Season 7 Episode 2 "Stormborn" - "Book readers"

Nody

Note anything after this post may contain spoilers for the episode; do not read or open this thread until you have watched the whole episode!!!

This is ONLY about the specific episode! No information from any other source but listed below are allowed to be posted but book related information is allowed as well as the lore from the DVDs. Anything relating to interviews or articles directly related to this episode can be posted with a spoiler tag.

The "Next Episode" and any speculation on what may come in the future episodes should be put in the appropriate Season 7 speculation thread; any funny pictures from the episode should be posted in this thread until Wednesday rather than the funny picture thread.

In addition anyone picking up 3 yellow cards will be banned from the forum for the current season; in case of serious enough transgressions the ban may come earlier than 3 cards.

Thread will be unlocked on Sunday evening.

Savage Tyrant

Yeah, that cut away from Jorah's greyscale to the bowl of food can fück right off... Grim!

Missandei is a fine fine shaped woman... But grey worm's little worm was less than useless. At least his tongue was put to good use for the first time because his speech scenes are worse than terrible.

wp_rathead

While he is nothing like the book version, I fecking loved Euron in this episode- killing 2/3 sand snakes was a plus.
I'm half asleep, did he kill Yara in the end? Or she still alive?

Wonder will he tie Elia to the Prow of the Silence like he did Falia Flowers?

Also I guess there is still alot of Reek in Theon afterall. Wonder where his arc goes now

rawn

What. An. ENDING!

I know loads of things bothered me about this episode but I'm going to forget about them til tomorrow and ride the high from that ending. Can't wait til next week.

Savage Tyrant

With Arya's dire wolf getting a major scene, you'd think they'd at least give a nod as to where Ghost has been in recent episodes.
Looks like Littlefinger will seize control of the North through Sansa in Jon's absence. Likely with the information that Jon is a Targaryen. If he doesn't have that information already (I thought he was about to drop it in the crypt) then Bran should be arriving with it at Winterfell in the next episode. He clearly doesn't have a teleportation device like Jamie and Varys had last season. Obviously not as quick without his Hor...dor.
Arya should also be arriving soon. I expect all the legitimate Stark children to be reunited in Winterfell soon.
That naval battle scene was fantastic. Little dissapointing the Theon regressed again. Though I think getting Wine for Elleria (sp?) foreshadowed that. No idea where his arc goes from here.

ZeitgeistGlee

mfw I want to complain about how yet again the episode dedicated too much time to pointless character fluffing (Grey Worm/Missandei) over actually advancing the plot and what little plot advancement we got didn't make a huge amount of sense but the last five minutes killed two Sand Snakes so I'm automatically obliged to give everything I didn't like before that a pass. :pac:

Bonus points for Sansa yet again undermining Jon at council and Varys and Dany's affiliation being so clumsily handled due to Aegon being removed.

letowski

wp_rathead wrote:

While he is nothing like the book version, I fecking loved Euron in this episode- killing 2/3 sand snakes was a plus. I'm half asleep, did he kill Yara in the end? Or she still alive?

Think both her and Ellaria are going to be hostages.

ZeitgeistGlee

Is there any other reason Jon is taking Davos with him to Dragonstone other than Davos is familiar with how to get there/the physical layout? Seems like he'd be much better left as the rational/common sense counsellor to Sansa to counterbalance Littlefinger's inevitable machinations. Davos doesn't know Dany, or her supporters particularly well so aside from general support it doesn't seem like he'd be a great amount of use and will likely get overly emotional when he sees Mel again.

Riddle101

The episode was pretty good. I thought the sea battle was a little too short. They kind've crammed it all in for the final five minutes of the show. They could have done away with some other scenes like the romance scene, and saved room for the battle, but I guess they got the message clear.

I'm disappointed with Theon but I guess he fled because he saw that there was no hope anyway, if he had stayed he might have been captured, and Yara would have been killed.

Euron doesn't mess about. He was the first one off the boat and started hacking away straight away. Then he cut down those two sand snakes, and captured Yara. He was pretty badass this episode, even if he was only in it for the last 5 minutes.

Kunkka

Good episode, so that wasn't Nymeria?

Jesus Theon's arch has plummeted again!

theteal

Am I the only one who's convinced they're setting it up for Theon to grow some metaphorical bits and come back to save the day?

Anyway, just when you thought nothing was happening (other than a bit girl on girl), Euron's big lunatic head pops up to save the episode.

Questions. How long would it take for a dragon to fly up to Winterfell? Also, couldn't one of them have flown ahead to scout the route for the ships?

Daith

Kunkka wrote: »

Good episode, so that wasn't Nymeria?

It was but I think like Arya before her she's "no one" atm. I fully expect Nymeria to reappear saving Arya. (Actually I don't expect her to be seen again. The show really doesn't like featuring them and I get their reasons)

Ghost must be huge by now too?

I could have done without the Missandei and Grey Worm scene even if I like both characters individually.

The episode zipped along other than that. Dany spelling out her plan and now 2/4 of her allies are captured and I'm not holding up much hope for another 1/4.

I think the dragons aren't invincible line won't help Cersei as much as someone else.

EagererBeaver

When are they going to get to the fireworks factory?

The Missandei/Grey Worm scene was beyond ridiculous. A waste of five minutes.

Good battle scene though. Thought that was going to be The one's final redemption for a second. Alas, he really is and always will be a cockless coward.

Daith

I forgot how much I enjoyed Euron starting his attack in silence. Very appropriate.

Sam's "something more poetic" line...hmm whatever could that be.

I'm not looking forward to the Sand Snakes meeting Cersei. I mean hate their portrayal but eugh.

Nody

EagererBeaver wrote: »

redemption for a second. Alas, he really is and always will be a cockless coward.

I think you got him wrong on this one; I think he recognised the fight was lost and Euron would kill his sister so he fled to free her later instead and then kill Euron with a dirk in the back instead. Gut feeling only but I think he's in for a redemption ark in general but I cold be wrong.

EagererBeaver

Nody wrote: »

I think you got him wrong on this one; I think he recognised the fight was lost and Euron would kill his sister so he fled to free her later instead and then kill Euron with a dirk in the back instead. Gut feeling only but I think he's in for a redemption ark in general but I cold be wrong.

We'll see. Possibly.

rawn

EagererBeaver wrote:

We'll see. Possibly.

I think it might simply be down to knowing she was lost and refusing to get captured by anyone ever again, no matter what.

After the Snakes conversation about the Mountain in the episode, i can imagine Cersei gives Elia and Stabby Snake to him, like she did with the septa. It would be cool if they did manage to break free and kill him!

bnt

Varys is lucky to be alive, there. I thought we'd seen the last of Melisandre, but now she's back advising Dany? Tyrion clearly doesn't know the role she played in the death of Renly Baratheon, and might not be so accepting of her if he did. :eek:

I honestly think that was Yara hanging from the bowsprit of her ship at the end, there - that she's dead. Euron wanted her dead, and he has Ellaria Sand as a hostage, so he doesn't need her. Except to torture her, perhaps. So dead would be better.

rawn

It was Whippy Snake, hanging from her whip. Yara is useful as a hostage against Daeny.

Also, Jon and Davos are en route to Daeny. They won't be too happy to see Melisandre after swearing to kill her if they saw her again.

Varik

bnt wrote: »

Varys is lucky to be alive, there. I thought we'd seen the last of Melisandre, but now she's back advising Dany? Tyrion clearly doesn't know the role she played in the death of Renly Baratheon, and might not be so accepting of her if he did. :eek:

I honestly think that was Yara hanging from the bowsprit of her ship at the end, there - that she's dead. Euron wanted her dead, and he has Ellaria Sand as a hostage, so he doesn't need her. Except to torture her, perhaps. So dead would be better.

Definitely not Yara, and Tyrion "accepted" the one who killed his niece.

CMOTDibbler

Well now we know what Euron's 'great gift' is. Cersei will be so pleased.

amos13

Have we just had the first hint that Azor Ahai and the prince that was promised are two different people? Mel telling Dany that she has a role to play as does another?

We have no indication yet that Bran will head to Winterfell, but I'm surprised that a raven hasn't even arrived from CB to inform Jon of his existence. Considering ravens were sent and received during the course of this episode and CB is closer.

Nymeria is fecking HUGE. That's what I expected direwolves to be like, ghost is a scrawny yoke altogether.

Good episode, but I must ask, why did the ironborn bring the sand sisters to Dorne? In the closing scene of season 6, they had their own ships. This episode seemed to infer they didn't?

CMOTDibbler

amos13 wrote: »

Have we just had the first hint that Azor Ahai and the prince that was promised are two different people? Mel telling Dany that she has a role to play as does another?

Well I suppose we need to be kept in suspense since there are far fewer candidates now.

amos13 wrote: »

We have no indication yet that Bran will head to Winterfell, but I'm surprised that a raven hasn't even arrived from CB to inform Jon of his existence. Considering ravens were sent and received during the course of this episode and CB is closer.

Castle Black is without a Maester at the moment. Perhaps there's somebody there who can read and write, but it's not a given.

amos13 wrote: »

Good episode, but I must ask, why did the ironborn bring the sand sisters to Dorne? In the closing scene of season 6, they had their own ships. This episode seemed to infer they didn't?

There were a few Dorne ships in the fleet, but probably not enough to provide an escort. And even then...

J. Marston

I hope Ghost is that big when we see him next but maybe Nymeria is bigger because she's wild. Ghost is kinda domesticated.

FunLover18

Is Littlefinger on Arya's list?

Euron should be poisoned at this stage after that fight with the sandsnakes, lest we forget how they got the name, although I suspect the show has conveniently forgot that little detail.

Ninjavampire

While the Greyworm/ Missandei scene lasted too long, I liked how we got more insight into his character and how he became the leader of the Unsullied army, addressing the obvious fact that he doesn't appear the strongest or most capable warrior at first glance.

CMOTDibbler

FunLover18 wrote: »

Is Littlefinger on Arya's list?

Euron should be poisoned at this stage after that fight with the sandsnakes, lest we forget how they got the name, although I suspect the show has conveniently forgot that little detail.

Would they have poison on their weapons at all times? And would it not deteriorate or even accidentally poison someone?

Triceratops Ballet

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Castle Black is without a Maester at the moment. Perhaps there's somebody there who can read and write, but it's not a given.

But Bran and Meera can both read and write at a minimum

EagererBeaver

Reading and writing is only part of it. Plenty can do that. "Ravenry" is a skilled discipline however - maesters have a dedicated coloured link on their chain for it.

Daith

EagererBeaver wrote: »

Reading and writing is only part of it. Plenty can do that. "Ravenry" is a skilled discipline however - maesters have a dedicated coloured link on their chain for it.

Bran can warg a Raven to and send it to Winterfell?

I'm surprised the Snakes don't hold poison vials to use if captured.

amos13

EagererBeaver wrote: »

Reading and writing is only part of it. Plenty can do that. "Ravenry" is a skilled discipline however - maesters have a dedicated coloured link on their chain for it.

We're talking about the brother of the king in the north, who can warg any animal, knows all history, is literally the three eyed "raven" and has been apart from his family for 6 years so surely must be desperate to make contact. There's no impediment to him getting word to Jon. Unless there is a reason for him not to tell Jon that he's yet another sibling back from the dead

CMOTDibbler

amos13 wrote: »

We're talking about the brother of the king in the north, who can warg any animal, knows all history, is literally the three eyed "raven" and has been apart from his family for 6 years so surely must be desperate to make contact. There's no impediment to him getting word to Jon. Unless there is a reason for him not to tell Jon that he's yet another sibling back from the dead

I would have thought that it would be best revealed face to face. Not sure the raven's 140 character limit* would cover all the info.





*This may not be true.

bur

Theon's nope! moment.

bur

FunLover18 wrote: »

Is Littlefinger on Arya's list?

Euron should be poisoned at this stage after that fight with the sandsnakes, lest we forget how they got the name, although I suspect the show has conveniently forgot that little detail.

Does anyone in Westeros know he's the one who betrayed Ned?

duploelabs

bur wrote: »

Does anyone in Westeros know he's the one who betrayed Ned?

Varys?

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

bur wrote: »

Does anyone in Westeros know he's the one who betrayed Ned?

He seemed to have a real "oh f*CK" reaction when he heard Tyrion was Dany's Hand, I was wondering if it's just because he thought he was dead/knows how good he is, or does Tyrion know something he can't have Jon finding out. Can't for the life of me remember what it could be, but something to do with Ned or the dagger maybe..

amos13

bur wrote: »

Does anyone in Westeros know he's the one who betrayed Ned?

Varys. Who coincidentally Jon is enroute to meet. And LF knows that Varys will be there so I'm not expecting him to hang around for Jon's return. It's just a matter of how much damage he'll wreak before he toddles off back to the vale.

On another note, where is that annoying little Vale lord in all of this?

EagererBeaver

Daith wrote: »

Bran can warg a Raven to and send it to Winterfell?

I'm surprised the Snakes don't hold poison vials to use if captured.

He can certainly warg into ravens. We know nothing of how long it is safe for him to be "out of it". Saying "Bran can take care of all that" would be a bit simplistic and, like the dragonbinder horn, all too deus ex machina at this point in the story.

CMOTDibbler

duploelabs wrote: »

Varys?

Also I'm fairly sure Sandor Clegane was there as well.

Surprising how many who were present in that room are now dead. Well probably not that surprising really.

Tywin, Barristan Selmy, Pretty much all the kingsguard except Jaime, Janos Slynt, Ned (obvs.), Joffrey, etc.

Easier to count who's left really.

Daith

EagererBeaver wrote: »

He can certainly warg into ravens. We know nothing of how long it is safe for him to be "out of it". Saying "Bran can take care of all that" would be a bit simplistic and, like the dragonbinder horn, all too deus ex machina at this point in the story.

Bran being able to warg a raven and deliver a message would hardly be a deus ex machina. It might be simplistic or poor story telling but the show ain't short of that tbh.

I don't think it would happen like that though and could see it just taking a while for Bran and Meera to get to Winterfell. I'd say it's more about getting Jon out of Winterfell first before Bran arrives.

CMOTDibbler

Thought that was a great episode. Dany pushing Varys to reveal his true loyalties and then pushing him again to warn her if he thinks she's going off the rails. She displayed a lot of insight in that scene and not just about other people. Melisandre and Tyrion putting in a word for Jon and in Mel's case the danger that puts her in was pretty selfless.

The conversation between Jaime and Randyll Tarly was interesting, but I'll leave that for the speculation thread. The whole "furriners coming to tek ur wimmin" thing was a bit overplayed, Tyrion had already recognised that danger and we didn't really need it repeated.

I know Theon will get stick for legging it, but it wasn't as though he was cowardly during the fighting. He could see the futility in trying to rescue Yara and took the only sensible option.

Finally, I'm not sure whether the 'cure' for greyscale is worth it.

awec

Where is Bronn?

CMOTDibbler

awec wrote: »

Where is Bronn?

Getting drunk and laid one presumes. He's not exactly one for hanging around throne rooms and being diplomatic.

Disposable1

rawn wrote: »

What. An. ENDING!

I know loads of things bothered me about this episode but I'm going to forget about them til tomorrow and ride the high from that ending. Can't wait til next week.

Same. Was just about regretting defending the last episode but they pulled it back towards the end.

The thing that bothers me about Daenerys' storyline is that it's one big stall tactic. This is especially the case in the book where he has her lost in the desert for ages for example. Now she finally has her army in Westeros and we're offered some excuse why she's not using it. "We can't have foreign hordes laying siege".

Same with the grayscale, it's portrayed as some incurable, highly contagious pestilence, but all you do to cure it is cut off the infected areas. Cop out. I know there are concoctions and salves on the trolley nut Sam says they're for the wounds not the disease.

Grand Maester "Jorah, you're totes screwed babes, you'll live for ten years, but your mind has at most six months , you can go to Valeria or, and I must only subtly hint this, KILL YOURSELF."
Sam: "Hold on there two secs....yep, done. Found the cure. It's actually fairly straightforward, and even though I have close to zero medical training, I think I can pull this off (pun intended)."

Disposable1

awec wrote: »

Where is Bronn?

Ripper Street

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Lena Headey and Robson or Jerome (can't remember, actor who plays Bronn) had a previous relationship, they have clauses saying they don't have to do scenes together. That and Bronns other commitments suggest we may not see much of him

Jofspring

I enjoyed the episode. Thought it whipped through setting up the next episode which I expect to be even better.

Euron is definitely a mix of Euron and Victarion. Delighted with that as this episode is exactly what I imagined victarion to be like when in battle on the seas.

Sand snakes and grey worm/missandei story are awful. Thank god two sand snakes are dead and fingers crossed the 3rd gone in the next episode. Felt the grey worn story is just setting him up to let his guard down in a later episode.

J. Marston

I think Bronn might do a Knight-in-shining-armour thing for the captured Sand Snake. Pretty sure the one who is left is Bad Poosy.

CMOTDibbler

Disposable1 wrote: »

The thing that bothers me about Daenerys' storyline is that it's one big stall tactic. This is especially the case in the book where he has her lost in the desert for ages for example. Now she finally has her army in Westeros and we're offered some excuse why she's not using it. "We can't have foreign hordes laying siege".

Well that's kind of the point of all that wandering around Essos. Conquering is easy (once you have the firepower ), ruling is difficult. So it's logical that she's learned those lessons and would be wary of charging in, all dragons blazing.

Disposable1 wrote: »

Same with the grayscale, it's portrayed as some incurable, highly contagious pestilence, but all you do to cure it is cut off the infected areas. Cop out. I know there are concoctions and salves on the trolley nut Sam says they're for the wounds not the disease.

Grand Maester "Jorah, you're totes screwed babes, you'll live for ten years, but your mind has at most six months , you can go to Valeria or, and I must only subtly hint this, KILL YOURSELF."
Sam: "Hold on there two secs....yep, done. Found the cure. It's actually fairly straightforward, and even though I have close to zero medical training, I think I can pull this off (pun intended)."

Well the ointment is called a 'treatment', which one would assume prevents the greyscale from coming back once it's cut off. After all, the stuff seems to spread through the bloodstream, otherwise cutting off the visible manifestation would just be a painful way of passing the time.

podgemonster

That last Sandsnake is proper fúcked. Good riddance to Ellayria and his kin. Enter Euron, the Molotov cocktail of this season. His entrance to the battle was fearless and almost clumsy but frightening. A brutal pirate battle that 5 Disney movies haven't come close too. My heart was pounding in that scene, just superb.


The connections being made among the remaining characters is wonderful. That "Oh my god I know that guy" face on Tyrion was brilliant. Ayra realisation that she didn't need to be on an end game regicide mission and that her family are back in power was beautiful.


Littlefinger hangs around Winterfell like a dangerous snake. Whispering in Sansa and Jon's ear. Silent and observant in meetings but the cogs in his brain are going 90. So much can go wrong up North with one bad move.


I like how Dany has taken a major blow almost immediately. She holding back but Cersei and Euron don't give a hoot about lives lost.


Much improvement from last week and still building momentum!

ThunbergsAreGo

The Jon Snow scene reminded me of Father Ted
..... ****ing hell.... Baaaa