Airtech CS350 Alarm - Dodgy Sensor?

jasonb

Hi there...

I've an Airtech CS350 installed in my house for 16 years now.

In the last couple of months the alarm has been going off sometimes when set, and it always reports the same window/sensor. The first time the sensor had come loose off the window frame, but since then I reattached it and it still sometimes happens. Just a couple of days ago I was leaving the house with the alarm beeping and then it went off.

Anyhow, I'm guessing the sensor is dodgy, or the wires to it, though it all looks fine to my untrained eye when I have a look at it.

Logic tells me to replace the sensor, or at least narrow it down to that sensor. I was thinking of swapping two sensors and see if that 'moves' the issue to another window, and if it does, that should confirm the dodgy sensor and then I can replace it. Just some questions though...

1. Can I test the sensor without basically setting the alarm and then banging the window to see if it goes off, and what sensor the screen reports?
2. Can set the alarm but tell it to ignore one sensor?
3. What sensor should I get as a replacement, where could I get it in Kildare/Dublin, and approx. how much would it be?

I should say that i have what I assume is the engineer code (I use it to change the time on the alarm when the clocks change) but I don't have a manual.

Thanks...

youtube!

jasonb wrote: »

Hi there...

I've an Airtech CS350 installed in my house for 16 years now.

In the last couple of months the alarm has been going off sometimes when set, and it always reports the same window/sensor. The first time the sensor had come loose off the window frame, but since then I reattached it and it still sometimes happens. Just a couple of days ago I was leaving the house with the alarm beeping and then it went off.

Anyhow, I'm guessing the sensor is dodgy, or the wires to it, though it all looks fine to my untrained eye when I have a look at it.

Logic tells me to replace the sensor, or at least narrow it down to that sensor. I was thinking of swapping two sensors and see if that 'moves' the issue to another window, and if it does, that should confirm the dodgy sensor and then I can replace it. Just some questions though...

1. Can I test the sensor without basically setting the alarm and then banging the window to see if it goes off, and what sensor the screen reports?
2. Can set the alarm but tell it to ignore one sensor?
3. What sensor should I get as a replacement, where could I get it in Kildare/Dublin, and approx. how much would it be?

I should say that i have what I assume is the engineer code (I use it to change the time on the alarm when the clocks change) but I don't have a manual.

Thanks...

1) You will need to set the alarm to test the sensor, unless it is a tamper fault but in that case it's more than likely that you would not be able to set the alarm at all.

2) You can inhibit a zone or place the panel in "Soak test" You will need to access the Zone menu to do this. It will mean that any activation on the particular zone will be logged but will not trigger an alarm, the problem though is that you must test the entire zone, not just one sensor (unless it is the only sensor on that zone.)

3) It depends on if the sensor is on a fixed window with no magnet (Standard) or contact beside it (MC), cost is about 15-18 euro.

What you could do is open a sensor that you know is not faulty, and remove the actual inertia part itself, usually there will be 2 wires directly into the sensor (aritech s10) or a barrel type which will have a lead connected to the base (HKC) remove and move it over to faulty sensor, remember though you will need to wrap the removed wires together to close the circuit so you can test it, it sounds a bit complicated but in reality it really isn't. Of course it could also be a faulty output on the panel but this is unlikely. Good luck.

jasonb

Thanks youtube!

Yep, I think I understand what you're saying. I've looked at the panel, and it looks like I have 4 zones (Front Door, Back Door, Front Window, Back Window) and I have three back windows with shock sensors (not magnetic) on them, so I'm now not so sure which of the sensors is the offending one, as I assume they're all in the same Back Window zone.

I need to get my hands on a CS350 manual to help me through the menus and figure out how to do some of the tests you're talking about. How exactly are sensors 'added' to a zone, is it knowing what wires they're on, or is it something in the sensor itself? Put another way, if I swapped a sensor from the Front Window to the Back Window, would that sensor now be in the Back Window zone (due to the change in wiring) or would it still be the Front Window zone?

Thanks...

jasonb

Actually, another question, sorry! I can get into the Engineer Menu, but I don't know how to get into the User Menu! If I enter what I think of as the 'user' code, it arms the alarm, I don't get any options like Arm Menu, Inhibit Menu etc. What am I doing wrong (I presume I am doing something wrong! )

KoolKid

The best way to find a faulty sensor is to check the resistence.
If you have a multi meter...

Disconnect the zone from the panel & remove any end of line resistors,
Set you meter to continuity and connect the pair to the 2 meter leads.
on a length of cable long enough to reach all your windows on zone 3.
Make a note of the reading in ohms. One by one tap every sensor & open and close every contact. After a tap or an open close the resistance should return to the around the same value. If it does not disconnect that device , close of the pair wired into it & move on. Replace any that you had to close off..

Best and most reliable method.
You user code appears to be set up with just the arm dis arm options without allowing you any access to the menu.

jasonb

Thanks KoolKid...

From what I remember from Leaving Cert Physics, that all kinda makes sense! I may even have a multimeter, I used to have one, will go check. If I find one I'll get back with more specific questions about your instructions!

Is there any way to use the engineer menu to change the settings for the user menu?

Thanks!

KoolKid

You would need the engineer code to access the engineer menu.
Unfortunately we are no longer allowed help you here with engineer or user codes.

jasonb

I actually have the engineer code and can access the engineer menu, so is there an option in that menu to change what options the user menu has? Thanks...

KoolKid

Sorry, yes there is .
In Engineer goto Users> User Attributes > and add IN MN and PG if any of them are not displayed.

Now when you enter your user code you will be presented with Arm Menu which is the first menu. From there you use the arrow keys to scroll up/down & accept to enter each sub menu?

jasonb

Brilliant KoolKid, I now have a full user menu, thanks!

Is there any way to stop each key press on the panel beeping, it's annoying when I'm working so much on it and my daughter's asleep in bed!

Now, I'll have a multimeter tomorrow evening, so more questions:

1. Exactly how do I disconnect the zone from the panel, where do I find the EOL (end of line?) resistors and how do I remove them?
2. Connect what pair to the two meter leads?
3. On a length of cable long enough to reach all three windows? What does this mean? Am I holding one meter lead against some point in the main Alarm box on the wall, the other against a length of wire, and then I'm bringing the other end of that wire to each window?
4. When you say tap every sensor, do I take the cover off the sensor and tap a particular part of it? They're all shock sensors, so I'm guessing there's no contact to open/close?

Sorry for all these questions, this is all rather new to me. I do appreciate your advice though!

jasonb

Sorry KoolKid, I've been re-reading your message, and reading through other threads of yours (all very helpful, thanks!).

I think what you're saying is I disconnect the two wire for the 'dodgy' zone from the panel, and connect the two multi-meter wires to those two wires, yes? And I check the resistance, and then I hit each sensor, see the change in resistance, see if it goes back to the original setting, and if it doesn't that sensor is dodgy, and I unwire that sensor (and join the two wires together at that sensor to keep the loop intact) and then test the remaining sensors. Is that basically it?

And I think I'm also right in saying that if I put that zone into Soak Test (as youtube! said), then I can do all this without the alarm actually going off, it'll just log the sensors being tapped.

Finally, from what I can see I can't turn off the button press beeping on the keypad, but according to a previous post from you, I can remove the keypad cover and lower down the pot to reduce the volume. If I remove the keypad cover will the alarm sound, detecting a tamper?

Thanks!

KoolKid

Yes. Thats pretty much right. But you need to do it without the EOL resistors to get the reading down to ohms rather than 1000s. It will be much more accurate.

jasonb

Great, thanks! Now I just need to see how obvious it is which wires are which zones, but I can do that tomorrow when I don't mind the alarm going off while I take off the panel lid.

Thanks...

KoolKid

jasonb wrote: »

Great, thanks! Now I just need to see how obvious it is which wires are which zones, but I can do that tomorrow when I don't mind the alarm going off while I take off the panel lid.

Thanks...

Happy to help. If you need anything else you know where we are.

jasonb

Well, it looks like we've narrowed it down to one sensor, thanks to everyone for their help and advice. I'll get one asap and replace it.

A final quick question. I put the zone with the sensors I was testing into Soak Test, and then they didn't go off even if we gave them a wallop while the alarm was set. However, nothing seemed to be logged in the logs either, and I thought the Soak Test stopped the alarm going off, but still registered the sensor? Which log should I be looking at to find this?

Thanks!

jasonb

Sigh... And what have I just noticed on the panel? Low Battery warning! I'll have to go get one of those too...

KoolKid

The soak test on that system logs the activation of the sensor when the alarm is set, without activating the alarm.

jasonb wrote: »

Sigh... And what have I just noticed on the panel? Low Battery warning! I'll have to go get one of those too...

One of these will do the job.

jimmycrackcorm

KoolKid wrote: »

The soak test on that system logs the activation of the sensor when the alarm is set, without activating the alarm.



One of these will do the job.

I'll have to get one of those.
My keypad is iffy, the buttons are almost impossible to press at this stage, it's like having to get a pen to push in to make contact.
/
Is it possible to get a replacement keypad at this stage

KoolKid

Not as new.
They can be opened & cleaned or swapped out. We normally have a few we would swap out to get someone out of a hole.

altor

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I'll have to get one of those.
My keypad is iffy, the buttons are almost impossible to press at this stage, it's like having to get a pen to push in to make contact.
/
Is it possible to get a replacement keypad at this stage

In most cases a simple clean of the keypads buttons and pcb will solve this issue.

jasonb

KoolKid wrote: »

The soak test on that system logs the activation of the sensor when the alarm is set, without activating the alarm.

Yep, that's what I thought, but while the alarm didn't activate, there doesn't seem to be anything in the log either. Would the activation of the sensor pop up on the screen, or do I have to look at the Engineer Log. I checked both the screen and the log there was nothing there.

KoolKid

It would be in the engineer log. But it should flash up on the screen after the system is disarmed also.

jasonb

Yeah, that's what I thought! I might try it again just to check it.

Thanks...

jasonb

Got the Battery and Sensor today, the only Sensors they had were the HKC Type A ones, so I'll have to spend a little time figuring out which wires from the dodgy sensor go where on the new one! I'm right in thinking that the arrow on the barrel has to point up, correct?

Thanks...

KoolKid

Yes the arrow must point up. There should be a diagram come with it. If not post up a pic and I'll go through it with you.

jasonb

Ok, I've attached two pics, of the old and new sensors.

Having looked at them myself, I believe I'm right in saying that that two blue wires are the tamper wires, and they go into the two tamper slots, the middle two on the new sensor.

The yellow and black wires are the spare/reed wires, and they go into the outer two slots on the new sensor.

And the red wires are the sensor wires, and they go into the middle two slots on the new sensor.

Assuming that's all correct, does it matter which of the two slots they go into? In other words, can the yellow and black wires go into either of the spare/reed slots?

Thanks!

KoolKid

All good.
As this is just a sensor then the 2 outer ones are spare so you can use those to join cables.
The next 2 are the sensor & the inner 2 are the tamper.

jasonb

Battery and sensor replaced today, took about 15-20 mins. Everything seems to be working fine, thanks to youtube! and especially Koolkid for your help, you saved me a lot of hassle and money!

KoolKid

Your welcome.