New Metal Light Switches not Earthed!

Sleeper12

cheif kaiser wrote:

Easier said than done when he won't answer phone, reply to texts or answer emails. No amount of threats of Reci, Court, etc, has worked!

What about the builder? He's as responsible if he supplied an electrician that has carried out illegal and dangerous work.
Both should be reported to safe electric imo. Not out of spite but because the work is dangerous. You could save a life further down the road by reporting them. Personally I would not have an issue with a none registered electrician doing the job if it was done correctly. It's a safety issue for me

Free-2-Flow

cheif kaiser wrote:

Easier said than done when he won't answer phone, reply to texts or answer emails. No amount of threats of Reci, Court, etc, has worked!

I talked to my brother about this as he an electrical engineer, he said he has seen numerous of identical cases to yours with metal fittings.

He said if they were fitted properly and tight then the only way you would get a shock is if a wire breaks out of its housing and comes into contact with the fitting.

He's not condoning the practice but said there are 10's of 1000's of houses in Ireland and England with this problem.

As long the latter doesn't happen you are safe, but if it happens you get 230v up the arm.

The house can never be certified in it's current state.

2011

cheif kaiser wrote: »

Easier said than done when he won't answer phone, reply to texts or answer emails. No amount of threats of Reci, Court, etc, has worked!

The reason that you are not getting anywhere is because you are not carrying out your threat. All you have to do is report him and this will be resolved.

When you pay a registered electrical contractor to carry out electrical work the work that they do must comply with the regulations even if you as a customer do not specifically request that the work complies.

These regulations are not optional, ignoring them can have very serious consequences.

cheif kaiser

2011 wrote: »

The reason that you are not getting anywhere is because you are not carrying out your threat. All you have to do is report him and this will be resolved.

When you pay a registered electrical contractor to carry out electrical work the work that they do must comply with the regulations even if you as a customer do not specifically request that the work complies.

These regulations are not optional, ignoring them can have very serious consequences.

That's also easier said than done. I went onto the RECI website and apparently, you must fill in their complaints form before any action can be taken and that's fine but the information they require is ... Electricians full name, address and registered RECI number.

Now how on earth is someone supposed to get that information? A dodgy electrician does not generally leave a calling card. He was working for the builder and not me and therefore all I know is his first name!?!?

Sleeper12

cheif kaiser wrote:

Now how on earth is someone supposed to get that information? A dodgy electrician does not generally leave a calling card. He was working for the builder and not me and therefore all I know is his first name!?!?

Report the builder. Get his address on the CRO website. Having said that his address should be on the invoice or receipt. Report him & he'll have to give up the electrictricans name and address

cheif kaiser

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Report the builder. Get his address on the CRO website. Having said that his address should be on the invoice or receipt. Report him & he'll have to give up the electrictricans name and address

I reported him to Safe Electric yesterday. I don't know what the procedure is with them so am just waiting to hear back.

If nothing happens there, I'll just have to hire someone in to run earth wires and fix the issues. I'll then sue him through the small claims court for any money I have to fork out.

I could actually run earth wires myself but am up to my eyes trying to fix up the rest of the house without adding that onto the list.

The house is actually my mother's house who is approaching 80. The builder also knows that she has loads of grandchildren who visit her on a regular basis and they don't give a f**k that they could have killed anyone of them.

aido79

I'm sure if they exist in Ireland but in Australia most light switches have replaceable face plates that just click onto the front of a plastic switch. They come in a range of metallic finishes. No earth is needed as there are no exposed screws and there is no possibility that the cover can become live. Might be an alternative to running earths to each switch.

cheif kaiser

aido79 wrote: »

I'm sure if they exist in Ireland but in Australia most light switches have replaceable face plates that just click onto the front of a plastic switch. They come in a range of metallic finishes. No earth is needed as there are no exposed screws and there is no possibility that the cover can become live. Might be an alternative to running earths to each switch.

Don't suppose you have a link to these?

Thanks.

Free-2-Flow

cheif kaiser wrote:

Don't suppose you have a link to these?

Australian switches are Completly different dimensions

Free-2-Flow

Sue him?

Did he price for work he didn't carry out?

Did he price to rewire every light switch with an earth?

cheif kaiser

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Sue him?

Did he price for work he didn't carry out?

Did he price to rewire every light switch with an earth?

This was a complete rebuild of a kitchen, removal of walls, plaster boarding and plastering walls, wiring new spots and sockets and switches and the installation of a new kitchen, cooker, etc and I paid for all of that.

If in order to install metal light switches, which he supplied and I also paid for, then yes, they should have been earthed.

Wiring them with no earth is Illegal!

If I have to get someone in to put holes in walls that were only plastered and painted in order to run earths to the switches, which should have been done before the walls went up. Then yes, he will be responsible for all that costs.

If you paid someone to build a wall, would you expect them to actually mortar the blocks together or do you think they could just pile all the bricks on top of each other and say, there ye go, there's yer wall?

Your comment is quite frankly ridiculous!

Free-2-Flow

cheif kaiser wrote:

Your comment is quite frankly ridiculous!

Okay, don't get too excited there, my comment was a General question looking for your point of view on your thoughts of legal action.

cheif kaiser

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Okay, don't get too excited there, my comment was a General question looking for your point of view on your thoughts of legal action.

Your comment didn't a help a situation that I am finding extremely annoying and frustrating!

There are kids running around this house and whether the chances of the live becoming loose is a slim to none, it is not a chance I am willing to take. 240v into a child would kill them.

Anyone that would risk killing a child for the sake of saving a little extra work and a bit of wire is noting but a complete scumbag!

Free-2-Flow

cheif kaiser wrote:

Your comment didn't a help a situation that I am finding extremely annoying and frustrating!

Okay, best of luck so!

ellobee

cheif kaiser wrote: »

This was a complete rebuild of a kitchen, removal of walls, plaster boarding and plastering walls, wiring new spots and sockets and switches and the installation of a new kitchen, cooker, etc

Wow this is really bad, I originally thought he just replaced the switches and sockets, and there would have been a huge amount of extra work involved to get an earth in there, but he put in new sockets and spots and the place had to be replastered , absolutely no excuse not to run an earth to the switches, if the electrician was sub contracted by the builder I would go after the builder, btw have you checked out the rest of the installation are the sockets lights and cooker all up to scratch, if there are any copper pipes are they bonded ?

rpmcs

Where did you get in contact with builder?
Was it from someone you knew?
From there you may be able to get electrician's full name and address...

cheif kaiser

ellobee wrote: »

cheif kaiser wrote: »

This was a complete rebuild of a kitchen, removal of walls, plaster boarding and plastering walls, wiring new spots and sockets and switches and the installation of a new kitchen, cooker, etc

Wow this is really bad, I originally thought he just replaced the switches and sockets, and there would have been a huge amount of extra work involved to get an earth in there, but he put in new sockets and spots and the place had to be replastered , absolutely no excuse not to run an earth to the switches, if the electrician was sub contracted by the builder I would go after the builder, btw have you checked out the rest of the installation are the sockets lights and cooker all up to scratch, if there are any copper pipes are they bonded ?

I know it's bad! I don't know if everything else is up to scratch to be honest. My knowledge of electrics is limited. As I said previously, I only found they were not earthed by accident (The plaster work around one of the switches was a bit rough and I pulled it back to sand around it).

I have suspicions that there is other dodgy wiring goings on behind the walls but what I can't see, I can't prove.

cheif kaiser

rpmcs wrote: »

Where did you get in contact with builder?
Was it from someone you knew?
From there you may be able to get electrician's full name and address...

Builder was initially employed to install 2 bathrooms and remove and old one. He owns a bathroom company and was recommended to me. I was happy enough with the bathrooms he built so allowed him to do the kitchen also.

Everyone that he employed was a subcontractor and it was their work that was good quality. I think he is really only a plumber as everything other than the plumbing that he touched was dreadful.

He is the one who will not answer my phone calls or emails.

2011

cheif kaiser wrote: »

I know it's bad! I don't know if everything else is up to scratch to be honest. My knowledge of electrics is limited. As I said previously, I only found they were not earthed by accident (The plaster work around one of the switches was a bit rough and I pulled it back to sand around it).

I have suspicions that there is other dodgy wiring goings on behind the walls but what I can't see, I can't prove.

Don't worry. You have reported this now, let the investigation take its course. One thing is certain, this will be dealt with. The fact that the information you provided about the contractors limited doesn't matter, are an inspection will generate such a sh!t storm the builder will suddenly become cooperative and supply the electricians details.

The important thing is that you do not fiddle with the electrical work as this would interfere with any subsequent investigation. If I were you I would follow up with a phone call to RECI.

With the attitude of the electrician I would be concerned about the rest of the wiring.

cheif kaiser

2011 wrote: »

.

The important thing is that you do not fiddle with the electrical work as this would interfere with any subsequent investigation. If I were you I would follow up with a phone call to RECI. .

Good idea, I'll do that today. Thanks

2011

cheif kaiser wrote: »

Good idea, I'll do that today. Thanks

Keep us posted.
I suspect that you may find that this electrician is not a registered electrical contractor.

ellobee

http://www.thejournal.ie/fake-electrician-fined-1760533-Nov2014/

Pkiernan

ellobee wrote: »

http://www.thejournal.ie/fake-electrician-fined-1760533-Nov2014/

I'll see your 3000 euro fine and raise you a prison sentence....

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/unregistered-electrician-first-in-country-to-be-jailed-381726.html&ved=0ahUKEwiKjrzlnLDUAhWKCBoKHUEzD_8QFggmMAA&usg=AFQjCNEj4P1QQYXUjYvyXOfCvZaxRh1CAw

Pkiernan

Report both the builder and the sparks OP.
Otherwise noting changes and we remain a 3rd world country.

cheif kaiser

I'll keep you all updated.

A €3000 fine and a prison sentence would be nice!

Thanks All!

Sleeper12

Free-2-Flow wrote:

Sue him?

Free-2-Flow wrote:

Did he price for work he didn't carry out?

Free-2-Flow wrote:

Did he price to rewire every light switch with an earth?

There are minimum standards that have to be met. When doing electrical work there are regulations that have to be met. He must be a REC to do any work in the bathroom and fusebox. He was supposed to cert this work. Instead he seems to have left the house in a dangerous situation. He can get a prison sentence in what he has done.

Free-2-Flow

Sleeper12 wrote:

There are minimum standards that have to be met. When doing electrical work there are regulations that have to be met. He must be a REC to do any work in the bathroom and fusebox. He was supposed to cert this work. Instead he seems to have left the house in a dangerous situation. He can get a prison sentence in what he has done.

Nobody has said that he is not RECI.
That link that was just posted was referring to a "fake" electrician

Sleeper12

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Nobody has said that he is not RECI.
That link that was just posted was referring to a "fake" electrician

It looks like he's not even an electrician by the quality of his work. RECI or REC must test & cert their work. This is a legal requirement. If he were RECI he'd have been back at the first mention of reporting him

Quick story: About 15/20 years ago my sister got a very large ground floor building & got a builder in to convert it to 3 apartments. She wouldn't pay the builder the last few thousands till she got a RECI cert. She got her cert.
A year later things stared going wrong in the apartments so she got her own electrician to look it over. He reported the whole thing to RECI. Turns out the builder bought a RECI cert, this wasn't unheard of at the time. Long story short RECI made the guy who issued the cert rewire the 3 apartments from scratch for free even though it wasn't his work. Him selling the RECI cert for a few hundred pound/euro cost him thousands in the end.
That was RECI in the old days. They are much tougher now. They prosecute through the courts & look for prison sentences. With Gas & Electricity it's not just a bad job. They are putting lives at risk

Risteard81

DublinDilbert wrote: »

Is the wiring to the switches accessible? Partition walls? In conduit?

I would just drop the earths now, as easy as changing all the switches. If you've changed light fittings, running an earth is easy enough. Then just ask a rec to connect it up.

Not minor works though presumably and therefore that would be unlawful for anyone other than a REC to do the complete job and not just connect up.

PVF

Le Grand have a range of these sockets etc.with plastic clip on plates.