Bus for 2nd Level Student Scary Prices!

magentis

A 90km journey is going to take at least a gallon of fuel,I reckon the bus would actually be cheaper going on just fuel costs.Not to mind insurance,tax,maintenance,depreciation and the fact the girl would not have to drive,allowing some study time.Parking may also be an issue at the school.

snowflaker

Leap card does work on the 120

Hilly Bill

sabinalee wrote: »

House is not ours yet...only sale agreed

Even we can afford Tallagh, Clondalkin, Newbridge,  some parts of  Naas, or small rural town ( we did not like )... to get to Celbridge, she will have to get a bus, luas, or train or both and walk a lot more.
We picked Edenderry as we thought it want be a huge problem to use public transport to Celbridge. Also, it is 30 minutes from our work places. Also, Edenderry has a good schools, and  we are sure our 6 year old son will be happy down in one of them.
I did set up meetings with principals of Edenderry schools, to have a chat about our situation and what would be the best for our daughter in their opinions.

Most important - she is open to changes, and she gave us permission to move a bit further  Life wouldnt be fair for her if she did not use HER VOTE
Thank You all....! You brought me lots of different viewings on things now...

My parents gave me the same permission years ago, not sure if they wanted me to go to offaly. The word off was used anyway.

LXFlyer

Bass Reeves wrote: »

It immaterial really we can see from this why people choose to use there car to work rather than public transport. Distance between Edenderry to Celbridge is 43KM. An efficient Deiesel car will do 20km to the litre so about 5.5/day in fuel costs and a 35 minute journey. As opposed to BE 53 euro/week for a 10 journey ticket or over 10 euro/day and a one hour journey. This is why rural Ireland was not in a panic with the BE strike for most workers BE is immaterial as they cannot afford to travel to and from work using BE. They are too expensive and journeys take too long as well as timetable not frequent enough

With regard to frequency, how many buses do you think should be operating on the 120 between Dublin and Edenderry?

Surely every 15 minutes in the morning peak extending out to hourly all day (half hourly from Clane inwards) isn't exactly unreasonable for that corridor?

Or did you even look at the timetables before making that comment?

120/121: http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1425902267-120.pdf

123: http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1425902310-123.pdf

sabinalee

Hilly Bill wrote: »

My parents gave me the same permission years ago, not sure if they wanted me to go to offaly. The word off was used anyway.

One of the life skills from my parents....always accept a challenge. Offaly here I come 🙄
My daughter is planning study abroad ... she already knows how to make her bed, and how to throw the ball...! ☺

Bass Reeves

Bass Reeves wrote: »

It immaterial really we can see from this why people choose to use there car to work rather than public transport. Distance between Edenderry to Celbridge is 43KM. An efficient Deiesel car will do 20km to the litre so about 5.5/day in fuel costs and a 35 minute journey. As opposed to BE 53 euro/week for a 10 journey ticket or over 10 euro/day and a one hour journey. This is why rural Ireland was not in a panic with the BE strike for most workers BE is immaterial as they cannot afford to travel to and from work using BE. They are too expensive and journeys take too long as well as timetable not frequent enough

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If you read my previous post I was explaining why people outside the major cities choose to use cars rather than travel by bus to work. The reality is bust service is limited and in general schedule is poor so the choice is it is more efficient to own a car. In general people need to travel at other times as well for shopping, leisue activitied and if you have children for after school activities so in general a car is a necessity in Ireland outside larger urban area's unless you live adajcent to work

When you have a car it is usually much cheaper to drive to work withh added flexability of time efficiency rather than be dependent on public transport

You need to quantify the total cost of ownership.
Depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance & fuel. You are looking at just fuel.
LUNACY

Dravokivich

snowflaker wrote: »

Leap card does work on the 120

I doubt the leap card would be worth while as they are essentially tickets to Dublin City they'd be purchasing.

snowflaker

Dravokivich wrote: »

I doubt the leap card would be worth while as they are essentially tickets to Dublin City they'd be purchasing.

No - Edenderry to Celbridge

Dravokivich

snowflaker wrote: »

No - Edenderry to Celbridge

The zonal tickets are for to the city. Not between zones.

Bass Reeves

C3PO wrote: »

This is going way off topic but it would not be cheaper, never mind "way" cheaper, to use a car rather than public transport if you consider all of the cost of car ownership which I the point that Magicbastarder was making!

When you talk about Ireland outside the cities car owner is a necessity for virtuall al families and especially for people that work. It is interesting to see the high car ownership figure amoung non nationals who live in Ireland. What is really interesting most of these come from places where public transport is the norm but they find the Irish PT system inadeqaute and too expensive.

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Insurance for a 17 year old presumably fully licensed driver - €2k per annum minimum.
Motor Tax - Say €300.

Then you can add your fuel per trip and compare Bus vs Car.

I did not reccoment it for the 17 year old I was explaining that the high cost of public transport was discouraging people from PT use

magentis wrote: »

A 90km journey is going to take at least a gallon of fuel,I reckon the bus would actually be cheaper going on just fuel costs.Not to mind insurance,tax,maintenance,depreciation and the fact the girl would not have to drive,allowing some study time.Parking may also be an issue at the school.

Agreed 90 KN will use about 5 L ( a little over a gallon) of diesel in a fuel efficient car cost is Cost is 6.25. REturn ticket is 15 euro

lxflyer wrote: »

With regard to frequency, how many buses do you think should be operating on the 120 between Dublin and Edenderry?

Surely every 15 minutes in the morning peak extending out to hourly all day (half hourly from Clane inwards) isn't exactly unreasonable for that corridor?

Or did you even look at the timetables before making that comment?

120/121: http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1425902267-120.pdf

123: http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1425902310-123.pdf

No I did not look at this specific case. I was posting about the bus service in general in rural Ireland and how it encorages car ownership. It is even more stark than that it make people buy second cars and encorages car ownership amoung young aduls

Augeo wrote: »

You need to quantify the total cost of ownership.
Depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance & fuel. You are looking at just fuel.
LUNACY

The cost of car ownership is often exaggarated. What one need to look at what is will it cost some one vis a v a bus. As car ownership is considered a necessity outside the cities of Ireland busses compete in cost with cars in two particular senario's.

The first is where one already owns a car and the decision is whether use public transport or the car. This is noticeable with the low level of activity on rail to dublin vis a v people that use the motorways even for what are often day trips. Most diesel cars will exceed 18km/L so fuel costs are about 7c/km even with inefficent cars fuel costs are usually not much with 10c/KM

Where a PT system is in place and it is cheaper for an individual to drive a car by themselves rather than use PT you have to question the viability of that system . It should only be in multi user applications that a car is cheaper to run.

What is really interesting is the high level of 2nd and 3rd car ownership in Irish households. It is considered a virtual necessity to own a car if you want to work. Two yeas ago my daughter did an interview for summer work in food plant. She was asked if she had access to a car as the work was shift work not only that it was enquired if she would have priority access to that car.

If you look at the cost of running a second car you really question PT costs. A 10 year old car is in the 4.5K bracket ( Toyota Yaris, dieselcorolla, Diesel Kia ria, Hynudai I30 diesel Kia seed). Othe cars would be cheaper but percieved not as reliable. Running costs are virtually the same as on smaller petrol models cheap tax and insurance make up the difference in fuel costs.

Take a yaris that costs 4.5K at the end of 5 years it will have a residual value of 800-1K. Car tax is 199 euro, for an individual in there thirties insurance will be about 500 euro a set of tyres every second year200 euro NCT 50, maintenance 2-400 euro ( and I am being harsh at that).

That is about 1850 euro. In a case of some one with a round commute of 100km/day over a year that would be about 23000Km/year. the yaris will do over 45mpg or 16km/L so total fuel is 1437 L or about 1950 in fuel costs.

So total cost /year is 3800 euro to run a second car. This is not taking the flexability the second car offers and allows the individual to travel to and from work and lose no time waiting for a bus or having to get to and from bus pick up points.

Sorry about the delay posting I was busy the last few days.

Victor

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

I don't think thats right. Leaps website says trains and Cork city services, nothing about commuter services.

Some if the routes are hybrid city / commuter routes, e.g. 215, 220. http://www.buseireann.ie/inner.php?id=235
https://about.leapcard.ie/cork
http://www.irishrail.ie/fares-and-tickets/cork-cobh-midleton

Bass Reeves wrote: »

REturn ticket is 15 euro

But who buys the reurn ticket if travelling every day? You've already been told the following.

n97 mini wrote: »

Student 10 journey is EUR54.50, ie just under EUR11 return.

n97 mini wrote: »

Student 7-day Leap fare is EUR55. Slightly better value than a Student 10-journey ticket.

loyatemu

there's only about 150 days of school when you take out holidays, mid terms etc - so about €1650 for the year if you go with the 10 journey ticket which is less than half your original estimate. Still not great though.

Bass Reeves

Victor wrote: »

But who buys the reurn ticket if travelling every day? You've already been told the following.

Fuel costs are still only 50% of that cost. I was told an interesting fact or what the teller told me as fact. About 6 months ago he inquired about a yearly commuter ticket on a bus eireann route. He was inforned that yearly commuter tickets were only avaailable on the tax saver through an employer. I taught it strange that BE did not do yearly tickets for regular travellers for what ever reason they travel.

magentis

I would be surprised if a 10 journey child ticket would not be issued by a driver in this case anyway.The vast majority of 2nd level students are under 16.If the girl is in her uniform I don't think she would be questioned on it.

Bass Reeves

schemingbohemia wrote: »

How can she get a taxsaver ticket when she's a student? Or are you suggesting breaking the law?

magentis wrote: »

I would be surprised if a 10 journey child ticket would not be issued by a driver in this case anyway.The vast majority of 2nd level students are under 16.If the girl is in her uniform I don't think she would be questioned on it.

You better be careful we have been here before. There is a real issue with ticket structureing accross PT and with BE in particular. In thsi case it is the hoops that a parent has to jump through to get there child to school at a reasonable cost. But generally accross BE there is this issue where other find general cost too much. This is why we have such high car ownership figures and why people use cars instead of PT.

n97 mini

magentis wrote: »

I would be surprised if a 10 journey child ticket would not be issued by a driver in this case anyway.The vast majority of 2nd level students are under 16.If the girl is in her uniform I don't think she would be questioned on it.

Is that not fare evasion? Not good advice if so. It will result in a fine.

loyatemu

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You better be careful we have been here before. There is a real issue with ticket structureing accross PT and with BE in particular. In thsi case it is the hoops that a parent has to jump through to get there child to school at a reasonable cost. But generally accross BE there is this issue where other find general cost too much. This is why we have such high car ownership figures and why people use cars instead of PT.

that may be true, but in fairness travelling from Edenderry to school in Celbridge is a bit of a niche case.

LXFlyer

Bass Reeves wrote: »

No I did not look at this specific case. I was posting about the bus service in general in rural Ireland and how it encorages car ownership. It is even more stark than that it make people buy second cars and encorages car ownership amoung young aduls

Most households in Dublin have two cars, let alone rural Ireland being honest about it.

With respect it is pretty clear that you haven't actually looked at the changes to the PSO Network that the NTA have initiated over the recent years. There have been wholesale improvements to routes and timetables across the country to actually make them relevant to potential users, facilitating students, people attending hospitals, and commuters.

Of course there will be areas that just have limited services, but on most main corridors into commuter locations the frequency and routes have been ramped up - and it's pretty apparent to me that you aren't aware of these changes. It's pretty clear that the NTA strategy has been to switch the focus of BE onto commuter and inter-town services, and move the once per week social services over to the rural transport service (local link).

For sure there is still some considerable way to go but there have been marked improvements in service provision over the last five years, and that fact seem to have completely escaped you, considering you hadn't even bothered to look at the service levels on this corridor before making your comment.

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You better be careful we have been here before. There is a real issue with ticket structureing accross PT and with BE in particular. In thsi case it is the hoops that a parent has to jump through to get there child to school at a reasonable cost. But generally accross BE there is this issue where other find general cost too much. This is why we have such high car ownership figures and why people use cars instead of PT.

As above - this is hardly a typical example to base a wide ranging comment on. Very few children would be travelling that distance to/from school. There are plenty of reasonable ticketing options for what would be normal school commutes.