The trial of Molly Martens

professore

Auldloon wrote: »

I vaguely remember reading that she had spoken to a family law type. If they had planned on killing him I'd say it would have been much cleaner. I think Jason was in bed asleep having taken a pill earlier. Molly found something, evidence he was planning moving back to Ireland without her or something that enraged her. She went outside/got the paving stone and attacked him with it as he lay in bed. He got out of bed, lots of screaming and shouting and that he could well have been squeezing her neck and threatening to kill her when the dad arrived with the Louisville slugger. Then they both beat him in a frenzy.

Yep that's possible too. Did her dad arrive on the scene later, or was he there all evening? If the latter, he must have been involved from the get go. Can't imagine a scenario where she says to him "I'll be back in a few minutes dad, just popping upstairs to murder Jay with a paving slab"

Auldloon

professore wrote: »

Yep that's possible too. Did her dad arrive on the scene later, or was he there all evening? If the latter, he must have been involved from the get go. Can't imagine a scenario where she says to him "I'll be back in a few minutes dad, just popping upstairs to murder Jay with a paving slab"

It was around 3am when they made the 911 call so its plausible he would have been asleep. Though the blood reports cast some doubt on the timing I think.

RacoonQueen

MarcusP12 wrote: »

If he was that abusive to her to the point where they were both in fear of their lives (as suggested today I think) then this was a gradual process, why did she not leave him??? Was there any reports of abuse to the police I wonder? He's ex FBI for the love of God, surely he could have intervened or used his obvious influence to sort him out. Its not like he was some kind of underworld, Tony Soprano type guy you'd be looking over your shoulder for the rest of your life if you left or felt you couldn't leave. Doesn't make much sense....but I have a bad feeling there'll be some twist in this and they'll get off on a technicality or something....

Any allegations of him being abusive could be argued against based on the fact he apparently planned to return to Ireland without her. I mean, I know nothing about how the average abuser thinks but I'd imagine they wouldn't be quick to leave the person they control / abuse / have power over.

optogirl

DellyBelly wrote: »

For me she's too hot to be guilty. Bit like that foxy knoxy in Italy will be found not guilty

There was zero evidence against Amanda Knox. Anyone claiming someone is too hot to be guilty and describing a woman as Foxy Knoxy, a term she has already said makes her deeply uncomfortable, makes me want to stop the world and get off

Fakediamond

Jason might have decided to tell her he was leaving her on that particular weekend as her parents would be around to support her in the aftermath. According to her ex-partner, she is mentally unstable so jason would have known she wouldn't take the news well.

Based on her Facebook posts, she really seemed to think she would retain custody of the children, after violently killing their father, which was delusional, at the very least.

WHIP IT!

optogirl wrote: »

There was zero evidence against Amanda Knox. Anyone claiming someone is too hot to be guilty and describing a woman as Foxy Knoxy, a term she has already said makes her deeply uncomfortable, makes me want to stop the world and get off

Any (presumably) grown up individual who uses the term "stop the world and get off" makes me want to... well, you know the rest...

Birneybau

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Any (presumably) grown up individual who uses the term "stop the world and get off" makes me want to... well, you know the rest...

I've never heard a kid use it.

MarcusP12

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Any allegations of him being abusive could be argued against based on the fact he apparently planned to return to Ireland without her. I mean, I know nothing about how the average abuser thinks but I'd imagine they wouldn't be quick to leave the person they control / abuse / have power over.

Yes, good point....when I read that before I immediately thought the same thing about her flipping at the thought of leaving with the kids....its sounds like she has an obsession with the kids to be honest and when this turned out to be on the cards, maybe she went mental....of course these are all only theories....I doubt the truth will come out only a version of it that the jury will or wont believe.....

harr

Any way of watching this online, I know in certain jurisdictions trials are Broadcast live or streamed live..

conorhal

Auldloon wrote: »

I vaguely remember reading that she had spoken to a family law type. If they had planned on killing him I'd say it would have been much cleaner. I think Jason was in bed asleep having taken a pill earlier. Molly found something, evidence he was planning moving back to Ireland without her or something that enraged her. She went outside/got the paving stone and attacked him with it as he lay in bed. He got out of bed, lots of screaming and shouting and that he could well have been squeezing her neck and threatening to kill her when the dad arrived with the Louisville slugger. Then they both beat him in a frenzy.

While the kids slept soundly down the hall?

A paving stone is an unwieldy weapon. To strike somebody in the back of the head with it, especially if you're a woman, they would need to be a prone sleeping target. A paving stone is also pretty heavy, nobody is getting up to have an argument after getting struck in the back of the head with one because they've just had their skull caved in.
I'd say the father took one look at the mess and grabbed the baseball bat to give the body a few whacks with because it's at least a plausible defensive weapon.

She may be found guilty. She may not. But coming to conclusions during the prosecution case, when the defence really hasn't shown it's hand, is very premature.

Pretty much EVERY accused person in EVERY trial looks doomed during the prosecution. If they can't convince people before the Defence has even opened, the case should never have been brought.

Gatling

I think the kids testimony will be a key factor in this ,
Especially if they say that they were forced or coercion was used to stick with Molly or her father's statements

screamer

There's a whiff of boiling bunny off this whole thing. I believe they'll get away it and it's sad for his family and kids to have to go through this trial if there's no justice to be had it's just opening old wounds again. Poor man what an awful death you'd not do that to an animal.....

January

Gatling wrote: »

I think the kids testimony will be a key factor in this ,
Especially if they say that they were forced or coercion was used to stick with Molly or her father's statements

The kids won't be testifying, they're at home in Ireland with family.

harr

January wrote: »

The kids won't be testifying, they're at home in Ireland with family.

But will the children's statements be used at all or would they physically need to take the stand ?

Icaras

Birneybau wrote: »

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Any (presumably) grown up individual who uses the term "stop the world and get off" makes me want to... well, you know the rest...

I've never heard a kid use it.

You need to hang around kids more so.

RacoonQueen

Hasn't the kids testimony already been struck out? They believed the children had been coached in what to say?

January

harr wrote: »

But will the children's statements be used at all or would they physically need to take the stand ?

I think for any testimony to be used they have to take the stand but as another poster pointed out, it was quashed already becauase they thought they'd been coached.

AudreyHepburn

Paddy Cow wrote: »

He didn't need to do anything to get rid of Jason. Jason was making plans to move back to Ireland with the children. Perhaps Molly found out and wasn't happy about it......

This is a big reason why the self defence story doesn't wash with me.

If Jason was in the process of leaving anyway then there was no need to take any further steps to protect Molly, if he was abusive which I don't believe for a second he was.

AudreyHepburn

Auldloon wrote: »

I vaguely remember reading that she had spoken to a family law type. If they had planned on killing him I'd say it would have been much cleaner. I think Jason was in bed asleep having taken a pill earlier. Molly found something, evidence he was planning moving back to Ireland without her or something that enraged her. She went outside/got the paving stone and attacked him with it as he lay in bed. He got out of bed, lots of screaming and shouting and that he could well have been squeezing her neck and threatening to kill her when the dad arrived with the Louisville slugger. Then they both beat him in a frenzy.

The only problem I have with this is that a commotion like that should have woken the children bit by all accounts they didn't wake until the police came to take them away.

I believe that he was drugged using the sleeping pills, Molly dealt the blows and killed him by herself and then panicked and called Daddy who is now covering for her.

AudreyHepburn

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Hasn't the kids testimony already been struck out? They believed the children had been coached in what to say?

Surely that fact is evidence in itself of the mentality of these people?

mikeybrennan

They rowed over him leaving with the kids

She attacks him in his sleep with paving slab

Father in law arrives with bat

They straighten out the story

If the mother in law knows anything she is told to say she heard nothing to avoid complicating the stories

njs030

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Surely that fact is evidence in itself of the mentality of these people?

Coached by who? Mentality of which people?

As was said earlier in the thread it's the prosecutions job to make them look guilty and spin a story of an evil woman trying to murder a defenceless man in his sleep, wait and hear what the defence has to say.

Didn't an expert say the level of sleeping pill in his system was minimal? People on this thread are still going on about it as if she fed him pills when it's been proven he wasn't "drugged".

jimmycrackcorm

The paving stone is very interesting in that at some point you have to go out and intentionally bring it in.

Water John

The evidence today, that both were in proximity to Jason, while his head was near or on the floor when hit, indicated by blood spatter pattern, is pretty conclusive.
Both were involved in the action. Also the brick was used, multiple times. He was hit a good few times, lying face down and later rolled onto his back.

Any amount of whataboutery, in defence, should not be able to cloud, today's evidence.

GLaDOS

I've only been half following this, but it's hard to imagine how a paving slab could be used in simple self defence.

January

notjustsweet wrote: »

Coached by who? Mentality of which people?

As was said earlier in the thread it's the prosecutions job to make them look guilty and spin a story of an evil woman trying to murder a defenceless man in his sleep, wait and hear what the defence has to say.

Didn't an expert say the level of sleeping pill in his system was minimal? People on this thread are still going on about it as if she fed him pills when it's been proven he wasn't "drugged".

But funnily enough the prosecution haven't been painting either of them as evil. They've simply been putting forward facts of how he was hit, how the blood splattered etc.

Water John

The prosecution would play right into the hands of the defence if they went the route of motivation, character etc. The dead person cannot defend their own reputation. The defence is all about, they having to defend themselves from this 'wife beater'.
The prosecution is letting the cold, hard, evidence, carry the case and rightly so.

screamer

I think I read somewhere that he'd started liquidating assets in advance of leaving her. I wonder if it's that he wasn't going to be allowed to leave and destroy the American dream life he'd built for her?

marklazarcovic

shes beginning to sound like the control freak who could not take it when he decided to go home without her and sell the assets