rainy Tuesday in Stoke.

Nalz

adox wrote: »

Hate this sort of condescending post.

Me also. Of course he contributed... And yes he hit the woodwork 9 times which is insane, but we should expect more from him and Jose to get the best out of him... Even if that means signing another midfielder in a DM role or resting him more. He's still young too and first proper season in the premiership.

Pogbas season has been average to slightly above average. Mors to come I'm sure!

Kerrydude1981

TV3 had a story about Pool and Utd apparently are in a race to sign Fabregas

beno619

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

I just cannot wait to see pogba dominate next season and shut the nay sayers up......

He'll be praised by the "nay sayers" but it wont make the valid criticism of him this season any less warranted or valid.

Rayne Wooney

Pogba has been thoroughly average this season overall.

His playing down of expectations recently in the media has been a little concerning. Apparently he is "just a midfielder" which is complete bollox. He has very little defensive responsibilities and is probably the most creative player we have, he should be providing far more at the top end of the pitch.

He has taken on a quarter back role far too often this season, reminiscent of Steven Gerrard in his last years at Liverpool hiding on the field. One or two good passes a game but adding nothing else to play that any average midfielder wouldn't do.

He lapped up the hype last summer and made his bed really, you could probably name 10 better midfielders this season in the PL alone that performed better overall than our world record signing. He needs to perform a lot better next season

posturingpat

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

TV3 had a story about Pool and Utd apparently are in a race to sign Fabregas

Oh now that's interesting, doesn't look to have a future at Chelsea and has only shown his quality with them in patches, a change and a chance to prove himself and he could be a fantastic signing.

Alf Veedersane

Nalz wrote: »

but we should expect more from him and Jose to get the best out of him... Even if that means signing another midfielder in a DM role or resting him more.

This has been a large part of the problem since day 1: there was no foil for Pogba and he was expected to answer all of the midfield questions and didn't really get much chance to play the role that he did at Juve.

He's a talented player and he didn't deliver on his potential but you can't just throw him into a relatively weak midfield and expect him to play to his strengths and do the other jobs as well.

RobertKK

beno619 wrote: »

You don't think there have been any problems with his performances this season ?

adox wrote: »

Hate this sort of condescending post.

yabadabado wrote: »

You think Pogba has played to his full potential this season .

I am not being condescending, I am just saying what I see and believe.
Pogba drives play forward.
He has shown his skill with some world class forward passes.
His stats are good. Just think he gets underrated for us.
Of course he had poor games but the reality is this is the exception rather than the norm in my opinion.
He scored 3 goals less than last season but was close countless times.
His assists are way down but then the argument was, why buy someone like Mbappe when like Pogba the right players are not around.
We have people in front of Pogba who failed to take their chances created by Pogba, one could say Zlatan was the exception.

Cantona's Collars

Was this posted yesterday?

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/859516441997062145

Jayop

Wouldn't mind Fabregas as a back up option. Still quality and had Chelsea been in Europe this season he'd obviously have played a lot more. Would have loved to have signed him a that summer we hot fellaini.

TheDoc

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

€85 million for Mbappe.

Jesus.

Considering the deal for Martial, and how Jose has fluffed him this season, I'd be concerned spending that amount of money on a player that will require a good coach for his development at that sort of age.

That is a lot of money for potential and coming from the French league. No doubt looks a talent, but I'd say that money could be spent on better,established strikers, or elsewhere in the team.

From what I've seen of him and granted it's been limited, don't see too much difference with Martial. Feels like a potentially silly purchase.

TheDoc

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Pogba has been thoroughly average this season overall.

His playing down of expectations recently in the media has been a little concerning. Apparently he is "just a midfielder" which is complete bollox. He has very little defensive responsibilities and is probably the most creative player we have, he should be providing far more at the top end of the pitch.

He has taken on a quarter back role far too often this season, reminiscent of Steven Gerrard in his last years at Liverpool hiding on the field. One or two good passes a game but adding nothing else to play that any average midfielder wouldn't do.

He lapped up the hype last summer and made his bed really, you could probably name 10 better midfielders this season in the PL alone that performed better overall than our world record signing. He needs to perform a lot better next season

He has featured in pretty much every top 10 list I've read in the last week for midfielders (few sites posted theirs). I think you're being harsh saying there is ten better, there really isn't.

He is leading a number of categories and has played a serious amount of football. While he hasn't been earth shattering, he has done pretty fine by me for his first season.

Don't forget while he was a United player, he never played in the PL properly. I don't feel that Jose has his role properly nailed down or has settled on a formation really.

Pogba has played in 3-4 formattions this season and in about three different roles. So I'm sure he will settle.

While he has poor games, he obviously is being over analysed due to this transfer fee and the marketing hype which was cringe. But he has had a pretty fine season and I'd imagine he will really kick on next season after a good rest in the summer and full pre-season.

He is one thing this season that I agree with the terms "unlucky" and that craic. He has cracked the woodwork about 8 times this season and has had teammates fluff incredible chances he has setup.

Marginal change and he could be sitting here in May with double figure goals and assists, which would be an incredible return for his first season.

I'd say with a more ruthless attack and him probably getting some breaks, he will appear on the surface MUCH better going forward. Think as the season went on he stopped trying to do everything on his own. I think his "setting of expectations" is a good thing, not so much for us, but for him.

TheDoc

zerks wrote: »

Was this posted yesterday?

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/859516441997062145

Oh Toni, can't deal with another summer of links and rumour. When I heard Van Gaal shut down the Kroos deal that Moyes had pretty much got all wrapped up :mad::mad::mad::mad:

Giggsy11

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Pogba has been thoroughly average this season overall.

His playing down of expectations recently in the media has been a little concerning. Apparently he is "just a midfielder" which is complete bollox. He has very little defensive responsibilities and is probably the most creative player we have, he should be providing far more at the top end of the pitch.

He has taken on a quarter back role far too often this season, reminiscent of Steven Gerrard in his last years at Liverpool hiding on the field. One or two good passes a game but adding nothing else to play that any average midfielder wouldn't do.

He lapped up the hype last summer and made his bed really, you could probably name 10 better midfielders this season in the PL alone that performed better overall than our world record signing. He needs to perform a lot better next season

You don't expect creativity from defensive minded midfielders, similarly it's not logical to expect Pogba to be defensively good. He is more offensive player than defensive. It's Jose's job to find balance which IMO he did.

Pogba has created more chances than any midfielder, so he is doing his job in creating chances. If only our strikers know how to finish.

Lord TSC

The Fabregas story sounds like todays dart in a random journalists office hit his name and United.

Still, what was the relationship like between him and Jose last year? My memories is that he was one of the ones who stopped playing for him?

If we go after any Chelsea player, I'd imagine Willian would be the more likely...

Trigger

He was said to be yeah but I think he was the only one that was vocal in his praise and backed Jose during that season IIRC

ericzeking

Leroy42 wrote: »

Jebus, when you see the fare that the Madrid teams, Real especially, offered up last night along with the other CL games, Utd and the EPL as a whole has a major problem. So all the massive amounts of money they have spent (and yes I know that Real spent even more), but in terms of a return on that spend, the EPL is not performing.

Real and Athletico are are a totally different level. Even Chelsea are nowhere close to that standard. Spurs, IMO, are closest to it in terms of ability to play.

Now of course Madrid don't play like that every game, and you sometimes have to grind out results and over a course of a season you will get good and bad games, but how many really great games does the EPL throw up each year? Can any of the top EPL teams really hope to be able to compete at that level?

Not sure what the solution is. It seems, to me, that the lower teams in EPL have got better, certainly there are very few push over games. But they appear to have got better at not being beaten, rather that better as a whole. Everything seems to be aimed at avoiding risks, reducing football to a series of standard moves. The utility player, consistent but not particularly good, is far more valuable that a Messi or Ronaldo who can be world class, but can also spend 89 minutes fannying around.

From a Utd perspective, its pretty depressing that we can't even be top in a such a poor league. Even after we achieve that, we have another massive mountain to climb to get back to the top table in Europe.

Still, CR7 is some player. He'll never make of course, show pony with no fight. Can't see him doing it on a rainy Tuesday in Stoke.

We aint gonna be playing like them any time soon either with JM as manager, we may compete with them, we may even beat them but it will be done in a certain way and that to me is depressing.

Say what you like about LVG but he masterminded some scintillating displays against the better teams....his tippy, tappy sideways here and there and everywhere struggled to break down Burnley and Swansea but he had it down against Liverpool, Chelsea, Tottenham etc.

He had to go because of the toxic atmosphere that was about, mostly in the stands but I think he had a higher ceiling for performance. JM might have a higher ceiling for achievement but LVG had a higher ceiling for performance, if that makes sense. In my opinion... of course.

I would have been very interested to see what LVG could have done with Pogba in the side and the year older Martial and Rashford.

posturingpat

ericzeking wrote: »

We aint gonna be playing like them any time soon either with JM as manager, we may compete with them, we may even beat them but it will be done in a certain way and that to me is depressing.

Say what you like about LVG but he masterminded some scintillating displays against the better teams....his tippy, tappy sideways here and there and everywhere struggled to break down Burnley and Swansea but he had it down against Liverpool, Chelsea, Tottenham etc.

He had to go because of the toxic atmosphere that was about, mostly in the stands but I think he had a higher ceiling for performance. JM might have a higher ceiling for achievement but LVG had a higher ceiling for performance, if that makes sense. In my opinion... of course.

I would have been very interested to see what LVG could have done with Pogba in the side and the year older Martial and Rashford.

Dropped him for being too daring in his passing.

Lord TSC

posturingpat wrote: »

Dropped him for being too daring in his passing.

Thats presuming he'd have had the option. Pogba never would have joined an LVG team. Neither would Ibrahimovic. And DDG would be 1 year into his contract at Real Madrid.

Edit: or Bailly, who said Jose calling him stopped him going to City...