Dublin GAA Discussion Thread - Capital Punishment

CatInABox

One hurling game to go, but as we're already out, it's a bit of a weird one. Going on their form so far, Galway are near untouchable, but they may choose to rest players for the next round, so hopefully the lads can go out and earn a win, it'd be a massive boost for them.

All in all, I'm happy enough with the Hurling this year. Obviously, I'd like them to be winning all around them, but from where they were starting at the start of the year, the last three performances have been worlds apart. I had low expectations at the start of the year, with the main hope of not getting relegated from the league and championship, and both of those have been met, and met well. We were competitive in games that would have destroyed us just last year, and there seems to be a bit of belief and backbone in the team.

I'm looking forward to what they do next year. I'd think that the main aim would be avoiding a relegation battle in the league, with getting into the playoffs as a secondary, bonus objective. Winning two or three of the round robin games next year would be the aim for me.

So, how is it looking for everyone else? I know some here are disappointed with Dublin Hurling, so does anyone else see green shoots for Dublin Hurling?

Muahahaha

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

what has happened Connolly this year, at first I thought he had a falling out with Jim Gavin, then he stopped playing club football and now hes off to the US. All a bit bizarre for one of the best players in the game. Anyone know whats going on to prompt all this?

Bonniedog

Perhaps Gilroy's plan is going to work. I admit I was sceptical but they have improved immensely since early stages of the league. They are also obviously one of the most physically developed teams, which almost got them over the line against KK and Wexford.

CatInABox

Muahahaha wrote: »

what has happened Connolly this year, at first I thought he had a falling out with Jim Gavin, then he stopped playing club football and now hes off to the US. All a bit bizarre for one of the best players in the game. Anyone know whats going on to prompt all this?

Not a clue. Perhaps he's sick of the media circus that surrounds everything he does.

Whatever is going on, hope he's well. Nothing worse than watching people continue on with something long after they've lost the love for it.

Dyr

CatInABox wrote: »

So, how is it looking for everyone else? I know some here are disappointed with Dublin Hurling, so does anyone else see green shoots for Dublin Hurling?

I was very dubious about Gilroy, but I always said that staying in the top tier and being able to given any top team a rattle was what Dublin should realistically aim for. Gilroys done that in year one so I'm happy out. Hopefully he builds on that now.

JRant

CatInABox wrote: »

One hurling game to go, but as we're already out, it's a bit of a weird one. Going on their form so far, Galway are near untouchable, but they may choose to rest players for the next round, so hopefully the lads can go out and earn a win, it'd be a massive boost for them.

All in all, I'm happy enough with the Hurling this year. Obviously, I'd like them to be winning all around them, but from where they were starting at the start of the year, the last three performances have been worlds apart. I had low expectations at the start of the year, with the main hope of not getting relegated from the league and championship, and both of those have been met, and met well. We were competitive in games that would have destroyed us just last year, and there seems to be a bit of belief and backbone in the team.

I'm looking forward to what they do next year. I'd think that the main aim would be avoiding a relegation battle in the league, with getting into the playoffs as a secondary, bonus objective. Winning two or three of the round robin games next year would be the aim for me.

So, how is it looking for everyone else? I know some here are disappointed with Dublin Hurling, so does anyone else see green shoots for Dublin Hurling?

More or less agree with you.

We were pants in the league, absolutely rubbish being honest. Thanks players looked jadded and the standard on display was not far off junior hurling at times but as the league progressed we slowly started to see some improvement. Poor aul Bill O'Carroll got a roasting in a few of the games at fullback but in fairness the defense as a whole were brutal. We weren't getting anywhere near tight enough and our distribution from the back was wojus.

Getting a couple of the Cuala lads back helped, especially at fullback. Kearney is playing great stuff as well. I'd like to see Rushed involved a bit more and getting Trollier back will add another cog to the attack. However we still struggle build from back to front and this needs major work in the offseason. We have to fight for our scores and make life difficult for ourselves when the simple option is on. I think we are seeing the last of Cunningham's influence here, which can only be a good thing, but we really need to stop leaking easy goals.

All in all I'm surprised at the turn around but very much welcome it. Still think we need to put a far more coherent league campaign together next year and build from there.

Dyr

Speaking of easy scores, Nolan is very fond of flooring any full forward who gets in, and it seems to me its often because his positioning is off so he just concedes the penalty

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

corny

Bonniedog wrote: »

Perhaps Gilroy's plan is going to work. I admit I was sceptical but they have improved immensely since early stages of the league. They are also obviously one of the most physically developed teams, which almost got them over the line against KK and Wexford.

Thats not true. We're actually still playing catch up. We weakened slightly against KK in the closing stretch and we paid for the effort the following week against a fresh Wexford. They comfortably outworked us. If Galway are in the mood we won't match them either.

We're not far off but just like Donegal under McGuinness, Mayo under Horan, Dublin footballers under Gilroy....it'll take more than one season before we're the real deal.

Talk about touch, stick work, vision etc is great but its no coincidence, at least not in my eyes, the best team in football and hurling are physically the most imposing. The second best teams in both are the second most imposing. Always was positive about Gilroy taking over (only one here i think) and everything i've seen affirms my optimism. When Crummey gains another stone in muscle just ****ing watch us.:D

gormdubhgorm

Muahahaha wrote: »

what has happened Connolly this year, at first I thought he had a falling out with Jim Gavin, then he stopped playing club football and now hes off to the US. All a bit bizarre for one of the best players in the game. Anyone know whats going on to prompt all this?

I think kicking a ball over the liffey is too easy for him.

He wants to kick it across the Atlantic....

Muahahaha

CatInABox wrote:

Not a clue. Perhaps he's sick of the media circus that surrounds everything he does

Whatever is going on, hope he's well. Nothing worse than watching people continue on with something long after they've lost the love for it.


.

Yeah the media thing is a bit over the top. Anyway I hope the US works out for him. It's just a shame that one of the best footballers in the game won't be seen on display this summer. I love his style of play, completely on the edge but remarkably effective, he is one of the few around who can grab a game by the scruff of the neck. I'll miss watching him.

BonnieSituation

CatInABox wrote: »

Not a clue. Perhaps he's sick of the media circus that surrounds everything he does.

Whatever is going on, hope he's well. Nothing worse than watching people continue on with something long after they've lost the love for it.

Who have NY got in the Championship next year?

* please be Mayo *

* assuming he stays *

EDIT: It's Mayo

BonnieSituation

corny wrote: »

Thats not true. We're actually still playing catch up. We weakened slightly against KK in the closing stretch and we paid for the effort the following week against a fresh Wexford. They comfortably outworked us. If Galway are in the mood we won't match them either.

We're not far off but just like Donegal under McGuinness, Mayo under Horan, Dublin footballers under Gilroy....it'll take more than one season before we're the real deal.

Talk about touch, stick work, vision etc is great but its no coincidence, at least not in my eyes, the best team in football and hurling are physically the most imposing. The second best teams in both are the second most imposing. Always was positive about Gilroy taking over (only one here i think) and everything i've seen affirms my optimism. When Crummey gains another stone in muscle just ****ing watch us.:D

Me me me me me me me too

seligehgit

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Who have NY got in the Championship next year?

* please be Mayo *

* assuming he stays *

EDIT: It's Mayo

Fantastic talent but I'd be lying through my teeth if I said I'll miss having him around this summer.I'm sure Leeroy will send his regards.:)

I don't believe it's going to overly weaken the Dublin panel such is it's depth and continuing development,looking in from the outside it appears that Gavin has been planning for a life post Diarmuid Connolly?

Powerhouse

seligehgit wrote: »

Fantastic talent but I'd be lying through my teeth if I said I'll miss having him around this summer.I'm sure Leeroy will send his regards.:)

I don't believe it's going to overly weaken the Dublin panel such is it's depth and continuing development,looking in from the outside it appears that Gavin has been planning for a life post Diarmuid Connolly?

He also had the opportunity to operate without him nearly all summer last year so planning for life post-Connolly will not be a big mental shift for Gavin.

willowthewisp

Powerhouse wrote: »

He also had the opportunity to operate without him nearly all summer last year so planning for life post-Connolly will not be a big mental shift for Gavin.

In fairness there was only one game last year where Dublin were stretched , the final, and arguably without Connolly’s significnt second half contribution, they’d have been beat.

ProudDUB

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Who have NY got in the Championship next year?

* please be Mayo *

* assuming he stays *

EDIT: It's Mayo

Aha !

It's all starting to make sense now.

doc_17

willowthewisp wrote: »

In fairness there was only one game last year where Dublin were stretched , the final, and arguably without Connolly’s significnt second half contribution, they’d have been beat.

What about his his rights though under The Constitution? Isn’t that why Good oul Jim kept him about? Even after he didn’t wear the same gear (as was his right under The Constitution) as everyone else in the warm up?

doc_17

Powerhouse wrote: »

He also had the opportunity to operate without him nearly all summer last year so planning for life post-Connolly will not be a big mental shift for Gavin.

*Nearly. until Good Oul Jim needed him and he played against Mayo in the final. Up to that Dublin disposed of Kildare (beat by Carlow this year). And then Tyrone who lost to the team who lost to Fermanagh.

Powerhouse

willowthewisp wrote: »

In fairness there was only one game last year where Dublin were stretched , the final, and arguably without Connolly’s significnt second half contribution, they’d have been beat.

I'd even remove the word "arguably" from your remark and it'd even be truer. Connolly's final contribution was massive. The funny thing is though that if he'd been on the Dublin team from the start he'd have had Lee Keegan in his ear for the match looking to get him sent-off. Maybe the best thing to happen to him last year was to push that linesman! He got to play a bit of ball when he came on.

But psychologically it certainly gave Dublin a glimpse of life without him which is important I think as it is hard to imagine he will ever be back. There are two live possibilities this summer: 1) that Dublin win the four in a row and confirm that Connolly heading for 32 years of age is surplus to their needs, or 2) Dublin will fall short and there'll be several possible retirements of senior players (30+ somethings like Cluxton, McAuley, Flynn, Brogan, McManamon, O'Sullivan, McMahon) and a reconfiguration of the team as a younger model for the coming years would hardly include a player of Connolly's age.

Either way it is likely he is signing off for good.

corny

Powerhouse wrote: »

But psychologically it certainly gave Dublin a glimpse of life without him which is important I think as it is hard to imagine he will ever be back. There are two live possibilities this summer: 1) that Dublin win the four in a row and confirm that Connolly heading for 32 years of age is surplus to their needs, or 2) Dublin will fall short and there'll be several possible retirements of senior players (30+ somethings like Cluxton, McAuley, Flynn, Brogan, McManamon, O'Sullivan, McMahon) and a reconfiguration of the team as a younger model for the coming years would hardly include a player of Connolly's age.

Either way it is likely he is signing off for good.

You make it sound like your conclusions are inevitable when Dublin win or lose. We could lose and have no retirements. We could win and have Connoly back as first choice in 2019.

Connolly has always looked after himself and he's a superb athlete. For my money he walks back into team if/when he chooses. Be it this year or next year.

C__MC

As a neutral, I think Connolly deserved better last year from the Dublin management. I felt Gavin wanted to win that final without Connolly but knew he needed him at half time. He also should have got at least 15 minutes against Tyrone instead of 5- kind of insult to Connolly as he is a class player. The whole thing is strange- Connolly hasn’t clarified his position nor his Jim Gavin really. When did he officially walk away? Was it mid March or April?

Dublin will probably still win Sam without him but you never know- he has been instrumental in this Golden era

Powerhouse

corny wrote: »

You make it sound like your conclusions are inevitable when Dublin win or lose.

In fairness I did use the word "possibilities" in my post. Never mentioned inevitabilities. But certainly if I were Dublin manager I would be assuming the future would be most likely without a player who I had not chosen to start either the semi-final or final last year and is now essentially unwilling to play for Dublin. It wouldn't have struck me as the perfect scenario for him to "walk back into the team" at a time of his choosing. And Connolly might be as likely to stay in America as come home at all. Who knows? But I would be unsurprised if his day is done.

ProudDUB

Powerhouse wrote: »

I'd even remove the word "arguably" from your remark and it'd even be truer. Connolly's final contribution was massive. The funny thing is though that if he'd been on the Dublin team from the start he'd have had Lee Keegan in his ear for the match looking to get him sent-off. Maybe the best thing to happen to him last year was to push that linesman! He got to play a bit of ball when he came on.

But psychologically it certainly gave Dublin a glimpse of life without him which is important I think as it is hard to imagine he will ever be back. There are two live possibilities this summer: 1) that Dublin win the four in a row and confirm that Connolly heading for 32 years of age is surplus to their needs, or 2) Dublin will fall short and there'll be several possible retirements of senior players (30+ somethings like Cluxton, McAuley, Flynn, Brogan, McManamon, O'Sullivan, McMahon) and a reconfiguration of the team as a younger model for the coming years would hardly include a player of Connolly's age.

Either way it is likely he is signing off for good.

I'd start thinking about what is behind Door C if I were you.

The odds of all those players (or even or half of them) all deciding to retire in August is between zero and non existant. Of the lot of them, only Brogan is likely to retire.

corny

Powerhouse wrote: »

In fairness I did use the word "possibilities" in my post. Never mentioned inevitabilities. But certainly if I were Dublin manager I would be assuming the future would be most likely without a player who I had not chosen to start either the semi-final or final last year and is now essentially unwilling to play for Dublin. It wouldn't have struck me as the perfect scenario for him to "walk back into the team" at a time of his choosing. And Connolly might be as likely to stay in America as come home at all. Who knows? But I would be unsurprised if his day is done.

We certainly don't but Gavin does. He's not assuming either. All he shares with us is 'he's resting up' but he knows full well what Connolly intends. If he intends coming back then there's a plan for his return. If there's a plan for his return he'll inevitably regain the jersey. And yes that is inevitable given the chaps ability and level of performance.

Powerhouse

corny wrote: »

We certainly don't but Gavin does. He's not assuming either. All he shares with us is 'he's resting up' but he knows full well what Connolly intends. If he intends coming back then there's a plan for his return. If there's a plan for his return he'll inevitably regain the jersey. And yes that is inevitable given the chaps ability and level of performance.

Funnily enough my impression from Gavin's public utterances on the matter is that it's a live situation of which he is not sure. And I don't think anything is inevitable bout his regaining the jersey. It didn't happen last year when he came back and he will hardly have moved up the pecking order if he's at the other side of the Atlantic.

I realise that you desperately want to see him back for Dublin. I too wish he was involved and not going to America at all but I don't think it's a move which can be made without consequences. And I don't think it's a move he'd make if playing for Dublin was really a priority for him. But that's just an opinion. That's all. I'm not condemning anyone at all.

Powerhouse

ProudDUB wrote: »

I'd start thinking about what is behind Door C if I were you.

The odds of all those players (or even or half of them) all deciding to retire in August is between zero and non existant. Of the lot of them, only Brogan is likely to retire.

Door A was Dublin winning the All-Ireland. Door B was Dublin not winning the All-Ireland. I wasn't really conscious of a third possibility. What would be behind Door C? Connolly leading an American Invasion as per 1888 and the championship not being completed?

ProudDUB

Powerhouse wrote: »

Door A was Dublin winning the All-Ireland. Door B was Dublin not winning the All-Ireland. I wasn't really conscious of a third possibility. What would be behind Door C? Connolly leading an American Invasion as per 1888 and the championship not being completed?

Door B also included a truck load of likely retirements all taking place this summer. That is what I was pointing out as highly improbable. Whether Dublin do the four in a row or not, that many players retiring this summer, is just not gonna happen.

Powerhouse

ProudDUB wrote: »

Door B also included a truck load of likely retirements all taking place this summer. That is what I was pointing out as highly improbable. Whether Dublin do the four in a row or not, that many players retiring this summer, is just not gonna happen.

Looks like there isn't a Door C then after all. If you read my post again you will see that I didn't say that many (a "truckload" of) players would retire. Nor did I mention the word "likely" - that's your word too. I mentioned as a possibility that several players might retires it is a relatively old team. I didn't specify a number and just listed the players in question as they are all over 30. If I hadn't mentioned them I'd have been asked in the very next post to name them. But it is hardly outrageous and revolutionary to suggest that that older players tend to consider retirement especially if success dries up.

However, I realise that there is a desperation for nothing to change and that is understandable but let's be brutally honest - if Dublin lose along the way this year they will not come back with the same group of players. Or if they do they will come up short again. That's just the law of the jungle. Nothing lasts forever. There are several key players in the Dublin set-up who are heading into their 30s. That's just a fact and Connolly is one of them.

To suggest that some who have several All-Ireland medals already would, without question, want to go through the grind of preparation again if the team was slipping and there was no longer the prospect of making history is to my mind optimistic. But then again I can't see into the future. All I can do is posit possibilities and I think that whichever fate awaits Dublin this summer is unlikely to increase the chances of a player who has chose to walk away coming back. I can't imagine, human nature being what it is, he will have curried much favour with the team management. But like I said, that's just talk and guesswork.

It really is very difficult to throw out a few ideas on these boards without the wagons being circled.

blanch152

Powerhouse wrote: »

Looks like there isn't a Door C then after all. If you read my post again you will see that I didn't say that many (a "truckload" of) players would retire. Nor did I mention the word "likely" - that's your word too. I mentioned as a possibility that several players might retires it is a relatively old team. I didn't specify a number and just listed the players in question as they are all over 30. If I hadn't mentioned them I'd have been asked in the very next post to name them. But it is hardly outrageous and revolutionary to suggest that that older players tend to consider retirement especially if success dries up.

However, I realise that there is a desperation for nothing to change and that is understandable but let's be brutally honest - if Dublin lose along the way this year they will not come back with the same group of players. Or if they do they will come up short again. That's just the law of the jungle. Nothing lasts forever. There are several key players in the Dublin set-up who are heading into their 30s. That's just a fact and Connolly is one of them.

To suggest that some who have several All-Ireland medals already would, without question, want to go through the grind of preparation again if the team was slipping and there was no longer the prospect of making history is to my mind optimistic. But then again I can't see into the future. All I can do is posit possibilities and I think that whichever fate awaits Dublin this summer is unlikely to increase the chances of a player who has chose to walk away coming back. I can't imagine, human nature being what it is, he will have curried much favour with the team management. But like I said, that's just talk and guesswork.

It really is very difficult to throw out a few ideas on these boards without the wagons being circled.

Powerhouse wrote: »

.

But psychologically it certainly gave Dublin a glimpse of life without him which is important I think as it is hard to imagine he will ever be back. There are two live possibilities this summer: 1) that Dublin win the four in a row and confirm that Connolly heading for 32 years of age is surplus to their needs, or 2) Dublin will fall short and there'll be several possible retirements of senior players (30+ somethings like Cluxton, McAuley, Flynn, Brogan, McManamon, O'Sullivan, McMahon) and a reconfiguration of the team as a younger model for the coming years would hardly include a player of Connolly's age.

Either way it is likely he is signing off for good.

Apart from Cluxton, and possibly McMahon, none of the rest are guaranteed starters this summer.

O'Sullivan is currently injured, shoulder again, and who knows if he will get his place back. Flynn is only back and is behind McAuley and Howard. If either O'Sullivan or Flynn do come back, it will be at the expense of McAuley, with McCarthy or Howard switching to midfield. McMahon is keeping his place because the likes of Murchan aren't quite ready. That will change next year, if not before then. Brogan and McManamon are unlikely to start a Championship game anytime soon.

So Cluxton will play until he is 40, a smattering of the others will stay around next season as back-up, but Dublin won't be losing any key starters from that list. They key players for Dublin now are Cluxton, Cooper, McCarthy, McCaffrey, Fenton, Kilkenny, Mannion, O'Callaghan, Scully and Howard, all nine of whom I would expect to start when fit. Given that list, I would be putting more money on Door A in your scenario than Door B.

Putting it a different way, the likes of Mayo will be playing the same team that has always lost to Dublin while Dublin will be playing younger hungrier players with those that are well used to always beating Mayo sitting on the bench if needed. Kerry are the dark horses this year and Galway the team to beat.