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DCM 2017 Mentored Novices Thread
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My week:
Monday - 5 mile easy - 7.87km @ 7:41
Tuesday - 5 mile easy - 9.08km @ 7:42
Wednesday - 10 mile easy - 16.57km @ 7:57
Thursday - rest
Friday - rest
Saturday - 20 mile LSR - 32.80 @ 8:24
Sunday - rest
Total = 66.31km
So, my longest long run now done. "Done" but not "ran". My previous longest run was 16 miles so I wanted to beat that at least, and I did. I did about 18 miles (29.25km) before I walked the remaining distance.
What I have categorically learned from this run is that there is no way I'll be able to run the whole marathon, no matter how slow and easy I take it in the early part of the race. My pacing was pretty much spot on for the first 25km-ish of this run. The last 4km were a huge effort, and I could give no more when I stopped to walk.
So, my question now is how to attack the marathon? I was thinking that now I know I can do 18 miles, I could run that, and walk the remaining 8. But (a), I seem to find races harder than training runs so there's no guarantee I'll even make it to 18 miles on the day (the crowds' support is great, but it's nearly hard not run a little faster than you should when you hear them cheering you on, at least that's my experience from the three race-series races), and (b), I'm not sure I'd have the energy to walk another 8 miles, as I know the last 2 miles on Saturday's 20 were tough enough.
My other thought is to run a distance that I'm relatively comfortable with, so say 22km, leaving a nice round 20km, and then alternating between walking 5km and running 5km (twice) to cross the line running at least. This is currently my prefered tactic.
Whichever way I cook it though, my predicted time of 5:40 is now highly unlikely. I calculated my time based on running 18 miles as I did on Saturday and walking 8 miles at the same pace I walked the last 2 on Saturday and I'm coming in at well over the 6 hours now.
There's a multitude of ways for you to approach this - all very valid - so dont be stressing, that just takes energy
You may be setting yourself up for an epic yet painful last few miles.
One possibility of your approach is that your body doesn't respond to being able to run again after walking for 5km - especially towards the end of the marathon.
Maybe think about walking earlier and more often, but for a smaller amount of time. e.g. Run 10k - walk 1k (1k is a long way and will take a while - you'll be well recovered after 1k) / or do it by time - run 40 mins, walk for 5 and repeat.
You can develop a number of combinations around this, BUT I would encourage you, if you think you need to walk - DONT leave it till you cant run anymore.0 -
BrownEyes79 wrote: »Even though it hurt you yesterday you should probably wear the same bra on marathon day since it’s broken in now!! If you wear a different one you’ll prob have the same problem but in new spots!
Skyblue have you no advice on sports bras.....
:D
My advice.....burn the bra!!! :-))0 -
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God no - had all my make up tattoo’d on before the day so i’d look good in all the photos. It’s important to be organized!
:pac::pac::pac::pac:El Caballo wrote: »Hey ariana. Sorry to hear about the injury and hopefully you get back on the road soon. I probably should've piped up earlier but I see this so often in logs and threads and rarely get listened to when I say it so have given up the ghost on saying it most of the time(not said it here I think but just years of it In general).
It's a classic novice mistake but easy runs and those paces are there for a reason, this is what training has become through over a 100 years of honing by some of the greatest coaches in history through experience and 100's of thousands of athletes before you guys. it feels unreal to blast out fast runs all the time but with experience comes knowledge that you have to manage that too with discipline and realise when it's time to push and time to hold back. There's an old saying about easy runs which goes that you should be embarrassed running that pace if a friend sees you. The purpose of them is to recover and improve low intensity fitness.
El Cab your advice on this thread has been excellent and appreciated, i've made a lot of notes on the back of your recent posts with regards to starting conservatively and so on. At the moment this current post feels a bit like 'salt in the wound' but that's my issue to deal with and i really hope others do read it and pay heed. I do remember in the early weeks having the mantra on my long runs of 'run slow and then slow it down more' and i think i was pretty good in the early weeks but then somewhere along the way i started concerning myself with other issues - fuel, distance, gear and the mantra got forgotten. I had 1 LSR that stands out at being way to fast for me and my PMP runs until recently were closer to 10m/HM paces. I had been more optimistic i guess when setting my PMP earlier on then and then i got caught in the rut of enjoying getting to stretch the legs a little bit one evening a week... well i'm paying the price now
This is pure gold and with just 3 weeks to go it's a timely reminder. Most of us will feel stronger as the distances we run get shorter in the taper. This isn't the time to bang in fast training runs. Remember in the boards and HH training plans there are no runs faster than PMP.
Ariana, I have to say this probably doesn't apply to you as in my role of Novices Group Strava Stalker I have noticed you are one of the best at keeping lsr, easy and recovery paces in the ranges they should be for your PMP and it was an area you paid particular attention to.
I appreciate the vote of confidence i really do but i'm not sure i deserve it AS i said above my MP runs have been a good 20-30 seconds/km faster than they should have been. In my defense i was more optimistic about my finishing time when i set my paces in the early stage. And also in my defense these paces still felt comfortable for the distances we covered but in hindsight, well.... look where i am now 
My advice.....burn the bra!!! :-))
:pac::pac::pac:Got a physio appointment tonight for 7 o clock with Aidan Woods, supposed to be really good. Will let yous know how I get on.
Brilliant. Do let us know how you get on.
I'm walking a bit more freely today. Still slight pain in the knee but no noticeable limp. Appointment for Wed.0 -
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Well the weekend was real busy for me, usually get out Sunday morning or even the afternoon if I can for my LSR and had planned on doing around 16 miles.
However with lots to do with the family the weekend, it was 7pm when I got a chance to go out. Was very tired going out, nearly thinking of not doing it but I got my gear on and went on my way. However in my rush out the door I forgot my 3 energy gels I had planned on taking. I got to 11 miles, still feeling good to be honest from an energy POV but my knees were killing me. Finished 12 miles, 4 short of my target and went home.
Feeling stiff under my knee joints today and my foot is sore too. After a good month of no niggles 0 -
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I appreciate the vote of confidence i really do but i'm not sure i deserve it AS i said above my MP runs have been a good 20-30 seconds/km faster than they should have been. In my defense i was more optimistic about my finishing time when i set my paces in the early stage. And also in my defense these paces still felt comfortable for the distances we covered but in hindsight, well.... look where i am
Ariana you have to stop being so hard on yourself. You are far from being the worst 'offender' at something we are all guilty of. I've seen people running 4/5 mile runs @ 7:xx to low 8 minute miles regularly when their HM race paces were in the high 8's. In the overall scheme of things you have trained well. Of course I'll point out that I'm only a novice too so my observations might well be pure and utter tosh!! :pac:
Re the next 3 weeks I'd strongly advise you take the advice of your physio. He/she is the only person with an intimate knowledge of your injury. Any advice from posters here, no matter how wellmeaning, may only make the issue worse. (Had this posted before I saw AMKs post. It's not meant to disagree with him. I was referring to novices advising each other on serious injury rehab)0 -
:pac::pac::pac::pac:
El Cab your advice on this thread has been excellent and appreciated, i've made a lot of notes on the back of your recent posts with regards to starting conservatively and so on. At the moment this current post feels a bit like 'salt in the wound' but that's my issue to deal with and i really hope others do read it and pay heed. I do remember in the early weeks having the mantra on my long runs of 'run slow and then slow it down more' and i think i was pretty good in the early weeks but then somewhere along the way i started concerning myself with other issues - fuel, distance, gear and the mantra got forgotten. I had 1 LSR that stands out at being way to fast for me and my PMP runs until recently were closer to 10m/HM paces. I had been more optimistic i guess when setting my PMP earlier on then and then i got caught in the rut of enjoying getting to stretch the legs a little bit one evening a week... well i'm paying the price now
Sorry about that, tact isn't exactly my strong point. I know it stings now but sometimes, salt is exactly what you need to for a wound to heal better. You can't change what happened now so the best thing you can do is learn from it. Again, Hopefully you get back on the road soon.0 -
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leesider77 wrote: »Finally, I'll probably be running on my own so really want to run with a pacing group. I'm running my long runs at 6:45 min kms which puts me between the 4:40 and 4:50 pacing groups. By now, I really don't think running any slower will help me run longer on the day. I'm thinking of starting at the back of the 4:40 group - they will be running 6:40 min kms. I don't expect to stay the full 26 miles with them and will end up drifting back. This will not demoralize me. And it allows plenty of time for a run walk strategy in last 10 kms so I get home with a 4 on the clock. I know this goes against all advice on banking time etc but does this apply to someone who knows they will be walking at some stage on the day?
I'll be interested to hear what the experts say. I'd be inclined to think that there is a direct correlation between pace and how long you can sustain an effort for. Believe it. You may still have to walk from time to time but probably a lot less than if you ran faster. 0 -
Ariana you have to stop being so hard on yourself. You are far from being the worst 'offender' at something we are all guilty of. I've seen people running 4/5 mile runs @ 7:xx to low 8 minute miles regularly when their HM race paces were in the high 8's. In the overall scheme of things you have trained well. Of course I'll point out that I'm only a novice too so my observations might well be pure and utter tosh!! :pac:Re the next 3 weeks I'd strongly advise you take the advice of your physio. He/she is the only person with an intimate knowledge of your injury. Any advice from posters here, no matter how wellmeaning, may only make the issue worse. (Had this posted before I saw AMKs post. It's not meant to disagree with him. I was referring to novices advising each other on serious injury rehab)
I will be doing exactly that don't you worry, i may suss out people's opinions on here but i'll be doing as i'm told by the expert
El Caballo wrote: »Sorry about that, tact isn't exactly my strong point. I know it stings now but sometimes, salt is exactly what you need to for a wound to heal better. You can't change what happened now so the best thing you can do is learn from it. Again, Hopefully you get back on the road soon.
I wasn't digging for an apology honestly, you're right in your posts! My pride is hurting as well as me knee i guess that's all :cool: but yip there's a lesson in it for sure 0 -
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