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Traveller Halting Site in Johnstown

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    #32
    One_Of_Shanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭One_Of_Shanks


    One_Of_Shanks wrote: »
    well that's funny because the same rules don't apply.

    Why is that?

    So no answer yet Anne?


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    #33
    One_Of_Shanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭One_Of_Shanks


    We'll stick ya down for a "no comment" then Anne. Because I asked the question yesterday an hour after you replied to me and again tonight and that wee green light thing says that you're online for the last few hours but have refrained from commenting further.

    If you don't mind I'll suggest that you ran yourself down a cul de sac by saying we're the same species.
    Because if we're the same species then we should all adhere to the same rules.
    So if I stop paying taxes, park my van in the middle of a green area and litter the daylights out of other peoples neighbourhoods then nothing will happen to me? Sure you'll support me wont't you?

    What actually would happen is that I'd be arrested and rightly so.

    So I ask you again, are you sure we're the same species? Or are they a protected species?


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    #34
    PeterTheNinth
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭PeterTheNinth


    I think that Anne might have been scared off by the fact that a lot of people that disagree with her. But that's not the point, it's not about trying to bully somebody else off the thread because they have a different opinion. The point is that the majority of people are in agreement that it's not acceptable to lie down and let any group of people just p1ss all over their area, and consider it acceptable because they are a minority.


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    #35
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Hi Peter, don't worry i wouldn't be scared off by keyboard warriors, and yes we are all entitled to our opinion.
    But at no point have i defended the actions of whoever made the mess.
    That was not the point i was making.
    Calling them a different species or taring them all with the same brush, is in my opinion, incorrect.
    There is good and bad in every part of society, as demonstrated on this thread.


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    #36
    Joe Public
    Registered Users Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭Joe Public


    Not being racist or anything but just giving the facts.

    There are less than 2,000 travellers out of 30,000, in Ireland, that actually travel around but all too often leave their mark wherever they stop.

    Two studies have been produced in relation to Travellers in prison. One was conducted in Ireland in 2014, and found a disproportionate amount of Travellers are incarcerated.
    Men are between five and 11 times more likely to be jailed, while for women it's 18 to 22 times more likely.
    (A 2005 study looking at mental health among Travellers claimed that they make up 5.4pc of the Irish prison population, while only comprising 0.6pc of the population as a whole.)

    A study carried out in the UK in 2011 reckoned that travellers make up 1pc of the prison population in England and Wales: a massive disparity given that the general population is 56 million people and that there are only 15,000 travellers. (0.026785714285714288pc of the population).

    They have a different DNA and are now recognised as a different race of people, this is all fine but much of their culture is so far removed from the laws and culture of the rest of the population and will always cause friction.


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    #37
    micks
    Registered Users Posts: 840 ✭✭✭micks


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Hi Peter, don't worry i wouldn't be scared off by keyboard warriors, and yes we are all entitled to our opinion.
    But at no point have i defended the actions of whoever made the mess.
    That was not the point i was making.
    Calling them a different species or taring them all with the same brush, is in my opinion, incorrect.
    There is good and bad in every part of society, as demonstrated on this thread.

    I'm intrigued. your first post
    AnneFrank wrote: »
    such racism in this thread

    can you point out which posts you think are racist?


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    #38
    beertons
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 23,097 ✭✭✭✭beertons


    Saw a few vans pulling into the old cement factory earlier. That site is fairly big, you'd fit some amount of vans in there.


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    #39
    WishUWereHere
    Registered Users Posts: 2,385 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    such racism in this thread

    Yours post was #12 on this thread. Would You be so kind and point out exactly where the racism is in the previous 11 posts?

    Also, I see 3 caravans now at the roundabout on the outer ringroad behind PowerCity. There has been 1 for the past week or 2, but now 3.

    Disgraceful!


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    #40
    HonalD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭HonalD


    One_Of_Shanks wrote: »
    So I ask you again, are you sure we're the same species? Or are they a protected species?

    I've no interest in defending travellers rights or commenting on the current situation but as a completely independent viewer, I would consider the above comments distasteful, if one is searching for racist commentary.


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    #41
    HonalD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭HonalD


    Joe Public wrote: »
    They have a different DNA and are now recognised as a different race of people, this is all fine but much of their culture is so far removed from the laws and culture of the rest of the population and will always cause friction.

    @Joe Public - similar was said about homosexuals in the 1980s for example and look where we are now.


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    #42
    anewme
    Registered Users Posts: 11,948 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    HonalD wrote: »
    I've no interest in defending travellers rights or commenting on the current situation but as a completely independent viewer, I would consider the above comments distasteful, if one is searching for racist commentary.

    Have you seen the state of the place?

    There are so many real causes crying out for funding in Kildare,it's saddening to see our funds diverted to clean up after the travellers year after year.

    its not about anyone's rights , but no one has the right got to leave a load of filth and expect permanent residents to pick up the bill.


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    #43
    One_Of_Shanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭One_Of_Shanks


    HonalD wrote: »
    I've no interest in defending travellers rights or commenting on the current situation but as a completely independent viewer, I would consider the above comments distasteful, if one is searching for racist commentary.

    Nope. Simply asking that if we're all the same why are the rules applied differently? (or not applied at all)
    But forget the context entirely and choose one line from my post and deduce that I'm a racist if that's what you want to do, off you go...


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    #44
    HonalD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭HonalD


    One_Of_Shanks wrote: »
    Nope. Simply asking that if we're all the same why are the rules applied differently? (or not applied at all)
    But forget the context entirely and choose one line from my post and deduce that I'm a racist if that's what you want to do, off you go...

    I didn't call you a racist - I don't know you.

    But your reference to travellers being of a different species is distasteful.

    And your "off you go..." comment is noted.


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    #45
    HonalD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭HonalD


    anewme wrote: »
    Have you seen the state of the place?

    There are so many real causes crying out for funding in Kildare,it's saddening to see our funds diverted to clean up after the travellers year after year.

    its not about anyone's rights , but no one has the right got to leave a load of filth and expect permanent residents to pick up the bill.

    I didn't comment on the issue directly - I probably hold similar views to you about littering and transient residents. But the reference to a different "species" by the other poster is objectionable. Last time I checked we are all humans.


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    #46
    One_Of_Shanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,436 ✭✭✭One_Of_Shanks


    HonalD wrote: »
    I didn't call you a racist - I don't know you.

    But your reference to travellers being of a different species is distasteful.
    .

    Fair enough I thought that's what you were implying. hence the curt reply. My bad.

    About the species comment, my question was are they a 'protected species'?
    Meaning why do rules applied to the rest of us regarding taxes and littering etc seldom seem to be enforced in the same way when it comes to travellers? And if we're all the same then we should all be treated the same.
    Hence the phrase protected species.
    A 'protected group' then if that sounds better.
    What people are asking for is for them to be held accountable in the same way as everyone else.
    It's not about a load of big evil racists hating travellers and looking to have a go at them just because they're travellers, its simply frustration among people that they seem to get away with certain things like the littering and tax issues that others dont.


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    #47
    anewme
    Registered Users Posts: 11,948 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    One_Of_Shanks wrote: »
    Fair enough I thought that's what you were implying. hence the curt reply. My bad.

    About the species comment, my question was are they a 'protected species'?
    Meaning why do rules applied to the rest of us regarding taxes and littering etc seldom seem to be enforced in the same way when it comes to travellers? And if we're all the same then we should all be treated the same.
    Hence the phrase protected species.
    A 'protected group' then if that sounds better.
    What people are asking for is for them to be held accountable in the same way as everyone else.
    It's not about a load of big evil racists hating travellers and looking to have a go at them just because they're travellers, its simply frustration among people that they seem to get away with certain things like the littering and tax issues that others dont.

    It's not even about getting away with certain things.....why would you want to leave your litter...why would you expect me as a tax payer to clean up after you....respect for earth end it's future...at some point everyone should think of this instead of you and your kids ****ting on the pavement expecting me to Clean up and foot the bill


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    #48
    Joe Public
    Registered Users Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭Joe Public


    HonalD wrote: »
    @Joe Public - similar was said about homosexuals in the 1980s for example and look where we are now.

    Meaning what?

    Society has changed their attitude to homosexuals and are more educated and accepting of their situation.

    Society can also live in harmony with the traveller people if they make more of an effort to abide by the laws of the land. Some travellers do but sadly too many make a career out of lawlessness and the situation is not improving.
    Travellers are just not trusted and they have to make the change, not society in general.


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    #49
    HonalD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭HonalD


    Joe Public wrote: »
    Meaning what?

    Society has changed their attitude to homosexuals and are more educated and accepting of their situation.

    Society can also live in harmony with the traveller people if they make more of an effort to abide by the laws of the land. Some travellers do but sadly too many make a career out of lawlessness and the situation is not improving.
    Travellers are just not trusted and they have to make the change, not society in general.

    Meaning.....

    You said that travellers have different DNA and are a different race of people.

    My point is that we all have different DNA and travellers are not a different "race" but have a different ethnicity. There is a huge difference in the meaning of these words.

    Again, I'm not debating the actions of anyone of the travelling community, just observing and pointing out questionable language.


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    #50
    Joe Public
    Registered Users Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭Joe Public


    HonalD wrote: »
    Meaning.....

    You said that travellers have different DNA and are a different race of people.

    My point is that we all have different DNA and travellers are not a different "race" but have a different ethnicity. There is a huge difference in the meaning of these words.

    Again, I'm not debating the actions of anyone of the travelling community, just observing and pointing out questionable language.


    I suppose it comes down to your understanding of the word race, some experts say there are only 4 or 5 races in the world while others argue there are much more. Race is not a scientific segregation but one of convenience.

    Have a look at this RTE video

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0209/851399-irish-traveller-genetics/


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    #51
    WishUWereHere
    Registered Users Posts: 2,385 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    WishUWereHere wrote: »
    Yours post was #12 on this thread. Would You be so kind and point out exactly where the racism is in the previous 11 posts?

    Also, I see 3 caravans now at the roundabout on the outer ringroad behind PowerCity. There has been 1 for the past week or 2, but now 3.

    Disgraceful!

    AF, You still haven't answered my question: where in post 1 to 11 was there a mention of racist?

    Oh, and that 3 caravans is now 4, and there is a hand written sign up saying 'chevaux for sale'. And please don't get me started on the rubbish accumulating there.


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    #52
    thadg
    Registered Users Posts: 269 ✭✭thadg


    this man wasn't long sorting them.
    if they went away started paying income tax and had mortgages like the rest of us they would be accepted here.

    they are giving out about discrimination in pubs alot, why don't they open there own pubs for instance, its all take, take, take.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2737691/Angry-farmer-takes-revenge-gypsies-blocking-tractor-collection-refused-leave-land.html


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