Limerick rugby experience

dave 27

Sorry if this is mentioned somewhere here but has anyone heard anymore about this? We should dedicate this thread to the development and any pictures and renders etc posted here

bigpink

Strange its not in Thomond park i think they a musem there already

Cookiemunster

Constructions not due to start before early 2018. http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/sport/227369/new-10-million-rugby-experience-for-limerick.html

mart 23

Any news regarding the status of the Rugby Museum . I dont think any planning application has been sent to the council . Would the loss of the RWC bid have any effect on it .

Glenomra

mart 23 wrote: »

Any news regarding the status of the Rugby Museum . I dont think any planning application has been sent to the council . Would the loss of the RWC bid have any effect on it .

Possibly. Also there appears to be a reduced public interest in rugby games at the moment. I
notice it my local pub, fewer conversations about the game and less people looking at televised games. One can only hype up certain games, for instance Munster v Leinster, so many times before saturation seeps in especially when teams field weakened sidrs. Also, the premier league sucks virtually all the oxygen out of Irish sport. So I am not sure about the viability of the proposed venture. I hope that I am wrong as it would be good for the city.

diusmr8a504cvk

Isn't there some Rugby Experience at the Parnell Plaza?

pigtown

According to a tweet from the Limerick Leader this is going to be over 7 floors. That's around the height of the George Hotel. It could be difficult to get planning permission for this with all the 4 story Georgian buildings that surround the site.

mdmix

7 floors seems excessive, sounds like a great deal of work. heres an old image of the proposed site - https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzjrAUqWIAAY0Jg.jpg:large

fans visiting thomond park for matches would obviously be there main audience, but i could see them earning their bread and butter with school tours from limerick and beyond. there certainly is a market for this kind of place, but i don't know how strong that is exactly. having a world cup to look forward to would have made the idea much more solid.

Townie_P

mdmix wrote: »

7 floors seems excessive, sounds like a great deal of work. heres an old image of the proposed site - https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzjrAUqWIAAY0Jg.jpg:large

fans visiting thomond park for matches would obviously be there main audience, but i could see them earning their bread and butter with school tours from limerick and beyond. there certainly is a market for this kind of place, but i don't know how strong that is exactly. having a world cup to look forward to would have made the idea much more solid.

Not convinced myself of how this would survive in the long term. How many rugby tourists are out there? Let's call a spade a spade, rugby is not the common man's game. It's a minority sport relative to GAA and soccer. Beyond certain urban areas in Limerick and nationwide, it wouldn't have much of a grassroots or traditional support. I've never seen the country grinding to a halt or wildly celebrating rugby success in the same way that soccer or GAA success is celebrated. A dedicated rugby only museum is a nice idea for Limerick, but as a money making venture it's a pretty niche market. A bit like the Munster rugby store in town, I wouldn't see it lasting long term as I do not think it would get the visitor numbers to sustain it. I just don't believe the interest in rugby is really there in the general population. For example, is a rugby museum going to do similar numbers to the Hunt Museum? I highly doubt it.

A Limerick sports museum would be a different story as it would appeal to a much larger clientele. GAA history, Limerick soccer's European history, boxing history including world champion Andy Lee and the many other Limerick related athletes would make for an interesting collection. Or go one further and have a Limerick museum which would incorporate sport, music, film, arts, culture and people. You'd be throwing the likes of Richard Harris, The Cranberries, Frank McCourt, Terry Wogan, De Valera, Sean South etc in to the mix then. To me that would be viable in terms of pulling in numbers and surviving long term.

Cookiemunster

A couple of inaccuracies there Townie. The Munster Rugby Store didn't close due to lack of interest. Lifestyle took over the sale of Munster apparel and it was decided to let the lease lapse as they already had multiple outlets around Limerick selling the same gear.
Also the country doesn't grind to a halt for GAA. Certain counties might around All Ireland final time, but as there's not national team (compromise rules isn't a sport) the whole county doesn't.
The 6 nations and Ireland matches in particular have some of the highest sport TV audiences year on year in Ireland. During the last world cup 1.6m people watched the France game. A Wales v Australia game had 800K viewers.
While rugby is a smaller sport than GAA and football, it's growing rapidly in non traditional rugby areas.

washman3

Townie_P wrote: »

Not convinced myself of how this would survive in the long term. How many rugby tourists are out there? Let's call a spade a spade, rugby is not the common man's game. It's a minority sport relative to GAA and soccer. Beyond certain urban areas in Limerick and nationwide, it wouldn't have much of a grassroots or traditional support. I've never seen the country grinding to a halt or wildly celebrating rugby success in the same way that soccer or GAA success is celebrated. A dedicated rugby only museum is a nice idea for Limerick, but as a money making venture it's a pretty niche market. A bit like the Munster rugby store in town, I wouldn't see it lasting long term as I do not think it would get the visitor numbers to sustain it. I just don't believe the interest in rugby is really there in the general population. For example, is a rugby museum going to do similar numbers to the Hunt Museum? I highly doubt it.

A Limerick sports museum would be a different story as it would appeal to a much larger clientele. GAA history, Limerick soccer's European history, boxing history including world champion Andy Lee and the many other Limerick related athletes would make for an interesting collection. Or go one further and have a Limerick museum which would incorporate sport, music, film, arts, culture and people. You'd be throwing the likes of Richard Harris, The Cranberries, Frank McCourt, Terry Wogan, De Valera, Sean South etc in to the mix then. To me that would be viable in terms of pulling in numbers and surviving long term.

Great post. You've hit the nail on the head. What's needed is a Limerick museum that would incorporate all aspects.
Limerick soccer for instance has a very interesting history coupled with the Markets Field which has hosted soccer, championship hurling and international rugby in bygone days.
How many people know that 2 brothers from West Limerick won Olympic medals for long jump/hop skip and jump while competing under the USA flag.
A local guy (their distant relative I think) compiled a brilliant book about their exploits.
Or famous Grand National winning jockey John Burke was born and raised in county Limerick before his family relocated to Kildare/Meath.
The Mick and John Mackey story is amazing along with the exploits of that Ahane team of the 30's and 40's.
This is the kind of stuff needed for a museum.
Some deluded people living in their own little bubble think the history of sport in Limerick began in Thomond Park in 1978. Their is an aura of grandeur attached to the modern day rugby 'fan' while hardly realizing that the present professional set-up bears little or no resemblance to the amateur one of old.
Its a franchise that was formed to make money for a clique of certain individuals. Forget this '€10 million per game to the local economy' rubbish. Its total nonsense.

pigtown

Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't JP McManus and Paul O'Connell behind this? They can hardly be accused of living in a bubble of rugby, and you can be sure that JP is confident of the numbers involved.

It's to be an international rugby museum that will attract both local and national/international visitors. A Limerick sports museum wouldn't even be an attraction for Clare people. It wouldn't be enough of a draw.

washman3

pigtown wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't JP McManus and Paul O'Connell behind this? They can hardly be accused of living in a bubble of rugby, and you can be sure that JP is confident of the numbers involved.

It's to be an international rugby museum that will attract both local and national/international visitors. A Limerick sports museum wouldn't even be an attraction for Clare people. It wouldn't be enough of a draw.

National/international Rugby museum.?? that's an even bigger joke.
You do realize that only about 10 countries in the World take rugby seriously.
Is somebody from Australia going to travel to Limerick to visit a Rugby museum?
Or better still somebody from France? I would have serious doubts.!!
I remember a few years back watching an international soccer match while on holiday in Italy. I got talking to a group of fanatical Italian fans who knew all about Irish players of old like Giles,Stapleton,McGrath,Bonner,Keane and especially Brady who played many seasons there.
It was interesting to note that not a single one of them knew Italy actually fielded an International Rugby team. That's Italy, a team that competes in the 6 Nations. So how many Italians do you think will come to Limerick to visit a Rugby museum.? Probably better off with an international Golf museum.
I don't recall anybody here mentioning a solely Limerick Sports museum.
What posters mentioned was a museum that covers ALL aspects.

Cookiemunster

One of the most successful business men that Limerick has produced wants to back a rugby museum in Limerick. He wouldn't be putting his money behind it unless he'd done some due diligence. It's a private endeavour with no public money involved so even if it does fail, then it's of no issue to anyone other than the private investors.
I can't understand why certain posters are against it other than their dislike of rugby.

Cookiemunster

washman3 wrote: »

National/international Rugby museum.?? that's an even bigger joke.
You do realize that only about 10 countries in the World take rugby seriously.
Is somebody from Australia going to travel to Limerick to visit a Rugby museum?
Or better still somebody from France? I would have serious doubts.!!
I remember a few years back watching an international soccer match while on holiday in Italy. I got talking to a group of fanatical Italian fans who knew all about Irish players of old like Giles,Stapleton,McGrath,Bonner,Keane and especially Brady who played many seasons there.
It was interesting to note that not a single one of them knew Italy actually fielded an International Rugby team. That's Italy, a team that competes in the 6 Nations. So how many Italians do you think will come to Limerick to visit a Rugby museum.? Probably better off with an international Golf museum.
I don't recall anybody here mentioning a solely Limerick Sports museum.
What posters mentioned was a museum that covers ALL aspects.

Townie literally said - A Limerick sports museum would be a different story

The Lost Sheep

Townie_P wrote: »

Not convinced myself of how this would survive in the long term. How many rugby tourists are out there? Let's call a spade a spade, rugby is not the common man's game. It's a minority sport relative to GAA and soccer. Beyond certain urban areas in Limerick and nationwide, it wouldn't have much of a grassroots or traditional support. I've never seen the country grinding to a halt or wildly celebrating rugby success in the same way that soccer or GAA success is celebrated. A dedicated rugby only museum is a nice idea for Limerick, but as a money making venture it's a pretty niche market. A bit like the Munster rugby store in town, I wouldn't see it lasting long term as I do not think it would get the visitor numbers to sustain it. I just don't believe the interest in rugby is really there in the general population. For example, is a rugby museum going to do similar numbers to the Hunt Museum? I highly doubt it.

A Limerick sports museum would be a different story as it would appeal to a much larger clientele. GAA history, Limerick soccer's European history, boxing history including world champion Andy Lee and the many other Limerick related athletes would make for an interesting collection. Or go one further and have a Limerick museum which would incorporate sport, music, film, arts, culture and people. You'd be throwing the likes of Richard Harris, The Cranberries, Frank McCourt, Terry Wogan, De Valera, Sean South etc in to the mix then. To me that would be viable in terms of pulling in numbers and surviving long term.

Plenty of inaccuracies there. Rugby isnt the common mans game? Id disagree and even if it wasnt countrywide it most certainly is in Limerick. Where this is based.
I wouldnt be so sure on this museum being an issue in terms of making money.
Munster rugby store shut because of Lifestyle taking over and they had their stores in the city already.

mdmix

i think people are underestimating the strength and appeal of rugby. the game only turned pro around 20 years back and is growing rapidly at home and abroad. teams tour Ireland and limerick regularly. the international rugby experience is likely to appeal to each version of rugby, be it union, league, sevens or even tag.

union is by far the most popular with munster competing against european and south african teams all season. we get the odd international match, and if this venture is successful this may improve limericks attractiveness as an international rugby venue. internationally the sport is growing, with japan to host the next world cup.

league is less popular in ireland but extremely popular abroad. there is still a chance that limerick will be able to be a host city for the next league world cup hosted primarily in england.

sevens is the fastest growing rugby sport with the dubai sevens a world class event and one of the biggest events of the year in the UAE. sevens is now an olympic sport which is driving interest in america and non traditional rugby nations.

pig and porter is a huge festival that brings in teams from dublin, cork, galway, clare, kilkenny - many of whom stay for the weekend. the main event last summer was limerick vs the australian national tag team

Treepole

mdmix wrote: »

sevens is the fastest growing rugby sport with the dubai sevens a world class event and one of the biggest events of the year in the UAE. sevens is now an olympic sport which is driving interest in america and non traditional rugby nations.

Indeed.
The international 7's tournament in Limerick last year was unbelievably successful.

Glenomra

If JP invests very significant money in artefacts and gets international exposure then it might be successful. Maybe he has been collecting already with the museum in mind. Look at the middle eastern purchase of the Leonardo da vinci painting and the resultant publicity. It's not a question of one's attitude to rugby but one of viability. Look at how few Leicester fans travelled last week. I know how difficult it is to keep a project alive. We have one of Europe's most significant industrial history sites on our doorstep at Ardnacrusha, free access and very few ever visit it. A successful rugby museum would be great for limerick so the best of luck to all concerned.

pigtown

Wait Ardnacrusha is open for visitors? They should let people know if they want people to come

washman3

Cookiemunster wrote: »

One of the most successful business men that Limerick has produced wants to back a rugby museum in Limerick. He wouldn't be putting his money behind it unless he'd done some due diligence. It's a private endeavour with no public money involved so even if it does fail, then it's of no issue to anyone other than the private investors.
I can't understand why certain posters are against it other than their dislike of rugby.

He is THE most successful business man that Limerick has produced, simple as, and we will not see another like him in our lifetime at least. What he has done for the city and county will never be surpassed. And a proud Limerick man too.
The cost of building this is probably loose change to him and I doubt if he would lose a nights sleep if it failed.
What's being discussed in this thread is the merits of a National/International rugby museum in Limerick city. Posters are simply arguing that there may be other or better options that would attract visitors.
I for one am definitely 'not against it' and I don't believe other posters are either, thus I refute your point that certain posters are only against it because of their 'dislike' for rugby'.
That was one of my original points where I described the 'deluded few living is a bubble' where anyone that questions anything rugby related are immediately branded killjoys. What ires many people is the bandwagon fans that have attached themselves to rugby.
i was in Thomond Park last Saturday night, and like many others i also attended many Limerick home soccer games this year (and 2 away) along with Limerick senior hurling/football games and that outstanding U21 campaign.

mdmix

Glenomra wrote: »

If JP invests very significant money in artefacts and gets international exposure then it might be successful. Maybe he has been collecting already with the museum in mind. Look at the middle eastern purchase of the Leonardo da vinci painting and the resultant publicity. It's not a question of one's attitude to rugby but one of viability. Look at how few Leicester fans travelled last week. I know how difficult it is to keep a project alive. We have one of Europe's most significant industrial history sites on our doorstep at Ardnacrusha, free access and very few ever visit it. A successful rugby museum would be great for limerick so the best of luck to all concerned.

i think he's looking at using virtual reality tech to make it an experience rather than a passing tour of objects. this is happening in museums around the world but is still early days. i did my thesis in VR a few years back and the tech available is impressive and reasonably priced, but is often not used right. hopefully they get the right designers or it will miss the mark.

Cookiemunster

pigtown wrote: »

Wait Ardnacrusha is open for visitors? They should let people know if they want people to come

It's not. They had a few open days with a tour last summer, but that was a once off.

washman3

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Townie literally said - A Limerick sports museum would be a different story

Yes, you are correct.
However he did go on to say it could also incorporate sports,music,arts,film,culture and people.

tototoe

Reading this thread, You could be forgiven for thinking some people would be quite pleased if this failed or didn't go ahead at all

bigpink

Rugby is popular but don’t see the long term appeal of the museum
Shur look how bad suppport is for club rugby
Tag and sevens is more a piss up
The media and council of course are going to fawn over Jp McManus and Paul o Connell
At least it’s private money I hope

Glenomra

Cookiemunster wrote: »

It's not. They had a few open days with a tour last summer, but that was a once off.

Ardnacrusha is open year round by appointment. Just ring up beforehand. They don't broadcast it.it should be developed as a major tourist attraction.. now if kerry had it......

bigpink

How does Jp McManus make a living?

riverrocked

I am not a rugby fan, have never been to a match but even I can clearly see how popular it is.
I am sure like other museums it will aim at the tours (bus tours/school tours) most of these that come into the city don't actually care what the places they go to are about it is just another good day out on the list. I would say those are the major visitors to the Hunt. I know my son got sick of visiting it as a child in a city centre school.
As I said, I am not a rugby fan but I will go into it, I will also suggest it to others as a place to visit, just as I do with the Castle, the Limerick Museum, the Art Gallery and the Hunt. It will be great to have another venue to point people towards.
There will never be a museum that covers everyone's tastes, that is not the remit of museums.

Or, we could belittle an attempt to revivalise a section of the city as it doesn't fit into our narrow focus what a museum should be. Carrying that negativity into an open forum, causing those who were thinking of going to this to doubt themselves as if the locals think it's rubbish then why bother.

pigtown

There is an image of what is proposed on the front of the Leader. Not sure how I feel about it to be honest. It's proposing a two storey section on O'Connell St. with a three storey section on Cecil St. and a 7 storey section in between. I don't think a two storey building is appropriate when the rest of the street has historically been 4 storeys.

The Lost Sheep

bigpink wrote: »

Rugby is popular but don’t see the long term appeal of the museum
Shur look how bad suppport is for club rugby
Tag and sevens is more a piss up
The media and council of course are going to fawn over Jp McManus and Paul o Connell
At least it’s private money I hope

Tag is designed to be a social sport. Nothing wrong with that. Support for club rugby isnt that bad.
Where is the long term appeal for the museum? Its great for tourists, school tours etc

bigpink wrote: »

How does Jp McManus make a living?

trading, investing