Dublin routes news and general chat

Beersmith

Idbatterim wrote: »

Dublin 11th busiest airport in EU in 2018... pretty bloody impressive!

https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/dublin-airport-was-eu-s-11th-largest-airport-in-2018

Should it be that impressive? I mean we are an island nation so rely on air travel and happen to be lucky to be the nearest to north America. Also DA is the only big airport we have. Other nations have several big ones not so reliant on one. Should we not be even more busy?!

theguzman

Idbatterim wrote: »

Dublin 11th busiest airport in EU in 2018... pretty bloody impressive!

https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/dublin-airport-was-eu-s-11th-largest-airport-in-2018

Where it will stand in the new smaller EU next year will be interesting.

View Profile

Idbatterim wrote:

Dublin 11th busiest airport in EU in 2018... pretty bloody impressive!

Interesting that out of that top 14 we are the only airport not operating multiple runways (bar LGW).

sandbelter

theguzman wrote: »

Where it will stand in the new smaller EU next year will be interesting.

Suspect it should move to ninth with CPH moving to 10th.

This means: Skytrax 4 hubs (FCO, AMS, ORY, CDG)
Oneworld (Current) 2 hubs (MAD,BCE)
Star 3 Hubs (CPH, FRA, MUC)
Plus Dublin mooted for Oneworld.

You can see Oneworld will be at a big disadvantage in the EU post Brexit, hence the motivation for the AA JV.

Irish Steve

View Profile wrote: »

Interesting that out of that top 14 we are the only airport not operating multiple runways (bar LGW).

And I suspect that Dublin is the only airport in that group without a rail connection.

LXFlyer

sandbelter wrote: »

Suspect it should move to ninth with CPH moving to 10th.

This means: Skytrax 4 hubs (FCO, AMS, ORY, CDG)
Oneworld (Current) 2 hubs (MAD,BCE)
Star 3 Hubs (CPH, FRA, MUC)
Plus Dublin mooted for Oneworld.

You can see Oneworld will be at a big disadvantage in the EU post Brexit, hence the motivation for the AA JV.

I assume you mean Skyteam and not Skytrax?

Barcelona is BCN and not BCE!

Also worth including Star Alliance’s ZRH hub given it’s in Schengen.

LXFlyer

Irish Steve wrote: »

And I suspect that Dublin is the only airport in that group without a rail connection.

Barcleona’s rail connections aren’t particularly great and the easiest way to and fro is the Aerobus.

Jamie2k9

sandbelter wrote: »

Suspect it should move to ninth with CPH moving to 10th.

This means: Skytrax 4 hubs (FCO, AMS, ORY, CDG)
Oneworld (Current) 2 hubs (MAD,BCE)
Star 3 Hubs (CPH, FRA, MUC)
Plus Dublin mooted for Oneworld.

You can see Oneworld will be at a big disadvantage in the EU post Brexit, hence the motivation for the AA JV.

Most ridiculous statement ever. JV and Brexit are completely unrelated.

Curb Your Enthusiasm

LXFlyer wrote: »

Barcleona’s rail connections aren’t particularly great and the easiest way to and fro is the Aerobus.

At least they have a rail connection.

I used the airport train at BCN a few months ago and found it perfectly fine. Only cost something like €2 as well and you could use the Metro line from the airport too. So 2x rail connections actually. Metro and mainline.

DUB's public transport options are embarrassing and shows tourists exactly what to expect when it comes to public transport quality and investment in this country unfortunately, before they even step foot in the city.

LXFlyer

Curb Your Enthusiasm wrote: »

At least they have a rail connection.

I used the airport train at BCN a few months ago and found it perfectly fine. Only cost something like €2 as well and you could use the Metro line from the airport too. So 2x rail connections actually. Metro and mainline.

I’m perfectly aware of the connections.

The rail connection isn’t particularly frequent (as you’d expect for an airport) and only serves the low cost older terminal and not the main hub terminal, which does have the metro but which isn’t particularly direct, requiring at least one change to get downtown.

JCX BXC

Irish Steve wrote: »

And I suspect that Dublin is the only airport in that group without a rail connection.

In fairness, Dublin's growth has been multiples of those other airports, so that's somewhat excusable.

No excuse to not expedite plans to build a railway connection to the airport now though!

sandbelter

LXFlyer wrote: »

I assume you mean Skyteam and not Skytrax?

Touche...caught.

sandbelter

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Most ridiculous statement ever. JV and Brexit are completely unrelated.

Hmm uncomfortable truth is more like it:

• Ownership restrictions on IAG's EU and UK divisions to be resolved by Oct 31st.
• A split into IAG UK and IAG EU appears unavoidable, I had though a passive shareholder such as Air Nostrum might be the solution but the EU is also assessing control so it might not as clear cut.
• UK will be outside the EU Open skies.
• Prior to this, US DOJ had real problems with the AA/BA JV due to lack of slots at Heathrow, (which you can familiarize yourself with here:
  https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/atr/legacy/2009/12/30/253575.pdf) which was before the BMI acquisition, open skies is not teh same as open slots though.
• And now the US DOJ, courtesy of JetBlue, has the opportunity to revisit the issue and join the UK competition watchdog.

I could of could also rabbit on about what it's like to stand in a queue to clear UK immigration as a non EU passport holder.....

The point is this,

• A BA/AA leg of the JV post Oct 31st is looking like an assumption as to its existence and with a uncertain time frame for its resolution. Its not clear it will cover the EU until the EU and the UK will sign a post Brexit accord any time soon.
  
  Personally I think that DUB should turn T1 is a pre-cleared Schengen terminal and everything else into T2. Then watch the EU-CA/US connection traffic grow. But yes Brexit does put Oneworld at a disadvantage.

munchkin_utd

sandbelter wrote: »

Hmm uncomfortable truth is more like it:
<snip>
Personally I think that DUB should turn T1 is a pre-cleared Schengen terminal and everything else into T2. Then watch the EU-CA/US connection traffic grow. But yes Brexit does put Oneworld at a disadvantage.

thats actually a great idea but how would it work in practice?

With USA preclearance you have US agents doing the passport checking.
With Schengen preclearance who exactly does the passport checking, as you are dealing with an area with a couple of dozen nations, not just one ?

Tenger

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Most ridiculous statement ever. JV and Brexit are completely unrelated.

I wouldn’t class them as ‘related’ but certainly one will affect the other.
The spectre of a No Deal situation does put some pressure on IAG to get the EI entry into the joint venture sorted out. It was mooted from the IAG takeover so has been coming for a few years now.
OneWorld are also talking about their new partial member status of “OneWorld Connect”.

Stephen Strange

munchkin_utd wrote: »

thats actually a great idea but how would it work in practice?

With USA preclearance you have US agents doing the passport checking.
With Schengen preclearance who exactly does the passport checking, as you are dealing with an area with a couple of dozen nations, not just one ?

Schengen border code as it stands now wouldn't allow that to work. If you have a Schengen visa, you must first enter the country that issued it. ie. If you have a french Schengen visa, you must go to France first.

Edit: as per post below, this is incorrect

ongarboy

DAA press releases are now saying Dublin Airport has almost 200 destinations, previous releases always kept it at around 190. Really impressive that DUB is now gravitating to that psychological benchmark figure of 200!!

embraer170

Stephen Strange wrote: »

Schengen border code as it stands now wouldn't allow that to work. If you have a Schengen visa, you must first enter the country that issued it. ie. If you have a french Schengen visa, you must go to France first.

I don't believe this is accurate. You should get a Schengen visa from the country where you expect to stay the longest. Your initial point of entry is not relevant.

Stephen Strange

embraer170 wrote: »

I don't believe this is accurate. You should get a Schengen visa from the country where you expect to stay the longest. Your initial point of entry is not relevant.

You are correct, I misspoke. Its primary destination, as in longest duration, rather than first country.

Although I think that doesn't apply for long stay visas. Either way, I think it would be too complicated for little benefit

steve-o

munchkin_utd wrote: »

thats actually a great idea but how would it work in practice?

It's a terrible idea. If I'm connecting to a long haul flight in Europe, the last thing I'd want to do is queue enter Schengen before I get on my flight and queue again to get out of it at the other end!

Jamie2k9

Tenger wrote: »

I wouldn’t class them as ‘related’ but certainly one will affect the other.
The spectre of a No Deal situation does put some pressure on IAG to get the EI entry into the joint venture sorted out. It was mooted from the IAG takeover so has been coming for a few years now.
OneWorld are also talking about their new partial member status of “OneWorld Connect”.

Pressure that's debatable. However the JV and OW were always the plan before "Brexit". Deal/No Deal or whatever will not speed up the process nor impact it.

Hmm uncomfortable truth is more like it:
Ownership restrictions on IAG's EU and UK divisions to be resolved by Oct 31st.
A split into IAG UK and IAG EU appears unavoidable, I had though a passive shareholder such as Air Nostrum might be the solution but the EU is also assessing control so it might not as clear cut.
UK will be outside the EU Open skies.
Prior to this, US DOJ had real problems with the AA/BA JV due to lack of slots at Heathrow, (which you can familiarize yourself with here:
https://www.justice.gov/sites/defaul...30/253575.pdf) which was before the BMI acquisition, open skies is not teh same as open slots though.
And now the US DOJ, courtesy of JetBlue, has the opportunity to revisit the issue and join the UK competition watchdog.

I could of could also rabbit on about what it's like to stand in a queue to clear UK immigration as a non EU passport holder.....

The point is this,

• A BA/AA leg of the JV post Oct 31st is looking like an assumption as to its existence and with a uncertain time frame for its resolution. Its not clear it will cover the EU until the EU and the UK will sign a post Brexit accord any time soon.
  
  Personally I think that DUB should turn T1 is a pre-cleared Schengen terminal and everything else into T2. Then watch the EU-CA/US connection traffic grow. But yes Brexit does put Oneworld at a disadvantage.

Still doesn't change the fact JV isn't related.

On the wider point people will still be traveling and Heathrow will ramin one of the world's largest gateways.

sandbelter

Stephen Strange wrote: »

Schengen border code as it stands now wouldn't allow that to work

Maybe as its stands that is correct as I'm not familiar enough with Schengen to provide guidance.

But the is a precedence in the Juxtaposed control currently utilized for Eurostar between FR, NL and the UK, I think with would be worth exploring as a starting point to see if these can be applied to T1, I think Europe would be open to win-win solution. I realise the current french situation complicates this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juxtaposed_controls

I think the key issue is quarantine the legal obligation of Schengen and CTA and build infrastructure accordingly. Specifically customs may present issues, but Ireland being an island I do think it would be possible but it would be a longer term project project.

sandbelter

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Still doesn't change the fact JV isn't related.

On the wider point people will still be traveling and Heathrow will ramin one of the world's largest gateways.

JV - I think with will come down to the definition of markets which the US DOJ adopts.

Heathrow - No doubt about it.

sandbelter

steve-o wrote: »

It's a terrible idea. If I'm connecting to a long haul flight in Europe, the last thing I'd want to do is queue enter Schengen before I get on my flight and queue again to get out of it at the other end!

You raise a valid point, but it can be addressed. looking at at it from experience of an non EU passport holder. They get two stamps one on arrival on departure, my point is to get the one arrival stamp at T1 clearing customs and immigration in your lay over it means when you walk straight out into the EU. You would simply identify at embarkation which bags/passengers are Schengen bound or CTA bound and direct and clear accordingly. essentially cutting out the middle.

It would require logistics to enable seamlessless two way schengen zone" US preclearance. But funny enough this isn't the hard part.

The hard part would be T1 departures and identifying the non EU passport holders (UK passport holders would be the most frequent) to be directed into immigration clearance. But it's not insurmountable. I'd think you find that LH, KL, IB, TP, SK and AF would all be enthusiastic for it as it would enable Dub to be more effectuve spoke for their spokes. Suspect KL/LH would be the big winners.

So the idea is once entering the T1 there are yes there are subsequent police security checks at border to confirm identity but in a intra-schengen flight there's no immigration/customs checks (except current french controls). Same as if you connected for an EU (except France) flight in FRA, AMS or CDG.

circular flexing

WOW announced they are not going to run KEF-YVR route afterall so DUB-KEF-YVR is off too. Route was only due to start in June.

LXFlyer

circular flexing wrote: »

WOW announced they are not going to run KEF-YVR route afterall so DUB-KEF-YVR is off too. Route was only due to start in June.

That wasn’t ever a route from Dublin - it was a connection at Keflavik.

By that logic I assume you’re going to inform us of every potential connection that’s dropped out of Heathrow, Frankfurt, Amsterdam etc.?

Noxegon

LXFlyer wrote: »

That wasn’t ever a route from Dublin - it was a connection at Keflavik.

For whatever reason the Irish media did in fact report every single Wow connection via Keflavik. I've never understood why.

LXFlyer

Noxegon wrote: »

For whatever reason the Irish media did in fact report every single Wow connection via Keflavik. I've never understood why.

A very proactive PR machine and journalists swallowing the story without asking questions.

Marcusm

sandbelter wrote: »

You raise a valid point, but it can be addressed. looking at at it from experience of an non EU passport holder. They get two stamps one on arrival on departure, my point is to get the one arrival stamp at T1 clearing customs and immigration in your lay over it means when you walk straight out into the EU. You would simply identify at embarkation which bags/passengers are Schengen bound or CTA bound and direct and clear accordingly. essentially cutting out the middle.

It would require logistics to enable seamlessless two way schengen zone" US preclearance. But funny enough this isn't the hard part.

The hard part would be T1 departures and identifying the non EU passport holders (UK passport holders would be the most frequent) to be directed into immigration clearance. But it's not insurmountable. I'd think you find that LH, KL, IB, TP, SK and AF would all be enthusiastic for it as it would enable Dub to be more effectuve spoke for their spokes. Suspect KL/LH would be the big winners.

So the idea is once entering the T1 there are yes there are subsequent police security checks at border to confirm identity but in a intra-schengen flight there's no immigration/customs checks (except current french controls). Same as if you connected for an EU (except France) flight in FRA, AMS or CDG.

Too many routes out of Dublin have insufficient connecting capacity to make this work where there are delays or breakdowns in service. For example, say you are arriving into Dublin with a 90 minute connection onto a route with a single sector per day. Miss it and you're hanging around for a further 24 hours - who is responsible for accommodation. and F&B cots. You can guarantee that the airlines won't wear it.

In the that it was established, it could not be staffed by Inis but by a Shengen area immigration service (which doesn't exist AFAIK). Staffing issues will arise on a regular basis unless there is extreme redundancy built in vis a vis the number of Ireland based staff.

WishUWereHere

Not sure if this has been reported yet - apologies if it has.

https://www.check-in.dk/danmark-har-faaet-et-nyt-flyselskab/

Denmark has got a new airline
By: Ole Kirchert Christensen in Ruter February 14, 2019 Last updated: February 14, 2019 at. 13:34 Print Print

Great Dane Airlines is the name of a new airline that will offer charter and scheduled flights with Embraer E195 aircraft. Opens three regional routes from Aalborg Airport.

North Jutland travelers have long wanted a number of direct flights, and this wish is now met by Great Dane Airlines, a newly established airline based at Aalborg Airport.

Today, the company holds a press conference at Aalborg Airport, where the founders Thomas Hugo Møller and Duc Huy Ngyuen have presented a start-up on June 14 with charter flights for Bravo Tours. Here you have to fly from Aalborg, Billund and Copenhagen to Mallorca, Rhodes, Crete and Varna on Bulgaria's Black Sea coast.

The charter flights are supplemented with their own routes from Aalborg to Edinburgh, Dublin and Nice, and on these routes, among others, Aller-owned Nilles Rejser bought a number of seats, so the airline has a solid base in the economy before the aircraft goes on its wings.

“We have identified a sub-capacity in the Northern European market for charter flights and regional scheduled flights with 100 to 120-person jets. This gave the idea to start an airline with strong North Jutland roots, ”says Thomas Hugo Møller, who becomes CEO of the new airline.

Two Embraer aircraft
Great Dane Airlines currently has an application with the Danish Transport, Construction and Housing Agency in relation to acquiring an operating license (Air Operator Certificate), which is the prerequisite for being able to operate commercial aviation.

The company has leased two Embraer ERJ-195AR jets with space for 118 passengers and a range of 4,260 kilometers, which is 450 kilometers further than from Aalborg to Gran Canaria.

Ticket prices start at 499 kroner for a one-way ticket from Aalborg to Nice, while the cheapest ticket to Dublin and Edinburgh will be 599 kroner. In addition, luggage and seat options are added if traveling on a Light ticket type, while Full Flex includes luggage.

The ticket sales start on March 5 at the company's website, and the airline's products will also be offered through the GDS company Amadeus and other sales channels.

Great Dane Airlines has got a sales office at Aalborg Airport, and on the first floor a control center is set up for operation of the aircraft.