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Official Conor McGregor thread (part 4) *Updated Warning in 1st Post Re:Boxing match
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Charmer!
It's true, I've avoided the forum for the few days since the fight for fear of the scutter being posted. Pleasantly surprised to see some neutral and genuine breakdowns
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Stopped reading at 'Floyd was shutdown for three rounds'.
Anyone that can't see Floyd was just getting the measure of Conor is those first three rounds and letting him tire himself out. Sorry, delusion on an epic scale.Here is one for you. Why did the career great pro need to get the measure of the novice pro? Did the novice not need to? Because it looked like Conor got his measure perfect, as well as winning the 3 rds..
And, if he did need to get the measure, was it planned to lose the rds? Could the career great pro not have got the measure and also won the rds?
Delusion is right, in making out Floyd deliberately gave the rds to Conor. Suits the boxing fan narrative, but it's just not true, and kind of disingenuous.
See Walshy, this is what you used to look like to us
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hewhoscares wrote: »Its testament to the UFCs marketing that when Nate Diaz asks for a fair price for his time that its instantly shot down as ludicrous.
If we work on the Meltzer numbers (as sketchy as they are) Diaz adds 300k PPV buys to a McGregor card and means an increase in the live gate.
Ignoring VAT (or the US equivalent) compared to Alvarez who brought a belt to the table, as well as a much stronger card and the added MSG prestige - thats $18m additional PPV revenue.
According to the documents prepared by Deutsche Bank before the WME/IMG takeover, the UFC are tied into a 50/50 split with their PPV provider (which was NeuLion until the Floyd debacle). Nate bringing 300k additional buys is indeed $18m but that still only means an extra $9m gross revenue.
There's 100% no question the UFC underpay the entire roster compared to most mainstream American sports and the most underpaid athlete in the UFC (by a country mile) is Conor McGregor. Conor has brought in roughly 6.75 million PPV buys in his last 5 UFC fights and his disclosed pay for those events only totaled $12.5 million. Even if we assume his cut of the PPV's went to $5 after the Aldo fight, that's still only something like $40 million total.
Paying Conor $40 million when he's making the UFC $200 million gross is crazy. Compare that to Mighty Mouse who made $450,000 for his last fight on a card that barely broke even. It's scandalous but on the plus-side it does mean the UFC have a lot of leeway in negotiations with Conor to greatly increase his pay and keep him happy.
Conor v Nate 3 - let's say it does close to 2 million buys (reasonable guess): That should leave a pot of $55 million on the UFC side of things after staging the event. Anybody suggesting Nate should be paid $30 million is smoking too much weed. For Nate to even get $20 million means Conor would have to get more, say $30 million, which means the UFC walks away with ... $5m.
That is not happening. Bottom line, the UFC know they can put on Conor v A Broomstick and there's no way the event does less than 1.4 million buys and they can also pay the broomstick less than $4 million all-in.
TL;DR - Nate is living in la-la-land if he thinks he a) deserves b) has a chance of getting $20/$30 million to fight Conor. We had this A-side/B-side debate with Floyd for a month but I'm guaranteeing the UFC knows the A-side here and will not be paying the B-side over $10 million.He doesn't but the tax office would have to prove otherwise. I've seen on some fight payouts that he's listed as a resident there, probably why he purchased a house in the first place.
EDIT: IT was actually the NSAC hearing over the Diaz monster can thing. He was asked where he resided, and he responded California I believe. It's why his community service was in the States.
J.K has said himself the reason Conor won't fight in Ireland again is tax.
Conor's pretty blonde lawyer said "Mr. McGregor is a resident of California and is in the process of purchasing a property in Vegas" during that hearing and I think that led to a bit of confusion over where he would be doing his community service. I was sort of surprised Eddie Alvarez didn't throw that in his face during the UFC 205 build-up because Conor is always saying his home is Ireland.
Speaking of which, 5 out of his last 10 follows on Instagram are famous American estate-agents who flog houses to celebrities, so that probably reflects where his head is at with his new money.I re-watched the fight.
Few points. I enjoyed the fight/spectacle a lot more than when I watched it live
4. To say Conor was 5-0 up is not a stretch. Watch the rds. 3-0 I had him after 3. rd 4 and 5 were very close and competitive.
6. One single rd Conor was outgunned. Rd 9. The rest (barring rd 10) he was either competitive or victorious. He may have lost a few, but he was fighting and competitive.
7. Conor gave Floyd more bother and hassle than a whole heap of other pro boxers, some elites.
8. Ray Leonard, unless I missed it never once gave a score of a rd or rds. He never gave a card. He's a fence sitter. Always has been.
People will be thinking I hacked your account
It's lovely when someone is open minded enough to change an opinion. I'd just add one thing - I've rewatched Round 8 in particular countless times now and to my mind it's the second most impressive thing Conor has done in his entire career, only 2nd to Round 4 against Nate.
Floyd was 100% going all-out in Round 8 and some of Conor's boxing was phenomenal in that round. He landed some really hurtful body shots, used some great shoulder rolls and slips and was strong enough in clinch range. He also ate some clean shots and didn't panic. To throw 59 punches in round 8 against an unbeaten boxer, to land 27% of his power punches that deep in the fight and, most importantly, to still have the ability to make Floyd miss (Floyd only landed 42%) was incredibly good stuff.normanoffside wrote: »He needed to pick his shots. Agreed. That comes with experience.
114 in 3 rounds is not massive. Wayne McCullough used to throw 114 punches/round!
Wayne used to fight between 115lbs and 126lbs. There's a physical reason why a McCullough or a Mighty Mouse can throw far more volume than heavier fighters. Conor's volume stacks up extremely well to Berto/Canelo/GGG.
I feel one thing that hasn't been addressed (at least in public) is a possible communication issue between Conor and JK/Roddy during fights.
In the Diaz 2 fight, he was told in between rounds to basically relax with the low percentage stuff and low-and-behold Conor comes out and almost immediately throws a low pecentage spinning back kick, prompting John to shout at him. In the Floyd fight, John advised him not to throw when Floyd was shelling up because he was wasting his energy unnecessarily and, yep, Conor went straight out and unloaded on a shelled-up Floyd.
To me, that's a blatant communication issue because both incidents came at the beginning of a round where the advice should be fresh in the mind, as opposed to the middle of a round where all fighters can forget advice in the heat of battle. It might not be a problem in future contests because Conor is brilliant at ending fights early.
In particular, I didn't like how Conor was looking to the big screen in between rounds. I know he does it at times in MMA but this was different. It was as if he was giddy with excitement at how well he was doing against one of his idols. He had the expression of a man thinking "OMG I'm ACTUALLY in Vegas beating Floyd 3 rounds to 0 in a boxing ring".
I'd have preferred if he was a bit more focused on what Owen/John were telling him and I definitely think the lads got lost in the moment too. On the whole, the corner advice was decent (I'd grade it B-) but early on they looked to be just as giddy as Conor at how well things were going.
Conor paced himself really well rounds 1-3 and that's reflected in the punch stats. But then he went hell-for-leather in rounds 4 and 5 throwing the same amount of punches in those rounds as he did in the 3 previous rounds. Hindsight is 20-20 but sudden explosions in activity are always going to be costly on your energy levels down the stretch. Conor threw 39 punches in round 3 and spiked to almost double (65) thrown in round 4.
Someone needed to get hold of him at the end of the 4th and communicate firmly that this is looking like a 12-round fight and implore/beg Conor to lower his work-rate to a more sustainable level.
Primarily, I was disappointed that Conor responded to Floyd's forward-pressure by throwing more volume. In boxing (and in MMA), the clinch is a vital tool to deal with waves of oncoming pressure and we saw that to good effect in the Diaz 2 contest where Conor was able to tie Nate up for long periods against the fence. Conor's instinct against Floyd was to throw in response, I'd have much preferred strong corner advice for him to clinch - especially as he was strong in the clinch and Robert Byrd was a) slow separating them and b) allowing Conor to get away with murder with the rabbit punches.
Overall, the fact is this - Conor threw more punches in rounds 5, 6, 7, 8 than he did in rounds 1, 2, 3, 4. That alone should shatter the myth he gassed early because his output was increasing as the fight went on, not dropping off, his power (to the body) looked just as solid too. It should also underscore they paced the fight wrongly given we know he faded badly from the middle of round 9 into round 10.
I felt Owen/John could have done better but it was a tough learning experience for them too. It should have been extremely obvious after 3 rounds that knocking Floyd out wasn't happening and they should have drilled that into Conor's head - "this is going the distance, 9 rounds to go" - in order to pace himself physically and mentally. I agree with Firas Zahabi's point when he said Conor copes much better when he expects a war and he panics a bit when he expects an early finish that doesn't come.
Anyway, criticism is extremely easy with the benefit of hindsight. I hope they all sit down and address the communication issues though because part of improving is problem-recognition. Coaches can't make their fighter listen to them (e.g. Henri Hooft screaming at Rumble to no effect, Mark Henry being ignored by Eddie Alvarez etc) but they can at least sit down afterwards as a team and try improve.
Conor has spent his entire career stopping people in rounds 1 and 2, so the delivery and receipt of corner advice in between rounds is something they never really needed to work on. I think they do now and that can only be a good thing
I hope we see John on the MMA Hour this week too. He doesn't owe the public any explanations but it'd be nice to hear what he made of the experience because, in my mind, the positives far outweigh the negatives. Conor did brilliantly well and I'm sure they're proud of him, just like I am 0 -
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