Men or Women, who has a harder life?

pangbang

Talking with a girl earlier and she brought it up, stating that men definitely have a harder life.

She meant it in an "across the board" kind of way. Specifically we were on the topic of loneliness when it came up.

Thought it was interesting because I hadn't given it much thought before. But I was thinking about her comment afterwards.

Funnily enough, its probably the male thing to do, to just not pay attention to the "group" so to speak. Whereas women tend to think as a pack. Not trying to sh*t stir at all, just a general observation.

If a bloke is on top of his game, employment, money, prospects etc, then the world is their oyster. Harder, I imagine, for a woman to be in such a position.

The flipside is that if a man is down on his luck he can seriously be thrown in the gutter, I suppose that's reflected in much higher suicide rates. Men are very much on their own, good times or bad. Women, in my experience, are never far from companionship in bad times, have a tendency to band together.

Maybe a quicker way to sum up, men have a higher ceiling above them, but a much further drop should they falter in any way. Is that balance?

Overall, very reflective of the animal kingdom.

One last thing too, another conversation not so long ago. A man is far more likely to be attacked, and far less likely to report attacks than women? Women are far less prone to attack, but it can be much more serious in a different way, such as rape (and not report it?). Just think of the amount of fights you see on an average night out and the sex-divide. Have seen it loads of times myself, where a group of men attack one bloke on their own. Jesus its bad when you think about it, really like animals.

I wont keep going. Without taking digs at one another, who would you say has the harder life, men or women?!

EDIT: I'll add this here to avoid some confusion. I'm not asking for peoples idealistic view of the world. Its the here and now, matter-of-fact run of life. And it has frighteningly little to do with individualism, or background, or education, or how big your ears are. Life will put you in situations BECAUSE you are a woman or man, individual reactions come AFTER the fact.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

You simply can't generalise. It depends on the man or the woman.

pangbang

Judah Old-fashioned Remote wrote: »

You simply can't generalise. It depends on the man or the woman.

I couldn't disagree any more! Just to pick one single thing, male suicide rates.

January

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

Wibbs

The average Irish woman of today can expect to live longer, be better educated, be better paid(before children), have more societal safety nets, more medical research aimed at her, be less likely to be physically assaulted or murdered, less likely to be homeless, far less likely to die in accidents in work(or outside) and far less likely to die by her own hand. These are statistical facts for the average. Individuals differ widely, but take from all that what you will.

Trump_Wall

Women have it harder.

They're emotional creatures who find offence/hurt at every corner. They look for drama where none exists. They're paranoid about their sexual partners and find it almost impossible to move on. They're attention seekers who try their best to look as good as possible (most of whom fail to do so) for others.

When they grow old, they become nasty and obsessed about their health.

What a life that must be.

Men have it easy. Full stop.

GritBiscuit

pangbang wrote: »

I couldn't disagree any more! Just to pick one single thing, male suicide rates.

Is that indicative of men having it harder? I don't know. It could just as easily show poorer coping skills...

pangbang

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

I'll see your opionion and match it with mine. I vote that men have the harder life. The risk of getting thumped around by other blokes at any time of the day, broad daylight, busy streets, wherever. And I'll throw in the isolation that generally accompanies a man throughout their entire life too.

To me those two trump the idea that I mightn't be getting paid a certain amount in a cheque or that I have to be careful being alone at night.

All generally speaking!

Wibbs

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone,

So ranged against all the other things, that's all you have?

let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Let's not, because under any sort of basic examination it's a crock.

One eyed Jack

pangbang wrote: »

I couldn't disagree any more! Just to pick one single thing, male suicide rates.

Just picking one thing though, is doing the exact opposite of what you outlined in the opening post in that it isn't looking at circumstances overall.

That's also not to mention that rates of self-harm are much higher among women than men, and in recent years the rate of suicide among women has increased year on year at a far greater rate than men in the same age categories.

You really can't generalise when it comes to suggesting one gender has anything harder than the other overall, not to mention that it's just chasing to the bottom for the victimhood trophy IMO.

People should be encouraged to see the value in resilience rather than victimhood.

Wibbs

Just for fun and by your leave I added two letters to your post

GritBiscuit wrote: »

Is that indicative of women having it harder? I don't know. It could just as easily show poorer coping skills...

How well do you think that opinion would go down in the mainstream media? Hint: It wouldn't.

OttoPilot

pangbang wrote: »

I couldn't disagree any more! Just to pick one single thing, male suicide rates.

Don't women attempt suicide more often, and men just succeed more?

ArchXStanton

Women I would say...this is probably not going to win me any fans,but emotionally a lot of them are children who throw strops and pout...that must be tiring after a while to be so ruled by their emotions

cbyrd

Surprisingly, giving birth hasn't been mentioned


I win.

Wibbs

Trump_Wall wrote: »

They're paranoid about their sexual partners and find it almost impossible to move on.

Actually I have found those two to be far more a male trait. IME average women reset the "love mechanism" far more quickly and more healthily and move on faster than the average man.

pangbang

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Just picking one thing though, is doing the exact opposite of what you outlined in the opening post in that it isn't looking at circumstances overall.

That's also not to mention that rates of self-harm are much higher among women than men, and in recent years the rate of suicide among women has increased year on year at a far greater rate than men in the same age categories.

You really can't generalise when it comes to suggesting one gender has anything harder than the other overall, not to mention that it's just chasing to the bottom for the victimhood trophy IMO.

People should be encouraged to see the value in resilience rather than victimhood.

Well I literally said I was just picking one thing in that response, I mentioned plenty more above it.

I still completely disagree that you cant generalise. And its not about trophies either, nobodys gonna get a trophy anywhere.

This is veering off the topic a bit too much, but you could look at male lions and female lions and make very distinct generalisations, no? Why would people be any different?

buried

Life is hard for everybody. Everyone you know or love is going to die. Every mortal is subservient to nature's will. Best not to divide people into groups and try claim who has it more tough, or who is the better victim just get on with it. What's the point of that pathetic f**king noise? Get on with it. It's hard enough as it is.

Pac1Man

I have to shave twice a week.

Wibbs

cbyrd wrote: »

Surprisingly, giving birth hasn't been mentioned


I win.

Not the observation prize... [see below]

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

OttoPilot wrote: »

Don't women attempt suicide more often, and men just succeed more?

Begod, men are even superior at killing themselves. [irony]

GritBiscuit wrote: »

I'm not sure who has it harder overall, each have specific issues in comparison to the other.
My point was the statistics can be pulled in whatever way suits any particular agenda. :cool:

Some can be, but the hard facts remain that;

Me. Earlier wrote:

The average Irish woman of today can expect to live longer, be better educated, be better paid(before children), have more societal safety nets, more medical research aimed at her, be less likely to be physically assaulted or murdered, less likely to be homeless, far less likely to die in accidents in work(or outside) and far less likely to die by her own hand.

Day Lewin

I'm opting for the middle road: depends so much on the individual.
I don't think that men and women are "the same" - in the general, conversational way that we are doing here: but as to who has it harder, they generally don't have the same identical life path, so who can say?

Votes: either, or both.

pangbang

Wibbs wrote: »

Actually I have found those two to be far more a male trait. IME average women reset the "love mechanism" far more quickly and more healthily and move on faster than the average man.

I'd agree there.

Wanderer2010

Its impossible to answer that question as there are too many variables but one interesting thing I have noticed on the whole depression and suicide scourge in this country is that its mostly men who choose to end their life despite suffering from the same depression/loneliness/despair and low self esteem etc as women. I don't know why, but women in mental despair don't seem to commit suicide a fraction as much as men.
Sadly I know of a man who ended his life recently because he was under financial pressure and had depression which only doubled his woes. He had a bad run of luck for a few weeks then sadly hanged himself. I also know of a woman who is an alcoholic and her abusive husband tried to take all her money, she lost her job etc and is in a miserable situation.....and yet, I cant ever see her taking her life. Just a gut feeling, cant explain it.
Are women stronger than men when it comes to major life issues? Are they too scared to go through it? Who knows, its just another weird series of unanswered questions in our tough harsh world.

Omackeral

Pac1Man wrote: »

I have to shave twice a week.

In some cases, that doesn't narrow it down as to which sex you're referring to.

pangbang

Pac1Man wrote: »

I have to shave twice a week.

What are you, 13? :P

Or else you're a woman, in which case that can take many forms....

Wibbs

buried wrote: »

Life is hard for everybody. Everyone you know or love is going to die. Every mortal is subservient to nature's will. Best not to divide people into groups and try claim who has it more tough, or who is the better victim just get on with it. What's the point of that pathetic f**king noise? Get on with it. It's hard enough as it is.

I agree 100% B. I only rev up when I see the all too mainstream "feminist" rhetoric of spurious but holy givens springing up, as it will, as night follows day(just like the red pill muppets, but with better PR and coverage). And my very marrow screams out to say;

pangbang

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Its impossible to answer that question as there are too many variables but one interesting thing I have noticed on the whole depression and suicide scourge in this country is that its mostly men who choose to end their life despite suffering from the same depression/loneliness/despair and low self esteem etc as women. I don't know why, but women in mental despair don't seem to commit suicide a fraction as much as men.
Sadly I know of a man who ended his life recently because he was under financial pressure and had depression which only doubled his woes. He had a bad run of luck for a few weeks then sadly hanged himself. I also know of a woman who is an alcoholic and her abusive husband tried to take all her money, she lost her job etc and is in a miserable situation.....and yet, I cant ever see her taking her life. Just a gut feeling, cant explain it.
Are women stronger than men when it comes to major life issues? Are they too scared to go through it? Who knows, its just another weird series of unanswered questions in our tough harsh world.

To the bolded, could that not be a seriously big difference, that men and women DONT suffer to the same extent?

_Brian

There's no one answer to this, everyone's life is different and everyone is equipped different to cope with life.

It's a typical juvenile AH question expecting an A or B answer to a hugely complex topic.

People have tough lives, some tougher than others, best we can do is hope we're capable of dealing with whatever life throws at us because not everyone can.

Tigger

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

Periods are one thing but i have a son and I didn't have to birth him
It looked really hard

Icemancometh

My Dad could beat up your Dad

wakka12

I think men have it harder. But as others have said , it depends on the individual. I recognise that there are most certainly pros and cons to being both genders, many of which I can never see being resolved, ever. Theres plenty of bad things about being a woman that men can never begin to experience and vice versa for men.

I dont want to be transgender. I like being a man. But if hypothetically I was given the choice at the beginning of my life to be either a man or a woman, now knowing the things I know, Id 100% choose to be a woman.

Omackeral

Icemancometh wrote: »

My Dad could beat up your Dad

Wouldn't be hard, my dad's dead.

bee06

buried wrote: »

Life is hard for everybody. Everyone you know or love is going to die. Every mortal is subservient to nature's will. Best not to divide people into groups and try claim who has it more tough, or who is the better victim just get on with it. What's the point of that pathetic f**king noise? Get on with it. It's hard enough as it is.

This. Why does it have to be men v women!

Wibbs

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Are women stronger than men when it comes to major life issues? Are they too scared to go through it? Who knows, its just another weird series of unanswered questions in our tough harsh world.

Good question. It would be my humble and mark me just my humble, that women often feel an instinct that society sees them as more "valuable", more supported by the group(not necessarily in a positive way and often not), so they feel there is more support for their "weakness" in real practical terms. Plus it has been my experience and again mark me, I say my experience, that women are more likely to fire out warning shots looking for help. I've buried too many men and women to that bloody finality and the men in most cases it was the first and sadly last cry for help. Very little overt warning.

Even in basic brass tacks biology women are more valuable. If a group of humans has a disaster and all but a few of the men are killed, but the women remain unscathed, that group will survive. If another group of humans has a disaster and all but a few of the women are killed, that group faces extinction.

wakka12

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

Right off the bat I could name two worse things men experience that both of those
Longer sentences in prison for same crimes for men in comparison to women
Higher rates of depression and suicide in men
Men are the majority of the workforce in practically every 'undesirable' job going, nor is there any incentive to encourage women to partake in these jobs. Only initiatives to encourage women to take part in more desirable and higher paid jobs in science/engineering etc jobs which have traditionally been male dominated.
Also women arent forced to have children.

GingerLily

Until Ireland gives women the right to bodily automony then I have to say women have to harder.

That aside, there are definetly pros and cons for both genders and I think it depends on the personality whether they'd find life easier as a male/female.

AllForIt

Pac1Man wrote: »

I have to shave twice a week.

Are you male or female ?

pangbang

_Brian wrote: »

There's no one answer to this, everyone's life is different and everyone is equipped different to cope with life.

It's a typical juvenile AH question expecting an A or B answer to a hugely complex topic.

People have tough lives, some tougher than others, best we can do is hope we're capable of dealing with whatever life throws at us because not everyone can.

But its not a complex question in many ways. The simple fact of the matter, if you were god and knew everything, you would be able to state, "yes, its men", or "yes, its women". Its not like asking is the glass half-full or empty, its not that complex, its not philosophical. It is quite easy to take the general state of play, such as a job, pop a man into the situation or pop a woman into the situation and come to an overall opinion. You just run a good few scenarios through your mind based on your life experiences.

Imagine you are a first time parent. Baby girl arrives, exact same situation in life regarding family, finances etc....would you not have an opinion as to whether that girl will have an easier or harder life is she was born a boy?

Its status quo stuff, as things are. Nothing about what to do about it, or trends, or what will happen in x amount of years, or victimhood, or trophies, or getting a sly dig in.

Jobs OXO

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

I think men dealing with their birds' PMT/PMS is very much overlooked. In fact I would say they have the worst of it when it comes to periods.

pangbang

bee06 wrote: »

This. Why does it have to be men v women!

My question has nothing to do with pitting men against women. Its just a simple observation of life as it is, that's all. If someone wants to turn it into a backhanded way to put men/women down....that's not the topic.

wakka12

Jobs OXO wrote: »

I think men dealing with their birds' PMT/PMS is very much overlooked. In fact I would say they have the worst of it when it comes to periods.

Well depends on the woman I guess. I live with my sister and mother and have been away/lived with close female friends on holidays that lasted several months and Ive never known when any of them were having their periods honestly.

Pac1Man

AllForIt wrote: »

Are you male or female ?

Pac1Man has all the willys.

lazybones32

No one has it harder or easier. We all have different amounts of the same abilities and opportunities. The difference is how we choose to think and act.

bee06

pangbang wrote: »

My question has nothing to do with pitting men against women. Its just a simple observation of life as it is, that's all. If someone wants to turn it into a backhanded way to put men/women down....that's not the topic.

Unfortunately that's the way these threads always end up.

buried

Wibbs wrote: »

I agree 100% B. I only rev up when I see the all too mainstream "feminist" rhetoric of spurious but holy givens springing up, as it will, as night follows day(just like the red pill muppets, but with better PR and coverage). And my very marrow screams out to say;

I know Wibbs, but in all absolute fairness, those types only exist on the faceless internet and the noisy branch of mainstream public media where anything can be anything, where you be a nothing but a actor or noisemaker looking for ratings, and these things scream like a pathetic, spoilt victim.
No actual person, male or female, that I actually know of in my circle, even tries to scream - "I got it more difficult!!" or "Ima bigger victim!!".
If any of the people I know, both male or female, said some pathetic $hit like that on a regular basis in my community, or anyone's actual community, the real community that everyone interacts with in reality, they'd be booted out of it so fast their heads would melt.
Because no-one in the real world wants to listen to that pathetic victim-porn BULL$hit. Everyone is living, everyone knows they will die. There is the real tragedy for EVERYONE. Trying to claim or create some sort of actual hierarchy to that is absolutely PATHETIC.
Claiming to be a victim is dangerous business. Very dangerous, and 9 times out of ten its based on absolute bull$hit.

pangbang

lazybones32 wrote: »

No one has it harder or easier. We all have different amounts of the same abilities and opportunities. The difference is how we choose to think and act.

So are you saying that when you add up the gigantic array of different issues that face men and women, they just so happen to precisely, EXACTLY balance out?

And its not about our choices. A man cant simply pull out a purse when about to be attacked by a gang and they'll go away, and a woman cant choose to be 50% stronger when trying to fight off a rapist.

The world isn't nearly as balanced as youd like it to be. This isn't an idealism question I posed, its a realistic question, based on the here and now.

January

January wrote: »

Women.

On periods and childbirth alone, let's not get into the inequalities in the workplace etc.

Women have it harder.

inequalities in the workplace?

Any examples?

I ask because the only inequality in the workplace that I have ever seen was when I was 15, working in Tesco, and the girls would never have to sweep the floors or empty the bins :-)

Seriously though, maybe I have been lucky in every single job I've ever had, ranging in a wide variety of industries, but not once have I worked for a company that would even tolerate any form of inequality(in Ireland), so I assume this is not a wide spread issue

Am I wrong? Anyone have examples

RayM

Sometimes it's hard to be a woman... childbirth, ovulation, the menopause, the fact that your bodily autonomy is disregarded by the state if you get pregnant... giving all your love to just one man.

It can hard to be a man too. The suicide problem is partly down to the fact that we're better at it (haha, take that, ladies), but also because we're brought up to believe that we're supposed to be oh-so-tough and that crying or talking about your problems and vulnerabilities is a girly thing (and girly=bad, obviously).

ToddyDoody

There's a quote somewhere about how men have to be made but women are given as they are.

It's to do with how girls were reared by their own sex but men by the opposite, and so at puberty needed to enter the world of men.

How that translates to today's less gender role defined bondaries is one for the (anti) social sciences.

pangbang

RayM wrote: »

Sometimes it's hard to be a woman... childbirth, ovulation, the menopause, the fact that your bodily autonomy is disregarded by the state if you get pregnant... giving all your love to just one man.

It can hard to be a man too. The suicide problem is partly down to the fact that we're better at it (haha, take that, ladies), but also because we're brought up to believe that we're supposed to be oh-so-tough and that crying or talking about your problems and vulnerabilities is a girly thing (and girly=bad, obviously).

So what do you reckon then, one has to be worse than the other, no? Be a man about it! :P

osarusan

It's me, I am the biggest victim of all. Nobody has it worse than me, why can't you all see that?

GritBiscuit

Wibbs wrote: »

Just for fun and by your leave I added two letters to your post
How well do you think that opinion would go down in the mainstream media? Hint: It wouldn't.

In much of the mainstream media your refer to, men have been awarded the title of primary oppressors of women and biggest hurdles to equality and that will always stand against them. The whole "men have found life tough for the last 5 minutes but women have had it tough for centuries so the balance can't possibly be even for generations to come" exudes...regardless of modern day statistics. They are the antithesis to the poison spouted by the red-pillers.

In the real world I think most people see society is a murky, complex shade of grey and everyone, regardless of their skill-sets, gender or opportunities suffer and cry and shoulder their fair share of heart-ache.