Home heating automation

olestoepoke

deezell wrote: »

Sorry, can't help there, but have these facts to hand if you get someone out to take a look, or email them some of the schematics, see if they know what they're on about. I can understand tradesmen being wary of something like the Heatgenie, presented as it is as a magical 'Black box' solution, when internally it's just a few pumps, pipes, stat and a heat exchanger,(and also a passive thermal operated safety drain sensor and valve).It's all well within the theoretical knowledge of an apprentice. Same goes for the NRG link exchanger, a modest plate exchanger, 2 pumps, a pipe stat , wired to turn on both pumps when the stove water exceeds set point. Nothing there that a plumber couldn't understand. A good one could even put it together himself, but given their hourly rates, it might well be true that they'd need €800 to cover parts and labour.(this is actually part of he sales pitch for the device). Here's the full file on the device,
https://www.nrgawareness.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/NRG-Link-Dual-Pressure-Interlinking-System-Installation-and-Manual-1.pdf
If a plumber or CH installer can't figure out how to go about the job after reading this, I give up.

Thanks again, One last question would you have a preference between the stystemlink and NRG given that they are both in and around the same price?
Thanks

deezell

olestoepoke wrote: »

Thanks again, One last question would you have a preference between the stystemlink and NRG given that they are both in and around the same price?
Thanks

The systemlink does have the passive (non electrical) safety remote valve to physically dump overheated water from the stove system in the even of power failure while a large stove is lit. Have you checked if you haveca spare coil on your cylinder? Without this you will need a heat sink, such as open bathroom or landing radiator connected to the stove system to dissipate heat. Am I correct in saying your gas boiler is a closed system? You also say your system was left 'ready for a stove. Is there already a blender/manifold? A heat exchanger. 'Stove Ready' to me would be capped flow and return pipes, straight the boiler, and no more than a stove circulation pump required. Highly unlikely that much redundant kit was installed
In terms of choice, I went with the NRG Zone 4 manifold, well made and tidy to install. My oil boiler was vented, didn't need a heat exchanger, but as you need a manifold and possibly an exchanger, you could haggle a price for both from NRG Awareness, or just get a heating company to give you an overall quote. Contact NRG, get the names of known installers of their kit in your area.

olestoepoke

deezell wrote: »

The systemlink does have the passive (non electrical) safety remote valve to physically dump overheated water from the stove system in the even of power failure while a large stove is lit. Have you checked if you haveca spare coil on your cylinder? Without this you will need a heat sink, such as open bathroom or landing radiator connected to the stove system to dissipate heat. Am I correct in saying your gas boiler is a closed system? You also say your system was left 'ready for a stove. Is there already a blender/manifold? A heat exchanger. 'Stove Ready' to me would be capped flow and return pipes, straight the boiler, and no more than a stove circulation pump required. Highly unlikely that much redundant kit was installed
In terms of choice, I went with the NRG Zone 4 manifold, well made and tidy to install. My oil boiler was vented, didn't need a heat exchanger, but as you need a manifold and possibly an exchanger, you could haggle a price for both from NRG Awareness, or just get a heating company to give you an overall quote. Contact NRG, get the names of known installers of their kit in your area.

Thanks again. I had my whole house plumbed by a great guy who was very experienced. His preference was Systemlink and thats what he intended to use. The house was completely re-plumber, new Worcester boiler, new larger cylinder everything new pipes included. There are two pipes in my hot press that say stove return and stove flow. These two pipes run under the landing floor and stop about 5 ft into my living room and are capped. Unfortunately, a couple of years passed and the plumber emigrated to Canada. So I need someone to finish the job, would a good plumber with no experience in theses systems be able to do it? Thanks again for your time and help its very much appreciated

deezell

olestoepoke wrote: »

Thanks again. I had my whole house plumbed by a great guy who was very experienced. His preference was Systemlink and thats what he intended to use. The house was completely re-plumber, new Worcester boiler, new larger cylinder everything new pipes included. There are two pipes in my hot press that say stove return and stove flow. These two pipes run under the landing floor and stop about 5 ft into my living room and are capped. Unfortunately, a couple of years passed and the plumber emigrated to Canada. So I need someone to finish the job, would a good plumber with no experience in theses systems be able to do it? Thanks again for your time and help its very much appreciated

A good plumber will figure it. He's looking to see where those capped pipes are linked, and if your current system is sealed or vented. If vented, direct connection possible via a blender or 'neutraliser' tank or manifold. There needs to be a thermal heatsink for the stove, (open radiator or gravity coil on the cylinder). A heat exchanger is required if the current system is sealed.

chuck eastwood

deezell wrote: »

A good plumber will figure it. He's looking to see where those capped pipes are linked, and if your current system is sealed or vented. If vented, direct connection possible via a blender or 'neutraliser' tank or manifold. There needs to be a thermal heatsink for the stove, (open radiator or gravity coil on the cylinder). A heat exchanger is required if the current system is sealed.

Speaking from experience, I have an open rad and gravity fed coil about 4 foot fro the stove. It's not enough to dissipate the heat with a decent fire going. It's really only a safety thing if you have power failures. This system needs to be set up so a zone is brought in when the stat hits a certain temp.

deezell

chuck eastwood wrote: »

Speaking from experience, I have an open rad and gravity fed coil about 4 foot fro the stove. It's not enough to dissipate the heat with a decent fire going. It's really only a safety thing if you have power failures. This system needs to be set up so a zone is brought in when the stat hits a certain temp.

That of course is what happens. There are obviously thermostat operated pumps and links to zones as well in the system. None of these will operate though during a power cut, so it behoves the householder to damp down the stove in this instance. Some of the larger stoves have outputs in double digits of Kilowatts, and if not damped would be beyond the heat sinking capacity of a cylinder coil or an open rad. There are a number of options, such as passive thermostat valves to vent the system water to a drain, or open to a gravity zone upstairs. Also, an inexpensive ups (uninterruptible power supply) could be wired to supply the stove pump, and at least one zone valve. Belt and braces solutions, you'd hope a large stove fully stoked would not be left running in a vacated home.

chuck eastwood

deezell wrote: »

That of course is what happens. There are obviously thermostat operated pumps and links to zones as well in the system. None of these will operate though during a power cut, so it behaves the householder to damp down the stove in this instance. Some of the larger stoves have outputs in double digits of Kilowatts, and if not damped would be beyond the heat sinking capacity of a cylinder coil or an open rad. There are a number of options, such as passive thermostat valves to vent the system water to a drain, or open to a gravity zone upstairs. Also, an inexpensive ups (uninterruptible power supply) could be wired to supply the stove pump, and at least one zone valve. Belt and braces solutions, you'd hope a large stove fully stoked would not be left running in a vacated home.

But that's thing thing with stoves. From time to time people have to leave them fully stoked and all you can do is close off the air supply. Either way it's pretty unlikely to be unlucky enough to have a power cut when your stove is at full whack and you have just left the house. Also I've seen ups used in computers I've never seen or heard of one large enough being used on a domestic system to back up a stove pump

olestoepoke

Any Idea what the ballpark cost would be to have the plumbing done for the stove, given that its ready to go in the living room?
Just the plumbing no work needed around the fireplace as ill be doing that myself. thanks guys

championc

Does anyone know as to what are the physical differences between the Tado v3 and v3+ internet bridge ? Is there an identifying model number or some minute physical characteristic, since they appear to look identical.

championc

Does anyone know as to what are the physical differences between the Tado v3 and v3+ internet bridge ? Is there an identifying model number or some minute physical characteristic, since they appear to look identical.

deezell

chuck eastwood wrote: »

But that's thing thing with stoves. From time to time people have to leave them fully stoked and all you can do is close off the air supply. Either way it's pretty unlikely to be unlucky enough to have a power cut when your stove is at full whack and you have just left the house. Also I've seen ups used in computers I've never seen or heard of one large enough being used on a domestic system to back up a stove pump

You can get ups in any size you want, while most people think of using them with PCs, they will power low consumption motors. There are plenty of circulation motors with efficient electronic power control and really low power consumption, such as this Grundfoss Alpha
https://kotly.com/gb/86-central-heating-pump-grundfos-alpha2-25-40-180.html
Adaptive power control or manual can be set with power consumptions of 5-45 watts. I have 4 of this electronic type, but different brand, in my refurb, originally with an eye to having stove heating ups protection as a fall back with two pumps running. I have generator backup anyway, so no real urgency setting up ups on the pumps.
Setting up alternate power for central heating stove pumps is probably a DIY or nerdy thing, you might have a car battery mains inverter like this,
https://www.screwfix.ie/p/ring-power-source-inverter-single-socket-12v/51612
This will power a circulation pump on a low setting for as as long as it takes to keep the stove heat circulated. I had used one of these back in the day when I'd occassional power outages, and the only CH in many houses was a stove, so some way of turning the pump was very desirable.
A third alternative is a 12V DC circulation pump, quite inexpensive and often used in solar systems which can't be turned off when the power fails and the sun is shining. These pumps are cheap and can be plumbed and wired to a 12v battery as a back up to a mains pump, enough to give emergency circulation during an outage. Used a bit on barges with stoves I've read, but not my cup of tea as it involves additional plumbing if its not really suitable as a permanent replacement for the main stove pump.
Where I live we get a lot of unscheduled power cuts, (2 half days last week), so the generator had more than earned it's keep over the years.

deezell

olestoepoke wrote: »

Any Idea what the ballpark cost would be to have the plumbing done for the stove, given that its ready to go in the living room?
Just the plumbing no work needed around the fireplace as ill be doing that myself. thanks guys

If you require a blending manifold, heat exchanger, pump(s) and stats, and also a head tank if your current system is sealed and not head tank fed, it's going to be maybe a grand for parts, so not cheap by the time you add labour. If an exchanger is not required as you might already have a vented system, it will be less, just pumps, stats, blending manifold and various other parts. Impossible to say without having someone assess your current system, but the capped pipes to the living room will save a lot of labour. You really need to find out where and how these connect to your current system.

deezell

championc wrote: »

Does anyone know as to what are the physical differences between the Tado v3 and v3+ internet bridge ? Is there an identifying model number or some minute physical characteristic, since they appear to look identical.

V3 and V3+ bridge are the same, but on installation, V3 will use the old app, and offer an upgrade to v3+.
http://support.tado.com/en/articles/3387241-what-s-the-difference-between-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v3-products-and-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v1-v2-v3-products

championc

deezell wrote: »

V3 and V3+ bridge are the same, but on installation, V3 will use the old app, and offer an upgrade to v3+.
http://support.tado.com/en/articles/3387241-what-s-the-difference-between-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v3-products-and-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v1-v2-v3-products

I've bought online what I (and seller) believe to be a v3 (since it includes the options that are subscription based on the v3+). The box is grey rather than the largely white with orange.

So I'll know when I register it ?

championc

deezell wrote: »

V3 and V3+ bridge are the same, but on installation, V3 will use the old app, and offer an upgrade to v3+.
http://support.tado.com/en/articles/3387241-what-s-the-difference-between-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v3-products-and-the-v3-app-that-comes-with-v1-v2-v3-products

I've bought online what I (and seller) believe to be a v3 (since it includes the options that are subscription based on the v3+). The box is grey rather than the largely white with orange.

So I'll know when I register it ?

deezell

championc wrote: »

I've bought online what I (and seller) believe to be a v3 (since it includes the options that are subscription based on the v3+). The box is grey rather than the largely white with orange.

So I'll know when I register it ?

Yes, you will be offered upgrade to the new app at some stage.

xckjoo

Following on from the Tado post in the bargains thread.


Would one of these be a good replacement for a rather basic heating set up of Riello 40 oil boiler that heats the whole house (no zone separation at the moment) and the hot water tank and an immersion heater for top ups of hot water? The tank is well insulated (replaced recently) but the hot water leaches upstairs in the summer when there's no heat running. Currently controlled by analog timers (one for the heat and one for the immersion) and a Sink/Bath+On/Off switch. No thermostat currently

Am I right that the app offers the basic functionality without a subscription? I've home-assistant running in the house, but the app would be useful for the other family members that won't want to near it.


Edit: Jesus the reviews for the V3+ subscription are scathing . I don't think I'm too bothered by it. I'll either not use the features, roll it myself with home-assistant, or just support them through a yearly subscription. Is the product good overall? More interested in if it's well built and high quality

championc

While bought a v3+ starter pack, I bought a v3 internet bridge on eBay with the plan of getting the subscription features without paying the subscription. I'm not sure if open window detection came with the v3.

I've currently installed the TRV's as standalone devices (awaiting delivery of the v3 bridge - wish AddressPal would get a move on !!) and I can certainly confirm that they are very accurate.

While I have a zone valve to isolate upstairs, I can now see more of a need for heating the north facing upstairs and downstairs rather than all downstairs without the upstairs.

Remember, radiators need TRV valves on them. Tado just replaces the heads only.

john_doe.

Just like to add for anyone using the Drayton Wiser System :
There is an old version of the app where you can see signal strength for the individual TRVs . It's version 2.10.1 on Android.

I've downgraded to this version for troubleshooting. No idea why they removed it in new versions of app.

I'm having a lot of dropouts but least now I can work on positioning the boosters via the signal strength.

Marlow

Not sure, if it has been mentioned, but I've moved my entire home to the AVM Fritz!DECT 301 TRVs.

They can be screwed straight onto the standard Honeywell valves, but a lot of adapters are available. One type Danfoss adapter comes by default.

They are DECT operated (no cloud, no subscription), but you need an AVM Fritz!Box router to control them centrally. Lots of flexibility in the system. And because DECT is 1.8 GHz, it won't interfere with WiFi.

There are also DECT switched sockets with the same amount of programming possible and build-in temperature sensor, but they are all the continental Schuko type. Not available in 3-pin UK plug.

Now, that sorted out my radiators. But my immersion and the 4 zones in the house still are on what I would call a make-shift DIY system.

For that I've looked at Velbus .. some real interesting options there: https://www.velbus.eu/

Here's is a basic demo video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCdLmLPhHFU

Their TRVs would have been no use to me anyhow, as they are wired, but I can certainly build a very usable system for control of the boiler, 4 zones and the immersion. And it's all fully accessible using OpenHAB.

So is the whole smart home implementation of the AVM Fritz!Box routers.

/M

xl500

Marlow wrote: »

Not sure, if it has been mentioned, but I've moved my entire home to the AVM Fritz!DECT 301 TRVs.

They can be screwed straight onto the standard Honeywell valves, but a lot of adapters are available. One type Danfoss adapter comes by default.

They are DECT operated (no cloud, no subscription), but you need an AVM Fritz!Box router to control them centrally. Lots of flexibility in the system. And because DECT is 1.8 GHz, it won't interfere with WiFi.

There are also DECT switched sockets with the same amount of programming possible and build-in temperature sensor, but they are all the continental Schuko type. Not available in 3-pin UK plug.

Now, that sorted out my radiators. But my immersion and the 4 zones in the house still are on what I would call a make-shift DIY system.

For that I've looked at Velbus .. some real interesting options there: https://www.velbus.eu/

Here's is a basic demo video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCdLmLPhHFU

Their TRVs would have been no use to me anyhow, as they are wired, but I can certainly build a very usable system for control of the boiler, 4 zones and the immersion. And it's all fully accessible using OpenHAB.

So is the whole smart home implementation of the AVM Fritz!Box routers.

/M

For the Fritz Smart Valves do you have a central controller like to set schedules etc

deezell

xl500 wrote: »

For the Fritz Smart Valves do you have a central controller like to set schedules etc

Control of the TRV valves is available via the router web interface Fritz smart home menu. TRVs also have a full led display. There is no formal controller, although the Fritz 400 is a stand alone switch with a built in temperature sensor, looks for all the world like a wall stat, and it can be used to control Fritz TRVs and smart sockets. There is no dedicated interface in the Fritz system to call boilers, though this could be achieved using the fritz 210 smart socket, you would need a continental plug convertor to plug it in, and a continental plug lead to take the switched power to the boiler terminals.
The Fritz router is excellent, I've had one for years, after installation, it's built in Dect network found my two cordless dect phones I've had since the 90's, ancient things, and now they are integrated into the house telephone system, not just to answer calls from outside, but to call each other, the wired hall phone, and my mobile via an app which makes it a landline extension off the router. If I put my mobile on a vpn to the Fritz box, it stays active away from the home, so calls to my landline ring my mobile even if abroad, and I can ring out the same way.
Would I use the Fritz as my home heating controller? No is the short answer. It's fairly obvious that they have stayed away from boiler control technologies and interfaces Why even bother with a TRV product then? Because in Germany, community heating is common, whereby circulation of the heating water is controlled on an estate basis, an apartment block say. All you need is to open and close the rads valves. Hence Tado, German firm, also sell their TRVs and bridge as a starter kit, with no mechanism for boiler firing. I cant see the point in cobbling together a partial system. I wouldn't expect my smart coffee machine, (If I had one,) to be concerned with the workings of my heating, though it could doubtlessly interfere, (just made a coffee, then turn up heat of coffee favourite drinking place, etc.)
For the average user, you want something that is complete in its features. It's fun to tinker with third party apps and hardware, IFTTT, Sonoff relays etc, but it's inconvenient to have to depend on them.
The idea of having to log on to the AVM router comprehensive interface, or the MyFritz interface, just to check a schedule grates with me. I spend enough time on it messing with VPN, remote access ports to satellite box, telephone call lists and contacts (it can harvest your mobile for the dect phones), and also as a NAS for Smart TV and Sat box. I keep the smart heating independent. It just works better that way.

Marlow

That was a hard read. You really need to format your posts.

deezell wrote: »

There is no formal controller, although the Fritz 400 is a stand alone switch with a built in temperature sensor, looks for all the world like a wall stat, and it can be used to control Fritz TRVs and smart sockets. There is no dedicated interface in the Fritz system to call boilers, though this could be achieved using the fritz 210 smart socket, you would need a continental plug convertor to plug it in, and a continental plug lead to take the switched power to the boiler terminals.

The dedicated interface is the web configuration of the router. AVM have always pride themselves, that this is a system, that stays within your home. For security reason more than others.

And yes, you have various ways to control the heat of the TRVs: schedules, using the TRV itself, the myFritz app, the Fritz!DECT 440 when it finally is launched and their own DECT phones through the Smart home menu.

Also you are wrong on the Fritz!DECT 400. That one has no temperature sensor.

deezell wrote: »

Because in Germany, community heating is common, whereby circulation of the heating water is controlled on an estate basis, an apartment block say. All you need is to open and close the rads valves.

It is not quite that simple. Because also in Germany boiler heating is not uncommon either.

And when you have your traditional TRVs, they can't signal a heat call either. They don't have to. The heat call comes from your zone thermostat.

So having the thermostats from one company and the remainder of the system from another is not really a problem.

/M

xckjoo

Marlow wrote: »

That was a hard read. You really need to format your posts.



The dedicated interface is the web configuration of the router. AVM have always pride themselves, that this is a system, that stays within your home. For security reason more than others.

And yes, you have various ways to control the heat of the TRVs: schedules, using the TRV itself, the myFritz app, the Fritz!DECT 440 when it finally is launched and their own DECT phones through the Smart home menu.

Also you are wrong on the Fritz!DECT 400. That one has no temperature sensor.



It is not quite that simple. Because also in Germany boiler heating is not uncommon either.

And when you have your traditional TRVs, they can't signal a heat call either. They don't have to. The heat call comes from your zone thermostat.

So having the thermostats from one company and the remainder of the system from another is not really a problem.

/M

Are you not completely tied to Fritz! brand routers or can you control it some other way?

Marlow

xckjoo wrote: »

Are you not completely tied to Fritz! brand routers or can you control it some other way?

You are tied to have the Fritz!Box router alright. But that does not have to be your main router.

And to be honest, if you just want one for controls in the middle of your network, a Fritz!Box 7390 (2 generations old, but top end model back then) can be got for 30-40 EUR on eBay.

The router completely integrates with OpenHAB though, so you can control it any way you want from there.

/M

deezell

Marlow wrote: »

That was a hard read. You really need to format your posts.

Charming. Hard facts are sometimes hard to swallow, reread it.

The dedicated interface is the web configuration of the router

This is not a rebuttal of my statement above it, "There is no formal controller, although the Fritz 400 440 is a stand alone switch with a built in temperature sensor, looks for all the world like a wall stat...." My statement remains true. The Fritz box interface can not connect to the boiler, and can not of itself operate the heating.

Also you are wrong on the Fritz!DECT 400. That one has no temperature sensor.

Simple typo, I was referring to the Dect 440, this one. Even if it's eventually launched, the device has no means of controlling the boiler directly or indirectly. it has no relay or contacts. AVM do not do a boiler relay, unless you count their smart sockets as equivalent.

.....Because also in Germany boiler heating is not uncommon either....And when you have your traditional TRVs, they can't signal a heat call either. They don't have to. The heat call comes from your zone thermostat.

Exactly, so you need a connected controller, wired stat or its relay, something to have the boiler running. But get this, your Smart TRV is now only as good as a dumb one. If it opens to heat the room, but the zone stat/controller/mechanical boiler timer/whatever is OFF, the room will not heat. Not smart.

So having the thermostats from one company and the remainder of the system from another is not really a problem.

...Except it would be for a lot of people, I wouldn't advise it for the bulk of readers of this thread. They want something that works from the box.
Btw, once you state things like "the Fritz!DECT 440 when it finally is launched", that's a cue to keep away. Products need to mature, be tried and tested before you can even begin to encourage uptake.
I don't want to sound harsh, though you deserve it for for your put-down opener in your reply, but I've had the Fritz router for 6 or more years. I love it for what it can do. I watched and waited as they promised smart home heating wonders, and the best they can come up with are a few standalone TRVs, requiring the use of OTHER smart heating devices to get anything like the functionality of a Tado, Drayton, Netamo or other Stat and TRV installation.
Now if you just want a few programmable TRVs, to add to an existing system, which could be zoned or not, timer only or just have a wall mechanical stat, then the AVM are as good as any if you don't mind being tied to the router for an interface (their Smart home App is also still only a promise). If you want your TRVs to be a part of a current smart system, then AVM don't do that yet. They have no basic smart thermostat system on offer that can fire a boiler and open zone valves. the Dect 440 is just a 4 port wall switch with a temperature sensor. It is not a heating thermostat. It comes nowhere near the completeness of a Tado, Hive, Netatmo, Nest or or other dedicated heating control system. Good luck with your experimentation, it's to be encouraged. There is great satisfaction in building something from scratch, or from hybrid ideas and sources. It's not for everyone though, and ordinary users need to know the challenges and shortcomings of anything that's proposed here, before they invest. That was the purpose of my reply, to frame your project in the context of it's ability to deliver expected minimum functionality. It was not a personal comment, (unlike your rejoiner), simply a synopsis on the current position of AVM Fritz in the smart heating world. They should stick to routers.

Marlow

deezell wrote: »

Charming. Hard facts are sometimes hard to swallow, reread it.

Jaysis. Try to read your two posts. You cram everything in one big chunk. Nobody is going to read it.

This was not an attack on yourself. It was feedback and advise.

And in regards, what people want or don't want, everyone has to make up their own mind. But you at least have to give them the options and tell them what systems are out there. How would you know, what suits to each individual person ?

I looked at lets say Tado, Nest and Hive and I wouldn't go near it. For the security aspect alone. I looked at a few others, too.

I've also looked at controlling my circulation pumps for the 4 zones using the AVM DECT system/switched sockets, but didn't take that route, because there is no easy way to implement the boiler call. For the TRVs, it suits my needs perfectly.

I even have the electric plinth heaters in the kitchen on AVM DECT!210 sockets and tied in that way. Something a lot of the other system may struggle with.

/M

deezell

Marlow wrote: »

I looked at lets say Tado, Nest and Hive and I wouldn't go near it. For the security aspect alone.....
/M

This snippet is sufficient to illustrate the difference in our approach. I do clear comprehensive researched facts. Seriously interested readers will take the time and trouble to digest. It's what I do when researching and reading informed but often long and detailed instructions. I leave sound bytes to the social warriors. Your statement above has no information, just an unfounded and unsupported opinion. Throwaway remarks, full of condemnation, nothing to back it up.

Marlow

deezell wrote: »

I do clear comprehensive researched facts.

As thorough, as you researched the Fritz!DECT 440, then confused it with another switch (misspelled or mistaken), and completely missed to mention the fact, that it's actually not available yet in your first post ? Just saying.

I could poke further holes in the content of your first response, but nobody will read it, as it's just too hard to make anything out, when it's not formatted in a sensible way.

/M

xckjoo

xckjoo wrote: »

Following on from the Tado post in the bargains thread.


Would one of these be a good replacement for a rather basic heating set up of Riello 40 oil boiler that heats the whole house (no zone separation at the moment) and the hot water tank and an immersion heater for top ups of hot water? The tank is well insulated (replaced recently) but the hot water leaches upstairs in the summer when there's no heat running. Currently controlled by analog timers (one for the heat and one for the immersion) and a Sink/Bath+On/Off switch. No thermostat currently

Am I right that the app offers the basic functionality without a subscription? I've home-assistant running in the house, but the app would be useful for the other family members that won't want to near it.


Edit: Jesus the reviews for the V3+ subscription are scathing . I don't think I'm too bothered by it. I'll either not use the features, roll it myself with home-assistant, or just support them through a yearly subscription. Is the product good overall? More interested in if it's well built and high quality

Update to my own post in case someone has a similar set up (boiler with simple timer and immersion with simple timer).

I got in touch to Tado to see if their kit could do what I wanted and it would only be able to control one of the interfaces; either the boiler or the immersion. I was hoping to be able to control both but maybe that device doesn't exist. Does anyone know of something that'll do this?


My other alternative would be to just go with Tado for the heating and something like a Shelly wireless relay for the immersion. I'd like to get a smarter immersion for the summer months