DCM 2017 Mentored Novices Thread

ariana`

Testosterscone wrote: »

Have used the below myself

www.startfitness.co.uk
www.wiggle.co.uk

Never had issues with either. Just worth noting that some of the non main street shops (your Amphibian King, Run Hub, Run Logic etc) are runners themselves and generally good about trying to do best deal for you where possible so might be worth holding off till you are buying a few things (clothes, gels etc) all at once and they will usually knock a bit off. Might not be huge amounts but between that and shipping costs added to the online stuff it might make the savings actually alot less and having the comfort of security of buying from a shop and supporting local business.

Just to add my experience of going to reputable running shop a couple of yrs back. I went intent on getting a new runners as Strava had kindly been telling me repeatedly that i needed a new pair! However the owner of the running shop took a look at my runners told me to ignore Strava that my runners were fine for another few miles. I was very surprised at his honesty as he was potentially doing himself out of a sale. I did end up buying a pair that day so i could start rotating. And ever since i try to support that shop in particular, i was so impressed with the service but sometimes unfortunately the opportunity to save €50 can be too much to ignore too.

positron

ariana` wrote: »

Well done on your 1st 10 miler.

Was that supposed to be a PMP run or an LSR? You mention is being your 1st 10 miler so i'm assuming it was your LSR in which case you started too fast (something we've all been guilty off :rolleyes:) unless you are targeting a marathon time of 3hrs 30min (maybe you are, i'm sorry i can't remember). Next time maybe start at 6:00min/km or slower and see how that goes for you? I always try to start nice & slow and then finish a little bit faster if i can... rather than watch the splits drop and drop which can be soul destroying.

The route sounds lovely, i'm jealous

Thanks ariana`, that was definitly my LSR for this week I think, I don't have a PMP worked out yet - I am still very much in the FSDD camp (Finish Somehow, Don't Die). But you are right, I think I should slow down even further if I want to run longer. My left glute is protesting, I could feel my right knee wasn't too happy either. Sounds like it's time to taper for the SOSAD 5k & Fingal 10k.

Baby75

leesider77 wrote: »

Very interesting! Do you not find that orange or apple juice is  'heavy' for your stomach during a run? I've a dodgy tummy at the best of times so not sure I could tolerate it.

Personally I have not, In saying that I have used it more on the bike than running. but if you were worried you could leave out the orange juice and try making the Isotonic drink with 40-80 grams sugar, 1 liter of water, 1/2 teaspoon of salt and a splash of cordial ( optional) .

Or another option is Tailwind http://www.tailwindnutrition.co.uk/category-16.html

Also try pretzels they have the carbohydrates and salts easier on delicate tummies as well

Dried fruit eg apricots, raisins, dates avoid dried apples ( they are harder to digest)

Honey in little sachets would be a good option ( I have looked on line for suppliers some on ebay maybe someone else would know were to get them)

I see some people are turning to baby food sachets instead of gels, they range from 60-120 calories per pouch and around 25+ grams of carbohydrates, these pouches are typically all natural and made of very few ingredients. read the nutritional information some will have more calories than others so you can pick the right ones.

I guess it is all trial and error and we need to find what works for us individually

Baby75

ariana` wrote: »

Very interesting, you probably shouldn't have told me that i will have you plagued with questions now :pac:

What is there difference between Iso & Hyper tonic? I can see the difference in the ratio of juice:water but i suppose more the difference between when you one need one over the other or why you would choose one over the other?
Hope i'm making sense. Thanks

I do not mind LOL I need the practice

Isotonic - Is a thirst quencher it provides energy and is absorbed the same as water so ideal for endurance sports

Hypertonic - supplies energy, it is taken up slower than water- ideal for less strenuous long duration exertions.

There is also Hypotonic - which is a thirst quencher, absorbed quicker than water and ideal for recreational sports

so depending on level of exertion and duration of exercise you can pick the correct one to suit your needs

The Black Oil

leesider77 wrote: »

Sorry for all the Qs this morning but was looking further ahead on the HH1 plan and notice that because of the HM we have no 18 mile run. Im worried that the jump from 16 to 20 will be too much for me. So how will I fit in an 18 mile too? I was thinking of changing the week 10 LSR to a 16 miles and doing 18 instead of the 16 on week 11. Would it be too much?

It is a jump from 16-20, for sure. I remember discussing it at the mini-meet up last year as the other two people were on the boards plan which had two 18 mile runs (iirc). My feeling is that if you stick to the HHN1 and training you'll be OK. I don't think it was a case of one week 16 miles, then next suddenly it's 20. There was probably a build up to it, usually after a long double digit one then it drops back the week after. However, I'd have to look at the spreadsheet again as I did not to the Half, nor did I chop and change the plan much. I was fine doing the 20, fwiw.

Post with spreadsheet. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=103520642&postcount=153

ariana`

leesider77 wrote: »

Sorry for all the Qs this morning but was looking further ahead on the HH1 plan and notice that because of the HM we have no 18 mile run. Im worried that the jump from 16 to 20 will be too much for me. So how will I fit in an 18 mile too? I was thinking of changing the week 10 LSR to a 16 miles and doing 18 instead of the 16 on week 11. Would it be too much?

It's also a big jump from 20 to 26.2 Maybe having made the jump from 16 - 20 will give you a confidence boost for D-day.

On the Boards plan we had a jump from 10 - 13 m this past week and i have to say the thought of it was worse than the reality (although i did cut it short by about 200m, oooops :P)

leesider77

ariana` wrote: »

It's also a big jump from 20 to 26.2 Maybe having made the jump from 16 - 20 will give you a confidence boost for D-day.

On the Boards plan we had a jump from 10 - 13 m this past week and i have to say the thought of it was worse than the reality (although i did cut it short by about 200m, oooops :P)

Ha Ha - I am fully aware of this jump alright but figured that it will be acceptable to shuffle/crawl over the finish line on DCM day - think Id get a few funny looks if I did the same in the Phoenix Park ;)

Damo 2k9

Made the switch to Strava from MapMyRun this week, still prefer MapMyRun but I like the clubs part on Strava, great seeing everyones progress in the DCM Novice group.

Everytime im out running and see others running too, I always wonder are they on this thread, do they post in here etc :pac: Weird I know, I always say hello anyways haha!

muddypaws

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

Made the switch to Strava from MapMyRun this week, still prefer MapMyRun but I like the clubs part on Strava, great seeing everyones progress in the DCM Novice group.

Everytime im out running and see others running too, I always wonder are they on this thread, do they post in here etc :pac: Weird I know, I always say hello anyways haha!

I'm the same, gutted to realise that someone from the Strava group was a pacer at a park run I did a few weeks ago, I saw her a few times but didn't realise it was her at the time, but then I did it again on Saturday, she was run director, I even spoke to her! Next time I will definitely make our boards sisterhood known to her

Just in from a 3 mile easy run that was anything but. I was absolutely shattered and really had to drag myself out but got round. I took a gel to see if it would help and if my stomach would be ok. I did get cramps after 2 miles and was worried that the unthinkable might happen - didn't dare to fart just in case but made it home safely.

AuldManKing

skyblue46 wrote: »

This is what scares me about the Fingal... 4 weeks of plodding relatively speaking and then a run at a pace at least a minute faster per km than anything done in a month. :eek:

Just remember that your not training for a 10k - just 4x10k and a bit at the end

Another thing is that the event you are training for is at the end of October - no one (from here) should be at peak fitness in July for a 10k.

If the race doesn't go well for you - DON'T DESPAIR - just remember that you are training for a different event in 14-15 weeks time.

Don't compare different peoples progress and results with your own - we're all different animals and take to training differently.

ariana` wrote: »

I know everyone is different but can anyone recommend where to even start with gels? Or is there any real food alternative that is easy to carry & eat on a run. I am clueless.

I buy a few sorts of gels - I have the Kenitica cola flavoured ones that you can take without water - these have salt in them and some have caffeine. These are pretty quick to take and generally go down well for me.

I also use the Gu ones - these are thicker and often take me a while (maybe 1/4 mile)to get through, but thats ok as they are good on the tummy and you get a feeling that you are having real food .

I take these near water stations as you'll need water to wash them down.

The interesting thing about Gels is that everyone is different with consistencies and flavours.
Someone above mentioned the High 5 ones - I despise these and find they make me sick - but lots swear by them.

Get a few different sorts (just 1 of each) and try them over the next few weeks - preferably while running a long run or at Marathon Pace.

Just watch the shot blocks as it can take a few of them to have the same effect as 1 gel - if you can stomach them and dont mind having a few of them every now and then - then great - but make sure you are aware of the carb intake of any fuel

You'll soon get a feel for what you like.

skyblue46

AuldManKing wrote: »

Just remember that your not training for a 10k - just 4x10k and a bit at the end

Another thing is that the event you are training for is at the end of October - no one (from here) should be at peak fitness in July for a 10k.

If the race doesn't go well for you - DON'T DESPAIR - just remember that you are training for a different event in 14-15 weeks time.

Don't compare different peoples progress and results with your own - we're all different animals and take to training differently.

Ah I'll be fine whatever the outcome. Scared was too strong a word to use haha. I'll give it a good crack and if I blow up then I'll jog to the end. Happy with the way training is going. :-))

clickerquicklic

skyblue46 wrote: »

This is what scares me about the Fingal... 4 weeks of plodding relatively speaking and then a run at a pace at least a minute faster per km than anything done in a month. :eek:

I scares me also! , yesterday I left the house and did a 2k warm up then 7k at PMP, my initial warm up was 5:50 pace and my PMP pace target of 4:30 felt harder than it should of and I get home thinking I'm never running sub 4 min pace for 10k on Sunday.

Roll onto today and I get up tired and run to work, first 3k i'm going 5:30 pace its easy but legs feel heavy like I've lead in my runners , next thing a guy passes me by running so I decide to stay with him , I run alongside him for next 7k at 4:30 pace and it feels effortless , he turned off and I did rest of distance alone at around same pace.

I think we will benefit from the crowd and hopefully find someone to follow running the same pace.
My plan now is to jump out and start the first 500metres at 3:30-3:45 pace and then let the pace drop back to 4:00 pace for Fingal , that might be a really bad strategy? But i find it easier going fast first then slowing psychologically.

Battery Kinzie

Did 16k this morning as per the Meno plan. Was tired enough during work, but nothing terrible. I think I could get used to these long mid-week runs, they're a good confidence boost.

Battery Kinzie

clickerquicklic wrote: »

I scares me also! , yesterday I left the house and did a 2k warm up then 7k at PMP, my initial warm up was 5:50 pace and my PMP pace target of 4:30 felt harder than it should of and I get home thinking I'm never running sub 4 min pace for 10k on Sunday.

Roll onto today and I get up tired and run to work, first 3k i'm going 5:30 pace its easy but legs feel heavy like I've lead in my runners , next thing a guy passes me by running so I decide to stay with him , I run alongside him for next 7k at 4:30 pace and it feels effortless , he turned off and I did rest of distance alone at around same pace.

I think we will benefit from the crowd and hopefully find someone to follow running the same pace.
My plan now is to jump out and start the first 500metres at 3:30-3:45 pace and then let the pace drop back to 4:00 pace for Fingal , that might be a really bad strategy? But i find it easier going fast first then slowing psychologically.

We have very similar goals, and my plan is to go out @4min/km to start, and even if I'm a few seconds slower than this for the first k or so, that's grand. I'll then ramp up a bit if I have it in me around half way. I'd be wary of going out that fast at the start as I know from previous races I've done that I'd get caught up in believing I could keep that pace up, and then by halfway I'm bolloxed and struggle to keep pace.

But sure you know yourself best, and even if it goes tits up, you'll have the experience of it all and know for next time.

Singer

clickerquicklic wrote: »

My plan now is to jump out and start the first 500metres at 3:30-3:45 pace and then let the pace drop back to 4:00 pace for Fingal , that might be a really bad strategy? But i find it easier going fast first then slowing psychologically.

Don't do that! It's a waste of energy and puts you in all sorts of debt. Stick to 4:00 pace from the start, maybe even slightly slower. Pick things up in the second half, and enjoy passing the fast starters out.

skyblue46

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

Made the switch to Strava from MapMyRun this week, still prefer MapMyRun but I like the clubs part on Strava, great seeing everyones progress in the DCM Novice group.

Everytime im out running and see others running too, I always wonder are they on this thread, do they post in here etc :pac: Weird I know, I always say hello anyways haha!

Yeah I enjoy looking at the novices Strava page too though at this stage I haven't worked out who too many of the regular posters are!

Testosterscone

skyblue46 wrote: »

Yeah I enjoy looking at the novices Strava page too though at this stage I haven't worked out who too many of the regular posters are!

Wait till you try introduce yourself under your username at races.

Spent years introducing myself as ecoli haha

AuldManKing

Testosterscone wrote: »

Wait till you try introduce yourself under your username at races.

Spent years introducing myself as ecoli haha

could of been worse - remember 'RunningKing' what an egotistical fart he was.

Newbie xx

clickerquicklic wrote: »

My plan now is to jump out and start the first 500metres at 3:30-3:45 pace and then let the pace drop back to 4:00 pace for Fingal , that might be a really bad strategy? But i find it easier going fast first then slowing psychologically.

Singer wrote: »

Don't do that! It's a waste of energy and puts you in all sorts of debt. Stick to 4:00 pace from the start, maybe even slightly slower. Pick things up in the second half, and enjoy passing the fast starters out.

I agree don't go to fast to soon, better to conserve at the start, wouldn't you rather have a super last few k's .Also bear in mind the start is a slight incline.

quickbeam

So, is there a novices meet before or after the Fingal 10K?

The Muppet

Testosterscone wrote: »

skyblue46 wrote: »

Yeah I enjoy looking at the novices Strava page too though at this stage I haven't worked out who too many of the regular posters are!

Wait till you try introduce yourself under your username at races.

Spent years introducing myself as ecoli haha

Ha Ha could be worse . "Hi I'm the muppet" lol .

D3PO

Rather belatedly week 5 of training completed

Tuesday 8.8km Easy 5.45km pace - felt great, really comfortable.

Wednesday 50 mins cycling

Thursday 8.5km Was supposed to be at PMP but my body just went into shutdown. First 5km I'm labored to keeping to PMP before I literally ground to a halt. Kms 7 & 8 were slower than 7 mins a KM. I had a mental battle just to keep going and not to stop. I just felt awful

Friday 7.5km Recovery 6.20 km pace

Saturday 14.7km long run 6.05km pace. Legs felt just as bad as they did on Thursday and I was thinking uh oh this could be a disaster. Felt leggy the whole way through and the biggest thing for me was winning the mental battle with myself when my head was just telling me to knock it on the head after 7 miles.

Kept going though and glad I did. Bizarrely even though my legs felt like lead the data says my body wasn't taxed at all. HR average was just 117 BPM yet somehow the run was still a struggle. I'm not entirely sure if that's a sign of overtraining and not letting my legs recover or what ?

Any insight greatly appreciated.

smashiner

D3PO wrote: »

Rather belatedly week 5 of training completed

Tuesday 8.8km Easy 5.45km pace - felt great, really comfortable.

Wednesday 50 mins cycling

Thursday 8.5km Was supposed to be at PMP but my body just went into shutdown. First 5km I'm labored to keeping to PMP before I literally ground to a halt. Kms 7 & 8 were slower than 7 mins a KM. I had a mental battle just to keep going and not to stop. I just felt awful

Friday 7.5km Recovery 6.20 km pace

Saturday 14.7km long run 6.05km pace. Legs felt just as bad as they did on Thursday and I was thinking uh oh this could be a disaster. Felt leggy the whole way through and the biggest thing for me was winning the mental battle with myself when my head was just telling me to knock it on the head after 7 miles.

Kept going though and glad I did. Bizarrely even though my legs felt like lead the data says my body wasn't taxed at all. HR average was just 117 BPM yet somehow the run was still a struggle. I'm not entirely sure if that's a sign of overtraining and not letting my legs recover or what ?

Any insight greatly appreciated.

Don't be too hard on yourself D3PO, there will be days/weeks where training doesn't go well and it may knock your confidence. It might just be a 'bad week' for you, maybe look at your fuelling such as electrolyte levels and pre and post work out meals, as I personally found that was/is an issue for me when building up the miles.

Marathon training can also affect your immune system and tiredness can also be a factor, taking a day or two off and coming back fresh can sometimes be of huge benefit. A good tip to all Novices is to keep your vitamin C levels up with fruit or a 'Rubex' vitamin C drink (or similar), it worked for me in the past.

I also would be a fan of the odd 'jelly baby' for the longer runs for a bit of a sugar kick that can get you through the last few miles of an LSR. I have also stopped using lucozade in recent years and switched over to 'HIGH 5' (zero cal, zero sugar) electrolyte tablets in water and found them great for the longer runs.

Might just be a bad week, dust yourself down take a day or two off and get back in the saddle for weekend and your body will probably thank you for it

ariana`

AuldManKing wrote: »

I buy a few sorts of gels - I have the Kenitica cola flavoured ones that you can take without water - these have salt in them and some have caffeine. These are pretty quick to take and generally go down well for me.

I also use the Gu ones - these are thicker and often take me a while (maybe 1/4 mile)to get through, but thats ok as they are good on the tummy and you get a feeling that you are having real food .

I take these near water stations as you'll need water to wash them down.

The interesting thing about Gels is that everyone is different with consistencies and flavours.
Someone above mentioned the High 5 ones - I despise these and find they make me sick - but lots swear by them.

Get a few different sorts (just 1 of each) and try them over the next few weeks - preferably while running a long run or at Marathon Pace.

Just watch the shot blocks as it can take a few of them to have the same effect as 1 gel - if you can stomach them and dont mind having a few of them every now and then - then great - but make sure you are aware of the carb intake of any fuel

You'll soon get a feel for what you like.

Thanks. I'll visit the running store on Fri and see what they stock. I like the sound of the cola flavour

skyblue46 wrote: »

Yeah I enjoy looking at the novices Strava page too though at this stage I haven't worked out who too many of the regular posters are!

No me neither. I haven't figured anyone out yet even though you'd think it should be very obvious when we're posting our run reports here as well. I would like to find a couple that are around the same level as myself to follow more closely but its not very obvious yet or maybe i just haven't taken the time to figure it out.

Does anyone even know how many of us there are now?

deisedude

I have shin splints in my left leg after a hard track session on Monday

Its annoying more than anything else. I'm able to run through it fine

Any suggestions to get it to go away or how to prevent in future?

brownbinman

deisedude wrote: »

I have shin splints in my left leg after a hard track session on Monday

Its annoying more than anything else. I'm able to run through it fine

Any suggestions to get it to go away or how to prevent in future?

Join the club! I'm (hopefully) coming through them. Has pain last week but eased over few days. Went physio and was given some specific stretches. Physio told me my hips might need strengthening as when doing squats or lunges my hips would wobble.

She also said it was common this time of year as milage starts going up and for me it may have been from doing hills my legs weren't able for

Might be worth going to one yourself. I've been cycling around 3 times and swimming twice to keep my legs going.

Back in physio Monday so fingers crossed

deisedude

brownbinman wrote: »

Join the club! I'm (hopefully) coming through them. Has pain last week but eased over few days. Went physio and was given some specific stretches. Physio told me my hips might need strengthening as when doing squats or lunges my hips would wobble.

She also said it was common this time of year as milage starts going up and for me it may have been from doing hills my legs weren't able for

Might be worth going to one yourself. I've been cycling around 3 times and swimming twice to keep my legs going.

Back in physio Monday so fingers crossed

Great advice, thank you

ariana`

deisedude wrote: »

I have shin splints in my left leg after a hard track session on Monday

Its annoying more than anything else. I'm able to run through it fine

Any suggestions to get it to go away or how to prevent in future?

You got great advice from brownbinman already. Hopefully you will have a speedy recovery. Have you tried foam rolling?

brownbinman wrote: »

Join the club! I'm (hopefully) coming through them. Has pain last week but eased over few days. Went physio and was given some specific stretches. Physio told me my hips might need strengthening as when doing squats or lunges my hips would wobble.

She also said it was common this time of year as milage starts going up and for me it may have been from doing hills my legs weren't able for

Might be worth going to one yourself. I've been cycling around 3 times and swimming twice to keep my legs going.

Back in physio Monday so fingers crossed

Good to hear you're improving and well done on staying active, i'm sure that will stand to you. I suggest you bring the training plan with you to the physio next week? She may tailor it slightly so you get back running more gradually to avoid a set back.

brownbinman

ariana` wrote: »

Have you tried foam rolling?

Foam rolling is also key. I YouTubed a good few but found this lady good https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2G5WCJBpps

I suggest you bring the training plan with you to the physio next week? She may tailor it slightly so you get back running more gradually to avoid a set back.

very good idea, will definitely do that

Baby75

deisedude wrote: »

I have shin splints in my left leg after a hard track session on Monday

Its annoying more than anything else. I'm able to run through it fine

Any suggestions to get it to go away or how to prevent in future?

RICE !!! possibly some anti inflammatory gel to rub in or tablets, I am only starting to feel right today mine came on in my left leg after a very fast 4km race I kept running ( I was massaging and and icing when I came in from a run) but it just got worse to the point it really hurt to walk down the stairs or actually walk full stop. I am pretty sure mine was caused by a tight calf muscle ( from an old injury a few months back)

But I suffered with them when I first started running, I found using some oil and a ruler and massaging up and down along the problem area first and then all around the calf, I wore compression socks and taped my shins when training I took a few days off at one point as they were just to sore to run on.
Stretching your shins and calf muscles before and after running mine were posterior shin splints there is exercises you can do to help strengthen shins

also check your runners do you need new ones I hope that helps

I was just coming to post that today is the first day I have been able to walk pain free and ran with the kids to get out of the rain and no pain!!! whoo hoo back to running only do I run tomorrow or wait ,I really wanted to run the planned LSR this weekend, I have been cross training all week by cycling