DCM 2017 Mentored Novices Thread

Singer

ariana` wrote: »

Just found out I have to go to America for a week from Sept 25th-Oct 2nd. Couldn't be worse timing in terms of training, the 2nd 20 miler is that weekend and a long mid week run too. Any advice on how to manage this?? I will hopefully run while over there i hope but 20 miles will be difficult and most likely i won't be sleeping or eating as good as normal either. Bad timing. I'm feeling very worried and upset about it right now.

When I went to the states recently I did a long run before my flight over, and a long run on the morning before my flight back. I didn't have to be at the airport early for either flight though, so that mightn't suit. In general I've managed to run plenty while in the USA, using the jetlag to get out at 5 in the morning or whatever

If you do attempt something like a 20 miler while over there, it's best to be a loop so if the jetlag/travel catches up with you it's easy to cut it short.

ariana`

Singer wrote: »

When I went to the states recently I did a long run before my flight over, and a long run on the morning before my flight back. I didn't have to be at the airport early for either flight though, so that mightn't suit. In general I've managed to run plenty while in the USA, using the jetlag to get out at 5 in the morning or whatever

If you do attempt something like a 20 miler while over there, it's best to be a loop so if the jetlag/travel catches up with you it's easy to cut it short.

Thanks for all the tips. I wouldn't have thought of checking out a local club. I'm going to Chicago. A week later and I could've done Chicago marathon lol!!! I'll take all the tips given and jig things around as best I can. I'm thinking if I even do 13/14m LSR over there then I'll still have 1 x 20m under the belt and I have 18m the following weekend. 18m will bring me over 3 hrs and it's questionable how much benefit running over 3 hrs is I believe? Or maybe i am clutching at straws lol. Thanks all :-)

Damo 2k9

Bit late but it keeps me sane posting these, and also makes me feel like im sticking to it properly now :pac: Was nice to get back into a rhythm after holidays!

Tuesday: 3 miles @ 07:14 pace, after getting my new runners I was buzzing and felt like I could go forever! Felt like a tiny blister on my second toe in after the run, hopefully doesnt happen again.

Wednesday 4/4.1 miles @ 08:06 pace, slowed down tonight and took it easy. Getting bored of my usual route so done it backwards, its the little things :pac:

Thursday 4/4.3 miles @ 07:48 min/mi pace. Had to pop down and collect something off someone, so was chatting to them for a few and then again around the corner to someone else, not ideal but sure look. Went a little over but was a nice run. No blisters after the 2 runs, thank god for that.

Sunday Fingal 10k (6.3 miles @ 7:02 average pace). Was a brilliant race, was delighted I stuck to my plan and I probably could have taken a few seconds off in the earlier km, I loved the rush to the finish to get sub 45 tho! Planned on close to sub 50, delighted in the end.


Buzzing for this weeks running, really excited for my 10 miles on the weekend as this will be the longest one by a jump of 4 miles but I am looking forward to it! New earphones and a phone armband hopefully on the way soon too, sick of carrying my phone :P

Candamir

ariana` wrote: »

Just found out I have to go to America for a week from Sept 25th-Oct 2nd. Couldn't be worse timing in terms of training, the 2nd 20 miler is that weekend and a long mid week run too. Any advice on how to manage this?? I will hopefully run while over there i hope but 20 miles will be difficult and most likely i won't be sleeping or eating as good as normal either. Bad timing. I'm feeling very worried and upset about it right now.

Hi Ariana, I'm long haul crew so do a fair amount of running in the US. I havent trained for a marathon before, but I've done plenty of runs in the 10-12 mile bracket with no problems at all. Quite a few of my colleagues are marathon runners and there's one guy who does iron man triathlons, so it's certainly possible! Chicago is a great place to run - there's a park/path that runs along the lakeshore and has runners and cyclists on it from early morning. There's also loads of water fountains on it so you won't have to worry about bringing water. And it's flat😄 On longer runs I usually put $20 and my phone with the uber/lyft app in my shorts pocket for emergencies. End of September the weather should be cooling down nicely too. A few tips - from my own experience, although everyone is different. Plan to run early - the temps will be pleasant and your body will be on 'daytime'. You'll start to flag in the late afternoon evening, so I wouldn't plan to do much then. More importantly, I'd try not to plan to do too much the day you get home or even the day after that. Jet lag is much worse travelling east. The day I get home I usually get a few hours sleep, go for a brisk walk and then try to get to bed at a reasonable time. You'll get a second wind in the late evening and you can easily find yourself wide awake at 2 or 3 am! The jet lag tends to go on and on if that happens! Enjoy the trip and try not to stress too much about the training.

excitementcity

Lazare wrote: »

Great post excitementcity, I've got to check out that doc, is it on Netflix?

Really enjoyed all of today's posting. Well done all.

Cheers Lazare! I think it was YouTube it was on. It was short but good

Wubble Wubble

D3PO wrote: »

well just looking at my next few weeks training schedule completely oblivious to the fact the rock n roll half is now less than 3 weeks away !!

In my head my next race was going to be the Frank Duffy 10 miler. From my training schedule I wont have gone beyond 12 miles for an LSR before the rock n roll.

Im signed up to the Dublin Half aswell so do I just use the rock n roll as a training run as an LSR and use the Dublin as a proper gauge on my conditionn ? Or do I try and do a modest enough pace for sub 4 hr training (aim to go with the 2 hour pacers or the 1 hr 55)

In this case, it might not be a great idea to race the R'N'R? It fits in perfectly for LSR purposes however. Racing the FD10 could be a more realistic option for you. 5 weeks out from DCM, the race series half will give you a far better idea of where you stand in relation to sub 4. Best of luck and keep us posted

Sheep1978

Whats the thoughts on doing a LSR (approx. 14m) on Fri evening and another (15m) on say next Wed evening. Too close together or should that be ok.?

choons

Some more stuff I've leaned from the first race and general training:

• Arrive early for races - get your bearings, drop your bag and get first pick of where you want to start in the crowd. Arrive late and you might end up flustered and have to start too far back.
  
  
• Think about clothes - wear something light if it's warm or humid. I was too hot in a baggy t-shirt.
  
  
• Water station did not work for me - First time passing one I thought I'd try it. Knocked me out of rhythm and the small amount I swallowed felt like it sat in my throat rather than going down! "Unthought Known" posted a technique or you can stop for 5 seconds and take a drink.
  
  
• Taking big deep breaths gave me bursts of energy! Breathing properly is important and here is a somewhat related documentary. A guy called Wim Hof has achieved some pretty amazing feats by controlling his breathing.
  
  
• Nike recently tried to achieve a sub 2hr marathon. Interesting project and this got me looking into what is possible and what affects performance.
  
  
• There is a theoretical scientific limit (VO2 max) of how much oxygen your body can process which limits physical exertion. Maybe that's not the best description - here's a pro.
  
  
• A lot of this marathon training is psychological. Pretty much anyone can do it and it's just like anything - practice, practice, practice. Currently reading a book called "Mindset" by Carol Dweck which backs up my theory.

Might help somebody this or next year!

ariana`

Candamir wrote: »

Hi Ariana, I'm long haul crew so do a fair amount of running in the US. I havent trained for a marathon before, but I've done plenty of runs in the 10-12 mile bracket with no problems at all. Quite a few of my colleagues are marathon runners and there's one guy who does iron man triathlons, so it's certainly possible! Chicago is a great place to run - there's a park/path that runs along the lakeshore and has runners and cyclists on it from early morning. There's also loads of water fountains on it so you won't have to worry about bringing water. And it's flat😄 On longer runs I usually put $20 and my phone with the uber/lyft app in my shorts pocket for emergencies. End of September the weather should be cooling down nicely too. A few tips - from my own experience, although everyone is different. Plan to run early - the temps will be pleasant and your body will be on 'daytime'. You'll start to flag in the late afternoon evening, so I wouldn't plan to do much then. More importantly, I'd try not to plan to do too much the day you get home or even the day after that. Jet lag is much worse travelling east. The day I get home I usually get a few hours sleep, go for a brisk walk and then try to get to bed at a reasonable time. You'll get a second wind in the late evening and you can easily find yourself wide awake at 2 or 3 am! The jet lag tends to go on and on if that happens! Enjoy the trip and try not to stress too much about the training.

Thanks

Legs feeling very heavy today after a slower than usual easy run last night. Cumulative fatigue is definitely setting in. Deep tissue massage booked for this evening and i'm so looking forward to it. Getting a few niggles in the hip from i'm guessing a rather tight ITB. Also have a few knots in the calves which are gone beyond the help of the foam roller.

Singer

Sheep1978 wrote: »

Whats the thoughts on doing a LSR (approx. 14m) on Fri evening and another (15m) on say next Wed evening. Too close together or should that be ok.?

That's fine, but if you intend on running hard in between then make sure you're recovered and feeling ok before the 2nd LSR.

Phoebas

choons wrote: »

• Water station did not work for me - First time passing one I thought I'd try it. Knocked me out of rhythm and the small amount I swallowed felt like it sat in my throat rather than going down! "Unthought Known" posted a technique or you can stop for 5 seconds and take a drink.

Water stations can be a real PITA.
In the Fingal 10k they were handing out water in cups which is impossible to drink on the go without spilling half of it down your front and choking on the rest of it.
IIRC (someone will correct my memory if I'm wrong), in DCM, the water will be given out in small squeezy bottles which is a lot easier to consume on the go.

Two tips for the big day re water:
* Try to figure out what side of the road the water station is at, because you don't what to have to traverse at the last minute from the opposite side of the road for water.
* Don't try to get water from the very start of the water station. That can be a bit of a pile up. Cruise past that mess and get it a bit further down. In a worst case scenario you don't get water, you'll often find someone who got an extra and is offering it up.

Singer

Phoebas wrote: »

Water stations can be a real PITA.
In the Fingal 10k they were handing out water in cups which is impossible to drink on the go without spilling half of it down your front and choking on the rest of it.
IIRC (someone will correct my memory if I'm wrong), in DCM, the water will be given out in small squeezy bottles which is a lot easier to consume on the go.

Cups are woeful yokes altogether. Per the DCM FAQ on the website, they're sports cap bottles as usual. I have a vague recollection that the half uses bottles too.

D3PO

well number for rock n roll arrived today. Think Im gonna take wubbleS advise though and do it as an LSR towards the faster end of that spectrum maybe 6 min per KM.

leesider77

Following on from my post about online shopping, I decided to risk it and my half price runners arrived last Friday. 55 Euro + 3.95 parcel motel. Haven't ran in them yet but feel good walking around the house at least!

ariana`

Sheep1978 wrote: »

Whats the thoughts on doing a LSR (approx. 14m) on Fri evening and another (15m) on say next Wed evening. Too close together or should that be ok.?

I will have a Sunday (16m) and Friday (13m) LSR at one stage. Not ideal but needs must. And luckily in my case the Friday is a step back. I've been running very consistently first thing on a Saturday morning for the past 9 weeks. But pretty much every weekend in August i've something clashing on Saturdays so it's going to get a lot more tricky and less consistent, i'll be getting out either Friday or Sundays for my LSR. That's life :rolleyes:

beakerjoe

Popped over here more for advice for motivation.

History, I completed my first and only Dublin Marathon in 2012. I was fairly fit back then, eat well and finished in 3:42. It really was great.

But since then Ive let things go.

I stopped football in dec 2016 and havent ran a race since with the exception of the odd park runs. In may I decided to get back in shape with the goal of the marathon in Oct.

Since then Ive conquered around 10 5ks (21 mins being my best time) and go for runs alone during the week of about 7k max so far.

Ive still got the belly and finding it hard to motivate myself during the week to go running. Ive signed up for the 10 mile in August.

My lack of motivation stems from my lack of time. I work 9-6 most nights with 3 hours on top of that commuting. When I get home Im tired and happily fall into the chair and spend time with the family who i miss while I am at work.

I guess I know the answers already, "just get off my hole" but even writing this has helped.

Baby75

I am one happy little runner tonight ran to night in a fundraiser for a local lady it was a great turnout and I got a PB for 5k ( 27.58 / 28 .02 ) minutes a bit of a conflict with Strava and my watch it was an 8K race and I ran it in 46.26. I was conscious that I had 3KM more to do when we hit the 5k mark so decided to slow down a little felt good and no pain anywhere all the stretching has paid off

I know that is probably slow in comparison to everyone else times for 5k but it's huge progress for me I am chuffed feels good to get out running again as well

skyblue46

leesider77 wrote: »

Following on from my post about online shopping, I decided to risk it and my half price runners arrived last Friday. 55 Euro + 3.95 parcel motel. Haven't ran in them yet but feel good walking around the house at least!

What site did you use?

quickbeam

beakerjoe wrote: »

Popped over here more for advice for motivation.

History, I completed my first and only Dublin Marathon in 2012. I was fairly fit back then, eat well and finished in 3:42. It really was great.

But since then Ive let things go.

I stopped football in dec 2016 and havent ran a race since with the exception of the odd park runs. In may I decided to get back in shape with the goal of the marathon in Oct.

Since then Ive conquered around 10 5ks (21 mins being my best time) and go for runs alone during the week of about 7k max so far.

Ive still got the belly and finding it hard to motivate myself during the week to go running. Ive signed up for the 10 mile in August.

My lack of motivation stems from my lack of time. I work 9-6 most nights with 3 hours on top of that commuting. When I get home Im tired and happily fall into the chair and spend time with the family who i miss while I am at work.

I guess I know the answers already, "just get off my hole" but even writing this has helped.

I'm no expert, but it seems like you're still relatively fit, even if not at the peek you were in 2012. Based on this, you could probably hop in to one of the training plans in the OP (Hal Higson's Novice plan, or Boards plan), even though you'e officially missed the first four weeks, I'd say you'd have no problem slotting in for the next 14.

You might also want to join the Strava group for the novices, for added motivation: https://www.strava.com/clubs/282063.

But yes, ultimately there's nothing to do for your training except to get off your hole and do it :P .

D3PO

went for my midweek PMP run last night.

10.8km @5.35 per km pace

Was feeling a little tight beforehand and put it down to a good effort at the Fingal 10k, warmed up went for the run, felt good and comfortable but could continue to feel the tightness.

I can still feel tightness in my left groin this morning. I think I might have done a very minor strain. Reluctantly that means a few days away from running I guess as I let it recover.

Whats the best thing to substitute in ? Swimming I would guess ? Hopefully will be ok for my LS on Saturday

ariana`

I went for deep tissue massage last night. The hip that was niggling me was very tight around the hip and into the glute. The glute on the other side was pretty bad too but was more concentrated in the glute and not into the hip. Other than that she said i was in surprisingly good nick, hams, quads, calves were all pretty supple as were my back & shoulders etc... I had a bit of fluid on the top of one foot (kind of at the base of the baby toe), it hadn't been bothering me but she said to keep an eye on it.

So i'll be buying a golf ball to try to roll the glutes/hip as the foam roller isn't really cutting it obviously. Any other recommendations for this area

Generally feel great today after it, much looser and legs less heavy (it was a rest day as well which i'm sure helped). I'm looking forward to tonight's pace run now

Baby75 well done on the 5k pb

beakerjoe welcome. I agree with quickbeam, i'd say you'd be able jump into either of the plans. HHN1 might suit you best if 7k is the longest run you are doing at the moment.

Sheep1978

Anyone know where in Dublin City centre would sell gels etc. Want to start trying them out this week

ariana`

Sheep1978 wrote: »

Anyone know where in Dublin City centre would sell gels etc. Want to start trying them out this week

I got a box of 6 gels in Tesco of all places last week for €2.50! Which is a great price considering i spent €2 on 1 Kinetica Gel in a reputable running shop. I can't remember the brand of the Tesco ones and i haven't tried them yet but the ingredient list looked almost identical to the kinetica one, they are Berry flavoured iirc.

The Kinetica one i tried is Cola flavoured, rotten texture (i assume they all are) but the flavour was ok and it seemed to agree with me. I'll try the Tesco ones next week as they're brilliant value.

How many/often would you use i wonder in a marathon, say 4.5hrs roughly?

leesider77

skyblue46 wrote: »

What site did you use?

I got them on amazon in the end. I was checking over a few months though before my size was available at this price. So keep checking regularly is my advice. They offered free returns as well so this was also a factor in my decision to go with them.

leesider77

beakerjoe wrote: »

Popped over here more for advice for motivation.

History, I completed my first and only Dublin Marathon in 2012. I was fairly fit back then, eat well and finished in 3:42. It really was great.

But since then Ive let things go.

I stopped football in dec 2016 and havent ran a race since with the exception of the odd park runs. In may I decided to get back in shape with the goal of the marathon in Oct.

Since then Ive conquered around 10 5ks (21 mins being my best time) and go for runs alone during the week of about 7k max so far.

Ive still got the belly and finding it hard to motivate myself during the week to go running. Ive signed up for the 10 mile in August.

My lack of motivation stems from my lack of time. I work 9-6 most nights with 3 hours on top of that commuting. When I get home Im tired and happily fall into the chair and spend time with the family who i miss while I am at work.

I guess I know the answers already, "just get off my hole" but even writing this has helped.

Im a complete novice on the running front so cant give any expert advice there - only that we are doing a 10 mile LSR as part of our plan this weekend - so that you have an idea where we are in the training plan right now.

Youve done a marathon before so know you can physically do it and in a good time but think you might want to lower your expectations on time this time around if you have less training done and carrying more weight - would you still be happy with this?

On the time front, I work long hours, travel with work and have two small kids so the training has a huge impact on my life - but I tell myself that it will be short lived - only 13.5 weeks to go! So you need to really want to do this marathon to make the sacrifice worth it - maybe Im reading too much into your post but I dont get the feeling that you really want to make the sacrifice. If you are finding excuses now then how will you fit a 20 miles LSR in ( plus 20 other miles across the week)?

ariana`

leesider77 wrote: »

Im a complete novice on the running front so cant give any expert advice there - only that we are doing a 10 mile LSR as part of our plan this weekend - so that you have an idea where we are in the training plan right now.

Youve done a marathon before so know you can physically do it and in a good time but think you might want to lower your expectations on time this time around if you have less training done and carrying more weight - would you still be happy with this?

On the time front, I work long hours, travel with work and have two small kids so the training has a huge impact on my life - but I tell myself that it will be short lived - only 13.5 weeks to go! So you need to really want to do this marathon to make the sacrifice worth it - maybe Im reading too much into your post but I dont get the feeling that you really want to make the sacrifice. If you are finding excuses now then how will you fit a 20 miles LSR in ( plus 20 other miles across the week)?

Good advice. The going is starting to get tough already. Like a lot on here i have 3 small ones and a full time job. Thankfully i don't travel much but my husband has a 2 hr commute so that is a factor for us a family. It's takes a lot of juggling to fit the runs in around everything else. I'm coming to the conclusion that the single most important factor which will determine getting to the start (and eventually the finish) line is commitement with a light peppering of good luck.

D3PO

ariana` wrote: »

I got a box of 6 gels in Tesco of all places last week for €2.50! Which is a great price considering i spent €2 on 1 Kinetica Gel in a reputable running shop. I can't remember the brand of the Tesco ones and i haven't tried them yet but the ingredient list looked almost identical to the kinetica one, they are Berry flavoured iirc.

The Kinetica one i tried is Cola flavoured, rotten texture (i assume they all are) but the flavour was ok and it seemed to agree with me. I'll try the Tesco ones next week as they're brilliant value.

How many/often would you use i wonder in a marathon, say 4.5hrs roughly?

some are different than others in texture. Some are like a jelly almost, others like youghurt.

re gels somebody who knows a lot more about me in marathon running (sub 3 hour runner) says he takes one at 4 miles and a further gel for every 4 miles up to mile 20 so 5 in total.

other stuff ive read on google says you have enough carbs to sustain 90 mins of effort so take the first one after about 75 mins of running which is a lot more than 4 miles.

what im getting is that there is no one exact answer. I personally will go with one every 4 miles. as for trying different brands i didnt before I did DCM in 2014 I just used the gels on offer on the day.

generally I use High 5 or SIS gels for cycling but they all seem to agree with me so im not pushed.

Sheep1978

D3PO wrote: »

as for trying different brands i didnt before I did DCM in 2014 I just used the gels on offer on the day.

they sell them there on the day.?

D3PO

Sheep1978 wrote: »

they sell them there on the day.?

Give them out free on the course

D3PO

I grabbed some from the official people woprking there and there were also lots of spectators just handing them out too.