First Time Buyer - Wireless Monitored Alarm

KoolKid

Exactly. But your last line is the problem.

altor

Padraig1888 wrote: »

Didn't know that but €24.99 for the monitoring, maintenance and batteries is good value. They give you a guarantee on the price so no need to go elsewhere as long as they stick to their word and don't put the price up.

That is all well and good but some systems are locked to company's meaning you wont have the option to move.

puamch

Hi, can I ask which network is being discussed in above comment. Also how has your experience been so far. Thanks

Padraig1888

puamch wrote: »

Hi, can I ask which network is being discussed in above comment. Also how has your experience been so far. Thanks

Network Security. All good so far.

KoolKid

Until you need something added or replaced, or wish to switch to another installer.

El Legion

Hi,

I am a newbie to posting, so hope its ok to jump on this thread.
I have read of lot of the threads here and I am taking the advice and getting SDP after a onsite visit. I noted it will be a hybrid alarm as some parts are wired and we have a new extension ( we have bought a house that we are doing up)
reading through the threads here my preference is pointing towards Siemens or GSD.
one service provider is coming next week who does GDS for a review and quote
the other one I contacted in regard to Siemens said the following "With regard to the use of panel, unfortunately the wireless on the Seimans is poor and we stopped using it. We would use a lot of HKC but also have the option of using Texecom"
Has anyone any thoughts on this statement?. Texecom does not seem to be getting good review here

KoolKid

Seems like hes only interested in selling you the system he wants to install.
The Siemens Vandebilt wireless isn't poor it works fine. They just don't have wireless inertia sensors at the moment.
My preferences would be Vanderbilt or GSD also. We have plenty of both of these systems installed .
Whoever calls out to you tell them these are the systems you are interested in & please supply you with a SDP based on what you want, not what they want to sell you. If their experience is limited to one panel they are best avoided IMO.
If you are looking at self monitoring with apps also take a look at the sticky .
There is quite significant differences between whats available especially now that both Vanderbilt & GSD have free options with push notifications.

El Legion

Many Thanks KookKid, I was hoping you would reply.
I have 2 SDP's in writing, covering GSD and HKC.

I am looking for self monitoring, I raised why there seemed to be a €10 a month charge for the GSD app ( GSM Self Monitoring Via GSD Phone APP with Technical Support on App), and the response was that Self Monitoring with home wifi is free, but not as secure as 4G GSM monitoring, which is charged. Has anyone any thoughts on this?

bk

El Legion wrote: »

I am looking for self monitoring, I raised why there seemed to be a €10 a month charge for the GSD app ( GSM Self Monitoring Via GSD Phone APP with Technical Support on App), and the response was that Self Monitoring with home wifi is free, but not as secure as 4G GSM monitoring, which is charged. Has anyone any thoughts on this?

I suppose it is the idea that it would be relatively easy to cut the phone or coax cable going into a house. While 3G/4G is harder to jam, but still very much possible to jam.

However the statement isn't always true. Think of an apartment building feed by Fiber To The Home buried in the road. Short of a thief taking a JCB to the road, then the broadband monitoring will be much more secure.

El Legion

Thanks bk, I think I many stay with the Wifi, and save the €120 annual fee and keep an eye out for JCB's!

2011

El Legion wrote: »

Thanks bk, I think I many stay with the Wifi, and save the €120 annual fee and keep an eye out for JCB's!

Either way don't avail of any insurance discount offered for having an alarm.

The reason is that there are conditions attached in the small print that can make your policy null & void :eek:

fred funk }{

El Legion wrote: »

Many Thanks KookKid, I was hoping you would reply.
I have 2 SDP's in writing, covering GSD and HKC.

I am looking for self monitoring, I raised why there seemed to be a €10 a month charge for the GSD app ( GSM Self Monitoring Via GSD Phone APP with Technical Support on App), and the response was that Self Monitoring with home wifi is free, but not as secure as 4G GSM monitoring, which is charged. Has anyone any thoughts on this?

Are GSD charging €10 per month for their app?

derekbro

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Are GSD charging €10 per month for their app?

As far as I'm aware it's for the international SIM and charges, I've received 2 different quotes, one 7 per month and one 45 per year. Can someone confirm if it's possible to get your own sim or use wifi and still be able to use the app without a subscription?

kub

El Legion wrote: »

Thanks bk, I think I many stay with the Wifi, and save the €120 annual fee and keep an eye out for JCB's!

You get what you pay for, if your electricity fails you will be notified of a comms failure, your alarm system will still be functioning as it has battery back up.
If however your place is broken into during a power cut, then you cannot be notified of an alarm activation.
But still up € 120 per year, so happy days.

El Legion

derekbro wrote: »

As far as I'm aware it's for the international SIM and charges, I've received 2 different quotes, one 7 per month and one 45 per year. Can someone confirm if it's possible to get your own sim or use wifi and still be able to use the app without a subscription?

The installer told me with the wifi the self monitoring app is free, and it is not possible to use own sim in GSD alarm, rather need to pay that €10 euro a month on a 12 month contract

bk

kub wrote: »

You get what you pay for, if your electricity fails you will be notified of a comms failure, your alarm system will still be functioning as it has battery back up.
If however your place is broken into during a power cut, then you cannot be notified of an alarm activation.
But still up € 120 per year, so happy days.

Stick your broadband router/wifi on a UPS and it will continue to work during a power outage and cost a lot less then €120 per year.

Of course it is all a trade off of cost versus risk.

Even a notification of a comms failure might be enough for many people, if you get on well with your neighbours, you could ask them to check on your place. Do they have power? etc.

But you are right, it is all about different risk profiles. It might be needed for someone living in an isolated rural house. But would be overkill for someone living in a city center apartment.

2011

bk wrote: »

Stick your broadband router/wifi on a UPS and it will continue to work during a power outage and cost a lot less then €120 per year.

Of course it is all a trade off of cost versus risk.

Even a notification of a comms failure might be enough for many people, if you get on well with your neighbours, you could ask them to check on your place. Do they have power? etc.

But you are right, it is all about different risk profiles. It might be needed for someone living in an isolated rural house. But would be overkill for someone living in a city center apartment.

Exactly a power cut doesn’t have to defeat an alarm so why should it have to defeat a router? It is not rocket science it is just applying the same solution to the same problem.

kub

bk wrote: »

Stick your broadband router/wifi on a UPS and it will continue to work during a power outage and cost a lot less then €120 per year.

Of course it is all a trade off of cost versus risk.

Even a notification of a comms failure might be enough for many people, if you get on well with your neighbours, you could ask them to check on your place. Do they have power? etc.

But you are right, it is all about different risk profiles. It might be needed for someone living in an isolated rural house. But would be overkill for someone living in a city center apartment.

That would be a very impressive UPS if it can power the local exchange as well.

2011

kub wrote: »

That would be a very impressive UPS if it can power the local exchange as well.

My broadband doesn’t have a powered exchange

bk

kub wrote: »

That would be a very impressive UPS if it can power the local exchange as well.

If your local exchange goes down, then it is likely your local mobile mast has already gone down.

Exchanges tend to be well backed up by UPS's, redundant power supplies, even diesel generators. Eir has legal requirements on redundancy that go far beyond what is required of mobile companies.

Actually it is most likely that the mobile masts are using the fiber backhaul of the local exchange anyway.

If you are talking about this level of outage, neighbours will be out on the road to chat and a burglar would likely be noticed. Plus expect ESB and maybe even Gardai to be around, a major power outage like this attracts a lot of attention and is probably the worst time to try and break in.

Truth is 3G/4G isn't very reliable at all, kind of a crappy comms channel. It has only become popular due to the risk of people cutting phone/coax cables into homes. But overall it is less reliable then a protected hard wire connection and over course it is open to jamming.

Truth is their is really no guarantees with any of them.

KoolKid

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Are GSD charging €10 per month for their app?

No, You know they dont.:pac:

kub

bk wrote: »

If your local exchange goes down, then it is likely your local mobile mast has already gone down.

Exchanges tend to be well backed up by UPS's, redundant power supplies, even diesel generators. Eir has legal requirements on redundancy that go far beyond what is required of mobile companies.

Actually it is most likely that the mobile masts are using the fiber backhaul of the local exchange anyway.

If you are talking about this level of outage, neighbours will be out on the road to chat and a burglar would likely be noticed. Plus expect ESB and maybe even Gardai to be around, a major power outage like this attracts a lot of attention and is probably the worst time to try and break in.

Truth is 3G/4G isn't very reliable at all, kind of a crappy comms channel. It has only become popular due to the risk of people cutting phone/coax cables into homes. But overall it is less reliable then a protected hard wire connection and over course it is open to jamming.

Truth is their is really no guarantees with any of them.

There is a lot to be said for the old fashioned way, radio communicators.

But of course, horses for courses.

KoolKid

bk wrote: »

Stick your broadband router/wifi on a UPS and it will continue to work during a power outage and cost a lot less then €120 per year.

Of course it is all a trade off of cost versus risk.

Even a notification of a comms failure might be enough for many people, if you get on well with your neighbours, you could ask them to check on your place. Do they have power? etc.

But you are right, it is all about different risk profiles. It might be needed for someone living in an isolated rural house. But would be overkill for someone living in a city center apartment.

Its all down to the notification you get & how quick you get it.

If all your comms are down you need to know about it quickly GSD s can notify you in 5 minutes , HKC is 5 hours. Instantly for smash & grab scenarios.
Using monitoring here the monitoring station will also contact you within 15 minutes.

fred funk }{

KoolKid wrote: »

No, You know they dont.:pac:

What's the €10 per month for? The sim?

bk

KoolKid wrote: »

Its all down to the notification you get & how quick you get it.

Absolutely, my logitech circle camera seems to notify me within 1 minute of being offline and mere seconds when movement detected. Pretty damn impressive.

altor

bk wrote: »

I suppose it is the idea that it would be relatively easy to cut the phone or coax cable going into a house. While 3G/4G is harder to jam, but still very much possible to jam.

However the statement isn't always true. Think of an apartment building feed by Fiber To The Home buried in the road. Short of a thief taking a JCB to the road, then the broadband monitoring will be much more secure.

That's just it though. Most new houses have easy access to cables, be that the electrical supply or telephone cables. Apartments would also have a comms room which houses these.
It's not digging up the road either in most cases as they have service boxes in most estates.

bk

altor wrote: »

That's just it though. Most new houses have easy access to cables, be that the electrical supply or telephone cables. Apartments would also have a comms room which houses these.
It's not digging up the road either in most cases as they have service boxes in most estates.

Ah now, I've been in my apartment buildings comms room. It is in the underground carpark, itself behind gates and CCTV cameras, behind two very solid utility doors. Only one of a dozen similar doors in the carpark, no indication which one is the comms room.

And if they do take it out, they have now taken out 100 apartments BB. People are going to notice, both neighbours and telecoms company.

We are really heading into mission impossible level stuff. I can totally see someone cutting an individual homes comms/power, but taking out entire apartment buildings/estates worth of power or comms is going to bring a level of attention that most thieves don't want.

And the point is, either way I still end up getting a "system offline notification", which personally I'd treat no different to "alarm activated notification", I'd be straight onto my neighbours to check if their power/bb is still up and if they could check on my place.

If someone is willing to take out a whole building/estates power/comms then they probably have GSM jammers too and you back to just getting a "system offline notification".

In the end, there is no such thing as perfect security. That is why we have home insurance to cover us.

But thanks for the ideas, it is really fun to think about these sort of things.

altor

bk wrote: »

Ah now, I've been in my apartment buildings comms room. It is in the underground carpark, itself behind gates and CCTV cameras, behind two very solid utility doors. Only one of a dozen similar doors in the carpark, no indication which one is the comms room.

And if they do take it out, they have now taken out 100 apartments BB. People are going to notice, both neighbours and telecoms company.

We are really heading into mission impossible level stuff. I can totally see someone cutting an individual homes comms/power, but taking out entire apartment buildings/estates worth of power or comms is going to bring a level of attention that most thieves don't want.

And the point is, either way I still end up getting a "system offline notification", which personally I'd treat no different to "alarm activated notification", I'd be straight onto my neighbours to check if their power/bb is still up and if they could check on my place.

If someone is willing to take out a whole building/estates power/comms then they probably have GSM jammers too and you back to just getting a "system offline notification".

In the end, there is no such thing as perfect security. That is why we have home insurance to cover us.

But thanks for the ideas, it is really fun to think about these sort of things.

It sure is.
Like I said, its access that can be got at. Your apartment comms sounds secure. Most others are not so lucky, same with having neighbours around to check out your place.
It's the world we live in unfortunately. Mission impossible does not come into it as I've seen it done, even in apartments blocks. I do agree houses would be higher risk with the ease of the facility's locations.

KoolKid

fred funk }{ wrote: »

What's the €10 per month for? The sim?

Being in the business yourself you know it's not.
As you know individuals and individual company's sometimes charge more than others.

xlight

I am first time get into the alarm system. Is securigard a good/fair one? I am looking at the pre-wired self monitor one. The system is made by Pyronix. Can anyone recommend any self monitor one? Not necessary need an app to have the remote control ability. Thank you guys.