Civil "communion" for 8 year old girl

smacl

recedite wrote: »

Do you think they have never heard of farming or toilets before?

Your logic seems a bit sketchy there. Seems a bit like asking a homeless person have they never heard of a house or suggesting that an offer of emergency accommodation is patronising as it is a home they really want. My best guess is that those with a desperate need will accept and appreciate whatever offer of help is forthcoming even if falls short of what they need long-term. In recent years my charities of choice tend to be closer to home, notably the Simon community and the life-boats.

recedite

I'm just saying that Africans already have goats and cows suited to their climate, and cheaply available.
If you think people over there are short of capital, then a charity that loans or donates cash might be better. The beneficiaries might still buy the goat, but they might choose to start some other business instead.

looksee

I don't think the charities actually put goats and cattle and hives of bees in a container and send them!

You are putting money into a fund that (hopefully) the value of your contribution will allow for the donation of a goat etc to a family. They are saying 'you have given a goat' but then again contributions to charities are asked for and included in the 'charity' are all the overheads of advertising, salaries etc, so it might easily take several donations to actually be worth a goat. Costs them little to send everyone a card saying they have donated one though.

silverharp

ive no idea what you are discussing, Ill just add this in, continue on gentlemen

jimmycrackcorm

Sofiztikated wrote:

I was brought up Presbyterian, in a predominately catholic town, and simply told we don't do that.

I think this is the whole crux of this thread. One of my nieces had a communion a few years ago, After the ceremony there was a kids party at the house, bouncy castle and so on.

One of her classmates came to it, she was a Protestant who wasn't bothered by the while communion thing because she was very clear that this was something Catholics did and not Protestants.

Otherwise, excuses aside, it's just a keeping up with the Jones.

looksee

Ok, and sorry, I will get back on topic, the animals are for the most part sent to Africa. It is not generally a good idea, but yes, they are sent.

Hotblack Desiato

recedite wrote: »

Do you think they have never heard of farming or toilets before?

Sanitation is the greatest improvement to human health ever devised, vaccination is the second.

Do you expect dirt poor people in the developing world to come up with their own vaccines? Or perhaps out of a shared sense of humanity we should share our advances with them for the greater good.

Same goes for toilets and there are many cheap low-tech designs, many of which don't need a water supply, which can make a real difference to human health in the developing world.

I'm a bit wary of the send-an-Irish-animal-to-Africa programmes though, as Irish farm animals are well adapted to temperate climates with abundant water. I would hope that that's only a smokescreen for the dimmer members of the public and the animals they actually supply are adapted to the local conditions. I don't support these sort of charities anyway.

Sofiztikated wrote: »

I was brought up Presbyterian

My sympathies

infogiver wrote: »

This is the kind of condescending patronising remark that Irish Atheists are becoming quite famous for.

"Help! Help! I'm being oppressed!"

When you come here in good faith (see what I did there) and don't misquote and misrepresent posters and seek a genuine honest discussion then we can talk.

If you lie, twist words and call into question the parenting abilities of people you've never met, then a smelly middle finger will be extended in your direction

Up to you.

infogiver wrote: »

I made a huge mistake and started contributing in this thread forgetting that this level of arrogance and condescension towards posters who don't agree that the RCC only exists to persecute non believers is totally acceptable here.
If you want to only post in an echo chamber of indignation and blinkered thinking then that's up to you, but you'll excuse me if I decline to take up your contemptuous offer to "stay around and watch how it happens ", thanks all the same.:-)

I do laugh internally when followers of religion accuse others of 'blinkered thinking'.

You've been sold a lie all your life, open your eyes.

One eyed Jack

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

If you lie, twist words and call into question the parenting abilities of people you've never met, then a smelly middle finger will be extended in your direction

Up to you.

...

I do laugh internally when followers of religion accuse others of 'blinkered thinking'.

You've been sold a lie all your life, open your eyes.

This very thread is full of posters questioning the parenting abilities of people they've never met, but I wouldn't extend a smelly middle finger in anyones direction, seems a horridly immature thing to be doing. Cathartic as it may be I suppose, it certainly doesn't add anything to the discussion. That you cannot see that, is the very definition of blinkered thinking.

You'll laugh internally about that of course, and that is your choice, but then the obvious consequence of that behaviour is that people will choose for themselves that you aren't to be taken seriously, and so in any discussion where you might have had an interesting point, it's of no use whatsoever when the people you would want to listen to you have long stopped listening having been on the receiving end of your smelly middle finger.

Hotblack Desiato

For what it's worth OEJ, I've never taken you seriously. Whether you did me or not I simply do not care.

One eyed Jack

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

For what it's worth OEJ, I've never taken you seriously. Whether you did me or not I simply do not care.

Of course I take you seriously, otherwise what's the point in discussion?

What's the point of this forum then where people such as the OP come to look for advice on an issue which affects many people in Irish society, where many posters have voiced their objections to the influence of the RCC on Irish society?

What's it meant to achieve if not to provide support, advice, discussion, engagement? If you don't want to engage with people in good faith, then what you're left with is an echo chamber which achieves nothing except to serve as an outlet for a minority in society to vent at the injustice of it all.

Hotblack Desiato

Didn't you misrepresent yourself as an agnostic here for qutie a time?

If I've confused you with another poster then I do apologise.

One eyed Jack

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Didn't you misrepresent yourself as an agnostic here for qutie a time?

If I've confused you with another poster then I do apologise.

Nope, definitely wasn't me HD, though having mentioned before that my wife is non-religious has in the past caused some confusion. She has never identified as atheist either and none of her family have ever given a second thought to religion. That's why I always draw a distinction between people who are non-religious, people who are atheist, people who are theists, and people who are deists.

It didn't cause our child any confusion nor has he ever felt as though he has been brainwashed. He's experienced plenty of times when he was left out or excluded from activities but he understands that he participates in activities too where other children may feel as though they are excluded.

I understand that's where the OP may have been coming from in asking for advice about organising an activity where her child wouldn't feel as though they were missing out on something her friends had to talk about, and that's why I thought even though it's unnecessary, I'd heard of secular ceremonies like these before, so that's why I linked the OP to an example.

It's just me of course I understand but I think the whole idea of people trying to out-do one another in giving their children something to talk about is setting their children up with expectations that life will always be like that. When it isn't then, as adults they haven't developed the coping skills to deal with the reality of competing in our consumerism driven culture. They simply can't compete, and this breeds resentment of people whom they perceive to be better off than them in one way or another, so they strive to outdo them in one way or another.

I was always more about cooperation than competition.