BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

trellheim

Doesnt the 11 replacing the 46a means the E spines have to launch first before the O

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122482854#Comment_122482854

Yes.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122481636#Comment_122481636

Will the QBCs be built for these single deckers to deliver on the frequency that is proposed?
If not then the frequency is a fairytale tbh.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122482982#Comment_122482982

Which QBC's are you talking about?

The only major route getting these single deckers is the O route. If you mean Busconnects core radial routes, they are getting double deckers.

Prior to BusConnects, there was the SwiftWay plan which proposed using single deck articulated buses on 3 core routes into the city, Luas style operation, off bus ticketing, zero driver interaction, 4 doors, enter/exit through any door. Full detailed plans with bus stops and everything were created for the routes.

One of the worst mistakes the NTA made was scrapping this plan and going with BusConnects instead, rather then integrating Swiftway into BusConnects. I believe they have now realised their mistake and realised they are approaching the maximum capacity of Double Decker buses.

As a result, before even the first BusConnects corridor goes under construction, they have already started talking about turning them into Luas routes in future (see the post 2042 Luas map)!

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122483427#Comment_122483427

No I mean the o route.
If there are no QBCs/bus priority infrastructure planned for the o route, then 5min frequency is a fairytale.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122481925#Comment_122481925

Yes, I've stood on many buses, both single and double deckers and for the most part it is fine.

In fact, as I live closer to the city, by the time a bus gets to me, most of the seating is already taken and I have to stand. Sure I wouldn't want to stand all the way from Swords, but just 3km from the city center that I travel is fine.

I will say that standing on Double Deckers is worse then a single decker. There just isn't much standing space and the little there is you are often in the way of people trying to get too and from the stairs which makes it annoying.

With the 3/4 door single deckers with no driver interaction, like you find in some parts of Europe or the airport as you rightfully point out, if you see the front of the bus is full, you can just run down to the back of the bus and get on one of the other doors. And of course getting off you just use the closest door. So no need to squeeze by people in the same way as you might do on DD's.

It is a pity they didn't try this type of operating model for the O route.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122483450#Comment_122483450

Well 8 minutes frequency isn't that far off. Many of the core corridors end up having sub 5 minutes frequencies when you combine routes closer to the city. For instance in Drumcondra when you combine the 1/13/16/41.

Infrastructure upgrades will come later as part of the BusConnects Infrastructure project.

Either way, they aren't really doing what I'd like to see them do, roll out a more radical Luas type operation. Instead it is taking them years to rollout a pretty vanilla two door single decker service!!

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122483522#Comment_122483522

You won’t get 8min frequencies for the O at peak times due to the O busses being stuck in traffic as they didn’t build the infrastructure to allow for faster frequency.
QBCs should have been built first.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484166#Comment_122484166

To be fair they schedule buses on a stop by stop basis nowadays, and in doing so take into account the expected traffic which allows for delays - so that’s not really the case.

The 46a is already scheduled to operate along the NCR every 8 mins.

The issue nowadays is more the longer journey times that result from the poor infrastructure.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484210#Comment_122484210

Well yeah that’s a roundabout way of agreeing with what I’m saying- they should have built the infrastructure on a route by route basis first to improve frequency and capacity.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484546#Comment_122484546

That doesn't make any sense. It takes years to build out infrastructure, see the BusConnects Infrastructure projects.

The orbital routes like the N4 were rolled out without new infrastructure (just some new bus stops) and have been a massive success, though they will even be better once the infrastructure is upgraded, it would be stupid to wait years before launching those routes, they are so badly needed.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484778#Comment_122484778

As in my previous post I said infrastructure should be rolled out route by route to show BC to its fullest potential.
You don’t add 1000 houses to the end of a water line without upgrading the water line first to cater for the extra demand.
The same way we should have given dedicated lanes (QBCs) or other bus priority measures (bus gates etc) and then introduced increased numbers of busses which would have meant more reliable frequencies and capacity instead of more bussses stuck in traffic which is what we have now.
The N4 example actually proves my point. This route has QBCs for the most part therefore you can throw a load of extra busses on it as they have a dedicated lane.

Disco24

Cant think of one QBC on N4? It crawls along Collins Avenue, Howth rd and east wall... n

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485634#Comment_122485634

They mean the N4 Road, the Lucan CBC.

tom1ie

yes as LX says the Lucan road QBC.

Disco24

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485706#Comment_122485706

ah sorry my mistake..

LXFlyer

Not strictly BusConnects, but the 102 is being diverted to serve Portmarnock Railway Station from tomorrow, Sunday 11th August. Buses will simply loop along Station Road into and out of the station.

Route 33a also gains an 04:00 departure from Skerries to Dublin Airport, which will be useful for early flights.

https://www.goaheadireland.ie/timetable-change-11th-august-2024

Timetable Change - 11th August 2024

Thu 25th Jul 2024

Route 102 

Go-Ahead Ireland will be introducing a timetable change to increase reliability and punctuality, as well as to introduce a new stop at Portmarnock Train Station. 

The following stop will be added to service Portmarnock Train Station: 8343

Please see timetable (effective 11th August 2024) here. 

 

Route 33A 

Go-Ahead Ireland will be introducing a timetable change to increase reliability and punctuality, as well as a new weekday departure. 

The 33A will now depart from North Cliff Heights, Skerries, at 04:00AM (Monday - Friday)

Please see the timeable (effective 11th August 2024) here. 

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122486984#Comment_122486984

Good to see the Portmarnock station loop added, it's quite small addition in the grand scheme of things for a good benifit to locals!

cgcsb

The prolonged roll out is stalling the college green plaza project, which has architects appointed already. I wonder can we just divert existing bus routes and build the plaza anyway. Otherwise we'll be waiting till 2030 at this rate

bikeman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122487512#Comment_122487512

Yes, considering the winding nature of the route anyway, a little spin to the station is great. Properly links Portmarnock to the station and for free if you use TFI 90 before or after the DART. Up to now, most of Portmarnock would have driven to the station as it is quite a bit away and the bus stop, just that bit too far from the station. Great job.

On that 33A, another simple and brilliant addition. That arrival time will get the crews to the airport in time for nearly all departures, while also give folks a saving of €30/40 in a taxi going on the same road.

BusGuy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122478643#Comment_122478643

The UK variants have a difference to our EA buses.

BusGuy

Also, TFI and the NTA are idiots and are throwing out buses which aren't even 20 years old! Across to the British, TFL really don't care about their buses.

TranslatorPS

^^ TFI and the NTA are one and the same thing…

Also, that's misinformation and speculation. In the 31 March 2023 TfL bus audit, only four buses were made in 2007 (so 16 years old) and 72 buses were from 2008 (15 years old). In a fleet of 8643 buses that doesn't even make 1%. The average fleet age in London was 7.82 years in that audit, which admittedly is the highest in the previous 10 years, but that can be attributed to the rather limited purchases during the pandemic years (316 buses in 2020, 335 in 2021, and 201 buses in 2022), as also shown by 5907 buses being under 10 being the lowest number in that same 2013–2023 period (and that's still 68% of the fleet).

The NTA limits PSO bus age to 14 and school bus age to 20 for a reason, not the least of which were accidents with buses well over 20 on school services. I believe the age limit actually may predate the NTA and may have been Department-imposed years earlier, so there goes your argument out the window, nothing new here.

john boye

Honestly, just don't engage him.

trellheim

FYI signs have been appearing along the B spine corridor to give notice about the acquisition of land and the extinguishment of ROWs

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122501820#Comment_122501820

Great. Odd though since the nta have indicated that finglas/ballymun and finglas are coming first

SeSHo

I sincerely hope that anyone has annny idea on when the N2 bus will be going live? I've read beginning of summer, then beginning of September, now November.

I understand there is a lack of drivers, but seriously .. come on not a single accurate communication by anyone regarding when a bus line will be available?

pff.. sorry for the rant, but yeah .. well

cgcsb

I've seen a lot of driver training activity around St Helena's road and ballyboggin road so I hope they'll meet their October deadline, which was the last date I heard of.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122501820#Comment_122501820

OK where exactly do you mean?

The B-Spine refers to bus routes and could be either side of the city centre.

You keep getting the terminology wrong and it does matter as they are two separate projects.

• Spines = Bus routes
• Core Bus Corridors = Infrastructure projects

There are 2 core bus corridors that the B Spine will travel along:

• Blackrock / UCD
• Blanchardstown

Perhaps you could clarify?

TheChrisD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122501820#Comment_122501820

I presume it's for the core bus corridor section along the Navan Road through Ashtown; as well as the traffic adjustments to the Old Cabra Road and Stoneybatter?