Is it worth it anymore..... ?

mcgratheoin

No

pelevin wrote: »

And do you think I was serious?!

I think I'm conditioned to expect unreasonable responses on this thread!!

07Lapierre

No

181 posts and I'm still cycling!

1eg0a3xv7b82of

cython wrote: »

Absolutely not!! While we need more enforcement of and action on violations of motoring and cycling offences, justice and integrity go out the window when the enforcers stand to make a direct profit from levying fines. Even GoSafe don't pocket the profits of fines from their vans, but look at the attitude towards them (Flash for cash, etc.).
Agree with this.



And back to disagreeing with at least part of this. Your blanket ban on tractors, for example, is farcical. By all means keep them out of urban areas at these times, but plenty of roads where tractors are used have very little other traffic at these times, so they are not actually causing any issue, but yet you want to make almost all farmers' lives more difficult because of a few nuisances. Would you also restrict livestock movements at these times? Because plenty of farmers move cattle to be milked at these times, to give just one example.

There is too many tractors on roads when people are travelling to and from work, school. I speak from personal experience as i am from farming stock.
A farmer near me, his house is about 2 miles from his farm and he drives from home to farm in his tractor constantly. That kind of madness has to be stopped.
We have tractors traveling long distances pulling large trailers carrying large earth moving machines and it is completely unsafe.
tractors are for use on farms and very minor road use, not i am going from clonmel to thurles and feck the lot of ye.
Many road users demand respect but give very little themselves.

If I met a tractor and i had to reduce my speed I am happy to do so, I am not a lunatic who despises any other road user who slows me down.
But also we need traffic to move freely especially at peak time and that is not going to happen unless unnecessary inappropriate usage is curtailed.

07Lapierre

No

What's your definition of traffic moving freely? As long as the tractor is taxed, insured etc. There's no reason for them to be excluded from the roads. Just overtake when it's safe?

I find the most tractor drivers are very aware of other road users and do facilitate overtaking.

smacl

No

07Lapierre wrote: »

181 posts and I'm still cycling!

Ah now, whatever about cycling with earphones, cycling while posting on boards is clearly dangerous

1eg0a3xv7b82of

07Lapierre wrote: »

What's your definition of traffic moving freely? As long as the tractor is taxed, insured etc. There's no reason for them to be excluded from the roads. Just overtake when it's safe?

I find the most tractor drivers are very aware of other road users and do facilitate overtaking.

I have explained in my posts quiet clearly what I mean.
Rural ireland has roads where overtaking when safe would mean waiting until at your destination to overtake which s fine with me if outside peak times

07Lapierre

No

smacl wrote: »

Ah now, whatever about cycling with earphones, cycling while posting on boards is clearly dangerous

Doh!

07Lapierre

No

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

I have explained in my posts quiet clearly what I mean.
Rural ireland has roads where overtaking when safe would mean waiting until at your destination to overtake which s fine with me if outside peak times

So be it. That's life.

fat bloke

In my experience, it's rarely the tractor. It's the gombeen up the ar$e of the tractor who won't overtake. And the gombeen behind the first gombeen who won't overtake either, but won't leave room for others to overtake him. So now, you have a 50 metre long, 50mph convoy of three that requires an unusually long, straight and clear stretch of road for anyone to get past.

07Lapierre

No

fat bloke wrote: »

In my experience, it's rarely the tractor. It's the gombeen up the ar$e of the tractor who won't overtake. And the gombeen behind the first gombeen who won't overtake either, but won't leave room for others to overtake him. So now, you have a 50 metre long, 50mph convoy of three that requires an unusually long, straight and clear stretch of road for anyone to get past.

You could say the same about a cyclist cycling along a country road. Its usually the inexperienced motorist that wont overtake that results in a tailback of cars. Then when the first car does eventually overtake, the next car blindly follows right on the first cars bumper!

The sooner these drivers have to do some sort of test and pay a road tax the better! that'll put manners on'em! :P

Chuchote

No

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

There is too many tractors on roads when people are travelling to and from work, school. I speak from personal experience as i am from farming stock.
A farmer near me, his house is about 2 miles from his farm and he drives from home to farm in his tractor constantly. That kind of madness has to be stopped.

Kind of hard on farmers, though, with the current fashion for stealing farm machinery. I don't think I'd be happy to leave a valuable, vital tractor in a remote field either.

Beasty

Chuchote wrote: »

Kind of hard on farmers, though, with the current fashion for stealing farm machinery. I don't think I'd be happy to leave a valuable, vital tractor in a remote field either.

We can try to accommodate them with a "Stolen Tractors" thread if you like...


:pac:

cython

No

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

There is too many tractors on roads when people are travelling to and from work, school. I speak from personal experience as i am from farming stock.
A farmer near me, his house is about 2 miles from his farm and he drives from home to farm in his tractor constantly. That kind of madness has to be stopped.

And how much of a delay does he cause, to how many other road users by doing this? Unless this is significant, the anecdote has no relevance (and even then, it is still just that, anecdotal evidence)

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

We have tractors traveling long distances pulling large trailers carrying large earth moving machines and it is completely unsafe.

Which your ban addresses how, exactly? Or is it suddenly safe to do the same long distances between 10am and 4pm? Instead surely regulations around transport of said equipment should be tightened up

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

tractors are for use on farms and very minor road use, not i am going from clonmel to thurles and feck the lot of ye.
Many road users demand respect but give very little themselves.

If I met a tractor and i had to reduce my speed I am happy to do so, I am not a lunatic who despises any other road user who slows me down.
But also we need traffic to move freely especially at peak time and that is not going to happen unless unnecessary inappropriate usage is curtailed.

"Inappropriate use" can be curtailed without a blanket ban though, let's not go throwing the baby out with the bathwater here.

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

I have explained in my posts quiet clearly what I mean.
Rural ireland has roads where overtaking when safe would mean waiting until at your destination to overtake which s fine with me if outside peak times

If someone elects to live in rural Ireland, then they should be familiar with the realities of that life. I'm from a rural area myself, as is the OH, and tbh while it can be a frustration to be stuck behind a tractor, it's a greater inconvenience to meet a "city driver" who goes full on deer-in-headlights when they meet a car coming against them on a bohreen. However banning them from driving on such roads is not realistic either.

Moflojo

No

fat bloke wrote: »

In my experience, it's rarely the tractor. It's the gombeen up the ar$e of the tractor who won't overtake. And the gombeen behind the first gombeen who won't overtake either, but won't leave room for others to overtake him. So now, you have a 50 metre long, 50mph convoy of three that requires an unusually long, straight and clear stretch of road for anyone to get past.

However...
...unless you're on an unusually bad road...
...and the tractor driver is on an unusually long journey...
...and there is a total lack of spots to pull in...
...or the tractor driver is completely oblivious to others and refuses to pull in...
...then your overall journey will not be delayed by much more than one, short minute.

For all the risk involved in overtaking the [inherently dangerous] piece of agricultural machinery, a simple change of mindset and application of minimal patience is probably the best solution all round.

stringed theory

So we have tractor drivers unaware, or not caring about other vehicles.  At least they are not endangering themselves.
Why, I mean to ask, do cyclists rarely if ever look over their shoulders when I am driving up behind them?  I mean, I often  look in the mirror when driving and have the habit of looking behind me while cycling as well.

greenspurs

stringed theory wrote: »

So we have tractor drivers unaware, or not caring about other vehicles. At least they are not endangering themselves.
Why, I mean to ask, do cyclists rarely if ever look over their shoulders when I am driving up behind them? I mean, I often look in the mirror when driving and have the habit of looking behind me while cycling as well.

Yes the majority of tractors drivers, are unaware/uncaring about whats stuck behind them.
But the 16yr olds , and adults also, that drive are tweeting/snapchatting/instagramming/facebooking/texting certainly arent aware. ...
(cliche for cliche)

fat bloke

Moflojo wrote: »

However...
...unless you're on an unusually bad road...
...and the tractor driver is on an unusually long journey...
...and there is a total lack of spots to pull in...
...or the tractor driver is completely oblivious to others and refuses to pull in...
...then your overall journey will not be delayed by much more than one, short minute.

For all the risk involved in overtaking the [inherently dangerous] piece of agricultural machinery, a simple change of mindset and application of minimal patience is probably the best solution all round.

Well, it should also encourage people to pay way more motor tax for nice powerful engines that get you passed dawdling tractors lickety split.

On that note it's been an idea of mine for a while to scan my annual 1500 euro motor tax certificate and get it blown up and put on the back of a cycling jersey...

CramCycle

stringed theory wrote: »

Why, I mean to ask, do cyclists rarely if ever look over their shoulders when I am driving up behind them? ?I mean, I often ?look in the mirror when driving and have the habit of looking behind me while cycling as well.

MOD VOICE: No generalisations, you will find plenty do, plenty don't and some do, some of the time. The same way some motorists always check their mirrors, some never do and some do when they remember. Same as some motorcyclists do a lifesaver everytime, some never do, and some do when they remember. This is not After Hours, sweeping generalisations will not be tolerated, please read the forum charter before posting again.

Any questions via PM.

Moflojo

No

fat bloke wrote: »

Well, it should also encourage people to pay way more motor tax for nice powerful engines that get you passed dawdling tractors lickety split.

On that note it's been an idea of mine for a while to scan my annual 1500 euro motor tax certificate and get it blown up and put on the back of a cycling jersey...

The trick is, whenever anyone tells you that you don't pay road tax, ask them to show you the receipt for theirs.

jimmycrackcorm

fat bloke wrote:

On that note it's been an idea of mine for a while to scan my annual 1500 euro motor tax certificate and get it blown up and put on the back of a cycling jersey...

I think we need shirt slogans on the back: I do pay "road tax" Joe!

CramCycle

Ibrahim Millions Railroad wrote: »

There is too many tractors on roads when people are travelling to and from work, school. I speak from personal experience as i am from farming stock.
A farmer near me, his house is about 2 miles from his farm and he drives from home to farm in his tractor constantly. That kind of madness has to be stopped.

Sub 10 minute delay if you meet him as he leaves and if he is driving a Massey 35. Almost every other tractor will have significantly faster times.

We have tractors traveling long distances pulling large trailers carrying large earth moving machines and it is completely unsafe.

How would you move them?

tractors are for use on farms and very minor road use, not i am going from clonmel to thurles and feck the lot of ye.

Users you describe are minimal

If I met a tractor and i had to reduce my speed I am happy to do so, I am not a lunatic who despises any other road user who slows me down.
But also we need traffic to move freely especially at peak time and that is not going to happen unless unnecessary inappropriate usage is curtailed.

In the countryside, bar mass and school, peak time is hardly rush hour. I lived in the country for years, you always left with extra time to account for moving animals or farm machinery.

smacl

No

stringed theory wrote: »

Why, I mean to ask, do cyclists rarely if ever look over their shoulders when I am driving up behind them?  I mean, I often  look in the mirror when driving and have the habit of looking behind me while cycling as well.

You have three mirrors and there's no risk of your car falling over if you hit a pot-hole while looking in any of them. Personally I have bar end mounted mirrors which help but I'd always look over my shoulder changing lane or to take a right hand turn. Sunglasses I currently use restrict peripheral vision which is the main reason for mirrors. Driving isn't exactly demanding in terms of indicating, checking what's behind you, etc... Maybe put yourself in the place of the cyclist and rethink your question.

1eg0a3xv7b82of

CramCycle wrote: »

Sub 10 minute delay if you meet him as he leaves and if he is driving a Massey 35. Almost every other tractor will have significantly faster times.
How would you move them?

Users you describe are minimal

In the countryside, bar mass and school, peak time is hardly rush hour. I lived in the country for years, you always left with extra time to account for moving animals or farm machinery.

You lived in the country for years and left with extra time to account for animals and machinery. May I ask what country. Rural people are notorious for being late and I am one.

Beasty

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I think we need shirt slogans on the back: I do pay "road tax" Joe!

Alas they never seem to have my size:

robyntmorton

^Do you have to replace the shirt every 12 months :P

stringed theory

smacl wrote: »

stringed theory wrote: »

Why, I mean to ask, do cyclists rarely if ever look over their shoulders when I am driving up behind them?  I mean, I often  look in the mirror when driving and have the habit of looking behind me while cycling as well.

You have three mirrors and there's no risk of your car falling over if you hit a pot-hole while looking in any of them.  Personally I have bar end mounted mirrors which help but I'd always look over my shoulder changing lane or to take a right hand turn.  Sunglasses I currently use restrict peripheral vision which is the main reason for mirrors.  Driving isn't exactly demanding in terms of indicating, checking what's behind you, etc... Maybe put yourself in the place of the cyclist and rethink your question.

Well, I am a touring cyclist, mostly in Wicklow and West Cork, and I can't imagine not glancing over my shoulder whenever a fast car is bearing up behind.  A simple pivot movement on the saddle is not dangerous in my opinion, and has saved me several near misses.  
This is something I look out for when driving  and it is my personal experience that not many other cyclists do this.

magicbastarder

Having lived an entire six months in the country, the thing that annoyed me most about farm machinery was the muck they'd throw onto the roads at times, which could be quite lumpy and stony.

Beasty

I find most tractor drivers quite considerate, using hard shoulders, or pulling in to allow other vehicles past if there is a build up (I did when I wer' a lad, and the other farmhands were instructed to do likewise by my dad who managed the farm)

And to be clear in most cases tractors have excellent mirrors and their drivers are perfectly well aware if they are causing a hold up. Modern tractors are often capable of getting well over 40 km/h and generally don't cause much of a hold up. Ultimately they have as much right to be on the road as other motorists as well as cyclists.

I agree they can sometimes dump quite a lot of crap on the road, but they should be clearing most of that off their tyres before they leave the field

greenspurs

Back on Topic....

Cyclist number 8 dies in Cork. RiP.

Anyone else changing their minds ?

Still not 1 reply from the 10 TD's and Councillors i emailed last Thursday.

ED E

Worth what?

Cuffe(DCC) is moderately ok but Ross is useless. Really need a minister with a getting things done attitude.