Dublin routes news and general chat

Icelandair flying to Dublin 6x per week from May

LXFlyer

It appears that Aer Lingus are dropping the Dublin-Warsaw route from early January 2018.

Jamie2k9

LXFlyer wrote: »

It appears that Aer Lingus are dropping the Dublin-Warsaw route from early January 2018.

They lost a lot of interest in it over the summer months in recent years. TBH I taught it might be a decent T/A connection but clearly not!

Bsal

When did the Air Arabia Morocco flights start between Dublin and Agadir? Just noticed one arriving on FR24.

LXFlyer

This will tell you all:
https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/air-arabia-maroc-launch-new-service-to-agadir

This week is the answer!!

kevinandrew

LXFlyer wrote: »

It appears that Aer Lingus are dropping the Dublin-Warsaw route from early January 2018.

This is embarrassing. 

Aer Lingus once served Warsaw, Krakow and Poznan, not to mention Vilnius in Lithuania and Riga in Latvia. Ryanair obviously destroyed Aer Lingus in this market and demand has clearly fallen from the peak 05-08 period when A330s were sent at Christmas but it also shows the huge weakness in their short haul business model, they simply cannot compete for business outside of the predictable sun destinations and major cities. This latest retreat means the furthest east they'll fly in Northern Europe is Berlin! 

Would love to see LOT Polish Airlines back on the route, right sized aircraft and a decent product.

California Dreamer

How is this embarrassing?

EI once served all those Eastern European cities when we were in Celtic tiger peak and that traffic was coming or going for work. They have all gone home and no longer come to Ireland for the pints and sunshine!!

EI are only reacting to the market changes, not a thing wrong with their business model unless you think operating a 320 with 50 pax is a good idea??

Jacovs

LXFlyer wrote: »

This will tell you all:
https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/air-arabia-maroc-launch-new-service-to-agadir

This week is the answer!!

Last week I believe. 7th october a flight operated, not sure if there was another before too.

VG31

kevinandrew wrote: »

Would love to see LOT Polish Airlines back on the route, right sized aircraft and a decent product.

It certainly seems more likely now. Ryanair have a total monopoly on flights to Poland. It would be great if LOT were to fly to Dublin. It's good to have an alternative to Ryanair, particularly when it's not a low-cost airline. LOT have a good range of connections to Eastern Europe as well.

JCX BXC

California Dreamer wrote: »

How is this embarrassing?

EI once served all those Eastern European cities when we were in Celtic tiger peak and that traffic was coming or going for work. They have all gone home and no longer come to Ireland for the pints and sunshine!!

EI are only reacting to the market changes, not a thing wrong with their business model unless you think operating a 320 with 50 pax is a good idea??

EI has near no expansion on European routes, at a time when Dublin is expanding massively. If you don't keep up you lose out, I think this is an example of this.

Locker10a

kevinandrew wrote: »

LXFlyer wrote: »

It appears that Aer Lingus are dropping the Dublin-Warsaw route from early January 2018.

This is embarrassing. 

Aer Lingus once served Warsaw, Krakow and Poznan, not to mention Vilnius in Lithuania and Riga in Latvia. Ryanair obviously destroyed Aer Lingus in this market and demand has clearly fallen from the peak 05-08 period when A330s were sent at Christmas but it also shows the huge weakness in their short haul business model, they simply cannot compete for business outside of the predictable sun destinations and major cities. This latest retreat means the furthest east they'll fly in Northern Europe is Berlin! 

Would love to see LOT Polish Airlines back on the route, right sized aircraft and a decent product.

Aer Lingus don't care about what their network looks like on a map, they go after yield. If they can make more money selling a holiday flight to Faro, than transporting immigrants and their families back and from Eastern Europe then they will naturally choose that! Irish people have good disposable income, and they love sunshine destinations, so if Aer Lingus feel their fleet is better utilised serving that market then that's smart business.

Irish Steve

JCX BXC wrote: »

EI has near no expansion on European routes, at a time when Dublin is expanding massively. If you don't keep up you lose out, I think this is an example of this.

To expand, there's several factors that have to be addressed. The first is airframes, and we already know that EI don't have a lot of spare capacity in that area at the moment, and extra airframes is not a quick fix, as they then have to be crewed, which in the present climate is not just a case of a quick advert in the aviation equivalent of the Irish Sun.

So, having got the airframes, and the crews to operate them, there is then the thorny issue of slots at Dublin to be able to utilise the airframes, and until the second runway at Dublin is on stream, that is going to be problematic, especially at peak periods, and if the runway slots are available, terminal stands to put the aircraft on are also at a premium, especially in T2, so all in all, expanding EI's operation beyond what they are already working on right now is not going to be easy.

kevinandrew

California Dreamer wrote: »

How is this embarrassing?

EI once served all those Eastern European cities when we were in Celtic tiger peak and that traffic was coming or going for work. They have all gone home and no longer come to Ireland for the pints and sunshine!!

EI are only reacting to the market changes, not a thing wrong with their business model unless you think operating a 320 with 50 pax is a good idea??

The list of failed routes is long, Warsaw, Poznan, Krakow, Riga, Vilnius, Helsinki, Stockholm, Copenhagen and Hanover in recent years. The fact that Aer Lingus cannot maintain a route from its home market and so called hub to major European cities and capitals is in my view embarrassing.  

I wouldn't encourage Aer Lingus to operate A320s on routes with 50 pax but when you're retreating from entire markets, in this case Northern and Eastern Europe, you have to wonder if there needs to be a fundamental change in their approach to short haul. Maybe the A320 is too big? Product too lacklustre or fares and costs still too high?!

JCX BXC

Irish Steve wrote: »

To expand, there's several factors that have to be addressed. The first is airframes, and we already know that EI don't have a lot of spare capacity in that area at the moment, and extra airframes is not a quick fix, as they then have to be crewed, which in the present climate is not just a case of a quick advert in the aviation equivalent of the Irish Sun.

So, having got the airframes, and the crews to operate them, there is then the thorny issue of slots at Dublin to be able to utilise the airframes, and until the second runway at Dublin is on stream, that is going to be problematic, especially at peak periods, and if the runway slots are available, terminal stands to put the aircraft on are also at a premium, especially in T2, so all in all, expanding EI's operation beyond what they are already working on right now is not going to be easy.

This has been going on for years, I'm not suggesting massive 15 aircraft growth, however growth has been practically minimal. These issues aren't unique to Aer Lingus, however other airlines are expanding, so I don't accept that.

Irish Steve

kevinandrew wrote: »

The list of failed routes is long, Warsaw, Poznan, Krakow, Riga, Vilnius, Helsinki, Stockholm, Copenhagen and Hanover in recent years. The fact that Aer Lingus cannot maintain a route from its home market and so called hub to major European cities and capitals is in my view embarrassing.

I wouldn't encourage Aer Lingus to operate A320s on routes with 50 pax but when you're retreating from entire markets, in this case Northern and Eastern Europe, you have to wonder if there needs to be a fundamental change in their approach to short haul. Maybe the A320 is too big? Product too lacklustre or fares and costs still too high?!

The other possibility is that Ireland is not seen as an attractive destination from Europe because the costs of holidays in Ireland are significant, and there are other destinations (often with a more benign climate) that are significantly cheaper, and despite the upturn of the economy, there is not the same level of business travel from Eastern and Northern Europe that was evident in the Tiger years.

Don't forget, the entire population of the Island is considerably less than the population of the Birmingham metropolitan area, so there's not the same traffic levels from Ireland, and Europeans have choices as to where they go, and for all sorts of reasons, Ireland is not on their list of choices in the way that it was a few years ago.

Some of the change is down to the different focus of economic activity compared to the Tiger years, we're not sucking in huge numbers of people into the construction industry like we were, and that's not down to the success or otherwise of Aer Lingus (or Ryanair) on European routes, its down to a (hopefully) more sustainable level of economic activity.

The distances to Eastern and Northern European airports means that it's not practical to serve them with ATR size turboprops, and smaller jets don't have the same economy of operation, so a smaller jet won't give the same pro rata cost reduction compared to an A320, a jet carrying 40 passengers still needs 2 flight crew, and handling, and a gate/stand etc. Yes, the landing fees will be lower, and the fuel burn is less, but not straight line compared to the larger aircraft, and the costs of a mixed fleet are also significant.

In that vein, I don't see Ryanair operating the same numbers of flights to these parts of Europe (from Ireland) as they used to, that has to tell us something.

California Dreamer

JCX BXC wrote: »

EI has near no expansion on European routes, at a time when Dublin is expanding massively. If you don't keep up you lose out, I think this is an example of this.

You make assumptions that (a) you know the market, (b) as long as you launch a route it will be a success. Do you not think that EI have mountains of historical data on the routes and how the have performed in the last 10 years? You can only whip the horse so many times before it collapses.

Those Eastern European bodies are just no longer here. Go back 10 years and tell me the amount of Polish etc that lived in your town. How many of the commuted for a few months, a year etc. Now fast forward to now, are those same people still there? Most likely not. Now out of who's rear end is EI supposed to find that traffic?

JCX BXC

California Dreamer wrote: »

You make assumptions that (a) you know the market, (b) as long as you launch a route it will be a success. Do you not think that EI have mountains of historical data on the routes and how the have performed in the last 10 years? You can only whip the horse so many times before it collapses.

Those Eastern European bodies are just no longer here. Go back 10 years and tell me the amount of Polish etc that lived in your town. How many of the commuted for a few months, a year etc. Now fast forward to now, are those same people still there? Most likely not. Now out of who's rear end is EI supposed to find that traffic?

No need to be so confrontational.

I make no assumption of knowing the market, in fact, let's completely remove that from the equation and just look at other airlines, many of whom are expanding. Dublins massive growth has not come from a few US and ME expansions.

I'm not saying they should operate a route to EE whatsoever, however I'm using it as an example of how Aer Lingus' lack of expansion is losing them market share. Let's assume that the route is completely unprofitable and Aer Lingus rightly leave it, will they be looking at other areas of expansion in Europe? I'm also sure that many of the expanding airlines have years of market research too.

California Dreamer

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

kevinandrew

We're not just talking Polish and eastern European cities here though. That's the obvious hole in the network due to the market changes mentioned but Helsinki, Copenhagen, Stockholm, Liverpool and Hanover have been and gone, Agadir and Sofia also come to mind and of course the Porto route was killed before it even started. 

So a smaller jet is too costly, the routes are too long, yield too weak and the economy has changed. What is the future of Aer Lingus' network, a constant focus on sun and the long standing city destinations? Eventually they'll be squeezed in those markets as well and then where will they run?

Fattes

California Dreamer wrote: »

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

You mean the same markets FR are expanding In and getting PAX and profit per passenger far beyond what EI get on short haul routes!

Your right it must be the markets and not EI that are the problem!

kevinandrew

California Dreamer wrote: »

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

You miss the entire point of a forum while trying to tell us it's just a forum?! 

I'm sure we're all aware someone is paid a lot more to know the inside details of the topics we're discussing but I wasn't aware that meant it couldn't be discussed?

California Dreamer

kevinandrew wrote: »

You miss the entire point of a forum while trying to tell us it's just a forum?! 

I'm sure we're all aware someone is paid a lot more to know the inside details of the topics we're discussing but I wasn't aware that meant it couldn't be discussed?

Not at all, in fact your posts are very well thought out and lucid. But yes someone knows more than us and why they won't expand. Maybe it's an IAG decision?

Locker10a

Fattes wrote: »

California Dreamer wrote: »

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

You mean the same markets FR are expanding In and getting PAX and profit per passenger far beyond what EI get on short haul routes!

Your right it must be the markets and not EI that are the problem!

Ryanair approach their business very differently, they're happy to operate flights to the most obscure Eastern European airports because those airports are almost paying them to fly there.
As has already been mentioned it's clear that Aer Lingus are not trying to just expand their European route network for the sake of it. Rather they are adding capacity to routes they know will deliver them good return. So where Helsinki might have been a really nice destination a Dublin to Murcia or Alicante overall will earn them more money. Many airlines take this approach.
Look across the water at London Gatwick and the mammoth base that easyJet have there.
Despite an absolutely huge Polish Market living in that part of London and England, easyJet have one route to Poland, ONE!!!
How many time a day do they fly to Barcelona, Malaga, Alicante?......hmmm that should tell you something. Airlines will fly where they make the most money.
Anyone would swear Aer Lingus hadn't expanded at all. Look at all the transatlantic expansion.
Aer Lingus have found a niche that makes them money,!selling transatlantic flights and connecting transatlantic passengers on to their European well-established city routes, alongside this they sell holidays and flights to the favourite Irish sun holiday destinations. This makes them money and that's what they are in business for.

kevinandrew

Locker10a wrote: »

Fattes wrote: »

California Dreamer wrote: »

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

You mean the same markets FR are expanding In and getting PAX and profit per passenger far beyond what EI get on short haul routes!

Your right it must be the markets and not EI that are the problem!

Ryanair approach their business very differently, they're happy to operate flights to the most obscure Eastern European airports because those airports are almost paying them to fly there.
As has already been mentioned it's clear that Aer Lingus are not trying to just expand their European route network for the sake of it. Rather they are adding capacity to routes they know will deliver them good return. So where  Helsinki might have been a really nice destination a Dublin to Murcia or Alicante overall will earn them more money. Many airlines take this approach.
Look across the water at London Gatwick and the mammoth base that easyJet have there.
Despite an absolutely huge Polish Market living in that part of London and England, easyJet have one route to Poland, ONE!!!
How many time a day do they fly to Barcelona, Malaga, Alicante?......hmmm that should tell you something. Airlines will fly where they make the most money.
Anyone would swear Aer Lingus hadn't expanded at all. Look at all the transatlantic expansion.
Aer Lingus have found a niche that makes them money,!selling transatlantic flights and connecting transatlantic passengers on to their European well-established city routes, alongside this they sell holidays and flights to the favourite Irish sun holiday destinations. This makes them money and that's what they are in business for.

Some very good points about the current situation but my point is about where Aer Lingus goes from there and the overall ability of the business to respond to changes in market and demand. Right now their short haul business is undoubtably retreating to the markets you describe, well established city routes and holiday sun destinations. How sustainable is that and how well does that support the ambitions of a Dublin hub? 

Claiming Aer Lingus doesn't care what their network looks like and that they'll go where the money is seems incredibly short sighted. The immediate effects of that approach are already apparent, no presence in eastern or northern Europe, an inability to break into new markets and a carrier that struggles to compete on less established routes when competition comes knocking.  

In the medium to long term it shows a lack flexibility and growth potential in short haul. In my view Aer Lingus need to learn to diversify their short haul network in order to sustain it long term because its inevitable they'll soon face competition on these predictable sun routes whether from Norwegian or someone else and they'll have no other markets to fall back on for those guaranteed profits they chase.

Locker10a

kevinandrew wrote: »

Locker10a wrote: »

Fattes wrote: »

California Dreamer wrote: »

I am not being confrontational, rather stating a fact. It's an endemic problem in this and other boards that you all debate these issues like you have the first hand information that the airlines possess. If you had that information you wouldn't be on an airline forum losing your s**t because someone disagrees with you.

There is a very valid business reason why EI have not expanded or have pulled out of markets? I don't know what it is but someone is getting paid a lot more than you and I to make these decisions.

You mean the same markets FR are expanding In and getting PAX and profit per passenger far beyond what EI get on short haul routes!

Your right it must be the markets and not EI that are the problem!

Ryanair approach their business very differently, they're happy to operate flights to the most obscure Eastern European airports because those airports are almost paying them to fly there.
As has already been mentioned it's clear that Aer Lingus are not trying to just expand their European route network for the sake of it. Rather they are adding capacity to routes they know will deliver them good return. So where  Helsinki might have been a really nice destination a Dublin to Murcia or Alicante overall will earn them more money. Many airlines take this approach.
Look across the water at London Gatwick and the mammoth base that easyJet have there.
Despite an absolutely huge Polish Market living in that part of London and England, easyJet have one route to Poland, ONE!!!
How many time a day do they fly to Barcelona, Malaga, Alicante?......hmmm that should tell you something. Airlines will fly where they make the most money.
Anyone would swear Aer Lingus hadn't expanded at all. Look at all the transatlantic expansion.
Aer Lingus have found a niche that makes them money,!selling transatlantic flights and connecting transatlantic passengers on to their European well-established city routes, alongside this they sell holidays and flights to the favourite Irish sun holiday destinations. This makes them money and that's what they are in business for.

Some very good points about the current situation but my point is about where Aer Lingus goes from there and the overall ability of the business to respond to changes in market and demand. Right now their short haul business is undoubtably retreating to the markets you describe, well established city routes and holiday sun destinations. How sustainable is that and how well does that support the ambitions of a Dublin hub? 

Claiming Aer Lingus doesn't care what their network looks like and that they'll go where the money is seems incredibly short sighted. The immediate effects of that approach are already apparent, no presence in eastern or northern Europe, an inability to break into new markets and a carrier that struggles to compete on less established routes when competition comes knocking.  

In the medium to long term it shows a lack flexibility and growth potential in short haul. In my view Aer Lingus need to learn to diversify their short haul network in order to sustain it long term because its inevitable they'll soon face competition on these predictable sun routes whether from Norwegian or someone else and they'll have no other markets to fall back on for those guaranteed profits they chase.

While I agree about wanting to see them expand their network, which of course would be great, I think your concerns about what to do when competition comes knocking are unfounded. Aer Lingus's most profitable (European) routes, are ones they compete head-to-head on with Ryanair arguably Europe's most feared airline when it comes to having a competitor. If they can share a route with Ryanair, then I don't think that they need to worry too much about other airlines. The reason they can actually compete with Ryanair on their shared routes (which I might add is almost every European route) is because an established market exists that means there is demand and money to be made. Its unlikely that the main routes served by Aer Lingus will change or that the demand will drop off as many of these markets have been in existence for 50-60 years.
Right now I'll bet you Aer Lingus are more concerned with capturing the more market share on Chicago to Rome(through their DUB hub) than they are about serving Ireland to Poland or the likes. Unless of course a new market develops in Eastern Europe and suddenly loads of retired Irish people with deep pockets buy holiday homes there!!

kevinandrew

Locker10a wrote: »

While I agree about wanting to see them expand their network, which of course would be great, I think your concerns about what to do when competition comes knocking are unfounded. Aer Lingus's most profitable (European) routes, are ones they compete head-to-head on with Ryanair arguably Europe's most feared airline when it comes to having a competitor. If they can share a route with Ryanair, then I don't think that they need to worry too much about other airlines. The reason they can actually compete with Ryanair on their shared routes (which I might add is almost every European route) is because an established market exists that means there is demand and money to be made. Its unlikely that the main routes served by Aer Lingus will change or that the demand will drop off as many of these markets have been in existence for 50-60 years.
Right now I'll bet you Aer Lingus are more concerned with capturing the more market share on Chicago to Rome(through their DUB hub) than they are about serving Ireland to Poland or the likes. Unless of course a new market develops in Eastern Europe and suddenly loads of retired Irish people with deep pockets buy holiday homes there!!

Again, that just seems a little short sighted to me. What you're basically saying is that Aer Lingus will continue to serve the same markets it has served for 50-60 years with little growth elsewhere unless a huge market develops where they can comfortably make money. 


As for the continued mention of Poland, yes this discussion started off with the cancellation of Warsaw but as I've mentioned there have been failures elsewhere in Europe, some of them being in those supposed bread and butter markets, namely Porto and Liverpool. Both killed off by Ryanair. 


I also used to think Aer Lingus could compete with Ryanair but actually I think they can only share a route rather than compete, they're on routes where there's enough demand to sustain both but the second it comes to competing for business, Aer Lingus is forced to admit defeat. If another carrier like Norwegian were to start Spain, Portugal, Italy and the Canaries would there be room for three carriers? Or would Aer Lingus once again say, "we can make more money elsewhere" and end the routes?


I just think it's fair to question how Aer Lingus can grow its short haul business in its current model. It's not about expanding for the sake of expanding but learning to diversify your business in order to sustain it whether that means reevaluating the fleet, product or costs in order to do that or something else because the current model is stagnant and retreating in other areas.

Locker10a

kevinandrew wrote: »

Locker10a wrote: »

While I agree about wanting to see them expand their network, which of course would be great, I think your concerns about what to do when competition comes knocking are unfounded. Aer Lingus's most profitable (European) routes, are ones they compete head-to-head on with Ryanair arguably Europe's most feared airline when it comes to having a competitor. If they can share a route with Ryanair, then I don't think that they need to worry too much about other airlines. The reason they can actually compete with Ryanair on their shared routes (which I might add is almost every European route) is because an established market exists that means there is demand and money to be made. Its unlikely that the main routes served by Aer Lingus will change or that the demand will drop off as many of these markets have been in existence for 50-60 years.
Right now I'll bet you Aer Lingus are more concerned with capturing the more market share on Chicago to Rome(through their DUB hub) than they are about serving Ireland to Poland or the likes. Unless of course a new market develops in Eastern Europe and suddenly loads of retired Irish people with deep pockets buy holiday homes there!!

Again, that just seems a little short sighted to me. What you're basically saying is that Aer Lingus will continue to serve the same markets it has served for 50-60 years with little growth elsewhere unless a huge market develops where they can comfortably make money. 


As for the continued mention of Poland, yes this discussion started off with the cancellation of Warsaw but as I've mentioned there have been failures elsewhere in Europe, some of them being in those supposed bread and butter markets, namely Porto and Liverpool. Both killed off by Ryanair. 


I also used to think Aer Lingus could compete with Ryanair but actually I think they can only share a route rather than compete, they're on routes where there's enough demand to sustain both but the second it comes to competing for business, Aer Lingus is forced to admit defeat. If another carrier like Norwegian were to start Spain, Portugal, Italy and the Canaries would there be room for three carriers? Or would Aer Lingus once again say, "we can make more money elsewhere" and end the routes?


I just think it's fair to question how Aer Lingus can grow its short haul business in its current model. It's not about expanding for the sake of expanding but learning to diversify your business in order to sustain it whether that means reevaluating the fleet, product or costs in order to do that or something else because the current model is stagnant and retreating in other areas.

Yeah I think you are certainly right about certain markets and a different approach, maybe different aircraft would make it work, that's been said for years and I hope it will happen at some point.
I definatly think Aer Lingus could fend their own corner if say a third airline tried to infringe on the territory of the shamrock and the harp. Amsterdam is a good example!
On a separate note, it appears EasyJet and Norwegian are both too afraid to compete head on with Ryanair. In a way Ryanair are the guard dog protecting both their own and Aer Lingus market!
I agree their tactic recently on Europe has been uninspiring, but they must be happy with it! And boaring as it is they obviously know their bread a butter market well, their fares on European flights have risen and so have their load factors, they seem to be achieving more revenue growth and filling more seats at the same time which is just making more profit.
I'd love to see them serve say the Scandinavian Captials, but for now they are obviously happier to cash in on the the Irish love for secondary Croatian cities! Let's see what happens, and I'm crossing everything for a C-series order which I think would open up new smaller markets to EI

A319er

EI are just very happy to continue to be the star in IAG on
Their small but growing markets, can't beat being profitable as a strategy !
Boring it may be .

Fattes

Locker10a wrote: »

Ryanair approach their business very differently, they're happy to operate flights to the most obscure Eastern European airports because those airports are almost paying them to fly there.
As has already been mentioned it's clear that Aer Lingus are not trying to just expand their European route network for the sake of it. Rather they are adding capacity to routes they know will deliver them good return. So where Helsinki might have been a really nice destination a Dublin to Murcia or Alicante overall will earn them more money. Many airlines take this approach.
Look across the water at London Gatwick and the mammoth base that easyJet have there.
Despite an absolutely huge Polish Market living in that part of London and England, easyJet have one route to Poland, ONE!!!
How many time a day do they fly to Barcelona, Malaga, Alicante?......hmmm that should tell you something. Airlines will fly where they make the most money.
Anyone would swear Aer Lingus hadn't expanded at all. Look at all the transatlantic expansion.
Aer Lingus have found a niche that makes them money,!selling transatlantic flights and connecting transatlantic passengers on to their European well-established city routes, alongside this they sell holidays and flights to the favourite Irish sun holiday destinations. This makes them money and that's what they are in business for.

Now let me see what hope ed that neich market in 2008? It's a good thing the USA is a stable bet with al ist no risk factors to its economy currently!

The point is over reliance on one market is not smart business! Be t EI or anybody else. A weakened or unstable US economy could see EI back to the perilous situation it was in in the late 00's

Tenger

Fattes wrote: »

Now let me see what hope ed that neich market in 2008? It's a good thing the USA is a stable bet with al ist no risk factors to its economy currently!

The point is over reliance on one market is not smart business! Be t EI or anybody else. A weakened or unstable US economy could see EI back to the perilous situation it was in in the late 00's

All eggs in one basket is an issue.

However the situation today is quite different to 2008. Back then EI didn't have a modern hub in Dublin, they ran their shorthaul and long haul networks almost as standalone entities, using Dublin as a T/A hub didn't exist for the EI exec team.
Their target market were Irish going to the US, ex-pats in the US and Irish-Americans. This was the weakness in their model.
According to the COO last week, ~40% of their current traffic is Irish based, ~25% isEuropean, ~25% is US based. (It was in the travelextra video posted a few days ago)