off the books pay

Dratuk

Hi all. I work in a bar in my home town and i know that some of the staff are paid off the books. i am a floor supervisor along with another guy, i get paid 10euro an hour while he is on 13euro. i had a chat with him yesterday and he disclosed to me that he is paid off the books, so that his grant for college isnt affected by his pay. is this legal? if not should i do something?

i know that i am not happy that i have worked there longer and do the same job as him but he is paid more which is quite unfair.

davo10

Dratuk wrote: »

Hi all. I work in a bar in my home town and i know that some of the staff are paid off the books. i am a floor supervisor along with another guy, i get paid 10euro an hour while he is on 13euro. i had a chat with him yesterday and he disclosed to me that he is paid off the books, so that his grant for college isnt affected by his pay. is this legal? if not should i do something?

i know that i am not happy that i have worked there longer and do the same job as him but he is paid more which is quite unfair.

You will have to consider that the other guy will become liable for all taxes and levies, not the employer and he could lose his grant as a result, not a nice thing to do.

SwD

I would bring the matter to your employer. Tell him you are aware that he is being paid more and you are requesting equal pay for equal work.

No, paying off the books is not legal.

Blackjack

Dratuk wrote: »

Hi all. I work in a bar in my home town and i know that some of the staff are paid off the books. i am a floor supervisor along with another guy, i get paid 10euro an hour while he is on 13euro. i had a chat with him yesterday and he disclosed to me that he is paid off the books, so that his grant for college isnt affected by his pay. is this legal? if not should i do something?

i know that i am not happy that i have worked there longer and do the same job as him but he is paid more which is quite unfair.

Have you asked for a pay Rise?. Is the guy better at the job and worth the extra 3 Euros more an hour than you?.

SEPT 23 1989

davo10 wrote: »

You will have to consider that the other guy will become liable for all taxes and levies, not the employer and he could lose his grant as a result, not a nice thing to do.

The employer will get in a spot of bother as well

SwD

davo10 wrote: »

You will have to consider that the other guy will become liable for all taxes and levies, not the employer and he could lose his grant as a result, not a nice thing to do.

As unfair as it may seem, the purpose of many grants is to support those who don't work. Tricking the system isn't exactly nice or fair to others either.

Blud

davo10 wrote: »

You will have to consider that the other guy will become liable for all taxes and levies, not the employer and he could lose his grant as a result, not a nice thing to do.

Well this isn't true.

It's the employer's obligation to withhold tax from pay to employees, and Revenue would come looking for it from the employer. Much easier for them that way - if an employer is paying 10 people off the books then it's obviously easier for Revenue to chase the employer than to chase 10 different people. It's also the law - PAYE should be withheld.

Revenue don't care if the employer then tries to get it from the employee or not, as long as they are paid. They don't tell the employer to go get it, and the employer has no legal recourse to get it from the employee either without their consent - the employee just needs to say 'I thought you were paying me net'.

Dratuk

Blackjack wrote: »

Have you asked for a pay Rise?. Is the guy better at the job and worth the extra 3 Euros more an hour than you?.

yes i have asked for a pay rise, but did not get it.. even if i got the pay rise i still wouldnt have been getting equal pay for equal work

SwD

Dratuk wrote: »

yes i have asked for a pay rise, but did not get it.. even if i got the pay rise i still wouldn't have been getting equal pay for equal work

This is tough to take, no doubt. The sad reality is that those who continue to abuse the system are rarely held accountable.

The honest tax payer is most certainly always.

CeilingFly

Dratuk wrote: »

yes i have asked for a pay rise, but did not get it.. even if i got the pay rise i still wouldnt have been getting equal pay for equal work

€10/hour to an employee through the books actually costs close to €13 an hour

It is illegal to pay people "off the books" aa it does little favour to anyone.

Difficult situation if its a small town / village, so possibly you need to suck it up or keep eye out for other jobs.


€10 per hour + 8.5% employer's prsi + 8% holiday time + bank holiday pay / time off (annualised cost = 4.4%) Total hourly cost of €10 per hour staff equals 12.23.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

SwD

CeilingFly wrote: »

€10/hour to an employee through the books actually costs close to €13 an hour

For the employer yes. It works out around the same.

For the OP, he takes home a lot less than his counterpart.

LionelNashe

Dratuk wrote: »

Hi all. I work in a bar in my home town and i know that some of the staff are paid off the books. i am a floor supervisor along with another guy, i get paid 10euro an hour while he is on 13euro. i had a chat with him yesterday and he disclosed to me that he is paid off the books, so that his grant for college isnt affected by his pay. is this legal? if not should i do something?

i know that i am not happy that i have worked there longer and do the same job as him but he is paid more which is quite unfair.

What would happen if you said you weren't happy to continue working there, considering that you're being paid €3 less than the other guy. Would the owner/manager say, right, good luck, here's your P45? If so, then you really should ask yourself if you're worth the extra pay. Maybe you're only worth €10 an hour. If somebody else is getting €13, that's their business, and nothing to do with you.

Ask the owner/manager if there's anything about the way you're doing your job, or your experience, that makes you worth €3 less than the other guy. You might get some useful feedback, if you're willing to accept it.

If I were you, I wouldn't mention the off-the-books thing in the workplace. They won't appreciate your civic-mindedness. They could think that you're threatening to dob them in to the Revenue because you're disgruntled about the pay difference, and they mightn't be far wrong.

LegacyUser

I originally started this thread but i was unable to log in to my account.

So everything has been sorted out in bar involving my coworker and he is now being 10.50 per hour as am I. I hadon't nothing to do with this change another staff member threatened to inform the revenue about the unfair pay. All in all I am happy to know that I'm being treated fairly in comparison to my counterpart. Thanks for all the replies.

Dratuk

So everything has been sorted out in bar involving my coworker and he is now being 10.50 per hour as am I. I had nothing to do with this change another staff member threatened to inform the revenue about the unfair pay. All in all I am happy to know that I'm being treated fairly in regards to pay. Thanks for all the replies.

ZeroThreat

At the end of the day no one likes a snitch, especially an envious snitch.

jimmycrackcorm

ZeroThreat wrote:

At the end of the day no one likes a snitch, especially an envious snitch.

No one who pays their taxes likes weasels who don't.

ZeroThreat

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

No one who pays their taxes likes weasels who don't.

It's not up to a nosey employee to enforce the law however. That's between the employer & revenue.

Squatter

ZeroThreat wrote: »

It's not up to a nosey employee to enforce the law however. That's between the employer & revenue.

Or, to put it another way, there's nothing to stop a civic-minded, patriotic citizen from assisting the authorities in their attempts to enforce the law of the land.

Or indeed to prevent a well-informed employee from gently informing his employer that his employment practices may not be in full compliance with the law of the land.