Very poor article in The Sun paper by Rob Gill

liamog

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

it seems Irish drivers only bought in white (I've yet to encounter one that's a different colour)

More chances for you to do a bit of research, 45% of sold Ioniqs are white.
I guess that shows how much they blend in, you haven't even noticed the majority of them.

BeepBeep

Each to their own, I've 70,300 Kms driven since Jan 2015.

The front of the Leaf is ugly but doesn't really bother me, the Ioniq is fine apart from that grey grill , Zoe is a good looking car, the I3 is a bit odd. The Egolf is just another boring as hell VW.

bertie4evr

Deleted User wrote: »

There's a lot of Irish people who buy Dacias , so they're not too bothered about looks.

liamog wrote: »

More chances for you to do a bit of research, 45% of sold Ioniqs are white.
I guess that shows how much they blend in, you haven't even noticed the majority of them.

BeepBeep

Still the majority.

Each to their own, I've 70,300 Kms driven since Jan 2015.

The front of the Leaf is ugly but doesn't really bother me, the Ioniq is fine apart from that grey grill , Zoe is a good looking car, the I3 is a bit odd. The Egolf is just another boring as hell VW.

I would have said the back end of the Leaf is the worst part, front I don't mind.

liamog

bertie4evr wrote: »

Still the majority.

55% Non-White (not noticed by oppenheimer1)
45% White (noticed by oppenheimer1)

bertie4evr

liamog wrote: »

55% Non-White (not noticed by oppenheimer1)
45% White (noticed by oppenheimer1)

White is the majority colour.

liamog

bertie4evr wrote: »

White is the majority colour.

And the majority of Ioniqs are not white.

The claim was:

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

it seems Irish drivers only bought in white (I've yet to encounter one that's a different colour)

I'm not disputing that the Ioniq has sold more white cars than the others, I'm merely pointing out that the majority of Irish Ioniqs sold are not white.

oppenheimer1

liamog wrote: »

More circles, you've gone from comparing econ diesels to specced up models that are EVs, to claiming that current EVs aren't suitable because 2017 models aren't available second hand.

If there's anyone going around in circles, it's you. Splitting hairs on non substantive points...

liamog

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

If there's anyone going around in circles, it's you. Splitting hairs on non substantive points...

Yeah, definitely got pulled into a circle there.

How about we flip the conversation, what would it take in your opinion for an EV to be suitable for the average Irish driver?

oppenheimer1

liamog wrote: »

Yeah, definitely got pulled into a circle there.

How about we flip the conversation, what would it take in your opinion for an EV to be suitable for the average Irish driver?

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I don't think we are that far away from this and it will get there. The main point I've been making, similar to the journalist in the Sun is the EV is not there yet.

jackofalltrades

Shefwedfan wrote: »

A car is a tool/machine. No more no less. If you think a car gives you freedom then you have bigger issues than electric over diesel/petrol.

I know the conversation has moved on, but I just wanted to address this one point.
A car for a lot of people IMO is much more than just a tool, it provides people with a sense of freedom amongst other things.
I think there is an emotional context to buying a car that people may be overlooking.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I'd add a much wider range of car types and manufacturers as well.

Orebro

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I don't think we are that far away from this and it will get there. The main point I've been making, similar to the journalist in the Sun is the EV is not there yet.

Even though none of this is required for city / suburban dwellers? And the current crop are even more relevant as the second car in a household.

liamog

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I don't think we are that far away from this and it will get there. The main point I've been making, similar to the journalist in the Sun is the EV is not there yet.

So you'd be wanting a 60kWh car that can charge at 150kW with the same
efficiency as an Ioniq at 120km. (assuming the battery doesn't increase in weight).

That would give 200km in a 12 minute fast charge.
Current battery prices are around €140/kWh so would cost an extra €4.5k.

I think we're a lot closer than people think.

bertie4evr

liamog wrote: »

And the majority of Ioniqs are not white.

The claim was:


I'm not disputing that the Ioniq has sold more white cars than the others, I'm merely pointing out that the majority of Irish Ioniqs sold are not white.

Sorry for being a bit cunty there. Had a long day.

jackofalltrades wrote: »

I'd add a much wider range of car types and manufacturers as well.

+1 to this. There needs to be more offerings from other brands.

Absolutely, Nissan should have more than 1 EV model after 8 years ffs !

goz83

Jobs OXO wrote: »

Ah seriously ! Using your broke deadbeat sister as an example takes the biscuit. Whoever is so disorganised not to have petrol or a credit card for petrol shouldn't be allowed to drive any vehicle. Likely someone like that would electrocute themselves with an EV anyway....

I'll forgive that post, because (a) You don't know how much of tool you are by posting it, and (b) your missus is obviously not happy with your hairy junk

She don't like meat? :pac: couldn't resist

liamog

The real mainstream acceptance will come when the choice of EV is just another option in an existing line.

Petrol, Diesel or Electric should just be a choice of powertrain.

goz83

goz83 wrote: »

I'll forgive that post, because (a) You don't know how much of tool you are by posting it, and (b) your missus is obviously not happy with your hairy junk

She don't like meat? :pac: couldn't resist

What on Earth is this about ??? ^^^^

Shefwedfan

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I don't think we are that far away from this and it will get there. The main point I've been making, similar to the journalist in the Sun is the EV is not there yet.

From Cork to Belfast is less than 500km. Who the hell is doing 500km a day?

I know in my job it is illegal if I drive than much in 1 day, so if I drive from Dublin to Cork, I am supposed to stay in Cork over night and then drive back up....

Not sure I would need a 10 min charger when I would be in a hotel over night.....

Even when I drove in the outback I don't think I would have done 500km in a day....

You mention price point again but again I refer to my previous 2 posts when I bought eGolf with better spec for the same money as a TDi version.

goz83

Deleted User wrote: »

What on Earth is this about ??? ^^^^

I got curious about post 93 http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=104045181&postcount=93

Peculiar enough threads to say the least. Don't look if you want to sleep well tonight.

bertie4evr

Shefwedfan wrote: »

From Cork to Belfast is less than 500km. Who the hell is doing 500km a day?

I know in my job it is illegal if I drive than much in 1 day, so if I drive from Dublin to Cork, I am supposed to stay in Cork over night and then drive back up....

Not sure I would need a 10 min charger when I would be in a hotel over night.....

Even when I drove in the outback I don't think I would have done 500km in a day....

You mention price point again but again I refer to my previous 2 posts when I bought eGolf with better spec for the same money as a TDi version.

It'd be nice if you could forget to plug it in every once in a while and not have your trip scuppered. Having a 500km range let's you relax a bit.

Shefwedfan

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

400/500km range at real world driving speed
Fast charge 200km in 10mins
At price points similar to ICE.

I don't think we are that far away from this and it will get there. The main point I've been making, similar to the journalist in the Sun is the EV is not there yet.

https://www.facebook.com/tesla/videos/10155478895917801/

Might be of interest

Shefwedfan

bertie4evr wrote: »

It'd be nice if you could forget to plug it in every once in a while and not have your trip scuppered. Having a 500km range let's you relax a bit.

So you drive 500km every day?

As mentioned already most people in Dublin drive less than 100km per day, even with my current range I have forgotten to plug in the car at night and still safely drove to and from work the next day without the need to top up....

Pointless arguments about situations that never will happen will never stop....

bertie4evr

Shefwedfan wrote: »

So you drive 500km every day?

As mentioned already most people in Dublin drive less than 100km per day, even with my current range I have forgotten to plug in the car at night and still safely drove to and from work the next day without the need to top up....

Pointless arguments about situations that never will happen will never stop....

No, but if I drive even 60-70km every day and forget to plug it in, I'm snookered.

jackofalltrades

Orebro wrote: »

Even though none of this is required for city / suburban dwellers? And the current crop are even more relevant as the second car in a household.

Why are none of these requirements required for city drivers?

Shefwedfan wrote: »

From Cork to Belfast is less than 500km. Who the hell is doing 500km a day?

I know in my job it is illegal if I drive than much in 1 day, so if I drive from Dublin to Cork, I am supposed to stay in Cork over night and then drive back up....

Not sure I would need a 10 min charger when I would be in a hotel over night.....

Even when I drove in the outback I don't think I would have done 500km in a day....

Why is the assumption that all of this driving is to be done in one day?

bertie4evr

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Why are none of these requirements required for city drivers?

Why is the assumption that all of this driving is to be done in one day?

Current EV owners are stuck in the mindset that they need to plug in everyday, and that no one else has a problem with that or might forget.

Orebro

bertie4evr wrote: »

No, but if I drive even 60-70km every day and forget to plug it in, I'm snookered.

It would be the last time you'd forget!

You'd swear that plugging it into your home charger every evening was an ordeal. Personally I find the idea of visiting a filling station and using the filthy smelly pumps far less attractive, and paying through the nose for the privilege.

bertie4evr

Orebro wrote: »

It would be the last time you'd forget!

You'd swear that plugging it into your home charger every evening was an ordeal. Personally I find the idea of visiting a filling station and using the filthy smelly pumps far less attractive, and paying through the nose for the privilege.

I've forgotten to plug in my phone a few times. It happens, I'd guess it would happen even moreso for a car, sometimes you just want to get kids out, into the house, and fall asleep!

Orebro

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Why are none of these requirements required for city drivers?

Because the distance most of them drive is far less than 100km per day

Orebro

bertie4evr wrote: »

I've forgotten to plug in my phone a few times. It happens, I'd guess it would happen even moreso for a car, sometimes you just want to get kids out, into the house, and fall asleep!

Sure you could forget to fill with petrol just as easily!

bertie4evr

Orebro wrote: »

Sure you could forget to fill with petrol just as easily!

Which is fine. It's still a 5 minute delay which could throw off the whole morning routine, but an EV would be worse.

Water John

The only thing I'm put out about here is, Schef didn't invite me to the party.

Shefwedfan

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Why are none of these requirements required for city drivers?

Why is the assumption that all of this driving is to be done in one day?

If it is not then why wouldn't you plug the car in over night?

jackofalltrades

Orebro wrote: »

Because the distance most of them drive is far less than 100km per day

Yes but in the post you quoted the person talked about increasing the speed at which fast charging happens.
Why is that something that isn't required by urban/suburban drivers?
Few people want to spend 30 minutes waiting for their car to charge, or multiples of that if there's a queue.
Especially considering at the moment you can get close to 500 miles for 5 minutes of your time.

Shefwedfan wrote: »

If it is not then why wouldn't you plug the car in over night?

Because they can't plug the car in overnight.
A lot of motorists out there don't have driveways.
Of the ones that do, it will be more than likely that there will be more than one car using that drive.
You could get landlords that don't want to install the proper equipment.
What if they forget or just couldn't be arsed doing it everyday.

liamog

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Yes but in the post you quoted the person talked about increasing the speed at which fast charging happens.
Why is that something that isn't required by urban/suburban drivers?
Few people want to spend 30 minutes waiting for their car to charge, or multiples of that if there's a queue.
Especially considering at the moment you can get close to 500 miles for 5 minutes of your time.
Because they can't plug the car in overnight.
A lot of motorists out there don't have driveways.
Of the ones that do, it will be more than likely that there will be more than one car using that drive.
You could get landlords that don't want to install the proper equipment.
What if they forget or just couldn't be arsed doing it everyday.

I'll agree there is a certain narrow mindedness towards the segment of the market where home charging is just not practical.

Tesla are working on urban charging centers to address this market, they see it as a particular issue given the likely profile of Model 3 owners.
Tesla - Charging our priority

It's my belief that the 2017 models, Ioniq, Zoe40 and Leaf2 will all give a 200-300km range which will be well suited to average suburban/urban driver. I think 15 mins is a reasonable benchmark for this style of charging.
A 15kW/100km that charges at 70kW will give 120km range in this time.

If the Leaf2 targets a 40kWh battery they should be aiming for 100kW charging to maintain the charge rate, this would give 170km for a 15 minute charge.

None of the above takes away from people who will charge at home, they're will be cars available with a mix of battery sizes similar to what we see with Tesla. As a home charger, you won't need as big a battery meaning your car will be lighter and more efficient. The Model S had a difference of 100kg between the 60 and 85 models.

Gumbo

All this white bashing
If I was buying brand new tomorrow, I would order white.

ELM327

bertie4evr wrote: »

Which is fine. It's still a 5 minute delay which could throw off the whole morning routine, but an EV would be worse.

Not if you forget and you live further from the fuel station than the fuel you have remaining it isnt!

Shefwedfan

kceire wrote: »

All this white bashing
If I was buying brand new tomorrow, I would order white.

Nothing wrong with white.....

Autochange

isnottheword wrote: »

People are slow to change and there are vested interests that resist change. There's a 200KM range affordable car on the market that charges at a faster rate than what went before it.
Now, what percentage of the driving public needs greater range than that...and if they do, how often?

Purely from a selfish point of view, I'm delighted if people like yourself are of the belief that EV's have not come of age. It means incentives stay in place - meaning I keep on saving €160/month on fuel alone (that's before consideration of those expensive services that were ending up as >€500/year for me on diesel).



Really? Whereas petrol heads are what exactly? I don't mind not being a sheep. I'll never drive a diesel/petrol ever again. Are 25% of the car buying public in Norway also 'a strange bunch'?



The point he's making is that there's damn all maintenance. Where will you buy your car - you can buy off a main dealer or an indy - you can do so in Ireland or the UK. However, Tesla intend to disrupt this model - as they are doing in the U.S. already.

Check through this section and see what sort of major surgery has been necessary thus far for EV drivers....very little. Yes, of course at this point in time, if you are unlucky enough to have something major go wrong outside of warranty, then you're stuck with a main dealer (can also happen with ICE anyway). As regards regular servicing, what is there to do? Brake fluid? Anyone can do that. Pollen filter, ditto. Break discs/pads (aside from the fact that they will last 2x the time than with a diesel/petrol due to regen) - can't an indy do that? What else is there?


Independents were/are getting squeezed with the way manufacturers are designing in complexity to shut them out - and force people back to the main dealers when there's an issue.
Furthermore, as EV development progresses, independents will pop up.

I have absolutely no doubt that e cars are the future. And rightly so. Ireland will have the infrastructure in place to charge the natural fleet around the same time as Ghana and Iraq. The rest of the world will be up and running about 15-30 years before us.

Wibbs

TBH If I was in the market for a new urban car I'd be very tempted by an EV, even at current(no pun) range "limits". 99.whatever per cent of my driving would be well within those limits, as would most urban/suburban driver's journeys.

What would put me off - and I accept and acknowledge my shallowness in this - would be the style, or lack thereof, of most of them. The Golf being the exception I suppose. The Muskmobiles are OK in that regard too(if a little bland considering the cash outlay). Fiat 500 EV? I'd love a converted vintage Fiat 500 for town use.

That's another angle that appeals about EV tech. When it gets to the plug and play drop in an E motor into older classics(that had mundane petrol engines. I would happily swing for the man who dropped a E motor into say a Dino), it will be a game changer in that segment and will keep older cool cars on the road.

The other aspect that puts me off - and I do realise this is somewhat illogical - is that EV's seem to be aimed at and driven/promoted by those who largely see driving as an unhappy side effect of getting from A to B. Where heel and toe is a dance move. The nerdy early adopters that have a fit if they see someone *gasp* go 5kms over the speed limit :eek: The horror(I've been stuck behind a couple of EV drivers that I thought were asleep at the wheel. With the mantra in their heads of "it's a limit, not a goal" churning away in self satisfaction*). They feel more of an appliance, a fridge on wheels. Again and outside of the nerdy early adopter meme, that would be the vast majority of people out there. The vast majority are not Petrolheads(which petrolheads often don't get), so would be Leccyheads in the morning if they saw the practical and economical benefits. So again that's most (sub)urban drivers out there, so they are a good bet for most people in that segment, even at today's range and tech levels.

To be fair I would be of the old school bent. I hate electric power steering(and no, bugger all have actual "feel"), I can tell if a car has a cable operated throttle or an electronic one(my mechanic mate didn't believe me until I demonstrated I could) and fake engine noise is to me the work of satan. But I and others like me are not the market, we're a different kind of nerd. The vast majority buy on personal finances(and financing), tax breaks, fear of breakdown, toys in the cabin, year on reg plate and if it has eye appeal(and that latter is minimal, many people have spent hard earned cash on that eye vomit that is the Skoda Roomster). The motive force is pretty much irrelevant. EV's will grab that market very soon as they spread beyond the early adopter, awkward looking and niche EV's. Of that I have no doubt.




*in areas where the limit is erring on the side of paranoia. And there are many of those. I'll happily kick in the headlights of a muppet driving hard in the vicinity of a school, or suburban estate.

Evd-Burner

Wibbs wrote:

The other aspect that puts me off - and I do realise this is somewhat illogical - is that EV's seem to be aimed at and driven/promoted by those who largely see driving as an unhappy side effect of getting from A to B. Where heel and toe is a dance move. The nerdy early adopters that have a fit if they see someone *gasp* go 5kms over the speed limit The horror(I've been stuck behind a couple of EV drivers that I thought were asleep at the wheel. With the mantra in their heads of "it's a limit, not a goal" churning away in self satisfaction*). They feel more of an appliance, a fridge on wheels. Again and outside of the nerdy early adopter meme, that would be the vast majority of people out there. The vast majority are not Petrolheads(which petrolheads often don't get), so would be Leccyheads in the morning if they saw the practical and economical benefits. So again that's most (sub)urban drivers out there, so they are a good bet for most people in that segment, even at today's range and tech levels.

To be fair I have seen a few people drive like this but it's not how I drive at all. I'm foot to the floor, I love the acceleration. I've shocked a fair few people at junctions with the leaf take off. I've mine 5 months and done 12k km.

goz83

@Wibbs

LOL. Everything about that post just wasn't me. I'm no Sunday driver. I leave every car at the lights. My dashcam footage would get me in trouble (joke). My most recent cars were E200k, FTO mivec, FTO mivec, FTO GX, FTO GR, FTO GR (you get the picture )

I have 2 Nissan Leafs. They are great fun to drive. Yes, there is a financial incentive, which is what got me interested, but it was test driving that got me hooked. It only took 5 minutes. Think...bumper cars

Gumbo

Evd-Burner wrote: »

To be fair I have seen a few people drive like this but it's not how I drive at all. I'm foot to the floor, I love the acceleration. I've shocked a fair few people at junctions with the leaf take off. I've mine 5 months and done 12k km.

goz83 wrote: »

@Wibbs

LOL. Everything about that post just wasn't me. I'm no Sunday driver. I leave every car at the lights. My dashcam footage would get me in trouble (joke). My most recent cars were E200k, FTO mivec, FTO mivec, FTO GX, FTO GR, FTO GR (you get the picture )

I have 2 Nissan Leafs. They are great fun to drive. Yes, there is a financial incentive, which is what got me interested, but it was test driving that got me hooked. It only took 5 minutes. Think...bumper cars

I think we are the new age EV drivers.
Wibbs hasn't met us yet.

I drive mine to the gym, to football matches, when out cruising for hookers....no wait, scrap that last bit. I mean when out buying the Sunday paper.....in my slippers, with my pipe....

stesaurus

Sorry Wibbs but that ain't describing me either. I regularly only get 70km out of a full charge on mine as I max it at all times.
I've often dreamt of a few different classics that I'd love to convert to EV. I'm a converted petrolhead at this stage. I love all cars, except diesels and puny underpowered **** boxes but once you go EV you don't really ever want to go back.

DrPhilG

I was heading up the road last week, and there were a few slow buggers ahead, around 50mph. I was waiting for the opportunity to overtake, but the woman behind me was cheeky as hell. Driving up my ass, riding the white line and generally being an aggressive cow. Eventually we both overtook the slow pokes and I was doing about 60mph. Again cheeky cow is tailgating and pushing to overtake.

Don't get me wrong, I have no issue with someone overtaking me. But I did take exception to this mug being so rude. And we're talking a middle aged woman in a sensible car, not some daft youngster in a souped up Corsa.

So we were approaching a long straight and I knew that she would be raring to go. I eased back to 55 and waited for the straight. Sure enough, as soon as the straight approached she was out on the other side of the road to overtake. I put the boot down and took off, hit 90mph* in no time. The silly sod stayed on the wrong side of the road for ages before she gave up and backed off.

*Of course this definitely didn't happen. I would never dream of breaking the limit.

I realise this was childish, but it did make me giggle...

oppenheimer1

DrPhilG wrote: »

I was heading up the road last week, and there were a few slow buggers ahead, around 50mph. I was waiting for the opportunity to overtake, but the woman behind me was cheeky as hell. Driving up my ass, riding the white line and generally being an aggressive cow. Eventually we both overtook the slow pokes and I was doing about 60mph. Again cheeky cow is tailgating and pushing to overtake.

Don't get me wrong, I have no issue with someone overtaking me. But I did take exception to this mug being so rude. And we're talking a middle aged woman in a sensible car, not some daft youngster in a souped up Corsa.

So we were approaching a long straight and I knew that she would be raring to go. I eased back to 55 and waited for the straight. Sure enough, as soon as the straight approached she was out on the other side of the road to overtake. I put the boot down and took off, hit 90mph* in no time. The silly sod stayed on the wrong side of the road for ages before she gave up and backed off.

*Of course this definitely didn't happen. I would never dream of breaking the limit.

I realise this was childish, but it did make me giggle...

That it's atrocious behaviour on the road. Never mind the speed limit, forcing someone to stay on the other side whilst they are attempting an overtaking manoeuvre is downright dangerous.

Quite frankly you don't deserve to be on the road in any type of vehicle since you can't have manners.

DrPhilG

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

forcing someone to stay on the other side whilst they are attempting an overtaking manoeuvre is downright dangerous

LOL

How did I force her to stay on the other side of the road? She pulled out to overtake, before she even drew level I was long gone.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Quite frankly you don't deserve to be on the road in any type of vehicle since you can't have manners.

There definitely was a lack of manners displayed during this episode, just not by me.

oppenheimer1

DrPhilG wrote: »

LOL

How did I force her to stay on the other side of the road? She pulled out to overtake, before she even drew level I was long gone.



There definitely was a lack of manners displayed during this episode, just not by me.

You baited her into an overtaking manoeuvre by slowing down then acted the prick by not letting her complete it. It's downright dangerous and you know it.

If someone is up on your ass let them pass. Two wrongs don't make a right.

DrPhilG

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

You baited her into an overtaking manoeuvre by slowing down then acted the prick by not letting her complete it. It's downright dangerous and you know it.

If someone is up on your ass let them pass. Two wrongs don't make a right.

1 - baited bollox. She was busting to overtake everyone on the road no matter what. I slowed on a bend and speeded up on the straight. Perfectly reasonable.
2 - yes I acted the prick, already admitted that it was childish. But sometimes a taste of your own medicine does you good. Maybe next time she won't be such an aggressive arsehole on the road.
3 - how would you know if it was dangerous, were you there? This was a very wide, long straight road. There were no other cars in sight apart from hers and mine. Unless she was in danger of driving into the ditch in shock at how much faster I was than her, I caused no danger whatsoever.
4 - would you ever get off your high horse and stop whinging for a change.

Nighty night.

DrPhilG

DrPhilG wrote: »

were you there?

Oh dear, maybe you were!

Are you a frustrated middle aged blonde lady?

Wibbs

goz83 wrote: »

I have 2 Nissan Leafs. They are great fun to drive. Yes, there is a financial incentive, which is what got me interested, but it was test driving that got me hooked. It only took 5 minutes. Think...bumper cars

Yeah I can see the bumper car analogy alright. Maybe it's just me to be fair G. I've been out of modern cars for so long that they tend to feel numb to me. From kinda disconnected to "am I driving here?". The Leaf's steering has about as much feel as doing the wild thing wearing Durex xtra safe and a wetsuit. Over Skype. It has absolutely none. Then again and to be fair that's the case for the majority of current supermini type cars regardless of engine type. The instant torque certainly makes it feel fast alright. Initially anyway. IIRC the 0-100 time is around the ten sec mark? Again to be fair most superminis with small petrol engines require a calendar to time their 0-100 times. As I say if I was in the market for an urban runabout, a generic "Car" that got me from A to B, I'd almost certainly go for an EV. Probably a Leaf. It feels well bolted together and as it's a Nissan it'll be as reliable as the sun rise.