Do you have sympathy for male 'incels (involuntary celibates)?

Glenster

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

men certainly seem more prone to it.

In public maybe.

There's nothing a woman loves more than giving a big boring lecture/talk in private.

tritium

Glenster wrote: »

Not everything is a 'thing'

I certainly wouldn't single out a group of men who haven't had sex with women for a while/ever as a distinct group in society worthy of sympathy.

I'd have more sympathy for 'stubbies' (white gay men who recently stubbed their toe)

You see broadly id agree with you. But then i have to wonder why we seem to have an industry of special groups who want their problems to be somehow worthy of attention. Im fine with addressing the causes of inequality but the endless positioning as victims is just jading tbh.

And i know every one them can put on the outrage hat and tell us how their suffering is so much more important than the incels or whoever, but for a large number of them, especially those largely drawn from priveliged first worlders, its kinda hard to care....

tritium

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

men certainly seem more prone to it.

Youve clearly never met my stepmother :pac:

But seriously, mansplaining is just an invented word that one woman came up with based on an experience she had. Whether one gender is more prone to the activity is entirely subjective (and hence its essentially a dishonest term)

wakka12

jeanjolie wrote: »

Is it due to American culture along with mental illness that caused this?

I don't think I've seen an Irish version of Elliot Rodger to be honest even factoring in the lack of firearm access. Don't think I've met any Irish lads who 'spoke like him in regards to women' if you know what I'm getting at.

Do you know anyone like this?

Not personally but Im quite interested in cosmetic surgery so I run into a lot of guys like him online actually. They're form all over the world, not just america

silverharp

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

men certainly seem more prone to it.

just checked google for synonyms

patronizing, supercilious, superior, snobbish, snobby, scornful, disdainful, lofty, lordly, haughty, imperious; snooty, snotty, stuck-up; toffee-nosed
"she looked us up and down in a condescending manner"

kunst nugget

wakka12 wrote: »

Not personally but Im quite interested in cosmetic surgery so I run into a lot of guys like him online actually. They're form all over the world, not just america

Interested in what way? Do you get a lot done yourself?

wakka12

kunst nugget wrote: »

Interested in what way? Do you get a lot done yourself?

Oh no I never have got anything done but I just like discussing it
too expensive tbh

LadyMacBeth_

LadyMacBeth_ wrote: »

I think what I said can certainly be contributing factors for both men and women struggling to find a relationship.

I have a female friend who is quite attractive and intelligent but struggles to find what she considers to be a suitable guy. I think it's because she has quite a misandrist attitude towards men and she also has some mental health issues that contribute too. It's definitely her attitude that causes the issues that don't allow her to have a successful relationship.

pwurple wrote: »

I don't agree with this. Mainly because women take a higher risk than men. I don't think it's easier, mentally at least. Women are generally not as strong as a man, and it's a pretty vulnerable position to put yourself in, usually in private, away from any safety net. A man can't get pregnant, some STDs are more serious and complicated for women than for men (hello, cervical cancer). You'd swear all a woman had to do was just pick someone off the street... but even if she fancies someone who may be up for it, these risk evaluations will end up with her talking herself out of it and brushing them off.

There are plenty of women with low self esteem or social anxiety issues as well. I wouldn't say those are confined to men. I certainly know women who think they are too ____ fat / skinny / quiet / uninterested in makeup for any man to be interested, and are completely oblivious to any signals, as they are unexpected.

See what I said in bold to address what you said about women and social anxiety/low self esteem. I wasn't saying that they aren't contributing factors for women who can't get into relationships, I was talking about incels specifically but stated that it applied to both genders.

I simply said that women generally find sex easier to access than men, if they want to have sex that is, not that there aren't drawbacks or reasons why they would refrain from accessing it.

Lorelli!

Pac1Man wrote: »

What is mansplaining?

I never use the word and only came across it on here but I always think of this cute kid whenever I see it :pac:

Pac1Man

God damn Linda, listen ffs!

Plopsu

Anybody else get the impression that was a replay of an overheard parental argument (in structure, not necessarily the cupcake bit)?

silverharp

Plopsu wrote: »

Anybody else get the impression that was a replay of an overheard parental argument (in structure, not necessarily the cupcake bit)?

indeed, Linda love.....

ceadaoin.

jeanjolie wrote: »

Bad sex would probably have prevented this guy from going on a gun rampage. Sure you must have seen him since his attack around the May of 2014

Elliot Rodger - Daily Mail

Elliot Rodger - Daily Mail 2

No it wouldn't have, he was a psychopath. It's not women's responsibility that he went on a killing spree, it's not women's reponsibility to provide men with sex so that they don't go on killing sprees. Ffs

This guy is the hero of the incel sub, they had his image as their banner for a while so I hear. They think that women should be kept purely to be used for sex, that sisters should be obliged to provide sex to their brothers. If they don't then it's their fault if people like Rodgers murder them and in fact they deserve it. Tell me again how they aren't a bunch of raging misogynists?

Glenster

ceadaoin. wrote: »

They think that women should be kept purely to be used for sex, that sisters should be obliged to provide sex to their brothers.

They don't do they?

I thought they were just delusional misogynist losers.

But if they believe that then they are clearly either mentally ill or trolling.

kittensmittens

harol wrote: »

shenshen

yes ! , a small group of guys are having a very large amount of sex , its always been this way , in fact it was more so centuries ago

a relatively small percentage of men are incredibly attractive to women

Well then, what you need to do is wait for these lucky lotharios to get knackered in between them pleasuring ALL the women......and POUNCE.
The jobs a gud'un. :rolleyes::pac:



Jesus, this is a thing????
Some people have waaaaaayyyyyy too much damn time on their hands. Maybe instead of bitching on the internet (had never heard of MGTOW till now and boy oh boy, there are some doozies over there )how about getting up, getting a hair cut, fresh clothes, lose a few lbs and lose the attitude that the women of the world OWE you sex, then maybe you'll find some form for of happiness.

Or, you know, dont. I'd hate to think you'd let a woman tell ya what to do

ceadaoin.

Glenster wrote: »

They don't do they?

I thought they were just delusional misogynist losers.

But if they believe that then they are clearly either mentally ill or trolling.

Some of them do post that, yes. Maybe they are just trolling but I dunno

A quick search found this and many other examples

Sisters, cousins, moms, or any other family females. Should be registered as property of the head of the household or oldest male. He can just do whatever he wants, no laws, no rights for females.

PucaMama

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Glenster wrote: »

They don't do they?

I thought they were just delusional misogynist losers.

But if they believe that then they are clearly either mentally ill or trolling.

Some of them do post that, yes. Maybe they are just trolling but I dunno

A quick search found this and many other examples

Sisters, cousins, moms, or any other family females. Should be registered as property of the head of the household or oldest male. He can just do whatever he wants, no laws, no rights for females.

Pretty sick aren't they

kunst nugget

ceadaoin. wrote: »

A quick search found this and many other examples

Sisters, cousins, moms, or any other family females. Should be registered as property of the head of the household or oldest male. He can just do whatever he wants, no laws, no rights for females.

And this is how A Handmaid's Tale gets started in real life…

Yourself isit

I can't see these guys taking over.

kunst nugget

Yourself isit wrote: »

I can't see these guys taking over.

Mike Pence is going to when Trump finally exits stage right in a little while and I get the feeling he's got views on women that aren't too far off that…

ceadaoin.

kunst nugget wrote: »

And this is how A Handmaid's Tale gets started in real life…

That wouldn't be far enough for them, they'd still moan about how only the high status men get access to the handmaids

DoozerT6

Not every man who is involuntarily celibate is a basement-dwelling, bitter MGTOW. They are a vitriolic minority, who if a group of women turned up at their door to confront them about what they said on some of these websites would probably pass out from fear.

I would think that the vast, vast majority of guys who can't score with girls are simply average joe's who are shy, maybe not as good-looking as some of their friends, perhaps grew up without much contact with the opposite sex and didn't really know how to talk to women when they went to college or got jobs, and quite simply...missed the bus. And then it gets to the stage where you are just so far behind that it seems like you'll never catch up, so you just give up. You become the person that everybody wonders if you've ever even HAD a girl/boyfriend, because they've never seen you with anybody, but don't want to embarrass you by asking you. That's my take on it, because I'm the female version.

Don't tar everyone who is continually unsuccessful in relationships with the same brush.

kunst nugget

DoozerT6 wrote: »

Not every man who is involuntarily celibate is a basement-dwelling, bitter MGTOW. They are a vitriolic minority, who if a group of women turned up at their door to confront them about what they said on some of these websites would probably pass out from fear.

I would think that the vast, vast majority of guys who can't score with girls are simply average joe's who are shy, maybe not as good-looking as some of their friends, perhaps grew up without much contact with the opposite sex and didn't really know how to talk to women when they went to college or got jobs, and quite simply...missed the bus. And then it gets to the stage where you are just so far behind that it seems like you'll never catch up, so you just give up. You become the person that everybody wonders if you've ever even HAD a girl/boyfriend, because they've never seen you with anybody, but don't want to embarrass you by asking you. That's my take on it, because I'm the female version.

Don't tar everyone who is continually unsuccessful in relationships with the same brush.

I wouldn't call people that are unlucky or have a hard time forming romantic relationships involuntarily celibate. I think it is a ridiculous term and is only used by vacuous, bitter and narcissistic men with regressive views of women to label themselves as victims. The majority of those unlucky in love are as you describe above and would never be tarred with the 'incel' tag.

Ben Gadot

DoozerT6 wrote: »

Not every man who is involuntarily celibate is a basement-dwelling, bitter MGTOW. They are a vitriolic minority, who if a group of women turned up at their door to confront them about what they said on some of these websites would probably pass out from fear.

I would think that the vast, vast majority of guys who can't score with girls are simply average joe's who are shy, maybe not as good-looking as some of their friends, perhaps grew up without much contact with the opposite sex and didn't really know how to talk to women when they went to college or got jobs, and quite simply...missed the bus. And then it gets to the stage where you are just so far behind that it seems like you'll never catch up, so you just give up. You become the person that everybody wonders if you've ever even HAD a girl/boyfriend, because they've never seen you with anybody, but don't want to embarrass you by asking you. That's my take on it, because I'm the female version.

Don't tar everyone who is continually unsuccessful in relationships with the same brush.

"Quite simply...missed the bus." I think that covers it quite well.

Another thing I think is an issue is that for many men and women, they never had that quality to be carefee when they were younger (as in when they were in their teens). They had opportunities, plenty even.....but were either afraid that they would be laughed at by their mates or just didn't want to do stuff just because some randomer they didn't like was "up for it."

I think if you ask those people 10/15 years later they'll say that they regret being so uptight about things. But you don't view it as a big deal when you're younger. It's only when you hit your late twenties and beyond that you begin to feel painfully out of sync with your peers that you begin to regret such things.

NinjaKirby

ceadaoin. wrote: »

That wouldn't be far enough for them, they'd still moan about how only the high status men get access to the handmaids

Is this the subreddit? https://www.reddit.com/r/Incels/

Some really funny stuff on there. I am never sure exactly how serious people like this are online.

Some of the communities you can find online are so strange.

NinjaKirby

Glenster wrote: »

But if they believe that then they are clearly either mentally ill or trolling.

This is the problem. Some of them will be mentally ill people and some of them will be trolls.

I'm sure there are many many people who are housebound all day and who may have some mental health issues. The only meaningful contact they may have with others is the internet.

Who really knows how much of all that stuff they say is genuine?

Have you ever heard of Gang Stalking? Read this article.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/the-nightmarish-online-world-of-gang-stalking

You have a lot of these communities online filled with unreasonable, confused and sometimes potentially dangerous people and they are all fueling each others delusions.

super_furry

I think the whole is rooted in a increased desire in online communities for people to be able to paint themselves as victims. They then get to sit around with other people who are desperate to give themselves some sort of label and rant at the world, fuelling each other's sense of victimhood.

DoozerT6

Ben Gadot wrote: »

It's only when you hit your late twenties and beyond that you begin to feel painfully out of sync with your peers that you begin to regret such things.

Yes. This. I have virtually nothing in common with the majority of women my own age.

Yourself isit

DoozerT6 wrote: »

Not every man who is involuntarily celibate is a basement-dwelling, bitter MGTOW. They are a vitriolic minority, who if a group of women turned up at their door to confront them about what they said on some of these websites would probably pass out from fear.

I would think that the vast, vast majority of guys who can't score with girls are simply average joe's who are shy, maybe not as good-looking as some of their friends, perhaps grew up without much contact with the opposite sex and didn't really know how to talk to women when they went to college or got jobs, and quite simply...missed the bus. And then it gets to the stage where you are just so far behind that it seems like you'll never catch up, so you just give up. You become the person that everybody wonders if you've ever even HAD a girl/boyfriend, because they've never seen you with anybody, but don't want to embarrass you by asking you. That's my take on it, because I'm the female version.

Don't tar everyone who is continually unsuccessful in relationships with the same brush.

Of course. I said there were 1.5M single people in ireland. They are hardly all nuts.

TheAnalyst_

DoozerT6 wrote: »

Ben Gadot wrote: »

It's only when you hit your late twenties and beyond that you begin to feel painfully out of sync with your peers that you begin to regret such things.

Yes. This. I have virtually nothing in common with the majority of women my own age.

It always grates when I hear a man or woman say this. Like you're so ****ing special and different.