London Fire and Aftermath RIP

Harry Palmr

EDIT: the SKWAWKBOX is now satisfied that no D-notice was issued. No plain answer to this blog’s question of other restrictions on information about lives lost at Grenfell has yet been provided, but a ‘D-notice’ (or DSMA-notice as they are now termed) was not.

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zerks

zerks wrote: »

In fairness,I reckon they do know.I guarantee that if any resident owed the authorities a tenner they'd be found fairly quickly.
Welfare,revenue even the post office would have records of any adults living there. It's a modern world where records of everyone are kept.

& do you think they know if a resident was subletting?
If the residents were at home at the time?
If the residents were out of the country?
If someone living alone had a party were a load of mates came round for the night?
If someone had a girl/boyfriend around for the night?

They may know how many people are supposed to be resident, but there is no way of knowing how many people were actually there on the night. And those things will take time to investigate.

Ballstein

bubblypop wrote: »

it's because they don't know. That's why.

"At this moment we have 30 confirmed dead and X amount confirmed missing" are you telling me you have never heard that statement released by the police before? Of course they know to within 2/3 people how many people are reported missing at this stage. If anyone watched Newsnight on BBC tonight and can honestly say they don't think London is a tinder box then they've their head buried in the sand. Christ sake even the reporters are saying it won't end well.

devnull

muddypaws wrote: »

That link says NO D notice has been issued

Something certainly happened like that.

Sky and BBC had reporters on the scene and round about the same time both of them cut away from the coverage of the protests and didn't go back and went right back to the studio on Sky and Sophy Ridge who only just came on air for her 2 hour slot was never seen again.

It was very odd, like someone forced them to pull the plug...

mikeybrennan

orangerhyme wrote: »

Google "mermoz tower fire roubaix, france 2012".
Theres a video on YouTube.
Small fire on balcony spreads up the entire facade in just a couple of minutes. Videos of Dubai and Germany. That stuff is lethal. It seems more flammable than wood!

It'll be banned across Europe in weeks Id imagine.

Currently hundreds of tower blocks retrofitted with the stuff in the uk

This stuff clearly obviates the traditional compartmentilization of apartment blocks in a fire situation

Add in poor lighting,single stairwells and no fire alarm system or sprinklers and its a recipe for disaster

A review of fire safety in tower blocks has been ordered and fixing this properly will cost huge money

Romantic Rose

bubblypop wrote: »

it's because they don't know. That's why.

That's the thing. Can they count a fatality if they didn't find the body yet?

Junkyard Tom

Romantic Rose wrote: »

That's the thing. Can they count a fatality if they didn't find the body yet?

'Missing presumed dead'?

Who the hell hides from their loved ones after a tragedy like this?

Gringo180

Romantic Rose wrote: »

That's the thing. Can they count a fatality if they didn't find the body yet?

Why dont they announce the number of people missing? I said 2 days ago on here it will be upwards of 150 dead. Mostly children. There is going to be civil war over this.

orangerhyme

muddypaws wrote: »

That link says NO D notice has been issued

Oh I know but people here said I was a tinfoil hat conspiracist for saying it.
Granted, it may not have happened, but it was rumoured and reported by a respected blog.

For all we know it was issued, and a condition of a D-NOTICE is that you can't say its been issued.

prinzeugen

devnull wrote: »

Something certainly happened like that.

Sky and BBC had reporters on the scene and round about the same time both of them cut away from the coverage of the protests and didn't go back and went right back to the studio on Sky and Sophy Ridge who only just came on air for her 2 hour slot was never seen again.

It was very odd, like someone forced them to pull the plug...

They were anti Tory protests planned long before the fire by the far left.

As in Ireland, they jump on any band wagon they can.

I find it sick that the socialists are trying to use this for political gain.

That's why the news cut away. Because the protest had nothing to do with the fire.

orangerhyme

mikeybrennan wrote: »

Currently hundreds of tower blocks retrofitted with the stuff in the uk

This stuff clearly obviates the traditional compartmentilization of apartment blocks in a fire situation

Add in poor lighting,single stairwells and no fire alarm system or sprinklers and its a recipe for disaster

A review of fire safety in tower blocks has been ordered and fixing this properly will cost huge money

It seems like an obvious thing to say, but surely the emergency stairs should have excellent ventilation.
These stairs are constructed in such a way a way as to not catch fire eg just concrete walls and paint, no fittings or furniture etc.
But what's the point if it's full of smoke.
So many residents complained the stairs were pitch dark and full of smoke so couldn't breathe. It seems obvious to me. People said they were stepping over bodies going down the stairs.

orangerhyme

orangerhyme wrote: »

Oh I know but people here said I was a tinfoil hat conspiracist for saying it.
Granted, it may not have happened, but it was rumoured and reported by a respected blog.

For all we know it was issued, and a condition of a D-NOTICE is that you can't say its been issued.

What's a D notice?

Romantic Rose

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

'Missing presumed dead'?

Who the hell hides from their loved ones after a tragedy like this?

I'm just asking a question.

muddypaws

devnull wrote: »

Something certainly happened like that.

Sky and BBC had reporters on the scene and round about the same time both of them cut away from the coverage of the protests and didn't go back and went right back to the studio on Sky and Sophy Ridge who only just came on air for her 2 hour slot was never seen again.

It was very odd, like someone forced them to pull the plug...

The rumoured, but non existent notice, was not about the protests, it was the numbers of people who have died.

Comes to something when conspiracy theories have conspiracy theories.

Junkyard Tom

Romantic Rose wrote: »

I'm just asking a question.

Sorry Rose I didn't mean to have a go at you! Peace.

GM228

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

What's a D notice?

It's now called a DSMA Notice, a Defence and Security Media Advisory Notice which basically is a request not to publish certain information for reasons of national security.

It's a voluntary code followed by the UK Government and the UK media.

prinzeugen

The notice is also used in cases like this.

Family should be informed of a death by other family or the police.

Not the media.

Also there may have been illegal migrants in the block and their body could be mistaken for someone that is still alive but "missing".

B.A._Baracus

Not sure if this has been posted here but https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/16/sun-journalist-grenfell-tower-victim-hospital

a Sun reporter pretended to be a friend of a victim in hospital to interview him.

The media are ghouls.

Send In The Robots

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

You can buy 'last resort' parachutes for people who work, or live, in highrise buildings.

Thought that was in jest, but seemingly there are a few avilable designed for buildings.

Evacuchute - will safely deploy from 42m and above, fireman's version also available.

SOS parachutre - will operate from 30m and above, made in US sold from spain. Opens much faster than conventional types.

Il Fascista

I wouldn't be surprised if this was real

https://twitter.com/RaheemKassam/status/875851835965394944

prinzeugen

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Not sure if this has been posted here but https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/16/sun-journalist-grenfell-tower-victim-hospital

a Sun reporter pretended to be a friend of a victim in hospital to interview him.

The media are ghouls.

Old habits die hard. Hacking the phone of a dead kid and now this. Vile.

prinzeugen

Il Fascista wrote: »

I wouldn't be surprised if this was real

https://twitter.com/RaheemKassam/status/875851835965394944

As I said.. Any band wagon.

There may be riots. Wonder if they will burn down any businesses this time round?

Junkyard Tom

Send In The Robots wrote: »

Thought that was in jest.

I wouldn't joke in a thread as serious as this. I remember there was a surge in demand for 'last resort' parachutes after 9/11. I'd have one if I didn't have a failsafe escape plan for such an incident.

The_Kew_Tour

The Sun should be well gone at this stage. Scum

Cantona's Collars

bubblypop wrote: »

& do you think they know if a resident was subletting?
If the residents were at home at the time?
If the residents were out of the country?
If someone living alone had a party were a load of mates came round for the night?
If someone had a girl/boyfriend around for the night?

They may know how many people are supposed to be resident, but there is no way of knowing how many people were actually there on the night. And those things will take time to investigate.

My point was that they should have a fair idea how many didn't make it out by now.Of course they aren't going to make exact figures public or name people. As you say,apartment spaces could have been sublet etc.If that's the case then said victims may never be identified. I fear the search of the top floors will reveal an absolute horror.
A woman who used to have an office on the first floor said that apart from the lift all there was left was a narrow stairs which was hard enough to use at the best of times. Imagine trying to even find your way to it let alone get down it in blind conditions and an inferno.

4068ac1elhodqr

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I wouldn't joke in a thread as serious as this. I remember there was a surge in demand for 'last resort' parachutes after 9/11. I'd have one if I didn't have a failsafe escape plan for such an incident.

Might also be useful on planes as well as water-floats. One product video shows it creating massive drag within about just 1.5 seconds, using wing airfoil design instead of regular design.

One report estimates 30,000 buildings with this type of cladding in the uk, obviously only so many, and so many people are over 8 levels or so floors which would be around the minimum for this.

Junkyard Tom

Makayla Petite Disc wrote: »

Might also be useful....

I was just thinking about it and what would you do if you'd a couple of kids or an elderly relative and are of limited means?

It's not a solution.

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

The Sun should be well gone at this stage. Scum

More-and-more businesses are refusing to sell it. The corporate/mainstream media is losing its grip on the public consciousness and that can only be a good thing in the long term.

prinzeugen

Makayla Petite Disc wrote: »

Might also be useful on planes as well as water-floats. One product video shows it creating massive drag within about just 1.5 seconds, using wing airfoil design instead of regular design.

One report estimates 30,000 buildings with this type of cladding in the uk, obviously only so many, and so many people are over 8 levels or so floors which would be around the minimum for this.

A 767 would need a parachute a mile wide and planes are water tight if they hit the water and the fuselage remains in one piece which is rare.

All floats on planes would do is prolong the agony.

But this is for another thread.

laugh

prinzeugen wrote: »

As I said.. Any band wagon.

There may be riots. Wonder if they will burn down any businesses this time round?

This time?

Any reasonable person should find it warranted to march about what has happened here.

gitzy16v

laugh wrote: »

This time?

Any reasonable person should find it warranted to march about what has happened here.

The march was organised right after the election....the hard left just lumped this tragedy into their agenda.