Dublin GAA Discussion Thread - Capital Punishment

muddle84

JustJoe7240 wrote: »

JRant wrote: »

Looks like Agent Spillane is doing his best to get Cooper a little time off this summer. Why RTE allow him to continually do this is beyond a joke at this stage?

Hardly? Absolutely everything he said was justified, Cooper definitely should have got a red today, A nasty player.

I can't stand Spillanes but I had to agree there, that should have been a straight red for Cooper. Shocking tackle on Cluxton, looked like he was concust after it. Hopefully it's nothing serious.

On the point about Comerford not getting enough game time, could it be that Gavin is so devoted to the system that until Comerford or another goalie start topping cluxton in training, they're not going to get game time?

Always number 1

muddle84 wrote: »

I can't stand Spillanes but I had to agree there, that should have been a straight red for Cooper. Shocking tackle on Cluxton, looked like he was concust after it. Hopefully it's nothing serious.

On the point about Comerford not getting enough game time, could it be that Gavin is so devoted to the system that until Comerford or another goalie start topping cluxton in training, they're not going to get game time?

Cluxton gave his head some wallop when he landed alright. Wish him a speedy recovery

Stoner

JustJoe7240 wrote:

Hardly? Absolutely everything he said was justified, Cooper definitely should have got a red .

It was 100 percent.

But every team has their Cooper. He has yet to go after a Kerry or Mayo player like that.
Kerry and Mayo players have "assaulted" referees and elbowed lads .

All that said, I thought Cooper had curbed a lot of that this year.

I assume Gavin is upset, I think he wanted a home in the half back line and he'd been quiet, better behaved. I do think he's been working on it.

He might have lost his place at half back now.

Also there really was no need for that today.

JustJoe7240

Stoner wrote: »

It was 100 percent.

But every team has their Cooper. He has yet to go after a Kerry or Mayo player like that.
Kerry and Mayo players have "assaulted" referees and elbowed lads .

All that said, I thought Cooper had curbed a lot of that this year.

I assume Gavin is upset, I think he wanted a home in the half back line and he'd been quiet, better behaved. I do think he's been working on it.

He might have lost his place at half back now.

Also there really was no need for that today.

Maybe so, Possibly a case that there wasn't an awful lot more to talk about in that game?
I'd be inclined to agree, Can't see Jim being too slack on him after that.

JRant

Always number 1 wrote: »

I agree Spillane does overdo it - a la Connolly last year - but then and now unfortunately he's right. If they did not commit these transgressions then he wouldn't have anything to rant about..

It's the selcetive nature of his "concern" that bugs me. I can guarantee you that worse happened today in some of the other games today and he'll be as quiet as a mouse on them. Where is his slow-mo analysis of the ref being manhandled after Meaths game today? Where was his "rule book" when Andy Moran pushed a ref earlier this year?

Always number 1

JRant wrote: »

It's the selcetive nature of his "concern" that bugs me. I can guarantee you that worse happened today in some of the other games today and he'll be as quiet as a mouse on them. Where is his slow-mo analysis of the ref being manhandled after Meaths game today? Where was his "rule book" when Andy Moran pushed a ref earlier this year?

He did go to town on McGee after his red in the Donegal v Down game too but he obviously has an agenda when it comes to how a potential suspension could benefit Kerry

gormdubhgorm

muddle84 wrote: »

I can't stand Spillanes but I had to agree there, that should have been a straight red for Cooper. Shocking tackle on Cluxton, looked like he was concust after it. Hopefully it's nothing serious.

I think Jim Gavin was worried about that.
He tapped his own head as if to indicate that Cluxton might be concussed, just before he brought comeford on.

muddle84 wrote: »

On the point about Comerford not getting enough game time, could it be that Gavin is so devoted to the system that until Comerford or another goalie start topping cluxton in training, they're not going to get game time?

I think Comeford should be given the chance to try the basics of the system in at least some competitve games.
He is not going to get a proper feel for it just in training.

Belt

Stoner wrote: »

Longford had good men in the square, but there should have been a couple more goals.
Mannions goal was great.

They left the blood sub on for the whole game. They need to close that one out.

How is it even a blood sub though? He wasn't bleeding from what I could see

DoctaDee

Stoner wrote: »

It was 100 percent.

But every team has their Cooper. He has yet to go after a Kerry or Mayo player like that.
Kerry and Mayo players have "assaulted" referees and elbowed lads .

All that said, I thought Cooper had curbed a lot of that this year.

I assume Gavin is upset, I think he wanted a home in the half back line and he'd been quiet, better behaved. I do think he's been working on it.

He might have lost his place at half back now.

Also there really was no need for that today.

I didn't see the cooper incident at the time but watching TSG can't have any complaint if he gets some time off tbh.

Funnily enough it all stemmed from Cooper getting levelled retreating back from an attack, he got back up and you could see him looking to get his retribution in straight away, the next play he looked to leave his boott in after the ball was gone. Consensus from the brethren on the hill was he needed taking off before been sent off.

I've said it before, but I think that incident on Dorset Street changed him psychologically.

BonnieSituation

Belt wrote: »

How is it even a blood sub though? He wasn't bleeding from what I could see

Bleeding internally

blanch152

Always number 1 wrote: »

At the time I thought the red card was harsh but in the cold dusk evening I think it was justified.
Thought Cooper was lucky to stay on and Gavin rightly took him off before he was sent off.
Thought Quinn should have seen yellow not black and McCormack should have got black at the end and there wasn't even a free!

Longford shouldn't fear too many in qualifiers and Dublin should have more than enough for Laois. I think Gavin will be annoyed with the wasted shots on goal that should've just been put over the bar.

Don't think Comerford did a lot wrong but Longford didnt really trouble him. I wish Cluxton a speedy recovery because Dublin will not retain the All Ireland unless he's playing.

If you remember Dean Rock's black card a couple of years ago for pulling the leg of a player, you can see why it was a deserved black card.

The tackle on Cluxton was late, nasty and deliberate. A fully deserved red card. Cooper should have gone as well for a second yellow, but he was targetted early on for some rough punishment. They should all look at Fenton, he has been the subject of some deliberate nasty stuff over the last year or so, yet he just gets up and plays on.

The forwards were disappointing yesterday, an awful lot of chances wasted, and we looked a lot tighter when McCaffrey and O'Sullivan came on.

CatInABox

Belt wrote: »

How is it even a blood sub though? He wasn't bleeding from what I could see

Total grey area that's been exploited for a few years by a few teams at this stage. The entire Temporary Substitution section needs to be overhauled/clarified, and not just because of this incident. The rules states that a player must come back on once he's stopped bleeding and all blood cleaned up, but there's no one designated to actually check if that's the case, so a player can sit out a game without ever been looked at.

They also need to codify the rules regarding potential concussion, and what should be done with any HIA. They really need to err on the side of caution here too, it's so easy to get a knock on the head in both codes now, and it's just not as acceptable to leave a player on when they don't know what planet they're on anymore.

On the whole, I think using the blood sub rule was right, but they really need to clarify it. The Tipperary hurling doctor was calling for a concussion sub to be used, similar to the blood sub, and that's something I'd totally support.

Torcaill

CatInABox wrote: »

Total grey area that's been exploited for a few years by a few teams at this stage. The entire Temporary Substitution section needs to be overhauled/clarified, and not just because of this incident. The rules states that a player must come back on once he's stopped bleeding and all blood cleaned up, but there's no one designated to actually check if that's the case, so a player can sit out a game without ever been looked at.

They also need to codify the rules regarding potential concussion, and what should be done with any HIA. They really need to err on the side of caution here too, it's so easy to get a knock on the head in both codes now, and it's just not as acceptable to leave a player on when they don't know what planet they're on anymore.

On the whole, I think using the blood sub rule was right, but they really need to clarify it. The Tipperary hurling doctor was calling for a concussion sub to be used, similar to the blood sub, and that's something I'd totally support.

The rules states that a player must come back on once he's stopped bleeding and all blood cleaned up, The rule does not state this.



but there's no one designated to actually check if that's the case, so a player can sit out a game without ever been looked at. No match official is qualified to instruct a player to go back on the pitch.


On the whole, I think using the blood sub rule was right, but they really need to clarify it. It was totally incorrect. There, apparently, was no blood, therefore the blood sub rule should not have been used and 7 subs would have been used (providing the ref didn't give his blood sub signal to his fellow match officials!!)

frankled

Any news on Cluxton? Nothing in the media yet that I can see apart from it being referred to by Gavin as a lower back injury of some sort. Praying it's not serious.

Dyr

frankled wrote: »

Any news on Cluxton? Nothing in the media yet that I can see apart from it being referred to by Gavin as a lower back injury of some sort. Praying it's not serious.

Went to A&E, presumably to check for concussion

seamus

Picture of Cluxton attending A&E in the Mater yesterday going around on social media.

It would be disappointing, but might be a good idea to rest him for the Leinster final so he's good to go for the All-Ireland.

I've waxed enough here about the importance and irreplaceability of Cluxton to the whole team. But seeing over the last few years Dublin just continue to dominate even with key players badly injured and the likes of Connolly and Brogan not getting full games, it would be stupid to suggest that Evan Comerford isn't the best alternative to Cluxton in Dublin. He's young and doesn't have a lot of major game experience, but I doubt Gavin would have him on the panel if he didn't think he was up to it.

frankled

Bambi wrote: »

Went to A&E, presumably to check for concussion

That's what most thought when I saw that picture, including myself. Seemed a little out of it at the time and only seemed to realise he was going off when Comerford was right in front of him. But Gavin has said it was a lower back injury.

seamus wrote: »

Picture of Cluxton attending A&E in the Mater yesterday going around on social media.
It would be disappointing, but might be a good idea to rest him for the Leinster final so he's good to go for the All-Ireland.
I've waxed enough here about the importance and irreplaceability of Cluxton to the whole team. But seeing over the last few years Dublin just continue to dominate even with key players badly injured and the likes of Connolly and Brogan not getting full games, it would be stupid to suggest that Evan Comerford isn't the best alternative to Cluxton in Dublin. He's young and doesn't have a lot of major game experience, but I doubt Gavin would have him on the panel if he didn't think he was up to it.

Fully agree that Comerford is a good goalkeeper and seemed to acquit himself well at times this year when asked upon (albeit he's quite light). But Cluxton is still such a massive influence, I would prefer him for as long as he is able. Plus, he is a player I'd hate seeing injured more than others. Definitely a cynical and nasty foul on him.

willowthewisp

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Bleeding internally

He was bleedin leveled....Wha!

At the time I didn’t necessarily think it was a red, but when I watched it back, there was no disputing the referees decision.

Cooper should have been sent off also, and his “form” for getting himself into trouble on the pitch could see his place in jeopardy. He’ll end up with a deserved sending off soon enough.

gormdubhgorm

willowthewisp wrote: »

He was bleedin leveled....Wha!

At the time I didn’t necessarily think it was a red, but when I watched it back, there was no disputing the referees decision.

Cooper should have been sent off also, and his “form” for getting himself into trouble on the pitch could see his place in jeopardy. He’ll end up with a deserved sending off soon enough.

I am actually pleased Dublin have fellas that are not afraid to play on the edge.
That was the main problem after the 95 vintage faded away too many "nice" players while the lads up North were laughing at them as soft touches.

Cooper at least tries to be clever about it not like the likes of EOG who just only knows too modes thick and pure thick.

blanch152

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I am actually pleased Dublin have fellas that are not afraid to play on the edge.
That was the main problem after the 95 vintage faded away too many "nice" players while the lads up North were laughing at them as soft touches.

Cooper at least tries to be clever about it not like the likes of EOG who just only knows too modes thick and pure thick.

Dublin need players like Cooper on the pitch who will stand up to the Kerrys of this world, to the nastiness of the O'Connors and to the cynicism of the Northern teams.

The likes of Fenton get knocked down thuggishly all the time and just get back up and play the game, as do O'Callaghan, Scully, Mannion, Howard etc. so they do need a little protection time and again. A lot of teams now target Dublin deliberately with off the ball hits and late tackles because they know the chances of them being seen are slim and that the refs are reluctant to punish underdogs trying to gain an advantage. That was the thing that made the red on Sunday so surprising.

Bonniedog

Very true about the early noughties team. Armagh beat the head off Darren Homan in 2002 and not one Dublin player took proper action. By jaysus, those days are gone!

Poor_old_gill

Any confirmation ton Cluxton's injury/the fact that he is out for the season yet?

corny

blanch152 wrote: »

Dublin need players like Cooper on the pitch who will stand up to the Kerrys of this world, to the nastiness of the O'Connors and to the cynicism of the Northern teams.

The likes of Fenton get knocked down thuggishly all the time and just get back up and play the game, as do O'Callaghan, Scully, Mannion, Howard etc. so they do need a little protection time and again. A lot of teams now target Dublin deliberately with off the ball hits and late tackles because they know the chances of them being seen are slim and that the refs are reluctant to punish underdogs trying to gain an advantage. That was the thing that made the red on Sunday so surprising.

Congrats blanch. That has to be the most one sided, self serving post ever. Cooper a knight in shining armour!!!!

Its ok to just admit there's a cynical streak in him and that the vast majority of the time its completely unnecessary and serves no purpose.

Also, if teams are targeting Dublin with off the ball hits then they've finally caught up because its just one more thing Dublin do better than every one else.

They all play the same game. There's no moral high ground for any team.

Stoner

Bonniedog wrote:

Very true about the early noughties team. Armagh beat the head off Darren Homan in 2002 and not one Dublin player took proper action. By jaysus, those days are gone!

Very true. Ironically he had the right kind of stuff himself.

Whelan carried the can on that himself many times. Ended up with a deserved bad rep.

There was no messing with the 1988-1995 team. Had sone great dings with Meath and like this team they had a tough halfback line.

Ray Cosgrove summed up that 96-2009 period for me

Stoner

gormdubhgorm wrote:

Cooper at least tries to be clever about it not like the likes of EOG who just only knows too modes thick and pure thick.

TBH gorm I usually agree with you, I think when you are playing the likes of Tyrone, Donegal, mayo and kerry, where there's numerous players from both sides at that stuff.

But I don't see the point or anything clever about following your man around with your back to play mouthing to him in a game like Sunday
I'm not the biggest fan of that anyway, but I'd keep it for a game when there's others at it too. He's only bringing attention to himself. Attention from the refs and management, he was taken off.

Agreed Fenton was hit late numerous times on Sunday.

I'm a fan of Cooper for a long time, he's our best cornerback Imo, tight and out in front when he needs to be. A good man for an O'Connor or O'Donaghue, better again for a Brian Hurley type forward.

He was doing well this year, but that side of his game popped back unnecessary on Sunday

BonnieSituation

Stoner wrote: »

Ray Cosgrove summed up that 96-2009 period for me

Never say that name in here

BonnieSituation

Stoner wrote: »

TBH gorm I usually agree with you, I think when you are playing the likes of Tyrone, Donegal, mayo and kerry, where there's numerous players from both sides at that stuff.

But I don't see the point or anything clever about following your man around with your back to play mouthing to him in a game like Sunday
I'm not the biggest fan of that anyway, but I'd keep it for a game when there's others at it too. He's only bringing attention to himself. Attention from the refs and management, he was taken off.

Agreed Fenton was hit late numerous times on Sunday.

I'm a fan of Cooper for a long time, he's our best cornerback Imo, tight and out in front when he needs to be. A good man for an O'Connor or O'Donaghue, better again for a Brian Hurley type forward.

He was doing well this year, but that side of his game popped back unnecessary on Sunday

It's even more annoying when you see how well he was playing.

Mopped up so much loose ball in the HB line.

IRE60

if the Indo is to be believed - not great news all round. The Cooper part was always on the cards


https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/dubs-fear-stephen-cluxton-will-miss-laois-clash-while-jonny-cooper-might-find-himself-in-hot-water-37000266.html

frankled

IRE60 wrote: »

if the Indo is to be believed - not great news all round. The Cooper part was always on the cards


https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/dubs-fear-stephen-cluxton-will-miss-laois-clash-while-jonny-cooper-might-find-himself-in-hot-water-37000266.html

I read that article this morning- they've no new information in it to be honest, only conjecture I think. I don't mind if Cluxton misses 1-2 games, once the injury isn't too serious.

Haven't seen Cooper's supposed dig clearly yet (Sunday Game still recorded waiting for me) but from the Cusack Stand it was very clear that his marker was trying to wind him up from the very start. Cooper was very restrained all things considered, although if he punched your man he would of course deserve a red for that.

He is a tough nut but not outwardly dirty in my opinion. Have a feeling he might be targeted again before the year is out.

Gael85

IRE60 wrote: »

if the Indo is to be believed - not great news all round. The Cooper part was always on the cards


https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/dubs-fear-stephen-cluxton-will-miss-laois-clash-while-jonny-cooper-might-find-himself-in-hot-water-37000266.html

Do the CCCC look at all footage over the weekend or just the ones flagged by Sunday Game? Was reckless from Cooper and lucky to escape a second yellow card.