Go-Ahead Dublin City Routes - Updates and Discussion

devnull

ax586 wrote: »

And where are you going to pull the buses out of for that there struggling to keep the service's they have at the minute with the buses the have...today I was in the garage around 2 and there was only 5 spare buses in there in case there was a breakdown and buses coming of there duty but going straight back out onto another one ...

I noticed a 191 vehicle in service yesterday, how many of the extra buses to be delivered are currently in service?

Sir Oxman

Was on the 76 on Tue 26th.
Driver very pleasant but hit the wrong button elsewhere after I paid by leapcard so had the following blasted out as I walked down the bus:

"This bus is under attack. Please dial 999" (In an English accent)

Went on for about 5 minutes as the driver called in for help in stopping it.

The looks I got

Stephen15

ax586 wrote: »

And where are you going to pull the buses out of for that there struggling to keep the service's they have at the minute with the buses the have...today I was in the garage around 2 and there was only 5 spare buses in there in case there was a breakdown and buses coming of there duty but going straight back out onto another one ...

This should've been taken into account from day one

ax586

devnull wrote: »

I noticed a 191 vehicle in service yesterday, how many of the extra buses to be delivered are currently in service?

4 at the minute and 11576 broke down in bray yesterday

ax586

Stephen15 wrote: »

This should've been taken into account from day one

Should of been but wasn't..typical thinking in Ireland

CatInABox

https://twitter.com/TFIupdates/status/1114095340611887105

Update on GoAheads second depot out in Naas.

Tomrota

CatInABox wrote: »

https://twitter.com/TFIupdates/status/1114095340611887105

Update on GoAheads second depot out in Naas.

Where will the depot be?

Yer Da sells Avon

Tomrota wrote: »

Where will the depot be?

Tougher's Industrial Estate, beside J10 on the M7, I think.

Stephen15

Some LFs from BE due to transfer have now been repainted into TFI livery same livery as the ex DB buses looks really bad on the LFs and they should be in a different livery for regional services not the same as DB which is going to cause some confusion having regional buses in the same livery as city buses.

devnull

Stephen15 wrote: »

Some LFs from BE due to transfer have now been repainted into TFI livery same livery as the ex DB buses looks really bad on the LFs and they should be in a different livery for regional services not the same as DB which is going to cause some confusion having regional buses in the same livery as city buses.

The livery isn't going to be the same - it may look like it at the moment but there are going to be different bits added and additional elements added to the final version.

I think the blue looks rather nice if you ask me on there.

GM228

Stephen15 wrote: »

Some LFs from BE due to transfer have now been repainted into TFI livery same livery as the ex DB buses looks really bad on the LFs and they should be in a different livery for regional services not the same as DB which is going to cause some confusion having regional buses in the same livery as city buses.

Thats LF313 which I reported here as transferring along with LF314.

Both have changed over to allow driver training and wìll be followed by 315-325 in due course.

As a side, BE are taking delivery of extra streetlights at the moment (add on to the Waterford order, but for non Waterford services) and I'm curious if they carry the same livery as the first streetlights or the existing BE livery? I understand they are in the TFI livery but have not seen any confirmation as yet.

john boye

Well my first reaction is not positive at all but I'll reserve judgement until we see the finished product with whatever else is applied. But based on how bare the GAI Dublin buses are I won't be expecting much.

Stephen15

devnull wrote: »

The livery isn't going to be the same - it may look like it at the moment but there are going to be different bits added and additional elements added to the final version.

I think the blue looks rather nice if you ask me on there.

It looks like it will be fairly similar though if its yellow at the front. They could gone with another colour like at the front of regional buses instead of yellow which is still in the NDAs guidelines for visibility.

GM228

Have heard that the GA Kildare services will have a split changeover (3 routes initially) rather than all 6 starting in August and completing in November.

P.S may be time to change to thread title to a more general title for GA as it's not just about 10% of DB routes for a long time now.

Qrt

john boye wrote: »

Well my first reaction is not positive at all but I'll reserve judgement until we see the finished product with whatever else is applied. But based on how bare the GAI Dublin buses are I won't be expecting much.

GAI buses are still sans-advertisement, I don't really get why!

In other news, single-decker what I believe to be Streetlites seem to be getting very popular on rush-hour 175 services towards UCD. The demand on that route is very tidal I'd imagine.

Charles Babbage

Stephen15 wrote: »

It looks like it will be fairly similar though if its yellow at the front. They could gone with another colour like at the front of regional buses instead of yellow which is still in the NDAs guidelines for visibility.

When you stand at the the stop and see the bus coming along the road you need some information about whether it is a city bus or a bog bus. This doesn't seem very obvious from the livery shown.

Stephen15

Qrt wrote: »

GAI buses are still sans-advertisement, I don't really get why!

In other news, single-decker what I believe to be Streetlites seem to be getting very popular on rush-hour 175 services towards UCD. The demand on that route is very tidal I'd imagine.

The NTA are trying to sort out a contract covering all their buses for advertisements for both DB and GAI could be starting when the new direct award for DB starts I believe.

The Streetlites are on the 175 I believe because since the 18 and 76/a switched over they have had a shortage of buses meaning that single deckers have ended on routes they shouldn't be on.

Yer Da sells Avon

Stephen15 wrote: »

The Streetlites are on the 175 I believe because since the 18 and 76/a switched over they have had a shortage of buses meaning that single deckers have ended on routes they shouldn't be on.

So far, I've seen them on the 175, 45A and 75. They haven't been (and most likely won't ever be) on the 59 and I'm not sure about the 63. Some of the roundabouts on Cornelscourt Hill are a bit tight, but I think they'd manage reasonably well on that route.

Stephen15

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

So far, I've seen them on the 175, 45A and 75. They haven't been (and most likely won't ever be) on the 59 and I'm not sure about the 63. Some of the roundabouts on Cornelscourt Hill are a bit tight, but I think they'd manage reasonably well on that route.

I believe some have been on the 17 and 114 aswell. The 63 is one of my local routes and I've yet to see any single deckers on it DB used to put WV class midibuses on that route fairly regularly when Donnybrook had a decent quantity of them and they managed. For that reason I'm surprised they haven't been on it yet but I know the 63 is interworked with the 75 which foes need double deckers.

dublinman1990

I haven't seen them on the 17 or 114 yet. I was down in Blackrock on Thursday. They mostly older SGs & 2 GT's. I've seen no streetlites on these routes yet AFAIK. I took the 114 to Dunnes Stores at The Playwright on Thursday evening. It was an old SG. There was one GT on the other duty for the 114. The other GT was on the 17.

punisher5112

Killiney hill will never allow the streetlites as they are now.

They are too long and wouldn't make the turn without taking the rear and side off....

Stephen15

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I haven't seen them on the 17 or 114 yet. I was down in Blackrock on Thursday. They mostly older SGs & 2 GT's. I've seen no streetlites on these routes yet AFAIK. I took the 114 to Dunnes Stores at The Playwright on Thursday evening. It was an old SG. There was one GT on the other duty for the 114. The other GT was on the 17.

I saw a picture of one on Facebook

dublinman1990

Stephen15 wrote: »

I saw a picture of one on Facebook

There is one there on Flickr as well. It was on the 114.

Stephen15

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

So far, I've seen them on the 175, 45A and 75. They haven't been (and most likely won't ever be) on the 59 and I'm not sure about the 63. Some of the roundabouts on Cornelscourt Hill are a bit tight, but I think they'd manage reasonably well on that route.

DB used to put VTs on the 63 the odd time now and again so I'm sure a Streetlite would manage as one of the Saturday departures was part of a 46a duty usually the driver would swap a VT for whatever was allocated to the 63 usually an AV, AX or EV but if neither was available the VT would work it.

SG317

Anyone know what the story with route 102 is? GAI have said that it is on their list of routes to be converted to DD operation yet since the 24/3/2019 when it was meant to be DD operated all I have seen on it are SDs. Two weeks ago there were 5 SDs on it and no DDs, some of the SDs were absolutely packed. Route 63 should really be single decker operated, along with some of the 17 and 114. Route 236 has now become DD operated as-well since its interworked with the 76A. Which explains why SDs have been appearing on the 18 at midday, which is fair enough as the route isn't at all busy after the morning rush and before the evening peak.

Stephen15

SG317 wrote: »

Anyone know what the story with route 102 is? GAI have said that it is on their list of routes to be converted to DD operation yet since the 24/3/2019 when it was meant to be DD operated all I have seen on it are SDs. Two weeks ago there were 5 SDs on it and no DDs, some of the SDs were absolutely packed. Route 63 should really be single decker operated, along with some of the 17 and 114. Route 236 has now become DD operated as-well since its interworked with the 76A. Which explains why SDs have been appearing on the 18 at midday, which is fair enough as the route isn't at all busy after the morning rush and before the evening peak.

8 SGs were diverted from DB not all have been delivered yet so far only 4 or 5 I believe, GAI now have a shortage of buses hence why SDs having been allocated outside their usual routes as the NTA completely underestimated their requirements and likely need more than the 8 additional that were ordered. I also think the plan is to put a mixed allocation on the 102 of dds and sds not a complete dd allocation as I don't think GAI have enough buses to make it fully double deck but I stand to be corrected.

john boye

I honestly think they wouldn't have needed the extra deckers if they didn't have this nonsense of interworking routes with deckers working on routes that single deckers could easily handle.

soundman45

Agreed. So silly having double deckers work the 63 for example, its only done as 63/75/59/45a are all on same rota. Also the 45a must be quieter now with the 155 working alongside it for most of the route.

Stephen15

soundman45 wrote: »

Agreed. So silly having double deckers work the 63 for example, its only done as 63/75/59/45a are all on same rota. Also the 45a must be quieter now with the 155 working alongside it for most of the route.

Not really the 155 only runs parallel to it between Shankill Village and Bray Station just like the 145 and 84. The 45a gets a decent amount in DL and Bray travelling to and from Sallynoggin, Rochestown Avenue (along with the 7/a) and Ballybrack Village which is it is the only route serving it. After Bray Station it's more of a Bray local operating up the Boghall Road, around Oldcourt and on to Kilmac.

AlekSmart

john boye wrote: »

I honestly think they wouldn't have needed the extra deckers if they didn't have this nonsense of interworking routes with deckers working on routes that single deckers could easily handle.

It is something of a surprise that the Go-Ahead Group allowed it's Irish subsidiary to progress with the "Interlining" of routes,after the somewhat obvious collapse of the same system in it's recently accquired Singaporean tender (A very similar tender to the NTA's tranche here).

https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/go-ahead-singapore-sub-contracts-sbs-and-smrt-due-higher-expected-staff-attrition

The number of drivers who have left is fewer than 20, said a Go-Ahead spokesperson in response to queries, and did so because they had difficulties adjusting to the operator’s “interlining” model, which requires bus captains to drive a number of different routes during the week, instead of one single route.

The Go-Ahead experience in Singapore really should be informing the company's decision making process in Ireland,if,that is,the companys various subsidiaries actually do interact with each other operationally.

https://www.humanresourcesonline.net/staff-attrition-forces-go-ahead-singapore-sub-contract-bus-drivers/

A new entrant to Singapore’s bus sector, Go-Ahead Singapore (GAS) has entered into sub-contracting arrangements with SBS Transit and SMRT Buses, owing to a shortage of bus captains in its ranks.

GAS has arranged for 30 SBS Transit bus captains to be deployed at Loyang Depot from 21 September 2016 for approximately two months to drive Services 358 and 359. In addition, SMRT is sending 10 bus captains.

Of somewhat more importance is the Singaporean Government's realization that recruitment of new Bus Drivers is now a very real problem,not least due to the shift/rostering issues which "Interlining" brings with it.

Earlier this year, the sectoral manpower plan for the bus industry was announced, targeted at easier entry into bus careers, and enhancing career pathways, in order to strengthen the Singaporean core,

Launched by senior minister of state from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Ministry of Transport, Josephine Teo, the plan was developed by the Public Transport Sectoral Tripartite Committee.


The five strategies laid out in the plan are:

Facilitate entry and transition to bus careers – Preparatory workshops (e.g. resume writing skills), industry previews and learning visits; accelerated pathways to becoming bus captain.

Enhance training to uplift and professionalise bus careers – Establishment of the Singapore Bus Academy from the second half of 2016; 15 SkillsFuture Study Awards for bus professionals.

Promote attractive benefits and career progression pathways – Infrastructure upgrades at bus interchanges, along with stronger emphasis on workplace health management

Build pipeline of future bus professionals through pre-employment programmes – More bus-related content within the final-year curriculum at Republic Polytechnic.

Strengthen outreach and community appreciation of bus professionals – Outreach programmes to help Singaporeans better understand career opportunities within the public bus industry.

Additional to this,is the fact that Singaporean Bus Driver terms & conditions were forced to improve in the immediate aftermath of the discovery that tendering,of itself,would not provide a supply of qualified Bus Drivers prepared to work longer hours for less money in addition to less attractive rostering in general.

The Singaporean experience should have been a very clear warning (to both Go-Ahead AND The NTA) of how not to handle a new Tendering regime.

It remains to be seen whether either entity actually took note ?

ax586

soundman45 wrote: »

Agreed. So silly having double deckers work the 63 for example, its only done as 63/75/59/45a are all on same rota. Also the 45a must be quieter now with the 155 working alongside it for most of the route.

What makes you think that I left bray full the other day on 45A sure people are still letting the 155 go by and wait for the145/45A

soundman45

ax586 wrote: »

What makes you think that I left bray full the other day on 45A sure people are still letting the 155 go by and wait for the145/45A

Was my mistake earlier. I thought 155 followed 45a route to DL then into town same as 7. My bad.

Yer Da sells Avon

Stephen15 wrote: »

DB used to put VTs on the 63 the odd time now and again so I'm sure a Streetlite would manage as one of the Saturday departures was part of a 46a duty usually the driver would swap a VT for whatever was allocated to the 63 usually an AV, AX or EV but if neither was available the VT would work it.

I've driven a Streetlite out-of-service on the 63 route and didn't have any problems. The stretch between Cornelscourt Hill and Glenamuck Rd North would be tricky enough in heavy traffic though.

CramCycle

The 145 won't be abandoned now, the 155, from Bray onwards is maiNly working as a 145 relief bus, which was needed desperately anyway.

GM228

AlekSmart wrote: »

The Go-Ahead experience in Singapore......

At this stage the thread should be retitled Go-Ahead Ireland & Singapore.

Stephen15

CramCycle wrote: »

The 145 won't be abandoned now, the 155, from Bray onwards is maiNly working as a 145 relief bus, which was needed desperately anyway.

The Bus Connects E1 is more or less the same as the 155 bar a slight extension to Northwood.

p_haugh

Stephen15 wrote: »

The Bus Connects E1 is more or less the same as the 155 bar a slight extension to Northwood.

The E1 will be like the 155, but it goes to Northwood instead of IKEA.
The E2 will be the 46a into town, then follow the routing of the 155 to IKEA, and will extend to Charleston Shopping Centre.

dublinman1990

I was walking around Dun Laoghaire this evening to get a taxi home from Marine Road. I saw two teenage young fellas hanging off the very back of an SG while it was on the 75 to Tallaght. There was two young fellas chasing after the other two hanging onto the bus going down Georges St. I saw the bus with the young fellas pass me by outside Shaws. One of them was chasing on foot; the other one was on a mountain bike.

They were both saying the two other fellas would be f*cked if they were caught by the bus driver or by anyone else. I was completely disillusioned when I saw it. Unfortunately the bus was going through a clear road without any traffic. I couldn't stop the bus on time. I don't know if the bus driver caught them doing the act at the next stop outside Argos. I did see the bus past by me again when I was in the taxi at York Road. But they had both disappeared by then.

punisher5112

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I was walking around Dun Laoghaire this evening to get a taxi home from Marine Road. I saw two teenage young fellas hanging off the very back of an SG while it was on the 75 to Tallaght. There was two young fellas chasing after the other two hanging onto the bus going down Georges St. I saw the bus with the young fellas pass me by outside Shaws. One of them was chasing on foot; the other one was on a mountain bike.

They were both saying the two other fellas would be f*cked if they were caught by the bus driver or by anyone else. I was completely disillusioned when I saw it. Unfortunately the bus was going through a clear road without any traffic. I couldn't stop the bus on time. I don't know if the bus driver caught them doing the act at the next stop outside Argos. I did see the bus past by me again when I was in the taxi at York Road. But they had both disappeared by then.

Catch them?

They would tell the driver to fcuk off and laugh while running away.

Anyone that thinks this is on deserves to face plant the tarmac.

Only issue being they will get a considerable amount of money in compo if they survive.

So much for every SG getting a new modified rear bumper to stop people doing this.

Terribly designed and why any previous buses had a flat rear with no grooves or places to grab onto.

Qrt

punisher5112 wrote: »

So much for every SG getting a new modified rear bumper to stop people doing this.

Terribly designed and why any previous buses had a flat rear with no grooves or places to grab onto.

Maybe these models still have the original bumper? After all the 75 is a GAI route now, and if this particular bus was never with DB, it was probably never altered.

Scutting in Jobstown is virtually nonexistent these days.

Stephen15

Qrt wrote: »

Maybe these models still have the original bumper? After all the 75 is a GAI route now, and if this particular bus was never with DB, it was probably never altered.

Scutting in Jobstown is virtually nonexistent these days.

They all had the ledge beside the reg plate removed including GAI vehicles afaik. It's still happening as they can cling on to the top of the engine cover. I thought Ringsend solved the issue by allocating GTs to the 27.

devnull

Stephen15 wrote: »

They all had the ledge beside the reg plate removed including GAI vehicles afaik. It's still happening as they can cling on to the top of the engine cover. I thought Ringsend solved the issue by allocating GTs to the 27.

Trouble is that you need a gap somewhere to have a gap to allow for ventilation for the engine else on a warm day the engine is going to overheat which is obviously not a good thing.

There would have to be a more substantial re-design of the bottom of the rear of the vehicle to avoid this, with both a new engine door and the surrounding bodywork to be modified and that wouldn't be a really cheap job.

Even if they put a grille in like the Enviro 400 MMC people are still going to be able to hang on that so it's not going to fix the problem and I've seen it done once myself on the GT as people just latch under the Wright logo.

Best way of around it are probably lots of narrowly spaced grilles with the gap between them so small that you are not going to be able to get your fingers between them. That's one thing that the ALX400 does well, but the problem with that is that it restricts airflow far more. This was a problem with the early ALX400s with the initial cooling set-up which is why so many of them roared.

john boye

Stephen15 wrote: »

They all had the ledge beside the reg plate removed including GAI vehicles afaik. It's still happening as they can cling on to the top of the engine cover. I thought Ringsend solved the issue by allocating GTs to the 27.

I've seen scutting on GTs and pretty much every other type. It's not restricted to the SGs.

punisher5112

Qrt wrote: »

Maybe these models still have the original bumper? After all the 75 is a GAI route now, and if this particular bus was never with DB, it was probably never altered.

Scutting in Jobstown is virtually nonexistent these days.

They were all changed and the new ones don't stop it hence why I said pointless changing them.

Stephen15

devnull wrote: »

Trouble is that you need a gap somewhere to have a gap to allow for ventilation for the engine else on a warm day the engine is going to overheat which is obviously not a good thing.

There would have to be a more substantial re-design of the bottom of the rear of the vehicle to avoid this, with both a new engine door and the surrounding bodywork to be modified and that wouldn't be a really cheap job.

Even if they put a grille in like the Enviro 400 MMC people are still going to be able to hang on that so it's not going to fix the problem and I've seen it done once myself on the GT as people just latch under the Wright logo.

Best way of around it are probably lots of narrowly spaced grilles with the gap between them so small that you are not going to be able to get your fingers between them. That's one thing that the ALX400 does well, but the problem with that is that it restricts airflow far more. This was a problem with the early ALX400s with the initial cooling set-up which is why so many of them roared.

Judging by the back of an SG I don't think it be possible to put a grille on the ledge as this would impede on the ability to open the engine cover. Sure there was a picture doing the rounds of someone on rollarblades clinging on to the handle of the engine cover on an AX so no design is really going to eliminate all risk.

Qrt

punisher5112 wrote: »

They were all changed and the new ones don't stop it hence why I said pointless changing them.

I wouldn’t call it pointless considering scutting on the 27 hasn’t been an issue since they changed them.

Stephen15

Qrt wrote: »

I wouldn’t call it pointless considering scutting on the 27 hasn’t been an issue since they changed them.

Pointless maybe not it may mitigate the issue but it hasn't gone away. Also how do you know it's not still happening just because you haven't seen it or seen any videos or witnessed it dosent mean it isn't happening. I have never seen this happening but don't doubt it does happen, have you?

Qrt

Stephen15 wrote: »

Pointless maybe not it may mitigate the issue but it hasn't gone away. Also how do you know it's not still happening just because you haven't seen it or seen any videos or witnessed it dosent mean it isn't happening. I have never seen this happening but don't doubt it does happen, have you?

It's my bus, couple of stops from the terminus, so any time the bus is curtailed, I notice it, ask, and DB usually give me an answer. The bus was being curtailed every second day when the scutting fad was at its height, now it's once a month or so.

Stephen15

Qrt wrote: »

It's my bus, couple of stops from the terminus, so any time the bus is curtailed, I notice it, ask, and DB usually give me an answer. The bus was being curtailed every second day when the scutting fad was at its height, now it's once a month or so.

Out of curiosity what would be the usual reason given I would've thought it would be stone throwing. Scutting is a bit of weak reason as if one of the scrotes falls off then it's only themselves that gets hurt whereas with stone throwing it actually puts passenger and the drivers safety at risk.

I've heard some bus drivers over in the UK say they're happy when their bus get's stoned as they can go back to the garage and in many cases go home early isn't the old saying for bus drivers an empty bus is a happy bus.

Qrt

Stephen15 wrote: »

Out of curiosity what would be the usual reason given I would've thought it would be stone throwing. Scutting is a bit of weak reason as if one of the scrotes falls off then it's only themselves that gets hurt whereas with stone throwing it actually puts passenger and the drivers safety at risk.

I've heard some bus drivers over in the UK say they're happy when their bus get's stoned as they can go back to the garage and in many cases go home early isn't the old saying for bus drivers an empty bus is a happy bus.

It's usually stone throwing or someone having a go at the driver. If there's scuttung it either bypasses the estates and goes straight to the Terminus (just off the N81) or it's stopped short. The bus doesn't go out of service, just diverted.