Buses and bicycles - whats the story

punisher5112

1bryan wrote: »

So here's one. This morning I was cycling across Mount St (lower) Bridge. The lights were red and there were 3 of us on bikes in the cycle lane alongside a bus. When the lights went green the first cyclist in line moved away no problem. I was 3rd in line, towards the back of the bus, but the guy in the middle was completely cut off by the bus and ended up having to mount the footpath for his own safety. This cyclist didn't seem the most safety conscious person I've ever seen (over-ear headphones, baseball cap, and I mentioned the incident to him. He seemed barely aware that it even happened.

Anyway, I caught up to the bus driver at the next lights and said to him that he'd run a cyclist off the road (even though it wasn't me). He said he didn't (obviously not even aware of what he'd done). I assured him he did.

Do I complain, even though I wasn't directly involved in the incident? Or is that down to the individual in question? I took the license plate of the bus and I can give a very good description of the driver. But, is it my place to do this?

If the road narrows do not pass a large vehicle like a bus or truck.

The other guy should be aware of his surrounding and its up to all to pull back if needs be.

I see it countless times where cyclists believe they have every right to pass a vehicle in the dumbest of places.

If you can't see the driver in the mirror s/he can't see you.

1st cyclist got off so bus moved off just like all traffic would and should.
Sometimes you just have to hang back a little if not for courtesy but for your own safety.

I don't know if it was the drivers fault or not as I wasn't there so can only take your side but just be aware of what I mentioned above.

Also worth thinking even if one is right its not much use if they are and dead or badly injured.

Infrastructure should be something all pedestrians, cyclists and drivers should be getting onto TDs and councils about as there are only more and more using the roads and no space.

The way I look at it every bike I see is one less car and in theory less traffic so in reality its a win win only for it can be extremely dangerous and attitudes of all road users need to be trained to be more careful around each other and give space and get on.

Better roads and more space and take away parking especially on core routes in and out of city centre.

magicbastarder

punisher5112 wrote: »

1st cyclist got off so bus moved off just like all traffic would and should.
Sometimes you just have to hang back a little if not for courtesy but for your own safety.

i'm amazed by the number of cyclists who cut up the inside of HGVs on the east link. sure, it can be slow going, but it's about 180m from one side to the other. it won't kill you (pun mainly unintended) to wait.

I love Sean nos

1bryan wrote: »

This cyclist didn't seem the most safety conscious person I've ever seen (over-ear headphones, baseball cap

1bryan wrote: »

but the guy in the middle was completely cut off by the bus and ended up having to mount the footpath for his own safety.

1bryan wrote: »

He seemed barely aware that it even happened.

These statements conflict.

railer201

1bryan wrote: »

So here's one. This morning I was cycling across Mount St (lower) Bridge. The lights were red and there were 3 of us on bikes in the cycle lane alongside a bus. When the lights went green the first cyclist in line moved away no problem. I was 3rd in line, towards the back of the bus, but the guy in the middle was completely cut off by the bus and ended up having to mount the footpath for his own safety. This cyclist didn't seem the most safety conscious person I've ever seen (over-ear headphones, baseball cap, and I mentioned the incident to him. He seemed barely aware that it even happened.

Anyway, I caught up to the bus driver at the next lights and said to him that he'd run a cyclist off the road (even though it wasn't me). He said he didn't (obviously not even aware of what he'd done). I assured him he did.

Do I complain, even though I wasn't directly involved in the incident? Or is that down to the individual in question? I took the license plate of the bus and I can give a very good description of the driver. But, is it my place to do this?

There's only two positions to find yourself in - either ahead or behind the bus or HGV. Supposing there was a railings to the left of the cyclist above - any retreat would be cut off. The rights or wrongs take second place to your safety.

1bryan

punisher5112 wrote: »

If the road narrows do not pass a large vehicle like a bus or truck.

the road didn't narrow. There is a cycle lane there. The bus moved into the cycle lane.

The other guy should be aware of his surrounding and its up to all to pull back if needs be.

agreed. However we were all stopped at lights. While stopped we all had plenty of room. It wasn't until the bus moved off that this all changed.

I see it countless times where cyclists believe they have every right to pass a vehicle in the dumbest of places.

again, (we) the cyclists weren't passing the bus. The first cyclist got away ok because he moved off quicker than the bus did.

If you can't see the driver in the mirror s/he can't see you.

The driver can't see you if he/she isn't looking in the mirror, as was clearly the case here given how oblivious the driver was to what happened when I confronted him.

1st cyclist got off so bus moved off just like all traffic would and should.
Sometimes you just have to hang back a little if not for courtesy but for your own safety.

fair enough. However, this didn't seem to have the makings of a dangerous situation when we were all stopped. I mentioned that the cyclist who was run off the road seemed a bit clueless. Normally I'd have a little less sympathy, but I don't think I'd have done anything differently to him had I been where he was.

I don't know if it was the drivers fault or not as I wasn't there so can only take your side but just be aware of what I mentioned above.

It was the driver's fault. He was driving a bus and ran a cyclist off the road.

Also worth thinking even if one is right its not much use if they are and dead or badly injured.

agree 100%. However there was no act of stubborness or defiance here. Moreso mindlessness (bordering on recklessness) by the bus driver.

Infrastructure should be something all pedestrians, cyclists and drivers should be getting onto TDs and councils about as there are only more and more using the roads and no space.

The way I look at it every bike I see is one less car and in theory less traffic so in reality its a win win only for it can be extremely dangerous and attitudes of all road users need to be trained to be more careful around each other and give space and get on.

Better roads and more space and take away parking especially on core routes in and out of city centre.

again, agree with all that. However it seems that many cyclists only learn once they have an accident or a near miss. Motorists continue, in large numbers, to be irrationally angry at cyclists for no good reason. However, in the case of bus drivers, being aware of other road users should be a priority for them in their training and their everyday work.

1bryan

I love Sean nos wrote: »

These statements conflict.

no they don't. Explain why you think so.

I love Sean nos

1bryan wrote: »

no they don't. Explain why you think so.

"He seemed barely aware that it even happened." vs. "mount the footpath"
So he took evasive action for something that he wasn't aware of according to you. Unless you're claiming that his mounting of the footpath was unrelated and completely coincidental.

1bryan

I love Sean nos wrote: »

"He seemed barely aware that it even happened." vs. "mount the footpath"
So he took evasive action for something that he wasn't aware of according to you. Unless you're claiming that his mounting of the footpath was unrelated and completely coincidental.

no, not at all. I was referring to his demeanour when I spoke to him. Seemed very nonplussed. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

punisher5112

Just because there is a cycle doesn't mean pass if not safe.

Large vehicles will encroach on them even if continuous white which are not meant to be..
Reasons are vehicle is that big there is no road space and terrible placement and design.

Look at cycle lanes and bus stops where a continuous white line meets the bus stop box itself.

How can the large vehicle get around legally and this is an honest answer they can't.

If a driver were to leave the depot they would be many points up just leaving it due to having to let the front swing over footpaths, cross continuous white lines, hatch markings/fake islands and many many more.

As I said I wasn't there but maybe the other cyclist should quit using ear phones and concentrate on what is happening.

I do not condone if someone does wrong but people make errors and he may not have intentionally done it but you or I can't say.

Chuchote

punisher5112 wrote: »

If the road narrows do not pass a large vehicle like a bus or truck.

As I read the description it seemed that they were in the cycle lane, and the bus came up beside them?

It's a common mistake to assume that people on bikes have come up inside a big vehicle, when in fact the vehicle has drawn up beside them.

Infrastructure should be something all pedestrians, cyclists and drivers should be getting onto TDs and councils about as there are only more and more using the roads and no space.

The way I look at it every bike I see is one less car and in theory less traffic so in reality its a win win only for it can be extremely dangerous and attitudes of all road users need to be trained to be more careful around each other and give space and get on.

Better roads and more space and take away parking especially on core routes in and out of city centre.

I could not agree more. Have you written to your TDs, to the Minister for Transport - shane.ross@oireachtas.ie and/or Minister@dttas.ie - to make these very well-expressed points? And maybe add Dublin City Council's Transport Committee:

Emails: Ciarán Cuffe, Chair <ciaran.cuffe@dublincity.ie>, Paul Hand <phand@dublincity.ie>, Teresa Keegan <teresa.keegan@dublincity.ie>, Frank Kennedy <frank.kennedy@dublincity.ie>, Dr Paddy Smyth <paddy.smyth@dublincity.ie>, Paddy McCartan <cllrpatmccartan@gmail.com>, Deputy Lord Mayor Larry O’Toole <larry.otoole@dublincity.ie>, Ray McHugh <ray.mchugh@dublincity.ieL, Jane Horgan-Jones <horganjones.jane@gmail.com>, Kieran Binchy <Kieran.Binchy@dublincity.ie>, Ciarán O’Moore <ciaran.omoore@dublincity.ie>, Mannix Flynn <mannix.flynn@dublincity.ie>

Phone: Ciarán Cuffe 087 2652075, Chairperson, Paul Hand 087 3390561, Teresa Keegan 087 1469902, Frank Kennedy 087 3383972, Dr Paddy Smyth 087 181 9000, Paddy McCartan 087 2248817, Deputy Lord Mayor Larry O’Toole 086 854 1940, Ray McHugh 087 9369611, Jane Horgan-Jones 086 837 5219, Kieran Binchy 087 1774365, Ciarán O’Moore 086 807 2753, Mannix Flynn 087-2246664

Twitter: @CiaranCuffe @paulphand @frankjkennedy @padsmyth @councillorpaddy @larryotoolebohs @ray_cllr @horganjonesjane @KieranBinchy @mannixflynn @Shane_RossTD

May I suggest that you use the terms "people on bikes" and "people driving cars" and "people walking" rather than the divisive driver/cyclist terminology?

https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2015/02/dont-say-cyclists-say-people-on-bikes/385387/

dashcamdanny

flatface wrote: »

I am happy to see this thread, it's appears like the OP came to this with a genuine question instead of the usual rants and entrenched ideas we see here. Please let us know if this discussion has answered your question or changed your viewpoint as that would be a success worth applauding.
I travel up and down the N11 daily and see plenty of respect between bus drivers and cyclists. Most give way to each other and I see plenty of common sense - e.g. A driver not opening his doors if a cyclist is approaching on the cycle lane, cyclists yielding to opening doors, buses waiting until safe points to overtake etc.
So mostly I want to say thanks to DB.

I think you should take from this that if a cyclist is in the process of overtaking for whatever reason you must yield.
The cause of the manoeuvre should not come into the reaction to it. It doesn't matter why is this cyclist overtaking, just since he is I must yield.
Likewise it shouldn't matter the reason why I may not be in a cyclelane (there are a few reasons for the ones I avoid) just since I am in the bus lane instead I must be overtaken with care and respect. Thanks.

Thanks for that reply.
I have not logged in since the last post as it was getting a bit heated, and was put into its own thread by a mod, but im glad I had a look back.

You are 100% correct on what I should take away from it. And have.



I still do still believe that some Dublin cyclists get way to close to buses and maybe take for granted the forces of an 18 tonne bus against an 80kg cyclist .

I know some bus drivers get way to close to vulnerable cyclist.
I wish both groups were segregated with a curb.

Maybe Shane Ross will fix it :pac:

AndrewJRenko

Chuchote wrote: »

It's a common mistake to assume that people on bikes have come up inside a big vehicle, when in fact the vehicle has drawn up beside them.

Or (as happened me today), the big vehicle starts to overtake without actually judging the speed of the cyclist, and finds themselves half way through an overtake approaching an obstacle or a pinch-point - and generally uses their might to push on through forcing the cyclist to hold back or stop.