Season 7 Episode 1 "Dragonstone" - "Non book readers"

Syphonax

Kirby wrote: »

You keep calling it a rubber mask. Rubber? Were you not paying attention to the, i don't know, massive hall of faces of dead people and how they got there?

It's not rubber, it's his actual face. The rest is just illusion and magic, no different from the magic wall or magic dragons or magic three-eyed raven.

Im still unimpressed, its clearly a mask, rubber or not, where did she get it, some magic face generation kit she carries around?

Syphonax

damienirel wrote: »

Well said - I can't believe the rubbish up on this thread trying to poke holes in that.
Now Ed Sheeran - disguised as Ed Sheeran and singing like Ed Sheeran - that was b0ll0cks.

STFU about Ed

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

Maybe it is Jim Carey MASK?!

She CLEARLY removes the mask twice, like its just a rubber......mask.

How can this be though when she just simply whips it off her after cuting Freys throat, its like "surprise, ima Stark, stupid mask fooled ya"

Not sure how you're getting a sequence here. She killed Walder Frey a fortnight before that scene. She clearly says it (as Walder) that it's the second feast in a fortnight. The first being when Jaime Lannister and Bronn were there and she was acting as a serving girl. After which she kills Walder.

damienirel

Syphonax wrote: »

Im still unimpressed

Good! Stay that way.

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

Im still unimpressed, its clearly a mask, rubber or not, where did she get it, some magic face generation kit she carries around?

Would you stop with the rubber masks. Have you not beeen watching the previous episodes? Season 5 shows them removing the faces from the dead.

Syphonax

JoeyJJ wrote: »

I think the beef is more with production quality of GOT how they visualize the transformation back to real character. For me you need to relax and enjoy the theater of it rather than question so hard.

Yes, finally someone understands my predicament. Its like watching Gladiator and thinking to myself...ehhh wait that never actually happened...aw fuk it

maximoose

JoeyJJ wrote: »

I think the beef is more with production quality of GOT how they visualize the transformation back to real character.

I don't really have a problem with it, but yep this is the issue.

I always assumed there was an element of magic involved and some suspension of disbelief given but I don't think it was ever really expressed when she was 'training'? They just cut the faces off and stick them on

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Would you stop with the rubber masks. Have you not beeen watching the previous episodes? Season 5 shows them removing the faces from the dead.

Ive seen most, I did a huge binge and might have missed a few, I did actuall fall asleep when the red wedding was on and had to go back as I know something was afoot!

JoeyJJ

I might have interpreted your discomfort with it however if this is your complaint jaysus were you as easily annoyed back in earlier series when other **** was going down. I hope you never intend on watching lost.

damienirel

Syphonax wrote: »

Ive seen most, I did a huge binge and might have missed a few, I did actuall fall asleep when the red wedding was on and had to go back as I know something was afoot!

That says it all really - your opinion doesn't count at all!:rolleyes:

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Not sure how you're getting a sequence here. She killed Walder Frey a fortnight before that scene. She clearly says it (as Walder) that it's the second feast in a fortnight. The first being when Jaime Lannister and Bronn were there and she was acting as a serving girl. After which she kills Walder.

I was talking about the fake girl mask she has on when she kills Frey, one of Freys girls not Frey

Syphonax

damienirel wrote: »

That says it all really - your opinion doesn't count at all!:rolleyes:

It was a marathon of about 10 straight GOT hours so I dont care what you think

damienirel

Syphonax wrote: »

It was a marathon of about 10 straight GOT hours so I dont care what you think

You should have let your little brain cool down between episodes.:D

kunst nugget

charlieIRL wrote: »

Can we get over the Ed Sheeran thing please?!!

I watched the episode and went 'Oh look, there's Ed Sheeran' and passed no more remarks on him. It seems I've been living my life wrong.

I should be frothing at the mouth that they allowed someone with ginger hair onto the programme. A cameo?!?! A shameo more like!!!! It's making me so mad that my blood pressure keeps rising so high that I keep fainting. The doctors said I'll have a stroke if I keep on acting like this and it is entirely the fault of Game of Thrones. I was enjoying the show so much but now it's been ruined by having that… thing sing a couple of lines of a song and say a a couple of words of dialogue. It's like all the colour has been drained from my existence… all colours except ginger!!! A pox on the producers of this show!!!

Syphonax

damienirel wrote: »

You should have let your little brain cool down between episodes.:D

My brain just gave up for sleep at about the seventh episode

BetsyEllen

I'm confused as to how the giant came to be in the army of the dead.

Is he the same one that fought for Jon Snow at the battle of Winterfell?
If so, surely his body would have been burnt?

damienirel

kunst nugget wrote: »

I should be frothing at the mouth that they allowed someone with ginger hair onto the programme. A cameo?!?! A shameo more like!!!! It's making me so mad that my blood pressure keeps rising so high that I keep fainting. The doctors said I'll have a stroke if I keep on acting like this and it is entirely the fault of Game of Thrones. I was enjoying the show so much but now it's been ruined by having that… thing sing a couple of lines of a song and say a a couple of words of dialogue. It's like all the colour has been drained from my existence… all colours except ginger!!! A pox on the producers of this show!!!

Spot on!

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

I was talking about the fake girl mask she has on when she kills Frey, one of Freys girls not Frey

And as I said, that was a fortnight earlier. Not one minute a serving girl and the next Walder Frey.

Being a faceless man (woman) is not just about masks. All the beating into her that she was 'no-one' has a point. To be a faceless man, is to be like a blank slate and take on all the characteristics of the person you're becoming.

It's not something you can get across very easily on television, it requires a bit of attention to what the likes of Jaqen say and the lessons that Arya learns in Braavos.

damienirel

BetsyEllen wrote: »

I'm confused as to how the giant came to be in the army of the dead.

Is he the same one that fought for Jon Snow at the battle of Winterfell?
If so, surely his body would have been burnt?

Why? Thought yer man Bolton shot him in the eye with an arrow and he dropped - hence the zoom into his eye in this ep.

BetsyEllen

damienirel wrote: »

Why? Thought yer man Bolton shot him in the eye with an arrow and he dropped - hence the zoom into his eye in this ep.

Why what?

If he had died at Winterfell, Jon Snow would have burned the body as he does with everyone that dies.

So how is he now marching for the dead?

CMOTDibbler

BetsyEllen wrote: »

I'm confused as to how the giant came to be in the army of the dead.

Is he the same one that fought for Jon Snow at the battle of Winterfell?
If so, surely his body would have been burnt?

Pretty much no.

As in there are quite a few giants north of the wall. Some of them may even be dead.

damienirel

Syphonax wrote: »

My brain just gave up for sleep at about the seventh episode

Yer very wrong about the rubber mask thing as many people have tried to explain. Just admit it, and move on with it. They(GOT crew) don't do sloppy(well apart from casting that little ginger pubes ).

Gal44

Wheres Theon? can't remember..

kunst nugget

Gal44 wrote: »

Wheres Theon? can't remember..

He's with Daenerys.

alchemist33

Gal44 wrote: »

Wheres Theon? can't remember..

He's now on Dragonstone with his sister and Daenarys and her army (or anchored offshore anyway)

maximoose

Oh yeah, that Giant - had to look up the quote afterwards but when I saw his big shiny blue eye I remembered something similar from rewatching over the last few weeks:

In Season 1

Robb Stark: "One time she told me the sky is blue because we live inside the eye of a blue-eyed giant named 'Macumber'."
Bran Stark: "...maybe we do."

And Season 4

Tywin Lannister: "Some believe the king choked."
Oberyn Martell: "Some believe the sky is blue because we live inside the eye of a blue-eyed giant.

Probably of no relevance but thought it was interesting!

Gal44

alchemist33 wrote: »

He's now on Dragonstone with his sister and Daenarys and her army (or anchored offshore anyway)

Ooooh yes thats right. Cheers!

damienirel

BetsyEllen wrote: »

Why what?

If he had died at Winterfell, Jon Snow would have burned the body as he does with everyone that dies.

So how is he now marching for the dead?

good point hadn't thought of that sameish discussion here....
https://www.popsugar.com/entertainment/Wun-Wun-White-Walker-Game-Thrones-43752016

BetsyEllen

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Pretty much no.

As in there are quite a few giants north of the wall. Some of them may even be dead.

As damienirel pointed out above, they zoomed in on his face to show he had been shot with an arrow - making us think he was the giant from the Winterfell battle.

But yeah maybe you're right and it is another giant.
I just don't think they would have shown his face so clearly if it was.
He was a big part of the battle and a sad loss; so having him in the army of the dead would be a little shocking.

I just don't understand how he got there!

damienirel

yeah another view of it here..interesting...
https://www.romper.com/p/is-wun-wun-a-wight-on-game-of-thrones-the-giant-made-appearance-in-the-season-7-premiere-70592

jooksavage

Arghus wrote: »

That Ed Sheeran cameo was a truly awful decision. It was really pushed into your face.

That scene was mawkish to begin with ("be kind to a stranger and they'll be kind to you"... puke!) Sticking the cherub-faced purveyor of suck-pop was just putting a hat on a hat.

damienirel

jooksavage wrote: »

That scene was mawkish to begin with ("be kind to a stranger and they'll be kind to you"... puke!) Sticking the cherub-faced purveyor of suck-pop was just putting a hat on a hat.

Pure muck - didn't fit in with anything they've done before, but I guess in a few years nobody will know who he was, so probably not all that bad.

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

And as I said, that was a fortnight earlier. Not one minute a serving girl and the next Walder Frey.

Being a faceless man (woman) is not just about masks. All the beating into her that she was 'no-one' has a point. To be a faceless man, is to be like a blank slate and take on all the characteristics of the person you're becoming.

It's not something you can get across very easily on television, it requires a bit of attention to what the likes of Jaqen say and the lessons that Arya learns in Braavos.

Ok, i never implied that she killed one after the other though! To be quite honest I was specifially stating that the lack of good visual effects takes away from how she is able to change faces and the whole part of the story. She simply appears to be able to change by way of (for lack of a better word) rubber mask.

damienirel wrote: »

Yer very wrong about the rubber mask thing as many people have tried to explain. Just admit it, and move on with it. They(GOT crew) don't do sloppy(well apart from casting that little ginger pubes ).

I think you have taken me up wrong its the transformation of faces tha bugs me,as Ive said a few times on here now.

Ann22

zerks wrote:

Was it just me or did he sound a bit stilted,it was almost as if he did feck all acting before.Sounded a bit amateur.

He was v good in This is England...played the sane character growing up. See how he goes in this.

CMOTDibbler

BetsyEllen wrote: »

As damienirel pointed out above, they zoomed in on his face to show he had been shot with an arrow - making us think he was the giant from the Winterfell battle.

But yeah maybe you're right and it is another giant.
I just don't think they would have shown his face so clearly if it was.
He was a big part of the battle and a sad loss; so having him in the army of the dead would be a little shocking.

I just don't understand how he got there!

I just don't hink it's him. There were three giants in that sequence. Is it not just as likely that they were giants who died north of the wall? Part of Mance Rayder's army that was defeated by Stannis most likely.

It's a long way from the wall to Winterfell. A very long way. We saw that in season 1 when Jon and Tyrion travelled to Castle Black with Benjen. Who's going to lump a massive corpse all that way and dump it on the other side of the wall? And why? Even if the sequence is of white walkers south of the wall some time in the future, how likely is it that Jon wouldn't have burned all the corpses from the BoB? That's the only remote possibility that the giant in that sequence is Wun Wun.

Syphonax

It shirley him

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

Ok, i never implied that she killed one after the other though! To be quite honest I was specifially stating that the lack of good visual effects takes away from how she is able to change faces and the whole part of the story. She simply appears to be able to change by way of (for lack of a better word) rubber mask.

Well I took it from this:

Syphonax wrote: »

She CLEARLY removes the mask twice, like its just a rubber......mask.

The only 'twice' removal that I can remember is when she kills Walder Frey and removes the serving girl face and then the scene the other night when she takes off the Walder Frey face. That's twice. But two weeks apart.

Syphonax wrote: »

I think you have taken me up wrong its the transformation of faces tha bugs me,as Ive said a few times on here now.

Yes, we get that. What you don't seem to understand is that the art or 'religion' of the faceless men involves the donning of the entire persona of the face they 'put on'. They are real faces from real dead people, not some sort of artificial construction made to change their facial appearance.

For want of a better word, it's magic.

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Well I took it from this:


The only 'twice' removal that I can remember is when she kills Walder Frey and removes the serving girl face and then the scene the other night when she takes off the Walder Frey face. That's twice. But two weeks apart.


Yes, we get that. What you don't seem to understand is that the art or 'religion' of the faceless men involves the donning of the entire persona of the face they 'put on'. They are real faces from real dead people, not some sort of artificial construction made to change their facial appearance.

For want of a better word, it's magic.

yea she did remove two masks, i never said one straight after the other. AFIAK she only ever 'inhabits' two persons truly (the girl and Frey) and that is for a mere few minutes, I get the magic part but in doing something so magical I would expect to see a proper magical transformation, all we get to see is her taking the mask off, its very basic and something that stood out for me as been very underdone.

I pretty sure in one of the earlier seasons Melisandre turns into some hideous creature and you see the transformation, thats what I would have expected here, maybe not hideous of like soeme horror transformation but something more cooler than her just pulling off a 'rubber mask!

duploelabs

Syphonax wrote: »

yea she did remove two masks, i never said one straight after the other. AFIAK she only ever 'inhabits' two persons truly (the girl and Frey) and that is for a mere few minutes, I get the magic part but in doing something so magical I would expect to see a proper magical transformation, all we get to see is her taking the mask off, its very basic and something that stood out for me as been very underdone.

I pretty sure in one of the earlier seasons Melisandre turns into some hideous creature and you see the transformation, thats what I would have expected here, maybe not hideous of like soeme horror transformation but something more cooler than her just pulling off a 'rubber mask!

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

yea she did remove two masks, i never said one straight after the other. AFIAK she only ever 'inhabits' two persons truly (the girl and Frey) and that is for a mere few minutes, I get the magic part but in doing something so magical I would expect to see a proper magical transformation, all we get to see is her taking the mask off, its very basic and something that stood out for me as been very underdone.

I pretty sure in one of the earlier seasons Melisandre turns into some hideous creature and you see the transformation, thats what I would have expected here, maybe not hideous of like soeme horror transformation but something more cooler than her just pulling off a 'rubber mask!

Well if that's your gripe, you're late to the party with it. Just before Arya is turned blind in season 5, there's a complete sequence of 'rubber' masks being removed one by one from a dead body and it ends with the last one being Arya herself.

That's how they rock in the house of black and white.

CMOTDibbler

Syphonax wrote: »

It shirley him

Well one of these things is not like the other.

BetsyEllen

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

I just don't hink it's him. There were three giants in that sequence. Is it not just as likely that they were giants who died north of the wall? Part of Mance Rayder's army that was defeated by Stannis most likely.

It's a long way from the wall to Winterfell. A very long way. We saw that in season 1 when Jon and Tyrion travelled to Castle Black with Benjen. Who's going to lump a massive corpse all that way and dump it on the other side of the wall? And why? Even if the sequence is of white walkers south of the wall some time in the future, how likely is it that Jon wouldn't have burned all the corpses from the BoB? That's the only remote possibility that the giant in that sequence is Wun Wun.

I totally agree with you.
That's why I am confused as to why, I felt, they were making out the zombie to be Wun Wun.
The eye he was shot in was blue; it's obvious that people are going to think it's him.

J. Marston

Read that the Sheeran cameo was for Maisie Williams. Apparently she's a big fan and pushed for it.

paulbok

BetsyEllen wrote: »

I totally agree with you.
That's why I am confused as to why, I felt, they were making out the zombie to be Wun Wun.
The eye he was shot in was blue; it's obvious that people are going to think it's him.

And was there not 3 Giants marching in the dead army? Surely that would suggest there were other Giants?

mcgiggles

Seriously lads.. build a bridge and get over the Ed Sheeran cameo already! he said about 5 words and they all sang for about a minute! He's no better or worse than any other extra in the show!

WhiteMemento9

mcgiggles wrote: »

Seriously lads.. build a bridge and get over the Ed Sheeran cameo already! he said about 5 words and they all sang for about a minute! He's no better or worse than any other extra in the show!

There was just something extremely jarring about the whole thing involving him which effected my enjoyment so much it is hard to just forget it. I like to wait till late at night, dark room, big TV and really get into the atmosphere to get as sucked into the fantasy as possible. That scene completely pulled me out of the world. It was a very bad misstep imo.

kunst nugget

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

There was just something extremely jarring about the whole thing involving him which effected my enjoyment so much it is hard to just forget it. I like to wait till late at night, dark room, big TV and really get into the atmosphere to get as sucked into the fantasy as possible. That scene completely pulled me out of the world. It was a very bad misstep imo.

I think the part where he pulled off his armour to reveal his trademark stripy jumper and he started to sing 'Galway Girl' was the worst. Seriously, there's no Grafton Street in Westeros!

Westeros? Worsteros more like!!!!

Syphonax

duploelabs wrote: »

I cant watch utube vids in work

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Well if that's your gripe, you're late to the party with it. Just before Arya is turned blind in season 5, there's a complete sequence of 'rubber' masks being removed one by one from a dead body and it ends with the last one being Arya herself.

That's how they rock in the house of black and white.

Really, i may have missed that episode but so long as they are rubber masks then my point still stands!

Syphonax

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Well one of these things is not like the other.

The giant they show coming back as a white walker is clearly implied to be the one killing most of them in the earlier episode, even if it is not I wouldnt be to bothered to post pictures trying to show otherwsie but you go nuts laddy