Schools Rugby 2017 2018 Thread SEE MOD WARNING POST #1773

irishfan9

Luke Rigney now with Newbridge College.

Zzippy

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Rugby boi

Castleknock 22 Roscrea 20 , what did I say never write of knock , beat a “top 6” school , personally thought the scoreline flattered roscrea , the knock men are back!!

irishfan9

Rugby boi wrote: »

Castleknock 22 Roscrea 20 , what did I say never write of knock , beat a “top 6” school , personally thought the scoreline flattered roscrea , the knock men are back!!

Who impressed?

Roscrea are a top 6 schoop? Suppose.. really its top 4 and the rest

Granny15

Rugby boi wrote: »

Castleknock 22 Roscrea 20 , what did I say never write of knock , beat a “top 6” school , personally thought the scoreline flattered roscrea , the knock men are back!!

And what did I say they are arguably a top 3 school.

Congrats - now I will have to listen about the glory days of my old man if knock go on a cup run this year

irishfan9

Granny15 wrote: »

And what did I say they are arguably a top 3 school.

Congrats - now I will have to listen about the glory days of my old man if knock go on a cup run this year

They are not a top 3 school

Rugby boi

Once again Cian Clancy , Adam corcoran , two second rows put in a huge shift and there 2 centers were outstanding , anyone know arrangements for semi ?

Rugby boi

Wingers were also very dangerous with ball in hand not sure of there names

Granny15

irishfan9 wrote: »

They are not a top 3 school

Depends how you measure it. If you are judging historically they are. if you are judging by some imaginary points based ranking system over the past few seasons then they're not and Roscrea are

Granny15

Rugby boi wrote: »

Once again Cian Clancy , Adam corcoran , two second rows put in a huge shift and there 2 centers were outstanding , anyone know arrangements for semi ?

Who do you think will win between knock and Gonzaga? Great to see Dublin schools take supremacy again in the League

Rugby boi

According to leInstead website knock and gerrads tbc and newbridge zaga tomorrow

irishfan9

Granny15 wrote: »

Depends how you measure it. If you are judging historically they are. if you are judging by some imaginary points based ranking system over the past few seasons then they're not and Roscrea are

Imaginery points system?

No based off of results this decade they are not a top 3 school. Its quite simple really.

Rugby boi

I have to agree knock are not a top 3 school this year , but could potentially surprise a few this year

Granny15

irishfan9 wrote: »

Imaginery points system?

No based off of results this decade they are not a top 3 school. Its quite simple really.

Same thing

irishfan9

Granny15 wrote: »

Same thing

Results dont matter no?

D14Rugby

Granny15 wrote: »

Depends how you measure it. If you are judging historically they are. if you are judging by some imaginary points based ranking system over the past few seasons then they're not and Roscrea are

Historically its Rock, Belvo, Nure. Its a mute point though really because you have to take it as the big 6 are the top 6 because they're not in the league so you cant really judge them against the other teams bar if they play in the cup but that is very draw oriented in that the best team will normally win but the second best could go out in the first round so its hard to judge

THFC198

D14Rugby wrote: »

Historically its Rock, Belvo, Nure. Its a mute point though really because you have to take it as the big 6 are the top 6 because they're not in the league so you cant really judge them against the other teams bar if they play in the cup but that is very draw oriented in that the best team will normally win but the second best could go out in the first round so its hard to judge

Good to see at least one person with sense on boards haha. Very mature reply

Granny15

D14Rugby wrote: »

Historically its Rock, Belvo, Nure. Its a mute point though really because you have to take it as the big 6 are the top 6 because they're not in the league so you cant really judge them against the other teams bar if they play in the cup but that is very draw oriented in that the best team will normally win but the second best could go out in the first round so its hard to judge

I would contest that it's Nure instead of knock in top 3. Nure only came strong in the early 70's whereas knock have been strong all the way up to the 60's. Historically speaking knock were ahead of nure

League sides win I'd say 1 in 8 games against top 6 opposition in the Cup. Roscrea Gonzaga and Gerard's being one off wonders in beating top 6 opposition and going on Cup runs in the past decade. But out of every 8 teams that qualify for the Cup from the League only 1 will beat a top 6 team every year

FrannoFan

Granny15 wrote: »

I would contest that it's Nure instead of knock in top 3. Nure only came strong in the early 70's whereas knock have been strong all the way up to the 60's. Historically speaking knock were ahead of nure

League sides win I'd say 1 in 8 games against top 6 opposition in the Cup. Roscrea Gonzaga and Gerard's being one off wonders in beating top 6 opposition and going on Cup runs in the past decade. But out of every 8 teams that qualify for the Cup from the League only 1 will beat a top 6 team every year

Not sure about that.
I think of the league finalist and winner one are usually a good bet for 4th in leinster. Obviously it is draw depending. Roscrea knocked out a fancied terenure a few years back and they didn't win league that year. Even the year roscrea won the cup Newbridge won the league. Likewise a castleknock team that lost a final knocked out Marys.
Realistically there is michaels. Rock. Belvo. Would include clongowes but they have fallen back a bit.
After that you have league finalists Marys and terenure.

FrannoFan

Rugby boi wrote: »

According to leInstead website knock and gerrads tbc and newbridge zaga tomorrow

Castleknock and gerrards was close when they met in terms league. Played in gerrards as well.
Would expect another close game there.
Don't know much about Newbridge this year but their results in league were all pretty close.
Gonzaga favourites there i would think?

Granny15

FrannoFan wrote: »

Not sure about that.
I think of the league finalist and winner one are usually a good bet for 4th in leinster. Obviously it is draw depending. Roscrea knocked out a fancied terenure a few years back and they didn't win league that year. Even the year roscrea won the cup Newbridge won the league. Likewise a castleknock team that lost a final knocked out Marys.
Realistically there is michaels. Rock. Belvo. Would include clongowes but they have fallen back a bit.
After that you have league finalists Marys and terenure.

Yes I fancy Roscrea and Zaga to get to a semi each this year at least and then once there it's anybody's guess but I'd guess belvo or rock should crush any of their hopes of glory just because of Zaga performances last year and in the Leagur for the past decade. They have been threatening to go on a run of form for some time.

Roscrea is obvious - final in 2011 narrowly beaten in contested first round game against eventual winners Michaels in 2012 and then their famous game against rock in 2013. There exploits from 2014 onwards are well known. They are a powerhouse of the Cup over the past decade

D14Rugby

Granny15 wrote: »

I would contest that it's Nure instead of knock in top 3. Nure only came strong in the early 70's whereas knock have been strong all the way up to the 60's. Historically speaking knock were ahead of nure

League sides win I'd say 1 in 8 games against top 6 opposition in the Cup. Roscrea Gonzaga and Gerard's being one off wonders in beating top 6 opposition and going on Cup runs in the past decade. But out of every 8 teams that qualify for the Cup from the League only 1 will beat a top 6 team every year

The top 3 are the ones with the most cups thats a simple fair way of judging it. Nure started to strong in the mid 50s, the historically statement is very subjective so the way I'd judge that is everything up to the year current pupils were born so 98 at earliest meaning terenure are still 3rd or even arguably 2nd.

FrannoFan

D14Rugby wrote: »

The top 3 are the ones with the most cups thats a simple fair way of judging it. Nure started to strong in the mid 50s, the historically statement is very subjective so the way I'd judge that is everything up to the year current pupils were born so 98 at earliest meaning terenure are still 3rd or even arguably 2nd.

Well you either count history or you don't. In real terms the last 3 years are the only ones that could count as a 4th year playing seniors could still be involved. Otherwise all history.

Tradition is the other way of looking at it and then how far back do you go?
Are Andrews with 4 titles better than michaels with 2!?

When does the past become irrelevant.

All very philosophical

Rugby boi

In my opinion these are the rankings id have
1 belvo
2 rock
3 Michaels
4 Clongowes
5 nure
6 zaga
7 knock
8 Mary’s
9 roscrea
10 newbridge
Going to be controversial but that’s what I think

D14Rugby

FrannoFan wrote: »

Well you either count history or you don't. In real terms the last 3 years are the only ones that could count as a 4th year playing seniors could still be involved. Otherwise all history.

Tradition is the other way of looking at it and then how far back do you go?
Are Andrews with 4 titles better than michaels with 2!?

When does the past become irrelevant.

All very philosophical

Yep thats it exactly.

Noscrumnowin

Granny15 wrote: »

Any of the other automatic qualifiers playing this weekend?

Rock v Clongowes

Noscrumnowin

Granny15 wrote: »

And what did I say they are arguably a top 3 school.

Congrats - now I will have to listen about the glory days of my old man if knock go on a cup run this year

Who in their right mind woild call a school who hasn’t won the cup since 1965 a top 3 school I would struggle to put them in top 8, statements like these are absolutely rediculous

Granny15

Noscrumnowin wrote: »

Rock v Clongowes

Be interesting to see where the two teams are at. I expect Rock to put 20-30 on them if they've no injuries. Means nothing at Cup time tho

Granny15

Noscrumnowin wrote: »

Who in their right mind woild call a school who hasn’t won the cup since 1965 a top 3 school I would struggle to put them in top 8, statements like these are absolutely rediculous

Depends on if you're using current rankings or "all time" list

FrannoFan

Think gonzaga beat Newbridge in semi final today in senior league

D14Rugby

Granny15 wrote: »

Depends on if you're using current rankings or "all time" list

"all time" they're still not third

Granny15

D14Rugby wrote: »

"all time" they're still not third

All the way up to the 90's they were ahead of Nure on the all time list so until relatively recently they were

D14Rugby

Granny15 wrote: »

All the way up to the 90's they were ahead of Nure on the all time list so until relatively recently they were

But thats not all time? What you're basically saying is if you dont count the last 20 years, which is what a 1/6 th of the time the cup has been run?, then they're in the top 3, pretty far from all time that.

FrannoFan

D14Rugby wrote: »

But thats not all time? What you're basically saying is if you dont count the last 20 years, which is what a 1/6 th of the time the cup has been run?, then they're in the top 3, pretty far from all time that.

Did you take appearances in finals into account?
21 appearances in finals must be pretty high

D14Rugby

FrannoFan wrote: »

Did you take appearances in finals into account?
21 appearances in finals must be pretty high

Terenure have 21 as well i think. As i said in an earlier post though the cup nature means that you can only really tell who the best team is as theyll normally be the winner, the second best could have lost to the best in the first round so being the runners up or semi finalists isnt really a good indicator of the teams strength

irishfan9

St. Michaels SCT side for game against Wellington College:

1. Jack Boyle
2. Lee Barron
3. Chris Hennessy
4. Ryan Baird
5. Matthew Healy
6. Jody Booth
7. Scott Penny
8. Dan O'Donovan
9. Rob Gilsenan
10. David Moran
11. Andrew Smith
12. Jay Barron
13. David Ryan
14. Mark O'Brien
15. Chris Cosgrave
16. Pierce Feeney
17. Adam Peat
18. Fionn Finlay
19. Jonathan Fish
20. Will Hickey
21. Niall Carroll
22. Elliot Haran
23. Eddie Kelly

6 4th years!!

Granny15

D14Rugby wrote: »

But thats not all time? What you're basically saying is if you dont count the last 20 years, which is what a 1/6 th of the time the cup has been run?, then they're in the top 3, pretty far from all time that.

I'm just using the context in which I made the statement. I was saying that growing up knock were top 3 all time. That changed in 90's 00's but my opinion of knock being top 3 didn't change. I suppose I'm biased and sentimental

Granny15

D14Rugby wrote: »

Terenure have 21 as well i think. As i said in an earlier post though the cup nature means that you can only really tell who the best team is as theyll normally be the winner, the second best could have lost to the best in the first round so being the runners up or semi finalists isnt really a good indicator of the teams strength

It's still a significat barometer of success. To navigate a teams way through a tournament to the final 2 teams is a significant achievement and is useful in showing teams that are there or there abouts and knocking on the door of success

Granny15

D14Rugby wrote: »

Terenure have 21 as well i think. As i said in an earlier post though the cup nature means that you can only really tell who the best team is as theyll normally be the winner, the second best could have lost to the best in the first round so being the runners up or semi finalists isnt really a good indicator of the teams strength

It's interesting to look at the most finals outside of Rock:
Knock 21
Nure 22
Clongowes 25
Belvo 26
Mary's 12
Michaels 7
Wesley 7
Roscrea 6
Newbridge 8
St. Andrews 7

It's interesting to see what teams finish their chances at glory and who bottles it. Most of the Top 6 have very similar records

The Lost Sheep

Granny15 wrote: »

It's interesting to look at the most finals outside of Rock:
Knock 21
Nure 22
Clongowes 25
Belvo 26
Mary's 13
Michaels 7

It's interesting to see what teams finish their chances at glory and who bottles it. Most of the Top 6 have very similar records

Bit harsh to say what schools "bottle it" when you have to take so many variables into account.

But of the finals theyve played. What would be more interesting is who schools have played and their win/loss record against the different schools theyve played like Castleknock have 3 wins and 7 losses in finals against Blackrock for example

Gavin4

Gonzaga won hard match yesterday and held off good comeback from a surprisingly adventurous newbridge team. Probably fair result as 3 tries to 2.
Gonzaga missing 2-3 starters but should have a close good match in final v Gerard's or castleknock

irishfan9

At Donnybrook – Gonzaga College 24 (H Gleeson, E Buggy, B O’Donnell try each; J Connolly pen, 3 cons); Newbridge College 12 (S Cahill try, con; L Rigney try).

Gonzaga: Frank O’Grady; Daniel Inglis, Brian O’Donnell, Arthur Henry, Fergus O’hOisin; Hugh Gleeson, Jack Connolly; Michael Gleeson, Eoin Barron, Simon Clear, Caoilim Fassbender, Eoin Buggy, Robbie Kidney (capt), Jack Barry, Jack Coolican.

Replacements: Henry Godson for Barron 28 mins; Liam Tyrell for Coolican 50 mins; Hugo Fitzgerald for M Gleeson, Colm Kirby-O’Briain for Kidney both 58mins; Karl Morgan for O’hOisin 68 mins.

Newbridge: Donal Conroy; Daniel O’Connor, Karmon Fitzgerald, Thomas Sheedy, Con Creedon; Luke Maloney, Jack Doyle; Thomas Grant, Luke Kelly, Luke Rigney, Cian Prendergast (capt), Dylan Morrissey, Conor McGroary, Harry O’Neill, Muiris Cleary.

Replacements: Jordan Nolan for Kelly, Jack Banahan for O’Connor both 47 mins; Marcus Kiely for Fitzgerald 57 mins; Mark Moynihan for McGroary, Sam Cahill for Maloney both 58 mins; Eimhim Conroy for Sheedy 62 mins.

irishfan9

Gavin4 wrote: »

Gonzaga won hard match yesterday and held off good comeback from a surprisingly adventurous newbridge team. Probably fair result as 3 tries to 2.
Gonzaga missing 2-3 starters but should have a close good match in final v Gerard's or castleknock

No Eoin Barr is notable, whose the other starters missing?

Granny15

When's the 'Rards Knock game - tomorrow?

FrannoFan

Granny15 wrote: »

When's the 'Rards Knock game - tomorrow?

Next Wednesday or Thursday

Granny15

Is rock Clongowes in rock or Clongowes? What time KO?

The Lost Sheep

Granny15 wrote: »

Is rock Clongowes in rock or Clongowes? What time KO?

In Kildare at 2. Clongowes tweet their fixtures before most wednesdays/saturdays

Rugby boi

LEINSter domestic says next Wednesday at 2.30 Donnybrook , 2 attacking sides should be a cracker

Noscrumnowin

Granny15 wrote: »

Is rock Clongowes in rock or Clongowes? What time KO?

In Clongowes and normally 2:30 because they have to go to school

FrannoFan

Granny15 wrote: »

When's the 'Rards Knock game - tomorrow?

Next Wednesday at 2:30