Mopeds not capable of more than 20mph

melkat

Sorry if there is a thread for this already, but I was thinking of buying a little moped and I'm just wondering the laws and licence rules etc.
I've read a few places that you don't need a licence if it can't go faster than 20mph but do you need to tax/insure/NCT version for mopeds it?

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks

CJhaughey

You need a license for a Moped, and Tax and Insurance.
No NCT for bikes.

Max Headroom

As much as i hate to say it..20mph.:eek:..you'd be better off with a bicycle..or better still walk..:)

Del2005

Just buy an electric bicycle or stick a 2 stroke engine to a normal bicycle. The fact that both require licence, tax, insurance and a lid is ignored by the Gardai.

Lumen

Del2005 wrote: »

Just buy an electric bicycle or stick a 2 stroke engine to a normal bicycle. The fact that both require licence, tax, insurance and a lid is ignored by the Gardai.

On your first point, you're wrong. Electric bicycles do not require any of those things although there are some restrictions.

On your second point, you're wrong. For instance...

http://www.leinsterleader.ie/news/home/251607/kilcullen-man-on-motorised-bicycle-was-drink-driving.html

spurious

A top speed of 20mph would be a death trap. There are many times you need a bit of oomph to get out of trouble.

Lumen

spurious wrote: »

A top speed of 20mph would be a death trap. There are many times you need a bit of oomph to get out of trouble.

If that were true, bicycles would be more dangerous than motorcycles. They are not, despite motorcycles requiring substantially more protective gear and mandatory training, licensing etc.

http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-rank-driving-cycling-walking-and-motorcycling-risk

OTOH, you'd have to motorcycle like a cyclist which would be...awkward, especially on roads with mandatory cycle lanes which motorcyclists are not legally allowed to use.

MSVforever

For mopeds/scooters up to 49cc you need an AM license plus tax and insurance). If you got your car license before october 2006 then it will include the AM license.

Thanks to the EU these mopeds/scooters are limited to 45 kph which makes them unsafe imo (as you are an obstacle/nuisance for car drivers even on 50 kph limited roads).

Electric bicycles don't require license, tax and insurance if the following criterias are met: engine up to 250w, pedal assist only up to 25 kph, no throttle as this would be classified as a mpv.

My wife has an electric bicycle for a couple of years now and its very handy in strong headwinds and uphills. The downside is the weight (unless you buy one for a couple of grand). If you forget to charge it and run out of juice then you are in for a proper work out...lol..

There are faster ebikes (called s pedelecs) on the market which assist you up to 45 kph with a 500w engine but require a license, tax and insurance. They re very expensive (from €3000 up to around €6500).

Those bicycles with a 49cc engine attached are in a grey area as they cant be ridden without pedalling. You need to pedal in order to start the engine or from a dead stop. Once you are over 10 kph you can use the throttle only.
In most EU countries they are illegal. However in Ireland there is no specific law afaik so it depends on the mood of the gards when you are stopped.
The ones I see around seem to be cheap converted €100 bikes which I wouldnt feel safe on without an engine. Total deathtraps.

Max Headroom

Nuff said.............:)

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=99188887

Del2005

Lumen wrote: »

On your first point, you're wrong. Electric bicycles do not require any of those things although there are some restrictions.

On your second point, you're wrong. For instance...

http://www.leinsterleader.ie/news/home/251607/kilcullen-man-on-motorised-bicycle-was-drink-driving.html

Electric bikes require a licence pedal assisted don't.

One person convicted for DUI while ignoring the licence and insurance issues proves my point on the 2 stroke.

ancuncha

Lumen wrote: »

If that were true, bicycles would be more dangerous than motorcycles. They are not, despite motorcycles requiring substantially more protective gear and mandatory training, licensing etc.

http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-rank-driving-cycling-walking-and-motorcycling-risk

OTOH, you'd have to motorcycle like a cyclist which would be...awkward, especially on roads with mandatory cycle lanes which motorcyclists are not legally allowed to use.

Those figures aren't misleading at all , done by per billion miles.

3 hours in a car or motorbike gets you Castlebar to Dublin (150 miles-ish)
How many hours on the road on a bike or walking?

TheChizler

Del2005 wrote: »

One person convicted for DUI while ignoring the licence and insurance issues proves my point on the 2 stroke.

Considering you can be arrested for DUI on a push bike I'm not sure it does.

Max Headroom

I love these pointless threads started by trolls that get the "i'm right youre wrong " brigade out....:rolleyes:

Lumen

ancuncha wrote: »

Those figures aren't misleading at all , done by per billion miles.

3 hours in a car or motorbike gets you Castlebar to Dublin (150 miles-ish)
How many hours on the road on a bike or walking?

Well OK, but comparing deaths-per-hour rather than deaths-per-mile widens the safety gap between bicycles and motorbikes even further.

Having experienced more crashes on various forms of transport than I'd like to admit to (I used to be even stupider than I am now) I just don't buy the "accelerating out of trouble" argument. In an emergency situation, if there is the choice between avoiding the accident by slowing down or speeding up, then braking your way out of it is almost always a better choice than accelerating, because if you get it wrong you'll have the accident at a lower speed.

Lumen

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/887207464172744705

statto25

Lumen wrote: »

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/887207464172744705

One one hand I'm impressed with the bike craftsmanship, on the other hand they were on the M11 on bike!

Del2005

statto25 wrote: »

One one hand I'm impressed with the bike craftsmanship, on the other hand they were on the M11 on bike!

Not much craftsmanship when they leave off the front break. Doesn't even look nicely put together, it's just a rough old bike with a 2 stroke and chains running everywhere.

Lumen

statto25 wrote: »

One one hand I'm impressed with the bike craftsmanship, on the other hand they were on the M11 on bike!

It reminds me of that old chestnut "if you can't be a good example then you'll just have to be a horrible warning".

Hotblack Desiato

MSVforever wrote: »

Those bicycles with a 49cc engine attached are in a grey area as they cant be ridden without pedalling. You need to pedal in order to start the engine or from a dead stop. Once you are over 10 kph you can use the throttle only.
In most EU countries they are illegal. However in Ireland there is no specific law afaik so it depends on the mood of the gards when you are stopped.

Nothing grey about it at all - totally illegal and can't be made legal. The fact that most guards either don't know the law or can't be bothered enforcing it isn't really a surprise - but that Leinster Leader article where the judge openly admits in court to not knowing what the law is either is a new one on me!

Traffic Corps would do you for sure on one of those and rightly so.

Edit: Knew I'd heard of that judge before, seems a bit, eh, eccentric...

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/clare-daly-speeding-case-timeline-of-court-appearances-1.2846098

Lumen

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

The fact that most guards either don't know the law or can't be bothered enforcing it isn't really a surprise

Steady on now, I'm not sure we'd want them to start rigidly policing bus lanes and stop lines.

professore

Lumen wrote: »

If that were true, bicycles would be more dangerous than motorcycles. They are not, despite motorcycles requiring substantially more protective gear and mandatory training, licensing etc.

This is anecdotal, but I really think in an urban environment, bicycles are more dangerous than motorcycles. Out on the open road, of course motorcycles are more dangerous.

I "motorcycle" and "bicycle" in an urban environment and have had far more close shaves on the bicycle.

Del2005

Lumen wrote: »

Steady on now, I'm not sure we'd want them to start rigidly policing bus lanes and stop lines.

Big difference between using a proven safer part of the road by vulnerable users than blantenly breaking the law regarding insurance and PPE.

Gazzmonkey

Lumen wrote: »

Having experienced more crashes on various forms of transport than I'd like to admit to (I used to be even stupider than I am now) I just don't buy the "accelerating out of trouble" argument. In an emergency situation, if there is the choice between avoiding the accident by slowing down or speeding up, then braking your way out of it is almost always a better choice than accelerating, because if you get it wrong you'll have the accident at a lower speed.

Not quite... I was overtaking an old Vectra a few years ago that was full of little hoods. Immediately as I started overtaking they put the foot down which left me stuck for longer on the wrong side of the road with a Merc coming the other way.

Luckily I was in an EK4 so when the big cam lobes kicked in I was able to pull ahead and swerve back into lane just as the Merc passed and I do mean just as it passed.

If I didn't have that extra bhp it would've been a head on collision, power gets you out of trouble just as easily as it gets you into trouble.

Del2005

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

Not quite... I was overtaking an old Vectra a few years ago that was full of little hoods. Immediately as I started overtaking they put the foot down which left me stuck for longer on the wrong side of the road with a Merc coming the other way.

Luckily I was in an EK4 so when the big cam lobes kicked in I was able to pull ahead and swerve back into lane just as the Merc passed and I do mean just as it passed.

If I didn't have that extra bhp it would've been a head on collision, power gets you out of trouble just as easily as it gets you into trouble.

Or you could of let off the loud pedal and pulled back in behind. Don't get me wrong I enjoy using power but saying that the only way to get safely back onto your own side of the road when the person you try to pass floors it is to go even faster is BS, the safest option is to ease off and pull back.

Lumen

Del2005 wrote: »

Or you could of let off the loud pedal and pulled back in behind. Don't get me wrong I enjoy using power but saying that the only way to get safely back onto your own side of the road when the person you try to pass floors it is to go even faster is BS, the safest option is to ease off and pull back.

Yes, but that's letting them win! The recommended course of action here is a punishment pass on the turbo 'busa.

blade1

Say if you have one,how do u go about insuring it?

Gazzmonkey

Del2005 wrote: »

Or you could of let off the loud pedal and pulled back in behind. Don't get me wrong I enjoy using power but saying that the only way to get safely back onto your own side of the road when the person you try to pass floors it is to go even faster is BS, the safest option is to ease off and pull back.

Well aware of it

Sometimes your space gets swallowed up as soon as you leave the queue to make the overtake. But in my case by the time the penny dropped that there was a problem, I genuinely believed I was past the point of no return and scared that the overtakee would hit the brakes when I hit the brakes.

Anyway the extra pull ended up getting me out of trouble, it would've been a clean overtake had he not hit the gas.

Hotblack Desiato

Lumen wrote: »

Having experienced more crashes on various forms of transport than I'd like to admit to (I used to be even stupider than I am now) I just don't buy the "accelerating out of trouble" argument.

It's saved my ass more than once.

If a car beside you starts to move into your lane, where do you go? If you're at least level with the front of the car it's going to be quicker to accelerate out of the way than to brake.