Irish insurance company refusing to offer third party abroad

Fafftastic

Apologies if this has come up before, I wasn't able to find a recent thread!

I have read repeatedly that EU insurance companies are required to provide the legal minimum insurance when an EU vehicle is in another EU member state, regardless of the duration of time that it's there.

I have an Irish van but will be doing a 7 month placement in France (related to a European mobility programme). I was a named driver on the vehicle but have recently bought it and am now the owner and policy holder. The policy is underwritten by Patrona but they are refusing to provide third party cover while I'm abroad as they say that 7 months means that I would technically be a resident of France rather than Ireland during the 12 month insurance period.

Can anyone shed some light on this? As far as I understand, they are legally obliged to provide it. I'm even coming home with the van for two or three weeks at Christmas so it wouldn't be seven months straight. I found a 2009 EU directive which states the following:

24. All compulsory motor insurance policies should cover the entire territory of the Community.

(25) Some insurance undertakings insert into insurance policies clauses to the effect that the contract will be cancelled if the vehicle remains outside the Member State of registration for longer than a specified period. This practice is in conflict with the principle set out in this Directive, according to which compulsory motor insurance should cover, on the basis of a single premium, the entire territory of the Community. It should therefore be specified that the insurance cover is to remain valid during the whole term of the contract, irrespective of whether the vehicle remains in another Member State for a particular period, without prejudice to the obligations under Member States’ national legislation with respect to the registration of vehicles.

(26) In the interests of the party insured, every insurance policy should guarantee for a single premium, in each Member State, the cover required by its law or the cover required by the law of the Member State where the vehicle is normally based, when that cover is higher.



Grateful for any advice!

Liam McPoyle

Vehicle is not permanently in Ireland so they can refuse cover.

Permanently in Ireland would generally mean it spends no more than 90 days outside of the country.

CiniO

Business Cat wrote: »

Vehicle is not permanently in Ireland so they can refuse cover.

Permanently in Ireland would generally mean it spends no more than 90 days outside of the country.

And what laws/regulations give them a right to refuse cover if vehicle is not permanently in Ireland?

Liam McPoyle

CiniO wrote: »

And what laws/regulations give them a right to refuse cover if vehicle is not permanently in Ireland?

Nothing to do with laws or regulations, insurers are privately run businesses that are free to put what ever acceptance criteria or terms and conditions they see fit on their policies once they are not discriminatory under the terms of the employment equality act ie gender, ethnicity, disabilities, sexual orientation etc.

CiniO

Business Cat wrote: »

Nothing to do with laws or regulations, insurers are privately run businesses that are free to put what ever acceptance criteria or terms and conditions they see fit on their policies once they are not discriminatory under the terms of the employment equality act ie gender, ethnicity, disabilities, sexual orientation etc.

Few quotes:

The Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport has responsibility for the legislative framework governing motor insurance. While the Department monitors the cost and availability of motor insurance in Ireland, it has no role in the regulation of insurers, or in the pricing or provision of motor insurance which are consumer matters.

All third party liability motor insurance policies are valid throughout the European Union for the full term of their cover. Additional benefits such as Fire, Theft and Comprehensive cover need to be negotiated with the motor insurance provider.

http://www.dttas.ie/roads/english/motor-insurance

To me, it doesn't look like any insurance company can just volunteer to refuse third party cover all over EU for the full term of the policy.

grogi

CiniO wrote: »

To me, it doesn't look like any insurance company can just volunteer to refuse third party cover all over EU for the full term of the policy.

The problem is that are not refusing cover abroad. They are refusing cover period.

Business Cat wrote: »

Nothing to do with laws or regulations, insurers are privately run businesses that are free to put what ever acceptance criteria or terms and conditions they see fit on their policies once they are not discriminatory under the terms of the employment equality act ie gender, ethnicity, disabilities, sexual orientation etc.

And that is the issue. The insurance is required by the state, but hardly regulated by the state. I really like the Polish model - where the mandatory TPL insurance does not even come with T&C. Everything about that insurance is defined by the statute.

wonski

Business Cat wrote: »

Nothing to do with laws or regulations, insurers are privately run businesses that are free to put what ever acceptance criteria or terms and conditions they see fit on their policies once they are not discriminatory under the terms of the employment equality act ie gender, ethnicity, disabilities, sexual orientation etc.

I just read it twice and can't believe it.

Whatever terms and conditions? Once they are not discriminatory under employment equality act?

I am sure there are more laws when it comes to underwriting motor policies in EU than gender and sexual orientation tbh.

grogi

wonski wrote: »

I just read it twice and can't believe it.

Whatever terms and conditions? Once they are not discriminatory under employment equality act?

Invisible market hand People will not take policies that are rubbish, right?!

Charles Babbage

The OP might note that he would not be considered to be resident in France by the Revenue. He could not have a French car and come home at Christmas as he would be illegally driving a foreign registered car

Perhaps the European Consumer Office in Dublin could help?