It goes from bad to worse for the Gardai

Ken.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/revealed-gardai-tapped-the-phones-of-innocent-people-35709010.html

"Gardaí have tapped the phones of innocent members of the public, Independent.ie can reveal today.
Officers routinely bypassed strict protocols to listen in on private conversations for almost a decade, our investigation has found.

However, the State signed off on a series of secret pay-offs for gardaí and officials in a bid to keep a lid on yet another major scandal."

The gardai are lurching from one crisis to the next. I normally don't comment on these but this could affect me.

Who's money was used to pay off the whistleblowers?

tomwaterford

They are gone as bad as the Catholic Church of the 90s lurching from crisis to crisis


It's like a bad joke at this stage

suicide_circus

Sure they weren't tapped how would we know they are innocent?

IvyTheTerrible

Sure if you don't do anything wrong you've nothing to worry about... /roll eyes/

longshanks

And still no one will resign or be fired.
Necks like a jockeys bollox.

Erik Shin

tomwaterford wrote: »

They are gone as bad as the Catholic Church of the 90s lurching from crisis to crisis


It's like a bad joke at this stage

Any organisation that doesn't have outside monitoring is always open to corruption....but I don't believe anyone is accusing the Gardai of systemic child abuse, torturing of young mothers and kissing their rings

Zebra3

longshanks wrote: »

And still no one will resign or be fired.
Necks like a jockeys bollox.

This is the most important thing.

Let's all keep calm and ensure nobody is held accountable.

Imallrightjack

longshanks wrote: »

And still no one will resign or be fired.
Necks like a jockeys bollox.

I've never seen a jockeys bollox.could you describe it?

Tell me how

Imallrightjack wrote:

I've never seen a jockeys bollox.could you describe it?

It's like the Garda commissioner's neck.

Winterlong

Would we have to pay them more to operate within the law?

I dunno, there are plenty of great rank and file Gardai out there but the force does seem to be ridden with people who just do it their way. Outside the law. Concocted stats. Misuse of public funds (aka Templemore) etc

Erik Shin

Erik Shin wrote: »

Any organisation that doesn't have outside monitoring is always open to corruption....but I don't believe anyone is accusing the Gardai of systemic child abuse, torturing of young mothers and kissing their rings

I think the poster was referring to frequency of scandals rather than directly comparing the issues.

myshirt

If you are under 35 here, it's really time to get out on the streets and demand reform. You really have been unbelievably screwed over and f#cked by these public servants. I mean seriously screwed. Please, please wake up and realise how this affects your immediate life and your future.

Plain and simple, you can't afford to pay their exorbitant pensions, pay their loans for excesses during the boom (how many guards own second homes), pay these wages that are just nuts, all while this type of sh't is going on. You have your own rent to pay, house to buy, family to build, life to live, or whatever you want to do with yourself. You certainly don't deserve this, because it is the biggest F#CK YOU that has ever been going on when it comes to youth and those under 35. F#ck you. Pay our pensions. Pay our wages. Pay our expenses. Pay our 35 days off. Pay your rent (to us and our generation). Pay the billions of debt we benefited directly from but you didn't. And shut your f#cking mouth. We are going to do whatever we want. We are going to stitch up innocent whistleblowers. Fake driving offences. Ignore rape or sexual assaults if it's someone we know. Beat you down on water charges. Let violence and drugs run riot in your community. Suicides, murders, we don't give a f#ck unless it affects someone important. The message is loud and clear youth of Ireland. Fuuuuuuck you.

If you are under 35 it's really time to don the war paint and storm the Bastille.

GarIT

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think the poster was referring to frequency of scandals rather than directly comparing the issues.

I'm sure there has to be some good gardai though. The whole garda force in Ireland doesn't exist solely to pretend to be good just so they can get to be alone with your children like the Roman Catholic church does.

tea and coffee

Why must you be under 35 to be annoyed?

tea and coffee

GarIT wrote: »

I'm sure there has to be some good gardai though. The whole garda force in Ireland doesn't exist solely to pretend to be good just so they can get to be alone with your children like the Roman Catholic church does.

The entire Catholic church doesn't want to be alone with your kids. And many aren't just "pretending" to be good; they are

osarusan

Jaysus, lucky I am older than 35!

GarIT

GarIT wrote: »

I'm sure there has to be some good gardai though. The whole garda force in Ireland doesn't exist solely to pretend to be good just so they can get to be alone with your children like the Roman Catholic church does.

On the other hand, the Church is not employed by the State to preserve law and order, so while corruption and abuse in the Church or, say, Swim Ireland, may be grotesque and depraved, it may not have the same invidious impact on democracy and civil liberties as wrongdoing within the Gardai.

D0NNELLY

suicide_circus wrote: »

Sure they weren't tapped how would we know they are innocent?

Exactly, nothing to hide, nothing to worry about.

GarIT

tea and coffee wrote: »

The entire Catholic church doesn't want to be alone with your kids. And many aren't pretending to be good but are

There are only tWo types of people in the RCC, those who commit abuse and those who have covered it up. Not a single good person has ever been catholic

tea and coffee

GarIT wrote: »

There are only tWo types of people in the RCC, those who commit abuse and those who have covered it up. Not a single good person has ever been catholic

I'm a good person. I've never covered up abuse.
I know many people who still believe / are mote closely involved with the church who I would vouch are the same.
There are many people who were not involved. The Catholic church has 1.28 billion members ; to say all are abusers or covered it up is pure fallacy.

Timberrrrrrrr

GarIT wrote: »

There are only tWo types of people in the RCC, those who commit abuse and those who have covered it up. Not a single good person has ever been catholic

What utter drivel

9or10

How in less than two pages was the RCC invoked?

I'm no fan but ffs lads.

myshirt

tea and coffee wrote: »

Why must you be under 35 to be annoyed?

Look, we are all annoyed. But it is those under 35ish that have felt the full force of being rightly kicked in the stones by these baby boomers and early gen'x'ers that are across the public service.

These issues affect us all from 0-100, but right at the core of it is economics, greed, corruption, and a disdain amongst a certain generation of public servants.

GarIT

GarIT wrote: »

There are only tWo types of people in the RCC, those who commit abuse and those who have covered it up. Not a single good person has ever been catholic

So Nobel Peace Prize winners like Lech Walesa and John Hume and Betty Williams and Mairead Corrigan were not good people?

myshirt

osarusan wrote: »

Jaysus, lucky I am older than 35!

You are. Do you know why? I hope to f#ck you do, because many don't. They go around thinking it is self efficacy and their own hard work that got them where they are.

So I hope you're not pulling out leg here. You are very lucky, yes.

shar01

Deleted User wrote: »

On the other hand, the Church is not employed by the State to preserve law and order, so while corruption and abuse in the Church or, say, Swim Ireland, may be grotesque and depraved, it may not have the same invidious impact on democracy and civil liberties as wrongdoing within the Gardai.

This. I don't have to go near a church or interact with a member of the clergy.

But I can be stopped at a garda checkpoint and if the garda doesn't like the way I'm answering them, they can (at the lower end of the scale) ruin my day or (at the extreme) make my life a misery.

The current case of the guard who recorded the feed of the arrest of Dara Quigley is, for me, the last straw. It's not a case of a few bad apples anymore. There is a culture of unprofessionalism in the force.

Questions have to be asked 1) of their selection process if it's not weeding out these idiots and 2) of the training in Templemore if it's not weeding them out there or changing attitudes and training PROFESSIONAL guards.

osarusan

myshirt wrote: »

You are. Do you know why? I hope to f#ck you do, because many don't. They go around thinking it is self efficacy and their own hard work that got them where they are.

Where am I and what is it that has got me there?

tea and coffee

myshirt wrote: »

Look, we are all annoyed. But it is those under 35ish that have felt the full force of being rightly kicked in the stones by these baby boomers and early gen'x'ers that are across the public service.

These issues affect us all from 0-100, but right at the core of it is economics, greed, corruption, and a disdain amongst a certain generation of public servants.

Another case of "the generation before us mucked it up" , much like the "what are the youth of today coming to" argument for old people like me ;-)
I don't buy it, sorry.
I agree that these scandals are awful and reform is badly needed for a damaged force. Morale must be at an all time low too.
But How have the Garda scandals affected the recession? If it's economics and greed you're worried about, I'd be far more concerned with private businesses than public services; the former had something to gain.

myshirt

myshirt wrote: »

If you are under 35 here, it's really time to get out on the streets and demand reform. You really have been unbelievably screwed over and f#cked by these public servants. I mean seriously screwed. Please, please wake up and realise how this affects your immediate life and your future.

Plain and simple, you can't afford to pay their exorbitant pensions, pay their loans for excesses during the boom (how many guards own second homes), pay these wages that are just nuts, all while this type of sh't is going on. You have your own rent to pay, house to buy, family to build, life to live, or whatever you want to do with yourself. You certainly don't deserve this, because it is the biggest F#CK YOU that has ever been going on when it comes to youth and those under 35. F#ck you. Pay our pensions. Pay our wages. Pay our expenses. Pay our 35 days off. Pay your rent (to us and our generation). Pay the billions of debt we benefited directly from but you didn't. And shut your f#cking mouth. We are going to do whatever we want. We are going to stitch up innocent whistleblowers. Fake driving offences. Ignore rape or sexual assaults if it's someone we know. Beat you down on water charges. Let violence and drugs run riot in your community. Suicides, murders, we don't give a f#ck unless it affects someone important. The message is loud and clear youth of Ireland. Fuuuuuuck you.

If you are under 35 it's really time to don the war paint and storm the Bastille.

Guards pay tax too you know, a lot of it.
Why under 35s?

blade1

tea and coffee wrote: »

The Catholic church has 1.28 billion members ; to say all are abusers or covered it up is pure fallacy.

Let's say if 20% were.
That would be only 256 million!:eek:

myshirt

myshirt wrote: »

You are. Do you know why? I hope to f#ck you do, because many don't. They go around thinking it is self efficacy and their own hard work that got them where they are.

So I hope you're not pulling out leg here. You are very lucky, yes.

What is this? Over 35s have had something handed to them? They don't work hard? I don't understand your crazy rants

tea and coffee

bubblypop wrote: »

What is this? Over 35s have had something handed to them? They don't work hard? I don't understand your crazy rants

Damn it. I knew I should have joined that queue. I missed my handout. I was working that day.

Tell me how

myshirt wrote:

You are. Do you know why? I hope to f#ck you do, because many don't. They go around thinking it is self efficacy and their own hard work that got them where they are.

So I hope you're not pulling out leg here. You are very lucky, yes.

35 year olds were born in or around 1982. They were 18 in 2000 when the "Celtic tiger" had found it's feet. From there to 2008 when the collapse happened, they had had the opportunity to contribute, benefit and influence both the economy and society. Why should they abdicate any responsibility for whatever problems you are upset about?

So, if you say that it's those who were entering the working world from about 2008 onwards who have been shafted then that's mostly because a lot of these didn't realize the harsher environment that existed up until the mid to late 90's.

Why should anyone have something handed to them? The crime here is the group of people whose peak informative years coincided with the peak boom years and now feel that that should be their norm or else someone else is at fault.

gifted

blade1 wrote: »

Let's say if 20% were.
That would be only 256 million!:eek:

"Let's say if 20% were"....

You were going grand there until you started randomly plucking numbers out of the sky lol lol

shar01

Wow! Did not know that many guards posted on Boards. A double derail - the Church and whataboutery about who caused the crash.

<slow handclap>

Well done.

Winterlong

Anyone giving out about how they have been shafted by older generations should do a little economic research on ireland in the 70s and 80s.
It was not all shag carpets you know.

Stoner

osarusan wrote:

Jaysus, lucky I am older than 35!

Me too, I'd go mad if all that was going on in my universe.

drunkmonkey

Erik Shin wrote: »

Any organisation that doesn't have outside monitoring is always open to corruption....but I don't believe anyone is accusing the Gardai of systemic child abuse, torturing of young mothers and kissing their rings

There's nobody accusing them of turning a blind eye to to those crimes but ohh boy they sure are guilty of it.

Erik Shin

drunkmonkey wrote: »

There's nobody accusing them of turning a blind eye to to those crimes but ohh boy they sure are guilty of it.

Apt username perhaps

Stoner

osarusan wrote:

Where am I and what is it that has got me there?

You are in universe 202877 however this forum is accessable to people from parallel universe 1124326

There's waiting lists in hospitals there , they can't retire on a state pension at 55 like us.
They have to pay for medical insurance and it's expensive.

They don't have any industrial schools or work houses either to store the low lifes , and the priest never calls for tea. They only get two holidays a year, the police filter all phone calls between people under 35 through a listening centre.

They have crime there, they haven't solved that one yet. Their city centres and towns are awash with drug addicts. They have to pay property tax and for water

Their bankers don't have wings, and when people do the wrong thing in universe 1124326 they don't leave their jobs, pay it back, show remorse or anything like that, it must be very frustrating there

drunkmonkey

Erik Shin wrote: »

Apt username perhaps

I'm not intoxicated right now give me a few hours but I do believe there was a mass cover up by church and state about child abuse and neither a political party or the Garda were held accountable only the Church. Looking the other way in those circumstances should be a crime.

vicwatson

Met a sargeant I know the other day I was told "its a cultural thing" and the shoulders were shrugged, then I was told "only 2 years to go" (to retirement) - that's also a "cultural thing" - they can't wait to get out the door after 30 years service or aged 50 on full pension. That system is a joke.

vicwatson

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'm not intoxicated right now give me a few hours but I do believe there was a mass cover up by church and state about child abuse and neither a political party or the Garda were held accountable only the Church. Looking the other way in those circumstances should be a crime.

Eh, were was the "church" held accountable? According to their law they did nothing wrong. Old and chestnut.

The Rape of Lucretia

myshirt wrote: »

If you are under 35 here, it's really time to get out on the streets and demand reform.

Nonsense. Thats just kidding yourself, and indulging in deluding yourself that you are doing something.
Dont demand reform - get properly involved, not just shouting for someone else to do it - be part of the solution, and reform yourself.

Green Peter

vicwatson wrote:

Met a sargeant I know the other day I was told "its a cultural thing" and the shoulders were shrugged, then I was told "only 2 years to go" (to retirement) - that's also a "cultural thing" - they can't wait to get out the door after 30 years service or aged 50 on full pension. That system is a joke.

Maybe it's because with the ****e he gets it isn't worth it for the money and hassle, funny enough the private sector very often cannot wait to hire these people when they do retire.

mzungu

vicwatson wrote: »

Met a sargeant I know the other day I was told "its a cultural thing" and the shoulders were shrugged, then I was told "only 2 years to go" (to retirement) - that's also a "cultural thing" - they can't wait to get out the door after 30 years service or aged 50 on full pension. That system is a joke.

blade1

gifted wrote: »

"Let's say if 20% were"....

You were going grand there until you started randomly plucking numbers out of the sky lol lol

Ok, so you don't know what a joke is or what if means.
Fair enough.

MyStubbleItches

While I don't agree that it's only under 35s who are affected, I do agree with the rest of that posters argument. It's probably gone beyond the stage that demands action by now. We really are a nation of wimps who just keep putting up with crap, self-serving governance. Every week there's something new coming out that has a direct impact on Joe soap taxpayer, either in our pockets or,like this latest news, our innocent private lives. A lot of other comparable countries would see people on the streets at this stage if not earlier. We just stay bent over. Me included. If someone else (respectable) took a stance then I'd stand beside them in a heartbeat. But like most on here, I'll never make the first move. Which is why Enda, Noreen, et al just keep doing what they want and get away with it. Paddy is a pussy.

lawred2

Barbie! wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/revealed-gardai-tapped-the-phones-of-innocent-people-35709010.html

"Gardaí have tapped the phones of innocent members of the public, Independent.ie can reveal today.
Officers routinely bypassed strict protocols to listen in on private conversations for almost a decade, our investigation has found.

However, the State signed off on a series of secret pay-offs for gardaí and officials in a bid to keep a lid on yet another major scandal."

The gardai are lurching from one crisis to the next. I normally don't comment on these but this could affect me.

Who's money was used to pay off the whistleblowers?

Bad enough the illegal wire tapping but the internal pay offs for silence..

How can any government continue to stand over this corrupted institution?

lawred2

myshirt wrote: »

If you are under 35 here, it's really time to get out on the streets and demand reform. You really have been unbelievably screwed over and f#cked by these public servants. I mean seriously screwed. Please, please wake up and realise how this affects your immediate life and your future.

Plain and simple, you can't afford to pay their exorbitant pensions, pay their loans for excesses during the boom (how many guards own second homes), pay these wages that are just nuts, all while this type of sh't is going on. You have your own rent to pay, house to buy, family to build, life to live, or whatever you want to do with yourself. You certainly don't deserve this, because it is the biggest F#CK YOU that has ever been going on when it comes to youth and those under 35. F#ck you. Pay our pensions. Pay our wages. Pay our expenses. Pay our 35 days off. Pay your rent (to us and our generation). Pay the billions of debt we benefited directly from but you didn't. And shut your f#cking mouth. We are going to do whatever we want. We are going to stitch up innocent whistleblowers. Fake driving offences. Ignore rape or sexual assaults if it's someone we know. Beat you down on water charges. Let violence and drugs run riot in your community. Suicides, murders, we don't give a f#ck unless it affects someone important. The message is loud and clear youth of Ireland. Fuuuuuuck you.

If you are under 35 it's really time to don the war paint and storm the Bastille.

35?

lawred2

tea and coffee wrote: »

I'm a good person. I've never covered up abuse.
I know many people who still believe / are mote closely involved with the church who I would vouch are the same.
There are many people who were not involved. The Catholic church has 1.28 billion members ; to say all are abusers or covered it up is pure fallacy.

Could be argued that you're effectively a tacit supporter of an organisation found the world over to be guilty of obscene crimes. Not the greatest thing to be.