Rickshaws -- do you like them or hate them?

ED E

lucernarian wrote: »

@ED E you described the claims of drug dealing as "hot air" - I wonder what you have to say about this:

https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2018/0511/962729-dublin-rickshaws-drugs/

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2018/0530/967014-rickshaws/

Sometimes I wonder why it takes multiple media and govt statements and investigations to be released before we can call a spade a spade on this forum.

I'm not one that normally holds their tongue but honestly thought the stories of rampant dealing were exaggerated. I've not seen any despite the convictions. But that said Ive not seen Taxi drivers dealing either and they've been done too so maybe that doesnt say much.



A ban is a nice idea, but who'd enforce it? The Gardai? Fat chance.

expectationlost

from 2016 to 2017 eighty-seven (87) rickshaw drivers operating in the Dublin Metropolitan Region South Central who were suspected of committing offences contrary to Sections 3 and 15 of the Misuse of Drugs Acts 1977 to 2016. https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2018-05-29a.665&s=rickshaws#g667.r

just suspects but still, could be immigration issues mixed up in that

Del.Monte

expectationlost wrote: »

eighty-seven (87) rickshaw drivers operating in the Dublin Metropolitan Region South Central who were suspected of committing offences contrary to Sections 3 and 15 of the Misuse of Drugs Acts 1977 to 2016. https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2018-05-29a.665&s=rickshaws#g667.r

just suspects but

Ah sure, as one wise poster said what's wrong with dealing the odd bag of weed but why stop there..why not sell a bit of cocaine as well. :rolleyes:

loyatemu

banning rickshaws will undoubtedly stamp out all the drug problems in the city. I hear some drug dealers drive cars, we should ban those too, and the Red Line Luas while we're at it.

seriously though, the only reason for banning them seems to be that some people find them annoying. If they were genuinely dangerous or causing serious traffic problems then the guards could sort that out using existing laws. I don't agree with banning something for such nebulous reasons.

brokenarms

Since this announcement their behaviour has become twice as bad.

I nearly killed a rickshaw rider last night when he looked and still pulled right across the path of a full bus. Braked heavy to avoid.

Maybe squished rickshaw is what Shane Ross needs to get the ball rolling.

Stephen15

brokenarms wrote: »

Since this announcement their behaviour has become twice as bad.

I nearly killed a rickshaw rider last night when he looked and still pulled right across the path of a full bus. Braked heavy to avoid.

Maybe squished rickshaw is what Shane Ross needs to get the ball rolling.

I hear some of the Dublin rickshaws are currently being transported over to Ibiza.

Stephen15

loyatemu wrote: »

banning rickshaws will undoubtedly stamp out all the drug problems in the city. I hear some drug dealers drive cars, we should ban those too, and the Red Line Luas while we're at it.

seriously though, the only reason for banning them seems to be that some people find them annoying. If they were genuinely dangerous or causing serious traffic problems then the guards could sort that out using existing laws. I don't agree with banning something for such nebulous reasons.

They are a nuisance and they are dangerous. No tax, no insurance, they cycle carelessly without regard for their passengers or other road users safety that's why they need to be banned. Being a nuisance is a secondary reason they are being banned.

magicbastarder

i'm getting a lot of 'lack of regulation is a reason not to regulate them' coming off some of the arguments here.

monument

Lots of stuff that doesn’t make sense here...

Stephen15 wrote: »

They are a nuisance and they are dangerous. No tax, no insurance, they cycle carelessly without regard for their passengers or other road users safety that's why they need to be banned. Being a nuisance is a secondary reason they are being banned.

The ones that are bicycles don’t require insurance or tax and the ones which are motor vehicles can be taken off the road and held for not having insurance or tax.

Cycling carelessly is mainly an enforcement issue and if the Gardai don’t think the person is being truthful about their ID or address, they can take the bicycles.

At least a good chunk of different road users think the others are a nuisance... it’s really not a valid justification to go banning types of vehicles or their use for higher.

brokenarms wrote: »

Since this announcement their behaviour has become twice as bad.

I nearly killed a rickshaw rider last night when he looked and still pulled right across the path of a full bus. Braked heavy to avoid.

Maybe squished rickshaw is what Shane Ross needs to get the ball rolling.

How likely is it that since the announcement their behaviour actually has become twice as bad? It’s the same with anything that gets coverage vs things that don’t get much coverage.

And if pulling out in front of people is a reason to ban them it’s a reason to ban cars.

Stephen15

monument wrote: »

The ones that are bicycles don’t require insurance or tax and the ones which are motor vehicles can be taken off the road and held for not having insurance or tax.

Cycling carelessly is mainly an enforcement issue and if the Gardai don’t think the person is being truthful about their ID or address, they can take the bicycles.

At least a good chunk of different road users think the others are a nuisance... it’s really not a valid justification to go banning types of vehicles or their use for higher.

It's obviously not happening as other posters alluded to these rickshaws are dangerous. The Gardai aren't obviously doing enough to stop them driving dangerously because there are still plenty out there driving dangerously. They rip people off, they're dangerous, I would imagine a percentage of drivers are illegal immigrants and should be deported, they're drug dealing and they are also a nuisance in the sense that they are trying to hassle people into using them. I honestly can't think of any good points about them. Can you?

Lord Glentoran

They are a rip-off. Won’t be missed.

LiamoSail

Stephen15 wrote: »

It's obviously not happening as other posters alluded to these rickshaws are dangerous. The Gardai aren't obviously doing enough to stop them driving dangerously because there are still plenty out there driving dangerously. They rip people off, they're dangerous, I would imagine a percentage of drivers are illegal immigrants and should be deported, they're drug dealing and they are also a nuisance in the sense that they are trying to hassle people into using them. I honestly can't think of any good points about them. Can you?

They're environmentally friendly and provide an in demand service. You know the fare before you engage a Rick shaw, so hardly a rip off. I'd rather pay a tenner from the Point after a gig to O'Connel bridge than walk, so not really a rip off in that regard.

I guess plenty are selling drugs, I don't particularly care; I'm not buying so doesn't affect me. I'm not too pushed whether my bus, Luas or taxi driver is doing smiler either, once they're capable of providing the service I have engaged them for.

There is an issue with regard to safety and regulation, but it's not insurmountable

Esel

So some of them are dope pedallers, and the rest are just dopes?

Del.Monte

LiamoSail wrote: »

They're environmentally friendly and provide an in demand service. You know the fare before you engage a Rick shaw, so hardly a rip off. I'd rather pay a tenner from the Point after a gig to O'Connel bridge than walk, so not really a rip off in that regard.

I guess plenty are selling drugs, I don't particularly care; I'm not buying so doesn't affect me. I'm not too pushed whether my bus, Luas or taxi driver is doing smiler either, once they're capable of providing the service I have engaged them for.

There is an issue with regard to safety and regulation, but it's not insurmountable

What a feckin attitude!

MarkY91

Some are drug dealers.

They charge a laughable fee to go down the road.

They are careless. Almost as careless and retarded as the deliveroo cyclists ..almost.

Stephen15

LiamoSail wrote: »

They're environmentally friendly and provide an in demand service. You know the fare before you engage a Rick shaw, so hardly a rip off. I'd rather pay a tenner from the Point after a gig to O'Connel bridge than walk, so not really a rip off in that regard.

I guess plenty are selling drugs, I don't particularly care; I'm not buying so doesn't affect me. I'm not too pushed whether my bus, Luas or taxi driver is doing smiler either, once they're capable of providing the service I have engaged them for.

There is an issue with regard to safety and regulation, but it's not insurmountable

Rickshaws solely operate in Dublin CC. Nowhere in Dublin CC is not within walking distance of another part of Dublin CC. People who take rickshaws should be walking which is also environmentally friendly. Why can't you get the Luas from the Point to O'Connell Street another environmentally form of transport and cheaper than one of these cowboys.

The rickshaw is attractive because it's unregulated. If it was regulated no one would take up the oppurtunity to run a rickshaw business or drive one.

McCrack

Stephen15 wrote: »

Rickshaws solely operate in Dublin CC. Nowhere in Dublin CC is not within walking distance of another part of Dublin CC. People who take rickshaws should be walking which is also environmentally friendly. Why can't you get the Luas from the Point to O'Connell Street another environmentally form of transport and cheaper than one of these cowboys.

The rickshaw is attractive because it's unregulated. If it was regulated no one would take up the oppurtunity to run a rickshaw business or drive one.

Nah

If youre in town after drinking etc and you want to hop the other side of the Liffey or wherever they serve a purpose when it can be difficult to get a taxi.

They provide a service that people are entitled to use and pay for.

Stephen15

McCrack wrote: »

Nah

If youre in town after drinking etc and you want to hop the other side of the Liffey or wherever they serve a purpose when it can be difficult to get a taxi.

They provide a service that people are entitled to use and pay for.

In a manner which puts yourself and others in danger. They are unsafe simple as. Just because you want to use one doesn't mean others should put in unesscary danger. Would you be in favour of them if you involved in an accident in them?

McCrack

Stephen15 wrote: »

In a manner which puts yourself and others in danger. They are unsafe simple as. Just because you want to use one doesn't mean others should put in unesscary danger. Would you be in favour of them if you involved in an accident in them?

There are inherent risks with every mode of transportation

I am quite happy to take my chances

Stephen15

McCrack wrote: »

There are inherent risks with every mode of transportation

I am quite happy to take my chances

Yeah but at least other modes are insured and you can claim if you are injured. Other methods have taken measure to mitigate the risks. Rickshaws have not. Your more likely to get injured travelling by rickshaw than walking, bus or taxi.

Also not everyone is happy to take their chances especially if your living depends on it.

McCrack

Stephen15 wrote: »

Yeah but at least other modes are insured and you can claim if you are injured. Other methods have taken measure to mitigate the risks. Rickshaws have not. Your more likely to get injured travelling by rickshaw than walking, bus or taxi.

Also not everyone is happy to take their chances especially if your living depends on it.

If there was an accident involving a Rickshaw it would depend who was negligent - it doesn't automatically mean a passenger cannot claim for an injury - other road users have insurance and if they do not the MIBI will step in.

Anyway they provide a service and for that reason I welcome them. People can choose to use them or not.

Del.Monte

How the hell did we ever manage to get around without them. The whole population will eventually end up like the passengers and crew on the "Axiom". :rolleyes:

magicbastarder

Stephen15 wrote: »

Yeah but at least other modes are insured and you can claim if you are injured. Other methods have taken measure to mitigate the risks. Rickshaws have not. Your more likely to get injured travelling by rickshaw than walking, bus or taxi.

again, i am hearing the drawbacks of lack of regulation as being used as an excuse for refusing to consider regulation.
i recently had to walk from the national concert hall to the far end of capel street, and the sooner i got there, the better. i hate the idea that i have to call on the services of a car to achieve this trip.
why are people so hung up on the current execution of a concept being the only example possible of that concept?

Stephen15

magicbastarder wrote: »

again, i am hearing the drawbacks of lack of regulation as being used as an excuse for refusing to consider regulation.
i recently had to walk from the national concert hall to the far end of capel street, and the sooner i got there, the better. i hate the idea that i have to call on the services of a car to achieve this trip.
why are people so hung up on the current execution of a concept being the only example possible of that concept?

The thing about regulation is you would have to pay a large number of civil servants to regulate the industry which would cost a lot of money. The real reason why the rickshaw business is attractive is because it is unregulated if you regulated it would no likely longer exist as it would be no longer be lucrative to get involved and it would also be likely that a large number of the current crop of drivers would not be eligible to apply for licences under a regulated system. So you might aswell ban them.

You can't continue with the current free for all especially now with 24 hours buses likely fingers crossed it would only be a matter of time before someone is killed or seriously injured due to an incident caused by one. The problem in this country is it's only after a serious incident something is done to prevent another serious incident happening.

howiya

Stephen15 wrote: »

Your more likely to get injured travelling by rickshaw than walking, bus or taxi.

Are there statistics on this?

Stephen15

howiya wrote: »

Are there statistics on this?

No but when was the last you heard of someone being injured in bus, taxi or Luas crash or the last time a bus, taxi or Luas driver beat and raped a passenger.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/rickshaw-driver-who-left-severely-injured-woman-in-dublin-laneway-after-raping-her-appeals-sentence-as-victim-faces-more-surgery-35485755.html

brokenarms

howiya wrote: »

Are there statistics on this?

Do you really need statistic to explain the bleedin obvious.

zero crash protection
unqualified drivers
No vehicle testing for the actual rickshaw

Not to mention the complete disregard for the ROTR and laws.

What about their revenue.

How are their earning benefiting society? I cant see a system of taxation in the massive cash fares they accumulate from the service or even their drug dealing.

They really do need to go. They are parasites ..

magicbastarder

Stephen15 wrote: »

No but when was the last you heard of someone being injured in bus, taxi or Luas crash or the last time a bus, taxi or Luas driver beat and raped a passenger.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/rickshaw-driver-who-left-severely-injured-woman-in-dublin-laneway-after-raping-her-appeals-sentence-as-victim-faces-more-surgery-35485755.html

what a weird and irrelevant reply.
i know someone who was injured in a taxi crash. i know someone else who was raped by a taxi driver. people have been killed in taxi crashes. people have been killed in bus crashes, and injured in luas crashes.

but what a weird digression, make a claim you can't stand over and your defence is 'no, no, the ball is over *here*'.

corks finest

monument wrote: »

I hope you don't mind -- I've edited the thread title. It's about regulations for rickshaws in Ireland, not just Dublin.

Also: It's open to all regardless of if you've used one or not.

No regulations,no rickshaw

Rechuchote

An ecological choice for short journeys… of course they should be licensed and regulated under the taxi-for-hire legislation. Banned? No.

As for drugs, most users would be more likely to ask a taxi driver about them than a rickshaw driver, I suspect. And rape… well:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/taxi-drivers-wont-give-dna-for-rape-probe-union-boss-35324900.html

Lumen

I'd expect the risk of harm to a drunk person in Dublin city centre is lower for being conveyed by rickshaw than walking.

It's also easier to puke over the side of a moving rickshaw than to puke out of the window of a moving taxi. Less blowback.

Lord Glentoran

Lumen wrote: »

I'd expect the risk of harm to a drunk person in Dublin city centre is lower for being conveyed by rickshaw than walking.

It's also easier to puke over the side of a moving rickshaw than to puke out of the window of a moving taxi. Less blowback.

Enticing.

Mr.Frame

Regulation wont work,simple.

At present the rickshaws break every rule under the sun, they go down one way streets, through red lights,on footpaths ect.

Given that the taxi industry (which has far greater numbers of cars)has less than 15 "enforcers" for the whole country Theres not a hope in hell an enforcer will be to do anything.Besides the rickshaw drivers will just pedal away.

Ban them I say , like they did in Galway.

what_traffic

Mr.Frame wrote: »

Regulation wont work,simple.

At present the rickshaws break every rule under the sun, they go down one way streets, through red lights,on footpaths ect.

Given that the taxi industry (which has far greater numbers of cars)has less than 15 "enforcers" for the whole country Theres not a hope in hell an enforced will be to do anything.Besides the rickshaw drivers will just pedal away.

Ban them I say , like they did in Galway.

This was done via a By-Law in Galway City Council, who enforces that?

magicbastarder

'I was on one myself late at night' - Shane Ross left 'shocked' after rickshaw ride
"I was on one myself late one night and I was pretty shocked quite honestly because it confirmed everything that I had heard about them," he said.
https://www.independent.ie/incoming/i-was-on-one-myself-late-at-night-shane-ross-left-shocked-after-rickshaw-ride-36964935.html

*everything* he had heard - obviously the driver offered minister ross some yokes as they were on stephen street. i wonder if he bought them?

john boye

magicbastarder wrote: »

'I was on one myself late at night' - Shane Ross left 'shocked' after rickshaw ride
"I was on one myself late one night and I was pretty shocked quite honestly because it confirmed everything that I had heard about them," he said.
https://www.independent.ie/incoming/i-was-on-one-myself-late-at-night-shane-ross-left-shocked-after-rickshaw-ride-36964935.html

*everything* he had heard - obviously the driver offered minister ross some yokes as they were on stephen street. i wonder if he bought them?

Would explain a lot

endacl

Rechuchote wrote: »

An ecological choice for short journeys…

... would be legs.

Rechuchote

endacl wrote: »

... would be legs.

Rickshaws are mostly leg-powered √

whisky_galore

Rechuchote wrote: »

Rickshaws are mostly leg-powered √

Why do they only come out at night though?

Because it's easier to rip off drunk people?

LiamoSail

Stephen15 wrote: »

Rickshaws solely operate in Dublin CC. Nowhere in Dublin CC is not within walking distance of another part of Dublin CC. People who take rickshaws should be walking which is also environmentally friendly. Why can't you get the Luas from the Point to O'Connell Street another environmentally form of transport and cheaper than one of these cowboys.

I do walk a lot, but sometimes you want to get to your destination sooner. Regarding the Luas, it's a nightmare after a gig in the point. Also, time constraints of not going to somewhere on Luas line

LiamoSail

I bet half the people complaining about rickshaws will be the same complaining when they're stuck in town with no taxis available.

There's a case for banning and there's a case for regulating. But banning without providing an alternative or providing more/later buses or Luas is crazy. It's hard enough as is to get around the city at certain times

LuckyLloyd

LiamoSail wrote: »

I bet half the people complaining about rickshaws will be the same complaining when they're stuck in town with no taxis available.

There's a case for banning and there's a case for regulating. But banning without providing an alternative or providing more/later buses or Luas is crazy. It's hard enough as is to get around the city at certain times

Rickshaws at present aren't facilitating any valid public transport journeys. They're just used by drunks instead of a five minute walk. Girlos in their heels will be complaining I suppose, but they'd be complaining anyway.

Stephen15

LiamoSail wrote: »

I bet half the people complaining about rickshaws will be the same complaining when they're stuck in town with no taxis available.

There's a case for banning and there's a case for regulating. But banning without providing an alternative or providing more/later buses or Luas is crazy. It's hard enough as is to get around the city at certain times

But rickshaws are useless if you want to go home unless you live in the CC.

LiamoSail

Stephen15 wrote: »

But rickshaws are useless if you want to go home unless you live in the CC.

Yea. There's quiet a few living in or near the city centre that like to get home too.

Also handy for getting around the city centre. Displacing all those who would in the past have used Rick Shaws is going to make it harder for others to get taxis home, as taxis are instead used for short journies around town

Stephen15

LiamoSail wrote: »

Yea. There's quiet a few living in or near the city centre that like to get home too.

Also handy for getting around the city centre. Displacing all those who would in the past have used Rick Shaws is going to make it harder for others to get taxis home, as taxis are instead used for short journies around town

No one's going to pay over €30 in a Rickshaw as opposed to a tenner in taxi to get if they live near the city centre to get to places like Ranelagh or Phibsboro.

People aren't going to que up for hours to get a taxi from Harcourt Street to Zaytoons at 3 in the morning they would likely skip going to Zaytoon and just go home instead. Taxi drivers may also refuse short journies on the grounds of passengers being too drunk.

Arcade_Tryer

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Rickshaws at present aren't facilitating any valid public transport journeys.

Rickshaws at present are facilitating many valid public transport journeys. They are used by people moving around the city centre for a multitude of reasons.

Stephen15

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Rickshaws at present are facilitating many valid public transport journeys. They are used by people moving around the city centre for a multitude of reasons.

So a pissed person going from Harcourt to Zaytoon is a valid pt journey at 3am in the morning? Most of their work is ferrying people from Nightclubs to late night eateries. Hardly important public transport work is it.

Arcade_Tryer

Stephen15 wrote: »

So a pissed person going from Harcourt to Zaytoon is a valid pt journey at 3am in the morning? Most of their work is ferrying people from Nightclubs to late night eateries. Hardly important public transport work is it.

Doesn't matter if it's important or not. And who decides what is and isn't important? It's obviously important to the rickshaw operators and their customers. And maybe unimportant to others. The most important thing is that demand exists for the service.

fritzelly

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Doesn't matter if it's important or not. And who decides what is and isn't important? It's obviously important to the rickshaw operators and their customers. And maybe unimportant to others. The most important thing is that demand exists for the service.

Demand would suggest that the citizens of Dublin were crying out for rickshaws - don't remember the public outcrying for such a service

How did we ever get from Temple Bar to Harcourt St before rickshaws...

It's no more than a exercise on how to rob the drunken public who are too incapable to walk up the road

magicbastarder

Stephen15 wrote: »

So a pissed person going from Harcourt to Zaytoon is a valid pt journey at 3am in the morning? Most of their work is ferrying people from Nightclubs to late night eateries. Hardly important public transport work is it.

maybe we should shut down the entire taxi network in dublin after 7pm so, as it's mainly people heading out to drink and eat.