What would you choose?

Bigman420

Right lads I'm planning on buying a rifle in the coming months and I'm looking for a bit of advise. I'm looking for a good let's say "all rounder gun" for foxes and rabbits. What would ye recommend? I'm kind of leaning towards a .17HMR

Gorgeousgeorge

.22 magnum for me. The .17 is a fantastic round though

RS98

I asked a similar question in the hunting section titled "caliber advice". Helped make my mind up, have a read of it, lot of good points for the hmr, wmr and 223.

RS

HW100S

Bigman420 wrote: »

Right lads I'm planning on buying a rifle in the coming months and I'm looking for a bit of advise. I'm looking for a good let's say "all rounder gun" for foxes and rabbits. What would ye recommend? I'm kind of leaning towards a .17HMR

Having had one until recently I would say the 17HMR is fantastic. Quiet, no recoil and cheap to run. Rabbits were no problem out 150m. Foxes 100-120m (precise shot req'd at upper limit tho).The gun could probably be pushed to further distances but I couldn't
I had the CZ455 and could head shoot them rabbits all day with ease due to this gun being super accurate.

I recently moved to a 223 because I was getting foxes running due to less precise shooting on my part. Now I can drop them on the spot with less precise shooting than above.

I cant comment on 22 mag as I never had one but would definately recommend the HMR once you remember your distances.

Bigman420 wrote: »

I'm kind of leaning towards a .17HMR

Having had one until recently I would say the 17HMR is fantastic. Quiet, no recoil and cheap to run. Rabbits were no problem out 150m. Foxes 100-120m (precise shot req'd at upper limit tho).The gun could probably be pushed to further distances but I couldn't
I had the CZ455 and could head shoot them rabbits all day with ease due to this gun being super accurate.

I recently moved to a 223 because I was getting foxes running due to less precise shooting on my part. Now I can drop them on the spot with less precise shooting than above.

I cant comment on 22 mag as I never had one but would definately recommend the HMR once you remember your distances.

extremetaz

The debate as to which is better on fox, the HMR or the WMR, could go on for weeks - either will do the job effectively as long as you get the round into the boiler room, and either will take anything smaller no problem. That said, at longer ranges, the WMR is more loopy and the HMR is more wind affected making both harder to place than you'd like on what is basically a 3" target.

If you're going to shoot "mostly rabbit - occasional fox", then either will do fine just take your time and don't f*ck it up when you're a ways away.

On the other hand, if you're going to shoot fox in equal numbers or better, I'd be inclined to step up to the .204 or the .223.
As HW100s has implied, the later is simply the better tool for the bigger quarry. It's far easier to place at any range you're regularly going to engage a fox at in this country, and it has far better terminal ballistics which makes it more forgiving in the first place.

Luckysasha

The Cz 455 comes with interchangeable barrels. So you could pick up a decent.22lr for €250 and buy a .17hmr barrel for another €250 that way you have two good calibre hunting rifles for €500. Bear in mind you will need two licenses to cover both calibres.

Vegeta

I'd try to get a second hand .223 for foxes and a second hand .22lr for rabbits (if you're eating them)

cookimonster

If it's mostly rabbits then I'd stick with a .22 , although the .17HMR would be a good bridge between a bunny basher and a more then adequate foxing calibre such as the .223, the HMR can be a bit expensive on the pocket compared to the .22 when it comes to lashing rounds down range, so to speak, as can the .223.
In the long run I think the duel option of two riflles is a good way to go. Each of the calibres - .22, .22WMR, .17HMR, .223, will do what you want, some better then others (vastly different ranges), some more economically, both cost wise and by way of edible meat return.

If it was me, I would be using this advice here to orchestrate my valid reasons to both myself and the significant other as to why I should have multiple firearms....

Cass

Bigman420 wrote: »

What would ye recommend? I'm kind of leaning towards a .17HMR

The HMR is a fantastic little round. It's accurate, powerful enough for most vermin shooting and cheap to run.

If you've little to no experience with rifles and want a good hunting rifle it's definitely one to look at for your first rifle. If you have experience with rifles and want something with more "punch" then as lads have said you can look to a larger caliber such as the 223.

While the 223 is better than the HMR and i mean nothing derogatory to yourself or anyone, i have seen a few people say (in no uncertain terms) they have gone for this caliber to "offset" their poor shot placement. The number of gut shot foxes i've seen in the last couple of months is growing. Now that is not to say it's an epidemic but frankly if you have good shot placement then even a 22lr can drop foxes at distances longer than most would consider safe or right. However that is an argument for another day.

As said above if its your first rifle then look to the HMR. Keep your shots within a reasonable distance and grow your ability before moving onto a higher caliber.

HW100S wrote: »

Having had one until recently I would say the 17HMR is fantastic. Quiet, no recoil and cheap to run. Rabbits were no problem out 150m. Foxes 100-120m (precise shot req'd at upper limit tho).The gun could probably be pushed to further distances but I couldn't

+1.

I'd agree with this and it ties into what i was saying about knowing your limits and the limits of the rifle.

extremetaz wrote: »

That said, at longer ranges, the WMR is more loopy and the HMR is more wind affected making both harder to place than you'd like on what is basically a 3" target.

Had this debate on the other thread mentioned above.

Thee HMR is better or even superior to the WMR in all aspects except energy. The HMR is flatter and less prone than the WMR to wind deflection.

I don't know where this theory about the HMR being effected by a mouse fart comes from. Yes it gets blown off easily enough but with a 17gr bullet doing over 2,200 fps that is to be expected. However this theory about the HMR being so bad in the wind has taken the focus of other similar calibers and their performance in the wind.

The WMR is slower, larger trajectory arc, and more prone to wind than the HMR. I compared the HMR to three of the popular WMR rounds and out to 300 yards (more than the limit of both rifles) the HMR is better in each case.








I don't want to turn this thread into yet another debate on the merits of each caliber as we're all fed up of talking about it (including me) and as said above it can go on for weeks. However some stories about each caliber seem to have gone from word of mouth to fact which unfairly casts some calibers in a bad light.

The 223 would be better than the HMR or WMR, but then again a 243 is better than a 223 and so on and so forth. Point is look at what you want to do. If it's rabbits with the occasional fox the HMR will work fine. If its foxes mostly with the occasional rabbit (and you're not worried about meat damage) then by all means look at the 223.

cavan shooter

22 hornet...if it's only foxes plenty out there to pick up very little report don't even need a mod.
After that and as someone who has owned all of the rifle caliber mentioned except 204....17 HMR.

20 grn bullet on foxes out to 120-130 yards drops them like a stone. Greys and mags rabbits 180 yards.

Bigman420

extremetaz wrote: »

The debate as to which is better on fox, the HMR or the WMR, could go on for weeks - either will do the job effectively as long as you get the round into the boiler room, and either will take anything smaller no problem. That said, at longer ranges, the WMR is more loopy and the HMR is more wind affected making both harder to place than you'd like on what is basically a 3" target.

If you're going to shoot "mostly rabbit - occasional fox", then either will do fine just take your time and don't f*ck it up when you're a ways away.

On the other hand, if you're going to shoot fox in equal numbers or better, I'd be inclined to step up to the .204 or the .223.
As HW100s has implied, the later is simply the better tool for the bigger quarry. It's far easier to place at any range you're regularly going to engage a fox at in this country, and it has far better terminal ballistics which makes it more forgiving in the first place.

Yes it would be mostly rabbits and the occasional fox. As I have shot many. 22 I think they are a excellent gun for rabbits but I wouldn't be pushed on shooting foxes as I have seen many being shot with. 22 and not drop which I think is wrong, I know its all about the placement of the shot and distance.

As for the. 223 I will be picking up one when the funds get better I have hunted with one occasion and they are fantastic on foxes at a distance.

Think I will look into the .17 and pick one up.

tac foley

cavan shooter wrote: »

22 hornet...if it's only foxes plenty out there to pick up very little report don't even need a mod.
After that and as someone who has owned all of the rifle caliber mentioned except 204....17 HMR.

20 grn bullet on foxes out to 120-130 yards drops them like a stone. Greys and mags rabbits 180 yards.

The only problem I can see with .22 Hornet is the appallingly high cost of the stuff.

tac

lefthooker

Cant dispute any of the points made by the guys above with regard to the hmr but personally I prefer the extra punch and range of a CF, .204 .223 etc. Haven't shot either of the hornets. It shouldn't mitigate against poor shot placement tho. Suppose it all comes down to cost with ammo price being the variable and maybe deciding factor