Heavyweight Boxing

fryup

^^^^^^^^^

btw - there was one glaring error it showed Tyson appearing on wogan as world champ in 1984 ??...but that was in 88 he appeared, he didn't become world champ until nov 86

and there was no mention of Bruno losing to Witherspoon in the 86 title fight

Kilboor

Thought Povetkin was poor against Whyte, his age is catching up to him, legs look completely gone.

Of course he still possess those that shoulder power to do one shot damage but Whyte will pick him apart this weekend imo.

walshb

fryup wrote: »

^^^^^^^^^

btw - there was one glaring error it showed Tyson appearing on wogan as world champ in 1984 ??...but that was in 88 he appeared, he didn't become world champ until nov 86

and there was no mention of Bruno losing to Witherspoon in the 86 title fight

Yes, the Whiterspoon absence was odd, as this was for a world belt. His Smith loss was just a regular fight. Jaysus, ref was very slow to step in there.

squinn2912

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I thought Whyte was very foolish first time around,
He changed trainer for that fight and it showed,
Whyte's strength is he is big strong and ignorant , when he hurt AVP it was a sin to stand off and try to slowly pick him apart he is just not that type of fighter don't change what has got you there ,Hurt someone and get in his face and get it finished he made the same mistake against Parker but just about got through it ,


AVP has all the experience in the world that if you give him time he will land something at some stage,

Yea he let him off the hook big time I think he thought the work was done. But up until the 4th it was going his way.

I felt AP could have been pulled out vs Hunter and was gifted a draw. I think he’s all but done. Still has a big punch chance but I expect Whyte to win inside 5

squinn2912

So are many of yous gonna get the fight on Saturday night? I think it’s a good enough card some undefeated fighters to watch. Nick Webb is first fight I think. I remember him doing well against David Allen and then Allen sparked him. He was in bad shape was a terrible ko. Fabio Wardley is an interesting HW as well and he’s against Molina former opponent of aj and wilder both. He’s not much good but it’s a decent step up for Wardley. Should be plenty of KO’s anyhow.

Butson

Should be a decent scrap but not going to pay for this one.
Bit of a joke when Dazn subscribers all around the world get this for their €2 per month, while fans in the UK + Ireland have to fork out £20 / €25 for same.

squinn2912

Butson wrote: »

Should be a decent scrap but not going to pay for this one.
Bit of a joke when Dazn subscribers all around the world get this for their €2 per month, while fans in the UK + Ireland have to fork out £20 / €25 for same.

There is that but in the absence of anything more appealing to do over the weekend I think I'll get it. The way I'm going at the minute that's standing me 2 lunches! I'm looking forward to it. I think Whyte will batter him but Povetkin will still be dangerous. It was one hell of a KO after being on his ass twice a minute beforehand.

Butson

Look, as you say you'd spend that in a pub in a couple of hours and not think twice!

iebamm2580

fury looking as lean as i have ever seen him in recent pics, wouldnt want him coming in under 18st though, that weight will be needed to lean and tire out aj.

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/boxing/tyson-fury-anthony-joshua-latest-23833385

squinn2912

Yea I saw that photo on his facebook page. He looks far too thin in it. The one with Andy Lee and Parker from a few days ago he looks trim and strong. Plenty of mind games going on

iebamm2580

squinn2912 wrote: »

Yea I saw that photo on his facebook page. He looks far too thin in it. The one with Andy Lee and Parker from a few days ago he looks trim and strong. Plenty of mind games going on

someting similar to wilder fight weight wise will be fine, reckon he tkos joshua in 5-7 rounds. Joshua will gas with fury all over him.

squinn2912

iebamm2580 wrote: »

someting similar to wilder fight weight wise will be fine, reckon he tkos joshua in 5-7 rounds. Joshua will gas with fury all over him.

Yea he’d need to around 19 wouldn’t he? It’s some size of a man when you consider it. I dunno about that I hope you’re right but I think aj is very dangerous, especially early on. Fury will need to have very good footwork and defence to keep away and he’ll need to show plenty of power as well. Other than the Wilder fights I’m not sure we’ve seen that.

iebamm2580

squinn2912 wrote: »

Yea he’d need to around 19 wouldn’t he? It’s some size of a man when you consider it. I dunno about that I hope you’re right but I think aj is very dangerous, especially early on. Fury will need to have very good footwork and defence to keep away and he’ll need to show plenty of power as well. Other than the Wilder fights I’m not sure we’ve seen that.

id like him to be 18 and half, yeah aj has power but i think fury has shown a very solid chin and recovery powers and for such a big man never looks tired which is astonishing given his size. I think the last wilder fight was an eye opener even for fury to be offensive in future, he took some clean shots early on in the second fight too and imo wilder carries more power than aj. I await walshb to discredit everything i have said and predict a Joshua win ha.

yourdeadwright

iebamm2580 wrote: »

id like him to be 18 and half, yeah aj has power but i think fury has shown a very solid chin and recovery powers and for such a big man never looks tired which is astonishing given his size. I think the last wilder fight was an eye opener even for fury to be offensive in future, he took some clean shots early on in the second fight too and imo wilder carries more power than aj. I await walshb to discredit everything i have said and predict a Joshua win ha.

Wilder carriers more power that correct,
AJ has more shots he can hurt you with , can fight better going backwards and is much heavier than Wilder so won't be as easy to back up ,


The Wilder fight means very little in this one,
I think Fury will win but this is the hardest fight for him in the Division so wouldn't be surprised if AJ won ,


I actually think Wilder would beat AJ ,


Styles makes fights ,

yourdeadwright

squinn2912 wrote: »

Yea I saw that photo on his facebook page. He looks far too thin in it. The one with Andy Lee and Parker from a few days ago he looks trim and strong. Plenty of mind games going on

I think the latest one where he is all in white and his top is tucked in and standing on his own makes him look slimmer than he actually is ,


The one the day before give you a better idea,

walshb

iebamm2580 wrote: »

id like him to be 18 and half, yeah aj has power but i think fury has shown a very solid chin and recovery powers and for such a big man never looks tired which is astonishing given his size. I think the last wilder fight was an eye opener even for fury to be offensive in future, he took some clean shots early on in the second fight too and imo wilder carries more power than aj. I await walshb to discredit everything i have said and predict a Joshua win ha.

I’m only 55/45 AJ here...

If AJ cannot take Fury out, and Fury sets a fast pace and smothers AJ, and roughs him up inside, Fury wins..

What is intriguing is that AJ can be very capable and dangerous in close and inside. Fury needs to be careful..

Wilder may, or may not have more single shot power, but AJ is a far deadlier puncher overall. Heavy handed and his shots a lot cleaner and neater than Wilder..

Both chins weak. Fury has been badly hurt several times, and was on his back for ten seconds from Wilder. Those shots were good, but not dynamite.

AJ will be a far deadly finisher if Fury is in trouble..

Don’t anyone be surprised if a 260 + lbs Fury can KO AJ with one, or a few shots. Fury is not a big puncher, but he can still hurt AJ here. He can still connect hard and clean, and AJs chin is not that good..

Cyrus

walshb wrote: »

I’m only 55/45 AJ here...

If AJ cannot take Fury out, and Fury sets a fast pace and smothers AJ, and roughs him up inside, Fury wins..

What is intriguing is that AJ can be very capable and dangerous in close and inside. Fury needs to be careful..

Wilder may, or may not have more single shot power, but AJ is a far deadlier puncher overall. Heavy handed and his shots a lot cleaner and neater than Wilder..

Both chins weak. Fury has been badly hurt several times, and was on his back for ten seconds from Wilder. Those shots were good, but not dynamite.

AJ will be a far deadly finisher if Fury is in trouble..

Don’t anyone be surprised if a 260 + lbs Fury can KO AJ with one, or a few shots. Fury is not a big puncher, but he can still hurt AJ here. He can still connect hard and clean, and AJs chin is not that good..

Wilders shots in the 12th weren’t dynamite ?

If wilders aren’t then whose are?

walshb

Cyrus wrote: »

Wilders shots in the 12th weren’t dynamite ?

If wilders aren’t then whose are?

You need to watch more of Wilder. Watch the shots. They were not as flush and clean as he has hit some others. They were more a cuffing variety..the first shot caught a retreating Fury. It was around side face/ear. The follow up was when Fury was falling backwards and had an element of push more than whip.

Good shots, no doubt, but not real Wilder power..

Plus, Fury was on his back for 9-10 seconds...

AJ can connect with deadlier shots than the ones that Wilder landed in rd 12

iebamm2580

walshb wrote: »

I’m only 55/45 AJ here...

If AJ cannot take Fury out, and Fury sets a fast pace and smothers AJ, and roughs him up inside, Fury wins..

What is intriguing is that AJ can be very capable and dangerous in close and inside. Fury needs to be careful..

Wilder may, or may not have more single shot power, but AJ is a far deadlier puncher overall. Heavy handed and his shots a lot cleaner and neater than Wilder..

Both chins weak. Fury has been badly hurt several times, and was on his back for ten seconds from Wilder. Those shots were good, but not dynamite.

AJ will be a far deadly finisher if Fury is in trouble..

Don’t anyone be surprised if a 260 + lbs Fury can KO AJ with one, or a few shots. Fury is not a big puncher, but he can still hurt AJ here. He can still connect hard and clean, and AJs chin is not that good..

Id agree with most of that, think you are however being bit harsh on furys chin, ajs is alot more suspect imo.

walshb

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Id agree with most of that, think you are however being bit harsh on furys chin, ajs is alot more suspect imo.

No..

Both chins suspect. Something I have said..

Just because Fury rose after 9-10 seconds doesn’t change my view.

Many refs would have not even counted, and we’d be saying he was clean knocked out. The shots were good. They were not great.

Plus, he has been badly wobbled and dropped before...from lesser punchers than AJ..

AJ for me delivers more clean and concussive type shots.

The big if being can he land them clean on a slippy Fury?

David Haye mentioned something I agree with, that being that AJ can punch through Fury....I have a feeling it will be a 1-2 straight combination that will get to Fury to either drop him heavy, or badly hurt him; and AJ will close the show far better than a wild and awkward Wilder..

iebamm2580

walshb wrote: »

No..

Both chins suspect. Something I have said..

Just because Fury rose after 9-10 seconds doesn’t change my view.

Many refs would have not even counted, and we’d be saying he was clean knocked out. The shots were good. They were not great.

Plus, he has been badly wobbled and dropped before...from lesser punchers than AJ..

AJ for me delivers more clean and concussive type shots.

The big if being can he land them clean on a slippy Fury?

David Haye mentioned something I agree with, that being that AJ can punch through Fury....I have a feeling it will be a 1-2 straight combination that will get to Fury to either drop him heavy, or badly hurt him; and AJ will close the show far better than a wild and awkward Wilder..

Aj was wobbled versus povetkin,whyte,klitshko and ruiz. None of them thunderous blows either. Fury was not even back in shape versus wilder in first fight, he walked through widler in the second, wilder landed clean enough in the first or second round and fury didnt budge. We won't agree so I'm hoping i will be right once again about fury. AJ stays wobbled longer too.

walshb

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Aj was wobbled versus povetkin,whyte,klitshko and ruiz. None of them thunderous blows either. Fury was not even back in shape versus wilder in first fight, he walked through widler in the second, wilder landed clean enough in the first or second round and fury didnt budge. We won't agree so I'm hoping i will be right once again about fury. AJ stays wobbled longer too.

I said both chins are suspect. I am aware AJ has a suspect chin, and I also said that nobody should be surprised if Fury, who isn’t a big puncher can KO AJ

iebamm2580

walshb wrote: »

I said both chins are suspect. I am aware AJ has a suspect chin, and I also said that nobody should be surprised if Fury, who isn’t a big puncher can KO AJ

My point was ajs is way more suspect and he stays dazed alot longer, fury ended up finishing the stronger versus wilder in that 12th, aj had to take few rounds off after wlad knocked him. Makes for a great fight though, hope to get to it.

walshb

iebamm2580 wrote: »

My point was ajs is way more suspect and he stays dazed alot longer, fury ended up finishing the stronger versus wilder in that 12th, aj had to take few rounds off after wlad knocked him. Makes for a great fight though, hope to get to it.

Well, something like what you are claiming here is difficult to assess

In the AJ/Wlad fight, AJ was also trying to get a second wind. He was cardio tired...

For simple ability to take a clean hard shot, I’d argue both chins the same...grade B-

Kilboor

I think the Fury we saw vs Wilder second time around is a new beast. Previously we all would have said Fury has no power, and that he relies solely on dancing around and outscoring his opponent. The fact he can now hurt back makes him extremely dangerous, especially when he combines it with his head movement and foot work.

If he comes in even stronger against Joshua, AJ will have to go for the body and rely maybe on uppercuts.

walshb

Kilboor wrote: »

I think the Fury we saw vs Wilder second time around is a new beast. Previously we all would have said Fury has no power, and that he relies solely on dancing around and outscoring his opponent. The fact he can now hurt back makes him extremely dangerous, especially when he combines it with his head movement and foot work.

If he comes in even stronger against Joshua, AJ will have to go for the body and rely maybe on uppercuts.

But AJ is 250 lbs and a strong unit..

Wilder is 220 lbs, and Fury was able to maul him in fight 2 with a 40 + lbs weight advantage..

It was as much a physical mauling Fury put on Wilder as opposed to any type power punching display..

Wilder was still standing and lucid when stopped. He simply was not strong enough to compete with Fury in the physical sense..

I don’t think Fury can get away with this vs a 250 lbs AJ. AJ will be hitting him clean and heavy, as well as being strong enough to both resist him, and bully him back!!

squinn2912

Wilder has freakish one punch power and he can throw very quickly. he’s not great at much else other than having a fair jab. This amounts to him being near the top. AJ is much better at many other things. He’s strong, can box better and has good combos with a very good uppercut. He also considers defence better. There were lots of things Fury could do to beat Wilder and the thing that worked most was that he sapped his energy. AJ may not have the best gas tank but wrestling with him will tire Fury as much. Even in the Wilder fight Fury was so on top but was blowing hard towards the end of rounds. I fear that AJ will be able to wrestle away with Fury and get some combos off. With Wilder I was sure that if Fury committed he would win, with AJ I don’t think it’s as clear.

yourdeadwright

squinn2912 wrote: »

Wilder has freakish one punch power and he can throw very quickly. he’s not great at much else other than having a fair jab. This amounts to him being near the top. AJ is much better at many other things. He’s strong, can box better and has good combos with a very good uppercut. He also considers defence better. There were lots of things Fury could do to beat Wilder and the thing that worked most was that he sapped his energy. AJ may not have the best gas tank but wrestling with him will tire Fury as much. Even in the Wilder fight Fury was so on top but was blowing hard towards the end of rounds. I fear that AJ will be able to wrestle away with Fury and get some combos off. With Wilder I was sure that if Fury committed he would win, with AJ I don’t think it’s as clear.

Id fancy Fury to win if both guys are tired,
I reckon that's his best shot actually ,to tire out AJ as much as he can,


AJ is dangerous no matter what we can all agree on that but if you tire him out he becomes frantic ,sloppy panic kicks in , seen this v Ruiz , Wlad & stage of Whyte , He starts making gestures to the opponent and crowd to try hide his fatigue


I think Fury being the more naturally gifted boxer will hold his P's & Q's together better , he carries less muscle and fights with less stress,


The problem is to get AJ tired you have to engage with him , that where Fury needs to be very clever and careful as AJ has numerous heavy shots and is a big big boy himself,

I just feel Fury is the type of guy to risk it for the glory he won't be afraid of getting hit,

yourdeadwright

walshb wrote: »

But AJ is 250 lbs and a strong unit..

Wilder is 220 lbs, and Fury was able to maul him in fight 2 with a 40 + lbs weight advantage..

It was as much a physical mauling Fury put on Wilder as opposed to any type power punching display..

Wilder was still standing and lucid when stopped. He simply was not strong enough to compete with Fury in the physical sense..

I don’t think Fury can get away with this vs a 250 lbs AJ. AJ will be hitting him clean and heavy, as well as being strong enough to both resist him, and bully him back!!

AJ last few fights he came in at 240 or below ,

eagle eye

yourdeadwright wrote:

AJ last few fights he came in at 240 or below ,

And much faster in every way.