BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

devnull

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118195879#Comment_118195879

Don't think there are RTPI feeds on BusTimes.org for Dublin Bus, the only operators who I know track on there in Ireland are Aircoach and TransLink. The RTPI feeds on that site are generally pulled from Ticketer ticket machines.

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118196018#Comment_118196018

The map is pretty interesting on that site too, shows just how many operators have live tracking in the UK - meanwhile in Ireland it's only Aircoach that's showing.

TranslatorPS

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118195999#Comment_118195999

Even better!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118196018#Comment_118196018

I feel like there used to be real-time departures available if you look at an individual stop, but I see that it's gone. Oh well, mea culpa.

Based on these timetables, I note some 76 new stops being added into the network, the vast majority of those on the six L5x services.

ggmat799

Please advise - At present ONLY Buss 44 connects Dundrum or City to Sandyford Village.

Bus Connect seems to have not improved it. Am I missing things here? Route 86/87 seems to be touching the village again at 60 min frequency.

Peregrine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118198111#Comment_118198111

87 and 88 each have a 60 minute frequency. They should be timetabled together to give a combined 30min frequency at Sandyford Village. There's also the less frequent L33 which is like the 44B but with more services.

LXFlyer

Yes, I think you are missing something actually.

The 86 will go through Sandyford village every 30 minutes and will link it with the city centre via Kilmacud and Clonskeagh.

The 87 and 88 will go directly along Sandyford Road from the city centre via Dundrum at a combined frequency of every 30 minutes (every 60 minutes each).

These changes are not due to happen until 2024.

https://busconnects.ie/media/2018/dundrum-area-map.pdf

Rulmeq

Just looking at this map, is it saying that if you want to go from Celbridge to Maynooth, you need to get off the C4, and change to the W6? I don't see any details of the W6 route anywhere, is this an old plan, or a future plan?

https://busconnects.ie/media/2008/celbridge-leixlip-area-map.pdf

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200007#Comment_118200007

It's already mentioned above to someone that W6 will be launched at a later phase. That's why C4 is currently extended to Maynooth. Later it will go to Celbridge only, when W6 will start operating.

jams100

They really should have announcements on the bus (25a, 25b, 66, 67 etc.) that the bus numbers will be changing from next week.

It would have more of an effect that putting one or two adds about the changes on Facebook or the radio...I'd say most old people don't know about the upcoming changes.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200520#Comment_118200520

Well, as with the H-Spine launch, I would expect there to be booklets on all of the buses from now on, and people out at all of the stops to explain this from next Sunday.

rx8

I spoke with 2 regulars yesterday who had no idea that they will have to transfer now in Townsend St to continue their journey to Ringsend and Sandymount. Definitely not enough information out there at the moment in D4.

Qrt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118180575#Comment_118180575

Why are we still doing hourly bus routes? Was the whole point of BusConnects not increased frequency? Oh well.

jams100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200638#Comment_118200638

My point is that on routes that will be changing next week they could do on board announcements like they currently have asking people to wear a face covering.

Imo that would be one of the best ways of informing people about the changes as your immediately targeting the correct audience

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200695#Comment_118200695

The bus service has a range of different routes, and this is reflected in the final BusConnects plan, which ranges from high frequency spines to lower frequency community bus routes where demand does not necessarily require more than an hourly service.

For the first part of the L51 and L52, they offer a combined half-hourly service between Adamstown and Lucan Village via Dodsboro, and then an hourly service along the rest of the route from where they split.

BusConnects doesn't mean every route increases in frequency, but it does generally see most routes having longer operating hours.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200658#Comment_118200658

Well as expressed before, I think that the NTA really have not displayed any particular talent at disseminating the information for these changes to the public.

• The rollout of information has been completely disjointed - dripfeeding the whole time - it is far too last minute
• No information posted on the BusConnects website about the launch of the C-Spine
• No information about what stops the Express routes serve on the timetables themeselves and no proper map provided of those routes
• No map provided for the night routes
• The booklets have no timetables in them - just a rather difficult to follow frequency guide
• Lack of focus of providing information about other route changes (1, 15a, 15b, 15d) to users of those routes
• Information about the new fare setup is still very vague one week before the launch

I shouldn't really be surprised by this. Most bus stops in south Dublin have completely out of date stop timetables for the GoAhead routes, and routes 6 and H9 were both changed last August (only a minor change for both) but none of the timetables on the stops show the revised timetables.

There seems to be a complete fixation on people using journey planners etc., when a significant number of people just want simply presented information either in printed form or at the stops.

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200832#Comment_118200832

As seen on bustimes.org, a lot this info (i.e. routing/stops served by the express routes) is already in the system - so the NTA could have easily made it available in a more public manner earlier.

There isn't even full stop by stop timetables made available by the NTA/Dublin bus, just the timetable for the first stop in either direction of each route - again something present on the likes of bustimes.org.

dfx-

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200764#Comment_118200764

For the combinations and Connects aspect of Bus Connects to work, it is dependent on the infrastructure and bus priority to make the connections work. It's years off, so its benefit is years off. Until then, you're going to end up at a connection point and hope the hourly service is not an hour away or just gone.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118201286#Comment_118201286

That’s true about certain routes where no alternative exists, but in this case, I don’t think that the unique part of the L51 will be a massive generator of combinations and connections to be fair (as the Spine routes will be within walking distance of all of it), but rather I suspect will be mainly for local journeys. As I said it and the L52 will deliver a combined 30 min frequency for Dodsboro connecting to/from the Spine routes C3 and C4.

Darc19

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200658#Comment_118200658

You will always have that no matter how much information is provided and for those people the best option is probably to have a day where they physically have to learn what to do and be late for where they are going - then they will know for future days.

TranslatorPS

Not to blow my own horn, but I've already whined about it: https://twitter.com/TranslatorPS/status/1409466217438535681 . NTA really needs to actually get something sorted, a far better solution than just the terminus departures.

rx8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118201915#Comment_118201915

These same people have no problem going to London or Berlin or Paris and transferring from one bus or train to another, to get around the city. It seems to be just an Irish mentality that everyone wants to travel to their home or office on just one bus. Changing is alien to most commuters, but for bus-connects to succeed and work as intended, people need to realise that sometimes changing is the fastest way to get around.

The other problem we have is getting staff to operate it. When the C-Spine starts next week, there's going to be news crews all over the place covering it, but the other services out of the garages operating it will suffer badly because of the shortage of drivers.

AngryLips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118200072#Comment_118200072

Does this mean that the level of bus service to Maynooth from city centre will actually get worse once W6 is introduced and the C4 stops serving the town?

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202690#Comment_118202690

No. Because not everyone is heading to town. It will get better due to a new route W6 to Tallaght introduced at a later stage. Will be more directions.

AngryLips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202754#Comment_118202754

But I wasn't asking about service to Tallaght, I was asking about service from Maynooth to city centre...

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202809#Comment_118202809

Well if the C4 is curtailed to Celbridge as per the plan published in 2020, people in Maynooth will be able to connect to/from it in Celbridge using the W6 with no fare penalty, or connect at Hazelhatch for rail services.

It is of course still possible that they may decide that the C4 may continue to operate to/from Maynooth, but that is not what was in the final plan published last year.

You seem to be surprised about this?

Did you not look at the planned final network and frequencies which has been in the public domain since September 2020?

OscarMIlde

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118201915#Comment_118201915

There's not a lot of information being provided though. Someone I know working in the same hospital as me was distraught when he saw the bus frequencies on the booklets disseminated on the bus, as it appeared from that that the first bus on the weekend was at eight o clock, which was incompatible with his shifts. He rang Dublin bus, and was passed to numerous people without any clarification. I eventually found it for him, and was able to show him the real timetable. People in their fifties and over are not necessarily tech savvy enough to find out this kind of information, which was actually quite hard to find. The least that could have been done was have the actual timetables for the main routes, and a map of each route specifically included in those booklets. Because as far as actual useful information there was sweet FA in them.

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118203468#Comment_118203468

Could be that when booklets were approved for printing, timetables weren't ready yet. As most things in Ireland, they are done the last minute ;) I completely agree that the NTA hasn't learnt much from the Phase 1. Communication seems to be a very low priority to them, sadly. I could understand that it's may be a result of a poor funding from the main government. But despite that, there still is, as you say, a poor information managing practise. Whether it's due to lack of skilled people in the NTA or something else, or a few reasons apart already mentioned, I don't know. Sad that the NTA isn't ambitious and enthusiastic enough to make things right. But again, perfectionism isn't one of the the Irish nation's qualities, so...

dfx-

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202878#Comment_118202878

That will depend on the connection. If you have to wait 20 minutes for the W6 to travel 10 minutes to wait 20 minutes for the C4, it's not going to work. There is a difference between being able to on a map and actually being prepared to do it.

Everyone in this thread might have read the plan and contributed to it, but there are a lot more who haven't. The communication has been terrible to well read users here, what do you think it is amongst the general public? There shouldn't be surprise or criticism that people haven't.

thomasj

Well with the new 90 minute ticket system coming , I was looking at the possibility of taking the train from maynooth to Confey and then hopping on one of the new services that run from River Forest to Hazelhatch. That's a combined 15 minute those frequencies will run. Still , would be better if the W6 hadve run from the start

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118203601#Comment_118203601

Yes, it's not ideal, but much better to what we have now (just a few orbitals). There's going to be more options and more buses overall. It is still down to the government to commit for annual funding increase to the public transport as now it's just around 40% (with an exception to last year) while in other European countries it's more above 60% and in some cities it's 97-100% (free for residents or for all).