Corbally to UL Riverpath and Dogs

bonnieprince

Unfortunately some dog owners see no need to control their dogs or respect other users of the path be it joggers, pedestrians or cyclists.

Too many dogs are let run amok by their owners on this path, respect seems to be a one way street with some dog owners pardon the pun.
As for cleaning up after their dogs, don't get me started!

We are blessed with amenities in Limerick City and the surrounds. It pains me that some users of these amenities don't care about their fellow citizens.

Maybe its Smarter Travels fault or the Council for trying to integrate a major walking & cycling travel route between UL and the City as a shared path.

zulutango

bonnieprince wrote:

Maybe its Smarter Travels fault or the Council for trying to integrate a major walking & cycling travel route between UL and the City as a shared path.

There's an argument for having a much wider path and I think this was the original plan. It was knocked back by An Bord Pleanala though. If the numbers using it continue to increase they'll probably have to look at it again. It's a good complaint though. If I were working or studying in UL I'd consider places like Corbally or the city centre as good places to live simply because of the accessibility that the path now provides.

Exeggcute

topper75 wrote: »

I honestly can't see an issue so long as owners are responsible, clean up after the dog, and don't let it run amok.

They aren't though, that's the issue.

phog

bonnieprince wrote: »

.

Maybe its Smarter Travels fault or the Council for trying to integrate a major walking & cycling travel route between UL and the City as a shared path.

I was the Bord Gais Theatre recently, as we waited outside on the Plaza we were nearly knocked down by cyclists, it was peak time and they just cycle across it as if they're the sole users. I felt uncomfortable there because of them.

Mr.H

topper75 wrote: »

I don't think that is the case. How would we find out such a thing?

AFAIK it is a public path but not a park per se.

Therefore the national law applies, which is section 9 of the 1986 act:



The part underlined is key. It simply requires me to ensure that my dog comes to heel when instructed and there is no explicit reference in the legislation to a leash.

So we have to live with the dogs.

If the dog is unruly - game changed. Which is fair enough on everyone.

Compliments to those who did up the path. It's great - get down if you haven't seen it yet.

I am pretty sure that "the park canal" is a public park. I would be able to provide a link if the local council website actually worked. If you do go along there take a look at the info boards. They give a general overview of wildlife etc and then it has in the footnote that it is a public park.

I cant find the actual bye laws but here is a draft for such bye laws made in 2009. It lists what the council consider "public parks".
http://limerickcity.ie/media/20100113%20-%20%20Draft%20Version%20of%20Limerick%20City%20Public%20Park%20Bye-Laws%202010.pdf

Meaning dogs must be on leash. In fact I am pretty sure that they also have signs along the canal saying so.

I am a dog owner and I would love this not to be true but unfortunately it is

OfTheMarsWongs

Mr.H wrote: »

I am pretty sure that "the park canal" is a public park. I would be able to provide a link if the local council website actually worked. If you do go along there take a look at the info boards. They give a general overview of wildlife etc and then it has in the footnote that it is a public park.

I cant find the actual bye laws but here is a draft for such bye laws made in 2009. It lists what the council consider "public parks".
http://limerickcity.ie/media/20100113%20-%20%20Draft%20Version%20of%20Limerick%20City%20Public%20Park%20Bye-Laws%202010.pdf

Meaning dogs must be on leash. In fact I am pretty sure that they also have signs along the canal saying so.

I am a dog owner and I would love this not to be true but unfortunately it is

There's no mention of Shannon Fields in this document. Also the majority of the path to UL is past the canal. Personally I think the Rhebogue side of the canal walk is too busy to let a dog off the lead. I don't think the same is true of Shannon Fields though.

Edit: I'm making the distinction as I don't think Shannon Fields or the majority of the path to UL are a public park. Maybe the canal is designated as one as Water Ways Ireland have responsibility for the canal, council for the paths alongside it so they see it as a separate entity to the river banks. Dogs are only required to be on leads in public parks.

zulutango

For what it's worth, it's the Parks department of the city council that oversee the maintenance of the Park Canal. I don't think that necessarily means that it's a public park though. By the way, just to confuse matters, it's not called the Park Canal because it's a park. The name of the area is Park and this is derived from P?irc, the irish word for field. Once upon a time it was the part of Limerick where a lot of the food produce for the city was grown, being just outside the city walls.

Mr.H

Canal bank walk (mentioned in the document) is considered a public park by the council. Shannon fields and the route to ul are definitely part of that.

OfTheMarsWongs

Mr.H wrote: »

Canal bank walk (mentioned in the document) is considered a public park by the council. Shannon fields and the route to ul are definitely part of that.

We'll have to agree to disagree till we can find a map :-p

OfTheMarsWongs

zulutango wrote: »

For what it's worth, it's the Parks department of the city council that oversee the maintenance of the Park Canal. I don't think that necessarily means that it's a public park though. By the way, just to confuse matters, it's not called the Park Canal because it's a park. The name of the area is Park and this is derived from P?irc, the irish word for field. Once upon a time it was the part of Limerick where a lot of the food produce for the city was grown, being just outside the city walls.

The council oversee that paths alongside it but Waterways Ireland have responsibility for the body of water and lock gates.

zulutango

OfTheMarsWongs wrote: »

The council oversee that paths alongside it but Waterways Ireland have responsibility for the body of water and lock gates.

Yes, I know. The Council were quick to blame Waterways Ireland a few years back when the lock gates were left closed during a flood, and a lot of damage was caused.

http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/irish-news/limerick-council-blame-waterways-ireland-over-locked-canal-gates-34288962.html

Mr.H

OfTheMarsWongs wrote: »

We'll have to agree to disagree till we can find a map :-p

Well I have found all the proof thus far so you can look for a map that says otherwise if you would like:D

bonnieprince

I also queried the "public park" designation with the Council, they never got back to me.

I have seen the Limerick Civic Trust carrying out maintenance on the canal and laying the new path on the Corbally side of the canal from the Guinness bridge to the Railway bridge.

OfTheMarsWongs

bonnieprince wrote: »

I also queried the "public park" designation with the Council, they never got back to me.

I have seen the Limerick Civic Trust carrying out maintenance on the canal and laying the new path on the Corbally side of the canal from the Guinness bridge to the Railway bridge.

Saw on FB that they were working on clearing weeds at the end of the Mill Road last week also. They've also done work tidying Mount Saint Lawrence. Not sure what their relationship with council is, as in who picks the jobs.

topper75

Mr.H wrote: »

I am pretty sure that "the park canal" is a public park.

I think we are talking about the district Park, from the Irish páirc meaning 'field'. This is not really used any longer but it was a district immediately north of the town, outside the Abbey River. It was all fields once (wasn't everywhere) and vegetables were grown. It lives on in Park Gardens. Older people will also remember the Park Tavern. Infamously the P was knocked off and it was then referred to as the Ark Tavern. It has given way to Corbally in the modern era and you never hear anybody refer to Park.

That is what gives the canal its name. We are not talking about a public park at all.

Mr.H

Well as far as I am aware, as it states said fact on official council documents. That the canal route is a "public park". It would likely fall under the national park remit to be fair just like cratloe woods for example. But as far as the council are concerned this is a public park and attains all the bye laws that that phrase carries.

One of those bye laws is that dogs must be on leash at all times. I wish it was up for debate but it's not. It's fact.

That being said. Regardless of whether you agree that it is a public park (you won't win that argument here let alone court), the park canal have signage all along the route saying that dogs are to be kept on a short leash at all times.

I live in the area. Walk the route to work most days. I've seen the signs. In fact I have taken a picture of one of them.

topper75

Fair enough Mr. H. I would have to accept seeing that pic that I was wrong.

I have to laugh though that none of the three conditions are being complied with:
cyclists without bells, dogs without leashes, pedestrians all over the path!

Cossax

I use it every week day but I think it's fair to say that Irish people are not used to sharing a path with cyclists - pedestrians walk 2/3/4 abreast filling the whole width of the path or wander from left to right and back again but are generally OK to move once they see you/hear the bell.
There are some sections that are narrow and have fencing at that sides which makes things much more difficult.

Once you get to Corbally and beyond the hump-backed bridge though, forget about people respecting the bike path! They they are constantly in it/allowing their dog to be in it when on the lead - nearly took a tumble one winter's evening as the walker was on her path and the dog on its lead was on the cycle path and you could barely make out the lead.

It's an excellent facility but it'd be unreal with a bit more cop-on from all users and a wider path.

Brian Lighthouse

I think there's a simple solution to all of this. If you are on the path just remember that you are sharing it with a variety of users be they pedestrians, joggers, cyclists and dogs. So be aware that some might be moving slower than you and some might be moving faster than you.

I've been using that pathway for over 30 years and the most recent development is an absolutely fantastic addition.

In 2012 Limerick Smarter Travel set up two points on the path over a period of a few days and carried out a consultation process on how the pathway should be developed. In 2013 they applied for planning permission to construct a boardwalk along the river from Rhebogue to UL, however that was not granted due to some indigenous species of trees in the water. So following a return to the drawing board we have the result that we have right now.

Generally all users don't encounter any issues, however if you do, please remember that there is a CCTV system in place out along the pathway, so there may be visual evidence of any wrong doing if you report it.

I enjoy using the path and I've only come across minimal unsavoury actions from others mainly people who speed on the bike and do not indicate their approach with a bell or even if they were to say hello when approaching someone from behind.

The worst experience was along the section that's fenced on both sides. I was walking with my dog (on a lead on this occasion as it was early evening and the pathway was busy) and I pulled into the left as three joggers approached me. The one directly in front of me fell behind to make room for all of us. The guy in the middle shouted to the guy who fell behind to 'stay where you are' and he moved back into position. They passed, but not without both of us hitting shoulders. Where did that guy in the middle think we were all supposed to go? Now, in fairness that was the rudest thing I've ever experienced on that pathway.

So use it, enjoy and remember it was not built for you. It was built for all to share.

panda100

Brian Lighthouse wrote:

So use it, enjoy and remember it was not built for you. It was built for all to share.

Great post. It will take time for everyone to get used to pedestrians and cyclists all sharing space together as its just not something we are used to in Ireland.

I'm heading to UL in September and the new path is a major decision in me deciding to stay living in the city centre. It takes me only 15 minutes to get to UL campus and the lovely scenery enroute really invigorates you for the day

zulutango

I think it offers UL students and staff a great opportunity to live in the city centre and Corbally. I've a friend who works in Castletroy who has just bought a house in Corbally because of it actually. He was advised not to move to Corbally because the traffic is so bad, but the upgraded path makes it a very pleasant and quite a short commute to work by bike.

bonnieprince

Thought i would post an update, my eldest was walking in Shannon Fields with his class and ended up covered in dog sh*t along with several other classmates.
On a cycle from Corbally to UL today, i counted over ten pieces of dog sh*t along the route.
There was at least 8 dogs off their leads on the route as well.
What is the problem with some dog owners, i really cannot understand their reasoning.

John_Mc

They're scumbags, plain and simple

zulutango

It's very easy to call them scumbags, but that doesn't really get us anywhere. Fact of the matter is the project has been so successful that it's drawn a lot more dog walkers and cyclists than it had before. I can see it being revisited in a few years, and the path widened. In the meantime, a fair amount of policing is probably required.

By the way, the bend where the canal meets the river is very sharp, it's slightly downhill and it can be slippy. I know of a number of cyclists and pedestrians who have collided there. Slow down on this one, and ring the bell!

Exeggcute

The only way to stop the scumbags down there is to slap a few of them with a 300euro fine for not deing in control of their mongrels. Do it enough times and word will get around and hopefully they'll get the message.

Don't hold your breath though.

mitresize5

I got on to the Limerick litter warden about this previously and have a little sympathy for them as its a ball breaker to prosecute.

You need a litter warden, a dog warden and a guard it enforce it.

A litter warden to approach and fine the owner if they haven't picked up the mess. Most people say that's not my dog, I'm not accepting the fine. Thats when the dog warden comes in and impounds the dog for not being under control, and then a guard for when the owner gets aggro.

the simple solution though is for the owners not to act like animals themselves and clean up their own dogs mess

panda100

is there many bins along the path for dog owners to use?

OfTheMarsWongs

panda100 wrote: »

is there many bins along the path for dog owners to use?

In Shannon Fields there's only one and that's at the entrance in Irish Estates.

Unless some is picking up after a horse though I see no problem in tying the bag and carrying it the few hundred metres to the bin.

FutureGuy

Just went for a walk there and some little ah!t is flying up and down it on a motorcycle

pnpweirdo

A few months back I brought my 3 year old boy down to feed the ducks in the Irish estate section of the path. We were feeding the duck when 3 large dogs came out of nowhere nearly knocked us off our feet and jump straight into the water to chase the duck. We were down off the path so we climbed up the bank back on to the path while the dogs were in the water. When the ducks flew off the dogs turned there attention to my wife and child who were holding a bad of bread. I had to hold my boy above my head while and muddy wet dog tired to jump and clamber up my body to get the bread out of my child's hand. I spotted the ower and asked her to call the dogs away. A women in her late 40's told me to **** off the dogs doin nothin. I had a crying boy above my head I was scraped by the dogs nails wet and full of mud. She then said ring the ****ing counsel your aloud have your dogs off the lead. We have never gone back down there again. I sure her dogs are running a muck anytime she has them there. I'm not sure who is worse the dogs or the owner with her pitbul head.