Dublin 15 is going to get a lot more congested.

Brock Turnpike

beauf wrote: »

Seems odd to squeeze the road when there's acres of grass verge/green area to make a entirely segregated cycle path.

They really should've done this. However, I'm encouraged to see them putting some cycling infrastructure in place.

liamog

beauf wrote: »

Is a regular bus service "few" large vehicles? I don't know the answer and while I know these roads I'm not on them often enough, to know how suitable these lanes are on this road.

Seems odd to squeeze the road when there's acres of grass verge/green area to make a entirely segregated cycle path.

The bus service isn't making the turn around these corners so the corner radius around the turn doesn't apply here. Are you referring to the carriageway width instead?

daymobrew wrote: »

One has to ask the (rhetorical) question - why are these mini kerbs needed?
Maybe solve that problem and they won't be needed.

In a word, the kerbs are installed to both reduce the road width which causes cars to drive slower, and to prevent cars from crossing into the cycle lane. Legally a solid white line has the same effect as installing the curb, but the inability of most drivers to stick to their lane causes them to encroach on the cycle lane.

KGLady

Its great to have physical barriers to protect the cycle lane and prevent vehicles encroaching into it, and also to prevent parking in it too (St Philips school in the afternoons!) Narrowing the road to reduce speeds is also beneficial to all of us, cars bikes pedestrians etc. However the obstructing of the junctions was frustrating, and its a relief that its going to be changed.

They widened the junction where our estate links to the Hartstown Rd and then installed the kerb blocking the junction to the point that even normal cars were so tight on the turning that they were crossing the central line just to get onto the main road. I've seen cars and vans really struggling at Willow Wood and Inglewood. The Traffic Lights at the T junction of Mountview Rd and Blanch Rd South is awkward at times now too, vans turning into the Mountview Rd from both directions are squeezed and it looks oddly jerky at times watching them when they're turning into it from the left and having to adjust road position. I can't see the logic behind the junction by Iceland, is the marked off space meant to be for bicycles queuing to join the cycling lane? New layout to me at least, presume it'll make sense in time.

ongarboy

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

A four storey apartment block also planned next to the Applegreen petrol station in Clonsilla was granted by Fingal council but now appealed by local residents to An Bord Pleanala.

Brock Turnpike

ongarboy wrote: »

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

A four storey apartment block also planned next to the Applegreen petrol station in Clonsilla was granted by Fingal council but now appealed by local residents to An Bord Pleanala.

Apartment block and cafe actually. Didn't realize it was being appealed.

beauf

liamog wrote: »

The bus service isn't making the turn around these corners so the corner radius around the turn doesn't apply here. Are you referring to the carriageway width instead?...

Yes.

beauf

ongarboy wrote: »

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

A four storey apartment block also planned next to the Applegreen petrol station in Clonsilla was granted by Fingal council but now appealed by local residents to An Bord Pleanala.

Why are they appealing?

ongarite

ongarboy wrote: »

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

A four storey apartment block also planned next to the Applegreen petrol station in Clonsilla was granted by Fingal council but now appealed by local residents to An Bord Pleanala.

That site has been derelict for as long as I can remember,
Feel sorry for the owners of the house on the corner of the roundabout.
Beautiful house but will soon be surrounded by the developments on all sides.

Clonsilla village is open for big development changes in the coming decade.
Far too many derelict sites & old houses boarded up to be left idle.

Phil.x

raheny red wrote: »

And the work now is being halted.....

https://twitter.com/CllrEOB/status/1325937251919015946?s=19

Ah ha ha, you couldn't make this sh1t up! Well done fingal. 1million a day of taxpayers money wasted

liamog

beauf wrote: »

Yes.

Ahh ok, most of the complaints on the kerbing was down to how sharp it made the turns onto the main road.

The kerbing is being installed in the same place as the previous solid white line, so there is minimal if any carriageway reduction. The lanes appear to be just over 3m wide, which is within spec for these type of roads (2.75m to 3m). So should handle two double decker busses at 2.6m each passing each other.

Phil.x

Haven't being down that part of d15 since they installed those damaging speed ramps. Id regularly fill up the car and buy in the Eurospar and hartstown off licence but wouldn't dream of it now,..that is until tonight! God love the residents, the entire road is littered with those aggressive/damaging ramps and now this calamity, it's starting to resemble a road safety experiment, I'd sell up if I lived there.

liamog

Phil.x wrote: »

I'd sell up if I lived there.

You'd sell up because you can no longer encroach on a cycle lane with a solid white line? I.e. one that you shouldn't of been driving over anyway.

Larbre34

beauf wrote: »

That the kerb was designed and then actually built so far out makes you question the whole process tbh.

The whole process of these poxy experimental cycle lanes all over Dublin needs to be questioned.

No statutory basis for them, they don't meet County Development plans, they don't meet DMURS design standards and they cause huge congestion. Its like a feckin land grab by the zealots in the County Councils while everyone is looking the other way at the pandemic.

In Dun Laoghaire, they're holding a public consultation 4 months after they were installed on the coast road FFS.

ongarboy

beauf wrote: »

Why are they appealing?

It didn't say as that is usually only provided at decision time in Bord Pleanala case inspector's report. The Fingal planning file did have a fair few observations from locals citing concerns like inappropriate for a village setting, overshadowing etc. Check the documents section under the Fingal council planning website with reference below which has all the various observations.

FW20A/0046

liamog

Larbre34 wrote: »

No statutory basis for them, they don't meet County Development plans, they don't meet DMURS design standards and they cause huge congestion. Its like a feckin land grab by the zealots in the County Councils while everyone is looking the other way at the pandemic.

The lanes currently being added in Hartstown do appear to follow DMURS in terms of the changes to the side street entrances and the size of the remaining traffic lanes.

liamog

Phil.x wrote: »

Wow, and you're a mod!

Not when posting in the D15 forum! I think selling a house is an overly extreme reaction to not being able to drive on a part of the road that you weren't previously allowed to drive on. The only difference being the installation of a physical barrier to help keep you in the correct lane.

Phil.x

ongarboy wrote: »

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

A four storey apartment block also planned next to the Applegreen petrol station in Clonsilla was granted by Fingal council but now appealed by local residents to An Bord Pleanala.

Ongarboy, do you know if its shops or apartments that's being built 100m down station rd on the left.

Pat Dunne

Phil.x wrote: »

Ongarboy, do you know if its shops or apartments that's being built 100m down station rd on the left.

Lidl?

angel eyes 2012

Larbre34 wrote: »

The whole process of these poxy experimental cycle lanes all over Dublin needs to be questioned.

No statutory basis for them, they don't meet County Development plans, they don't meet DMURS design standards and they cause huge congestion. Its like a feckin land grab by the zealots in the County Councils while everyone is looking the other way at the pandemic.

In Dun Laoghaire, they're holding a public consultation 4 months after they were installed on the coast road FFS.

They are dreadful. Never fails to surprise me how bad public bodies are at public consultation. Even though they are mandated to represent all members of the public, they either delay consultation until it's too late or completely disregard the views of the majority when consultation has been done.

It's really just a box ticking exercise. I really don't see the need for such control measures especially when we have been advised not to use public transport during the pandemic and in the longer term surely traffic volumes will ultimately reduce anyway with more people wfh.

Not good enough Fingal and a shocking waste of tax payers money. I could've told you that the majority of the residents would not welcome those cycle lanes, it's not rocket science.

Hurrache

Phil.x wrote: »

I'd sell up if I lived there.

Buy a better steering wheel and get your brakes checked. Or even a driver refreshers course. Either way, it'll be less hassle improving your driving skills on how to manage corners than selling a house because a corner is currently too difficult for you.

Larbre34 wrote: »

Its like a feckin land grab by the zealots in the County Councils while everyone is looking the other way at the pandemic.

Seriously, drama much? A land grab?! It's protecting space on a public road for cyclists. You've no ownership of it, or rights over anyone else to it. The councils are not where the zealotry is coming from.

angel eyes 2012 wrote: »

I really don't see the need for such control measures especially when we have been advised not to use public transport during the pandemic and in the longer term surely traffic volumes will ultimately reduce anyway with more people wfh.

Not using public transport does not equate to using your car. And if you fail to see the need for such measures, you're oblivious to what it's like to cycle. You don't see the irony in complaining that there may be an increase in traffic so there shouldn't be better facilities to cater for cyclists?

What's not rocket science is people still believing that they themselves are not traffic, it's other people that are causing the problems. The less cars on the road, the less congestion. That's not rocket science.

Hey, it's too dangerous to let our kids walk or cycle to school with all this traffic, they should make it safer. Hey, look at dis, dey're annexing the road off us, get onto Facebuke and kick up a fuss, how are we supposed to drive our kids to school and figure out how to turn corners. Tis a disgrace Joe Kenny.

DvB

ongarboy wrote: »

Taking a break from cycle lanes for a moment, I see a mixture of 79 3 storey duplexes and 2 storey semi-Ds are planned for Allendale on the undeveloped site just north of Allendale Square. Allendale House will remain as it's a protected structure. I think apartments were planned for here years ago but either they were refused or the property crash came and they fell by the wayside.

Fingal planning ref: FW20A/0180

Took a look at that on the Fingal website. The open space elements look far from ideal, IMO its over development of the site.

KGLady

The kerbing and the bollard has already been moved back at the entrance to our estate, only for the left turn but its made the turn safe again thankfully. The right turn is still quite tight and its pretty much a 90 degree turning into the estate from the Hartstown Rd but it is grand so long as you're at almost a complete stop making the turn, which I'm happy to do and bonus its likely to piss off all the lads in Honda Civics with the loud exhaust pipes as we take our time!

Won't be holding my breath for any apology from the FF Councillor who was slagging off the residents who raised the issues and the Councillors who called for urgent review. Very eye opening to see hyperbolic blaming, finger pointing and raging along party lines for what has been proven to be a valid issue that needed review and alteration.

ongarboy

Phil.x wrote: »

Ongarboy, do you know if its shops or apartments that's being built 100m down station rd on the left.

If you're referring to Hansfield, it's shops and apartments. 2 apartments blocks (3 storey) and a retail block that will have a few small units and a supermarket. My money is on Aldi leasing the supermarket seeing as they've been refused permission numerous times to build in Clonsilla. That or a smaller type Tesco (which is woefully underrepresented in D15!).

eimsRV

Anyone know whats going on with the development work on the R149 - the road from Ongar to Clonee village?

ongarboy

eimsRV wrote: »

Anyone know whats going on with the development work on the R149 - the road from Ongar to Clonee village?

It might've been covered on another thread but a new housing development is being built on the old Williamstown stud on that road along with a roundabout at the Leixlip road junction. I believe the road will close temporarily later this month to build water and sewer infrastructure in advance.

angel eyes 2012

Hurrache wrote: »

Buy a better steering wheel and get your brakes checked. Or even a driver refreshers course. Either way, it'll be less hassle improving your driving skills on how to manage corners than selling a house because a corner is currently too difficult for you.



Seriously, drama much? A land grab?! It's protecting space on a public road for cyclists. You've no ownership of it, or rights over anyone else to it. The councils are not where the zealotry is coming from.



Not using public transport does not equate to using your car. And if you fail to see the need for such measures, you're oblivious to what it's like to cycle. You don't see the irony in complaining that there may be an increase in traffic so there shouldn't be better facilities to cater for cyclists?

What's not rocket science is people still believing that they themselves are not traffic, it's other people that are causing the problems. The less cars on the road, the less congestion. That's not rocket science.

Hey, it's too dangerous to let our kids walk or cycle to school with all this traffic, they should make it safer. Hey, look at dis, dey're annexing the road off us, get onto Facebuke and kick up a fuss, how are we supposed to drive our kids to school and figure out how to turn corners. Tis a disgrace Joe Kenny.

How do you know I don't cycle, most cyclists are drivers too.

I don't know what your last paragraph is referring to; some kind of derogatory rant aimed at people engaging with a fairly inoffensive radio programme. Demonstrates that you are similar to some (not all) cyclists, in that you proceed to shout down other posters that dare to express a contrary view on planning issues that may impact on their lives. We are all entitled to our views you know. If I want to write to my local councillor and demand that clamping is banned in Dublin 15 in the morning, I can submit such a demand, the measure may not be implemented but I am entitled to my views and a response.

Hypothetically, if the vast majority of residents in an area submit a petition and demand that cycle lanes are removed, the proposal is supposed to be properly considered. That is local democracy, and democracy requires that we are tolerant and respectful to alternative views.

Phil.x

angel eyes 2012 wrote: »

How do you know I don't cycle, most cyclists are drivers too.

I don't know what your last paragraph is referring to; some kind of derogatory rant aimed at people engaging with a fairly inoffensive radio programme. Demonstrates that you are similar to some (not all) cyclists, in that you proceed to shout down other posters that dare to express a contrary view on planning issues that may impact on their lives. We are all entitled to our views you know. If I want to write to my local councillor and demand that clamping is banned in Dublin 15 in the morning, I can submit such a demand, the measure may not be implemented but I am entitled to my views and a response.

Hypothetically, if the vast majority of residents in an area submit a petition and demand that cycle lanes are removed, the proposal is supposed to be properly considered. That is local democracy, and democracy requires that we are tolerant and respectful to alternative views.

Angel eyes, Ignore the troll, he's probably a banned Twitter cyclist.

Hurrache

Lol, a banned Twitter cyclist, troll, if that's how you can only deal with things you don't like fire away.Twitter doesn't even ban racists.
I've a few bikes, yes, but two cars, first one 25 years or so ago. I'm not so precious when using either that I feel the world is out to get me when road space is given to cyclists.

What I am though is a realist who sees the benefit in providing protected road space for vulnerable road users and don't act like a baby if it's of an inconvenience to me when I'm driving.

Figure out how to get full use out of your steering wheel yet when you approach the scary sharp turns? I'll give you a few pointers if you like, wouldn't want you to sell house after house every time a council puts one near you.

KGLady

Hurrache wrote: »

I don't act like a baby if it's of an inconvenience to me when I'm driving.

Figure out how to get full use out of your steering wheel yet when you approach the scary sharp turns? I'll give you a few pointers if you like, wouldn't want you to sell house after house every time a council puts one near you.

You might want to get off the high saddle there, its been proven that there was an issue and the remedial works which were urgently completed to correct the junctions have addressed it. There's no need to be an arse, especially so when you're in the wrong this time.

daymobrew

I think that FCC should have taken the opportunity to explain the design. It looks like it's all about traffic calming and slowing vehicles as they enter and exit side roads.

For example, a car that might overtake a cyclist to turn left off the main road may now not do this because the driver will know that they have to slow down a lot more than previously to take that turn.
Similarly, when turning left out of a side road, knowing that they have to take it slower should result in drivers slowing as they approach the junction and thus increase the chance that an approaching cyclist is seen.

People have been killed on Hartstown Road by cars and that was why the ramps were put in.

It does sound like the kerbing is a little too far out but the concept sounds positive.