Tubeless Road Riding

harringtonp

Anybody here ride tubeless road wheels ?

Harrybelafonte

Yes.

harringtonp

What's the rim/tyre combo ?

Was tearing my hair out trying to get Schwalbe Pro Ones on to a Carbonal 25mm Tubeless easy rim. Gave up and went standard for now but bought the wheelset with tubeless in mind and forked out for 2 pro ones

AmberGold

I have them on a set however they were difficult to get on. Dread the thoughts of puncturing and having to get a tube in and the tyre back on. Find myself taking industrial strength tyre levers and taxi money on rides.
Having said that they roll well.

I have Scwalbe Pro and Easton RT90.

Harrybelafonte

Schwalbe have a lubricant that you can use on the tyres which really helps. Stretch them a bit etc but as said, use good levers. No other way. I did have to change to a tube one day in freezing conditions and was in tears of frustration by the time I got them on.

I use achwalbe ones and above is only time I had to fix a puncture. Gloob worked in all other occasions but I only really race on them.

Wheels were Ultegra Tubeless

harringtonp

AmberGold wrote: »

I have them on a set however they were difficult to get on. Dread the thoughts of puncturing and having to get a tube in and the tyre back on. Find myself taking industrial strength tyre levers and taxi money on rides.
Having said that they roll well.

I have Scwalbe Pro and Easton RT90.

That's interesting. My Schwalbe Pro Ones went on to my Carbon rim really easy with no lever necessary. This is perhaps part of the reason why I am having such difficulty getting a seal.

harringtonp

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Schwalbe have a lubricant that you can use on the tyres which really helps. Stretch them a bit etc but as said, use good levers. No other way. I did have to change to a tube one day in freezing conditions and was in tears of frustration by the time I got them on.

I use achwalbe ones and above is only time I had to fix a puncture. Gloob worked in all other occasions but I only really race on them.

Wheels were Ultegra Tubeless

Just double checking that you actually mean Schwalbe Ones ? The Schwalbe Pro One is a newer and lighter tyre which I presume is more supple and easier to fit.

And is the lubricant the container shown in image 1 in

https://www.schwalbe.com/en/tubeless-technology.htm

I gathered this was more to help a seal form.l

AmberGold

AmberGold wrote: »

I have them on a set however they were difficult to get on. Dread the thoughts of puncturing and having to get a tube in and the tyre back on. Find myself taking industrial strength tyre levers and taxi money on rides.
Having said that they roll well.

I have Scwalbe Pro and Easton RT90.

I have a similar problem with my continentals and bontrager tubeless ready rims. So much so I still struggle with tyre levers.

This method has made life so much easier.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XUFVrl0UT4
The key as you will see is to use a strap to hold the small bit of tyre slack in place while you push more up the other side.

I bring a bit of a strap in my saddle bag in case I get a puncture.

Harrybelafonte

harringtonp wrote: »

Just double checking that you actually mean Schwalbe Ones ? The Schwalbe Pro One is a newer and lighter tyre which I presume is more supple and easier to fit.

And is the lubricant the container shown in image 1 in

https://www.schwalbe.com/en/tubeless-technology.htm

I gathered this was more to help a seal form.l

Schwalbe One's

I don't see an image, it's this tuff, not the sealant:

Corker1

harringtonp wrote: »

Just double checking that you actually mean Schwalbe Ones ? The Schwalbe Pro One is a newer and lighter tyre which I presume is more supple and easier to fit.

And is the lubricant the container shown in image 1 in

https://www.schwalbe.com/en/tubeless-technology.htm

I gathered this was more to help a seal form.l

I run Scwalbe Pro One tubeless tyres with Easton EA90 SLX tubeless ready rims and have done so for the last year. No problems mounting on the rims. They are a little tight but even my weak thumbs can get them on. If anyone is having trouble mounting the bead I find using a pair of cycle gloves and the palm of your hand to roll them on does the trick. I also use this stuff;

https://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;product=5556;menu=1000,185,188;mid%5B6%5D=1

It is mainly used to lubricate the bead onto the rim but if used liberally may help with the seal. A bit of fairy liquid on a wet sponge will also do the trick (and leave your hands 'Fairy Soft' )

My Schwalbe Pro Ones mounted easily with a track pump first time (vigourous pumping) but Santa brought me one of these, which makes it even easier;

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/airwave-airblast-tubeless-tyre-track-pump/rp-prod142714

Rotating the tube and tyre with a bit of sealant in might also help getting sealant onto the beads but might be a bit messy.

Corker1

By the way, I recently got to see the benefit from one of the advantages of tubeless recently when my rear tyre punctured on a 30% gradient descent on the Fred Whitton Challenge two weeks back. There was a bit of spray from the sealant onto the frame but the puncture self sealed (major safety feature too) and allowed me to continue the next 30km until the finish without removing the tyre. Result.

And of course they roll sooo nice. I am a total convert to tubeless. Having said that, my first use of tubeless a couple of years back was with a pair of Hutchinson Atom Galacticks which were hard to mount and both developed sidewall defects after brief use before I sent them back to Chain Reaction for a refund.

But I am delighted with the Schwalbe Pro Ones which are also very hard wearing. They need to be around the rough roads of West Wicklow!

LollipopJimmy

A small bar of soap (the kind you steal from hotels) in your kit, drop of water onto it and rub it around the edge of the tyre and your tyre will slide on so much easier, you'll also have clean hands after.

harringtonp

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

A small bar of soap (the kind you steal from hotels) in your kit, drop of water onto it and rub it around the edge of the tyre and your tyre will slide on so much easier, you'll also have clean hands after.

Great idea, had tried washing up liquid and warm water but can see how soap would be better

harringtonp

From the wheelbuilder himself:

"Sorry you are having trouble wit the tubeless but nice to know that the wheels feel good with tubes in.

Pro One tyres normally inflate fairly easily on these rims. We have supplied a number of sets with 23mm and 25mm Pro One tyres fitted.

If a tyre is being difficult (normally a MTB one), one trick we use in our workshop is to:
Remove the valve core completely leaving just the stem in place.
Fit a bit of plastic tube over the stem a few turns (the size used for bleeding car brakes is about right).
Use a garage compressor with a blow gun (the sort a workshop uses to clean parts).
The extra volume going in quickly usually blows the tyre straight up onto the beads.
Obviously the tyre deflates as soon as you take the gun away but if you refit the valve core and repeat the process fairly quickly, the tyre will inflate and seal.

We haven't tried all the air blast tools available. We have a Zefal one which works well but the best one may be the Specialized which has the biggest tank volume - Cycling Plus has a test of 6 types in the June 2017 issue.

Mark
Spokesman Wheels"

Sarz91

Corker1 wrote: »

By the way, I recently got to see the benefit from one of the advantages of tubeless recently when my rear tyre punctured on a 30% gradient descent on the Fred Whitton Sportive two weeks back. There was a bit of spray from the sealant onto the frame but the puncture self sealed (major safety feature too) and allowed me to continue the next 30km until the finish without removing the tyre. Result.

And of course they roll sooo nice. I am a total convert to tubeless. Having said that, my first use of tubeless a couple of years back was with a pair of Hutchinson Atom Galacticks which were hard to mount and both developed sidewall defects after brief use before I sent them back to Chain Reaction for a refund.

But I am delighted with the Schwalbe Pro Ones which are also very hard wearing. They need to be around the rough roads of West Wicklow!

How did you find hardknott and wrynose?

Corker1

Sarz91 wrote: »

How did you find hardknott and wrynose?

Tough - very, very tough. My 34x29 gearing just wasn't enough to get me up the stupid steep 33% pitches on Hardknott so I have to admit I walked on part of it. I had even brought cleat covers so had expected that TBH. But I managed to pedal all the way up Wrynose and Honister. Did it with a crew of 7 from the Club and everyone met their Waterloo on Hardknott Pass. It was actually on the descent down the back of Hardknott where I punctured and depunctured on the move!

harringtonp

Rode tubeless for the first time ever yesterday, Schwalbe 25mm Pro Ones. And it certainly has a completely different feel to it. The closest I've come to that feeling before was last year in Majorca when I rented a Titanium bike for a day (and didn't like it). Even though tubeless is far smoother, the ride felt "heavy" at times, particularly at slower speeds going up hills. Having said that the speed for the power I was putting out during the spin (around the 200W mark) was good and I reckon I just need too get one decent race under my belt on the wheels before I start feeling the love for them !

What tyre pressure do people ride tubeless on here ?

And did anybody else think the ride felt "heavy" when they first used them ?

rollingscone

harringtonp wrote: »

Rode tubeless for the first time ever yesterday, Schwalbe 25mm Pro Ones. And it certainly has a completely different feel to it. The closest I've come to that feeling before was last year in Majorca when I rented a Titanium bike for a day (and didn't like it). Even though tubeless is far smoother, the ride felt "heavy" at times, particularly at slower speeds going up hills. Having said that the speed for the power I was putting out during the spin (around the 200W mark) was good and I reckon I just need too get one decent race under my belt on the wheels before I start feeling the love for them !

What tyre pressure do people ride tubeless on here ?

And did anybody else think the ride felt "heavy" when they first used them ?

Imho the wider the tyre the better the tubeless experience.

The 38mm ghetto tubeless on my hack mtb are awesome at 30 and 35psi but the 32mm cx tyres on my CDF are way less reassuring at that pressure.

harringtonp

rollingscone wrote: »

Imho the wider the tyre the better the tubeless experience.

The 38mm ghetto tubeless on my hack mtb are awesome at 30 and 35psi but the 32mm cx tyres on my CDF are way less reassuring at that pressure.

The tubeless ride was on a road bike and the thinking is to have extra reliability (I.e. less punctures) without safricing speed. To be honest I don't really care about comfort when the legs are being ripped of me in a race.

During itv4s tour de France coverage there was a little feature on tubeless and they asked but didn't answer why it hadn't caught on in the pro peleton.

Lumen

harringtonp wrote: »

During itv4s tour de France coverage there was a little feature on tubeless and they asked but didn't answer why it hadn't caught on in the pro peleton.

You can't safely ride them flat, unlike a tubular.

rollingscone

harringtonp wrote: »

The tubeless ride was on a road bike and the thinking is to have extra reliability (I.e. less punctures) without safricing speed. To be honest I don't really care about comfort when the legs are being ripped of me in a race.

During itv4s tour de France coverage there was a little feature on tubeless and they asked but didn't answer why it hadn't caught on in the pro peleton.

I think unless you go low pressure you'll get that dead feeling.

The general idea is to go as low as you can go without feeling deflection.

Gerry

This is a really encouraging thread. I'm thinking of converting my giant pr2 wheels to tubeless, using the same method as I've used on mtb wheels - duct tape.

aworthycause

harringtonp wrote: »

Rode tubeless for the first time ever yesterday, Schwalbe 25mm Pro Ones. And it certainly has a completely different feel to it. The closest I've come to that feeling before was last year in Majorca when I rented a Titanium bike for a day (and didn't like it). Even though tubeless is far smoother, the ride felt "heavy" at times, particularly at slower speeds going up hills. Having said that the speed for the power I was putting out during the spin (around the 200W mark) was good and I reckon I just need too get one decent race under my belt on the wheels before I start feeling the love for them !

What tyre pressure do people ride tubeless on here ?

And did anybody else think the ride felt "heavy" when they first used them ?

That heaviness you feel on both titanium and and tubeless is a lack of road buzz. It's actually faster, although feels slower, you are going over tiny bumps rather than feeling every little bit as you might on hard pumped clinchers. I ride clinchers on the training bike, race on tubeless; the clinchers are tougher on wrists etc.
I'm not describing the feeling too well. Velonews had a podcast on it explaining how the chatter feel on clinchers feels deceptively faster.

Corker1

I switched from 23mm Schwalbe Pro Ones to 25mm in the same tyre a couple of months back. I am going back to the 23mm version as I think there is less 'zip' to the 25mm tyres. I have heard all about the aero benefits of wider tyres etc. but subjectively I prefer the feel of the skinnier version. Of course the lack of zip could be in my legs ;-) Schwalbe Pro ones are also generally slightly wider in real life than it says on the box. You may have seen this comparison website before ... http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews

harringtonp

Corker1 wrote: »

I switched from 23mm Schwalbe Pro Ones to 25mm in the same tyre a couple of months back. I am going back to the 23mm version as I think there is less 'zip' to the 25mm tyres. I have heard all about the aero benefits of wider tyres etc. but subjectively I prefer the feel of the skinnier version. Of course the lack of zip could be in my legs ;-) Schwalbe Pro ones are also generally slightly wider in real life than it says on the box. You may have seen this comparison website before ... http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews

That website is a bit like a bible for me. Based on it, I was using a Continental Grand Prix TT/Latex tube combination with the wheels but after a few uses had a bad blow out and ended up getting an expensive rebuild done (see http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=103899107 )

How wide are your rims ?

The 23mm Grand Prix TT tyres that I had on the 25mm wheels did result in a great looking wheel profile. There is a bit of a bulge with 25mm Pro Ones on the rim.

harringtonp

aworthycause wrote: »

That heaviness you feel on both titanium and and tubeless is a lack of road buzz. It's actually faster, although feels slower, you are going over tiny bumps rather than feeling every little bit as you might on hard pumped clinchers. I ride clinchers on the training bike, race on tubeless; the clinchers are tougher on wrists etc.
I'm not describing the feeling too well. Velonews had a podcast on it explaining how the chatter feel on clinchers feels deceptively faster.

Yes its definitely a feeling rather than reality. Used the set up club racing yesterday evening and even though my form was good I've done enough of them now to know that the wheels gave a good boost over the aluminium clinchers I was previously using with Michelin Pro 3 tyres.

Corker1

harringtonp wrote: »

That website is a bit like a bible for me. Based on it, I was using a Continental Grand Prix TT/Latex tube combination with the wheels but after a few uses had a bad blow out and ended up getting an expensive rebuild done (see http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=103899107 )

How wide are your rims ?

The 23mm Grand Prix TT tyres that I had on the 25mm wheels did result in a great looking wheel profile. There is a bit of a bulge with 25mm Pro Ones on the rim.

The rims are 17.5mm internal and 22mm wide external. Frame clearance is also very tight with the Schwalbe pro one tubeless 25mm. https://www.eastoncycling.com/products/details/ea90-slx-wheels

harringtonp

Corker1 wrote: »

The rims are 17.5mm internal and 22mm wide external. Frame clearance is also very tight with the Schwalbe pro one tubeless 25mm. https://www.eastoncycling.com/products/details/ea90-slx-wheels

I was also struck by how little frame clearance there is on the rear with the 25mm pro one. Thankfully didn't notice any rub sprinting yesterday evening. But like yourself I'd go 23 next time round