Any advice for leg cramps and peeing to often?!

Ksking

I got into adventure racing about 18 months ago and am a bit annoyed that I'm still struggling with leg cramps and peeing too often (!) every race I do. Both happen mostly in the last 1/3 of the race. I just did DAR full and had to run behind a rock 3 times in the space of 1 hour. I was ok for the rest of the race before and after. I'm just wondering if it's something that could be fixed by tweaking fluid and fuel.

I use Kinetica gels about every 30-45 minutes and Hi5 electrolyte tabs. I dont think I'm drinking too much. I drank about 1.25 litres in 4.5 hours yesterday, though it was cool and I'm not a big sweater.

The gels have some sea salt in them - maybe using the electrolyte tabs as well is too much? I've read alot of conflicting info about cramps. Some swearing by using dioralyte powder to get rid of cramps. Others saying it has a lot more to do with fitness than electrolytes. Maybe I just need to train smarter. Any advice?

RacoonQueen

Can't help you on cramps I'm afraid but peeing is probably psychological. Can never understand why people need to run behind trees numerous times on a long run/long bike when they've had feck all to drink since the last time they stopped.

Animella

Do you use compression socks or sleeves? Worth a try to prevent cramp.
Cramp should lessen as your fitness improves over longer durations. I absoluted hobbled the last 4K of my first adventure race with cramp but it very rarely bothers me now.
Electrolytes are important too. Try a banana as a pre race snack.
Grinding too hard on the bike can cause cramp too.
The peeing may be psychological if you're not overhydrating.
Am presuming you are male but for many women pelvic floor issues cause big problems..

Ksking

I haven't tried compression socks, so yes, I'll give them a go thanks. I usually eat an energy bar and some peanut butter sandwiches pre race. Would bananas be better?

Regarding the pee problem, (yes I'm a guy!) I've read of people feeling the urge to go but not really needing to - that's not the case with me -I really need to! Maybe I just dont sweat as much and need to drink as much as others, especially when weather is cold and wet like it was on saturday mid race.

tunney

Animella wrote: »

Do you use compression socks or sleeves? Worth a try to prevent cramp.
Cramp should lessen as your fitness improves over longer durations. I absoluted hobbled the last 4K of my first adventure race with cramp but it very rarely bothers me now.
Electrolytes are important too. Try a banana as a pre race snack.
Grinding too hard on the bike can cause cramp too.
The peeing may be psychological if you're not overhydrating.
Am presuming you are male but for many women pelvic floor issues cause big problems..

Compression socks won't help. Sleeves are even less likely to help.
Unlikely to be electrolytes although chronic magnesium deficiency may not help.
Grinding on the bike is unlikely to cause cramp (anyone got a link to the Doc's stance on cadence).

More than likely it will be you are not fit enough - either at all, or for the pace you are trying to maintain.

pgibbo

This one is it?

Animella

tunney wrote: »

Compression socks won't help. Sleeves are even less likely to help.
Unlikely to be electrolytes although chronic magnesium deficiency may not help.
Grinding on the bike is unlikely to cause cramp (anyone got a link to the Doc's stance on cadence).

More than likely it will be you are not fit enough - either at all, or for the pace you are trying to maintain.

Compression socks might help and certainly wouldn't do any harm. Cramps might be caused by dehydration , but that's obviously not the issue here.
Anyway I'll leave it to ye the experts.

peter kern

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Can't help you on cramps I'm afraid but peeing is probably psychological. Can never understand why people need to run behind trees numerous times on a long run/long bike when they've had feck all to drink since the last time they stopped.

report back when you are in your 40 s lol

to OP tunney has kind of alluded to it but i think you might have to have a look at your overall diet not just race day.

what might help you its not that uncommen what you describe.
and with a 99.9 % likelyhood ,the combination of gels and your drink is not the problem. if anything you might need more salt.

the other thing is if you havent had those issues in training you might not prepare yourself well enough and need to do longer sessions or longer intervals to prepare your body better for the task .

timmaii

Do the gels contain caffeine? Caffeine is a diuretic so that could be the problem (I know it has that effect on me!).

tunney

Animella wrote: »

Compression socks might help and certainly wouldn't do any harm. Cramps might be caused by dehydration , but that's obviously not the issue here.
Anyway I'll leave it to ye the experts.

Why would compression socks help cramps?

timmaii wrote: »

Do the gels contain caffeine? Caffeine is a diuretic so that could be the problem (I know it has that effect on me!).

The diuretic effect of caffeine, albeit extremely mild, does not exist in exercise.

pgibbo

I was chatting with a buddy yesterday that suffers from cramps. He has found that eating Chilli Chocolate on the bike helps. He read a study about spicy foods helping with cramps. It's n=1 but it's working for him.

P.

Ksking

timmaii wrote: »

Do the gels contain caffeine? Caffeine is a diuretic so that could be the problem (I know it has that effect on me!).

Thanks for replies. I don't use caffeine gels because rightly or wrongly I read somewhere that they can contribute to cramps.

Re cramps - it looks like its mostly down to training. I need to include more longer runs and cycles and hill work. I was just checking here to see if there were any other tips that would help. Maybe I'll try spicey food. Has anyone had any success using pickle juice to relieve cramp? I'm turning 50 shortly which probably is also working against me.

Re peeing too much, I was aiming to drink 500-750mls/hour because I read that drinking to thirst is a bad idea, and that's about what should be consumed. Is it safe to say the amount we need to drink varies a lot between different people and different weather conditions, and that guide isn't very helpful? Should I just aim to drink less, especially in weather conditions like on Brandon last Saturday which were cold and damp?

BTH

So you drank 2.5-3 litres of water during a 4.5 hour race?
That's sounds like a lot alright. I drink very little so probably got a good basis for comparison, but drank 1-1.5L during a 5:15 race in temps of 20+ recently without any problems.

Ksking

BTH wrote: »

So you drank 2.5-3 litres of water during a 4.5 hour race?
.

No, I started out aiming for that but I cut back my intake when I started having to look for rocks to jump behind! I think I drank about 1.25L in 4.5 hours.

jameshayes

Where are the cramps? Calf or upper leg?

Ksking

jameshayes wrote: »

Where are the cramps? Calf or upper leg?

Both. Sometimes starts with upper leg and spread to lower, sometimes other way around.

jameshayes

Ksking wrote: »

Both. Sometimes starts with upper leg and spread to lower, sometimes other way around.

I suffer with cramps on anything over 25km running, I don't think it is hydration based because it doesn't get better if I drink more, I don't think it is electrolyte based because it doesn't get better if I take the tablets (I even tried the packet of salt trick - didn't work) and I don't think it is muscle strength based because I strength and condition 3 days a week... I think its just something I am going to have to live with and I have to work around. There are 2 things I haven't tried yet; calf sleeves (although that'll do nothing for my quad cramps) and I've never tried pickle juice although I've heard a lot about it - for some reason I think i'd prefer the cramps than to drink that

sconhome

I was aiming to drink 500-750mls/hour because I read that drinking to thirst is a bad idea, and that's about what should be consumed. Is it safe to say the amount we need to drink varies a lot between different people and different weather conditions, and that guide isn't very helpful? Should I just aim to drink less, especially in weather conditions like on Brandon last Saturday which were cold and damp?

I think you're drinking too much for the conditions.

Drink to thirst is a good rule of thumb in racing situation. Can benefit by not having to pee but also in not carrying all that fluid (weight) in your system.

Try train with less reliance on fluids and you can control your thirst urge.

Depending on what you are drinking you may be knocking your electrolyte balance out causing cramps.

Experiment and figure out what works for you.

Keeks

Could be a mineral problem.....Too little potassium, calcium or magnesium in your diet can contribute to leg cramps....

_Brian

Zma tabs are great to prevent cramps.

tunney

_Brian wrote: »

Zma tabs are great to prevent cramps.

Aye, thats the M in the ZMA - magnesium. Usually it in the form of magnesium oxide with a bit of magnesium citrate. Magnesium glycinate is more bio available and less likely to give you the sh1ts.

El Director

Personally I find the best thing to combat muscle cramps is decent/good level of fitness and then, crucially, pacing appropriately, according to your current level of fitness.

MojoMaker

Sensible

Victor

Does this happen at times other than races / training. Might it be something completely unrelated. Have you spoken to your doctor?

pgibbo wrote: »

I was chatting with a buddy yesterday that suffers from cramps. He has found that eating Chilli Chocolate on the bike helps. He read a study about spicy foods helping with cramps. It's n=1 but it's working for him.

Spices have a high salt content.