Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2017/2018

klose

I don't think the club should appeal given there's a slight chance it could be extended. Chances are he was not going to play the cup game anyways and if we can't beat Burnley and Leicester in the league we are up **** creek as he's never going to play every game for the season. It's pretty much an ideal situation for chamberlain to get a run of games out wide, his pace will be if use if nothing else and with phil coming back it could be a whole lot worse.

Looks like sakho is getting atleast a few months under the hodge, poor guy.

Osmosis Jones

Looks like Benteke's awful 1v1 finishing has gotten another manager sacked.

Agent Coulson

Osmosis Jones wrote: »

Looks like Benteke's awful 1v1 finishing has gotten another manager sacked.

I bet de Boer is regretting turning down the Liverpool job now when he say he was offered it sacked from two high profile jobs since within 90 days of getting each job.

Luis21

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

No Plan B.

Will be another see-saw season with no trophies.

Im starting to believe my mate who always said "Klopps a spoofer"

SlickRic

Luis21 wrote: »

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

There was a response. He gave the game up.

Boom_Bap

Luis21 wrote: »

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

No Plan B.

Will be another see-saw season with no trophies.

Im starting to believe my mate who always said "Klopps a spoofer"

He had a plan B and C in that game, changed the formation and personnel a couple of times. None of them worked.
Our players heads dropped as soon as the red card came out and never lifted.
Our captain was playing too many blind balls and not leading by example.
Our central defenders were brutal on the day.

And not only that, City were brilliant on the day.

5starpool

Klopp out, bring back Hodgson.

NukaCola

Luis21 wrote: »

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

No Plan B.

Will be another see-saw season with no trophies.

Im starting to believe my mate who always said "Klopps a spoofer"

The definition of how fickle supporters can be. 6 matches gone. 4 wins 1 draw one loss and you're starting to think our manager is a spoofer.

Osmosis Jones

Luis21 wrote: »

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

No Plan B.

Will be another see-saw season with no trophies.

Im starting to believe my mate who always said "Klopps a spoofer"

Currently on my phone and don't know the exact text needed for the smiley, but this post deserves the rolling eyes lad.

Riesen_Meal

Osmosis Jones wrote: »

Currently on my phone and don't know the exact text needed for the smiley, but this post deserves the rolling eyes lad.

Like your man on BBC the other night wanting Klopp sacked, there aren't enough roll eyes in the world...

awec

Boom_Bap wrote: »

He had a plan B and C in that game, changed the formation and personnel a couple of times. None of them worked.
Our players heads dropped as soon as the red card came out and never lifted.
Our captain was playing too many blind balls and not leading by example.
Our central defenders were brutal on the day.

And not only that, City were brilliant on the day.

Klopp did change it up to try and keep us competitive but the defence is just so bad that it'll be ruthlessly exposed by any team that we fail to dominate and press high against.

Mumha

Since we can't bring in new defenders until January (and realistically until the end of the season, to get the right players), shouldn't questions be asked of who is doing the defensive coaching ? That can be changed now.

yourdeadwright

I love Klopp as a manger and our style of play is amazing to watch but how did we not sign at least 2 CB in the summer,
Where literally 2 good CB away from a top 2 finish,
Lucas played about 10 games as a CB last year and he was sold and not replaced  , makes zero sense we are lighter in CB options this year than last with added games,

5starpool

If we win our next 2 games I'm sure we'll be there best team in the world again.

awec

Mumha wrote: »

Since we can't bring in new defenders until January (and realistically until the end of the season, to get the right players), shouldn't questions be asked of who is doing the defensive coaching ? That can be changed now.

What is a defensive coach going to do with Klavan? The coaches are not miracle workers, if the quality isn't in the squad they can't do much about that.

NukaCola

Moreno/TAA/Klavan......as good as they have been and can be as stand ins is one thing. Slot any one of them into a functioning backline and we'll be ok, but starting all 3 is begging for trouble.

I've kinda just given up on the defence really. I think what we are getting with Klopp is an attacking system that will get away with being fragile at the back a lot because we can probably dominate a lot of teams and score. When it works there's very few that can match us, and it works more than it doesn't. I'm not saying we shouldn't criticise or its correct but thats what we are going to get.

If we fail to hit realistic targets this season and improve I'll be annoyed obviously but I'm done worrying about the defence at this point, mainly because I cant understand the logic of not adding to CB, theres nothing we can do about that now and we wont be changing any time soon.

Buford T. Justice XIX

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I love Klopp as a manger and our style of play is amazing to watch but how did we not sign at least 2 CB in the summer,
Where literally 2 good CB away from a top 2 finish,
Lucas played about 10 games as a CB last year and he was sold and not replaced , makes zero sense we are lighter in CB options this year than last with added games,

He was replaced with Joe Gomez who is now fit and an actual CB rather than a shortish converted DM.

Mr.H

awec wrote: »

What is a defensive coach going to do with Klavan? The coaches are not miracle workers, if the quality isn't in the squad they can't do much about that.

Really????? So coaching doesnt work???

A good defensive coach (they can be part of the coaching staff. I wouldnt want the manager to be that coach) can "coach" players into what to do in certain situations. For example a good defensive coach would be showing TAA this week videos of the City game and showing him that at times he was too tight to his man. Allowing the man to pull away from him. A good coach would suggest ways of dealing with that type of attacker and more importantly how to deal with the throw in situations where he felt he had no man on. Maybe he could have taken it quicker or got someone else to take it. A good coach would tell him that.

With Klaven he was dragged out to full back at times because Moreno was gone forward. Now I am not blaming Moreno as I thought he had a good game. But a good coach would suggest to Klaven how he could have dealt with situations better.

Every great golfer needs a good tactical coach to help them be better. Just because you have the talent to make it at the very top doesnt mean you cant get advice to help you optimise those talents.

We badly need a defensive coach to help our team. Our current coaching system seems to be looking at making the most of our attacking side. But would it kill our system to have an expert "coach" our defenders a couple of sessions a week?

Mumha

Mr.H wrote: »

Really????? So coaching doesnt work???

A good defensive coach (they can be part of the coaching staff. I wouldnt want the manager to be that coach) can "coach" players into what to do in certain situations. For example a good defensive coach would be showing TAA this week videos of the City game and showing him that at times he was too tight to his man. Allowing the man to pull away from him. A good coach would suggest ways of dealing with that type of attacker and more importantly how to deal with the throw in situations where he felt he had no man on. Maybe he could have taken it quicker or got someone else to take it. A good coach would tell him that.

With Klaven he was dragged out to full back at times because Moreno was gone forward. Now I am not blaming Moreno as I thought he had a good game. But a good coach would suggest to Klaven how he could have dealt with situations better.

Every great golfer needs a good tactical coach to help them be better. Just because you have the talent to make it at the very top doesnt mean you cant get advice to help you optimise those talents.

We badly need a defensive coach to help our team. Our current coaching system seems to be looking at making the most of our attacking side. But would it kill our system to have an expert "coach" our defenders a couple of sessions a week?

Exactly. Bring in a defensive coach who knows what he is doing, because whoever is currently doing it, it clearly isn't working. A good technical defensive coach with take their game apart and hopefully put it back together again, or at least come up with a defensive strategy that can fit in with what Klopp is doing in midfield and up front.

Agent Coulson

Clyne, Lovren, Gomez, Klavan, Moreno, Robertson, Matip, Flanagan, TAA.


The highlighted ones are the only players I would consider real defenders in our entire squad that's the weak point not a defensive coach as such it's a complete lack of real defenders who know and understand how to defend.


4 real defenders in a team competing in four competitions that's on Klopp.

Klavan is a decent 3rd/4th choice that's it nothing more.

Lovren can be 90% of the time but this level you need that 99% of the time.


Moreno is more a winger than a defender really.

TAA is way to young and seems to be a bit of a Moreno in the making at times in him.

Gomez is still up in the air if he will reach is potential after two serious injuries. and like TAA still very young for this level of football.


Flanagan is a league 1 hard tackle at best.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

NukaCola wrote: »

The definition of how fickle supporters can be. 6 matches gone. 4 wins 1 draw one loss and you're starting to think our manager is a spoofer.

I dont see him as a spoofer, but he seems either unwilling or unable to tackle the long-standing issues with defence, which is worrying.

We've been lucky so far, we weren't on Saturday. And we cant always rely on being lucky.

shamrock55

Lads where's the best pub for atmosphere before a game,id normally just go to the park or albert,but the craic can be a bit dead depending on who we playing,i know its only burnley on sat so is there somewhere else where there will be plenty singing

5starpool

Mumha wrote: »

Exactly. Bring in a defensive coach who knows what he is doing, because whoever is currently doing it, it clearly isn't working. A good technical defensive coach with take their game apart and hopefully put it back together again, or at least come up with a defensive strategy that can fit in with what Klopp is doing in midfield and up front.

Do people honestly think that it has just never occurred to Klopp or the lads to bring in a defensive coach? They obviously feel they are happy with the current coaching setup. Lads on a forum saying to bring in a coach will fix stuff is just mad.

I don't know what the root of the problem is, but I'm sure those lads are better placed than anyone here to evaluate things.

Soarer

Apologies for the quality. It's a grab from Sky Sports last night.

One red, one yellow.

This is what I'd be using to appeal.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

5starpool wrote: »

I don't know what the root of the problem is, but I'm sure those lads are better placed than anyone here to evaluate things.

After more than a year of ongoing defensive ****ups, I'm not entirely convinced if their ability to fix it.

Knex*

The whole defensive coach thing I don't really get, to be honest. It just doesn't seem remotely feasible.

What could they actually do to change anything? They'd have to convince Klopp to set up differently, have his defensive line deeper, play a dedicated DM, make his players taller to cope with set pieces. None of these things are realistic.

A coach won't be able to come in and stamp a Mourinho style defensive plan on a team that Klopp wants to adhere to his style. We need better players, or Klopp himself has to make adjustments to counter the players limitations. Nothing else is really a practical or realistic solution.

NukaCola

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I dont see him as a spoofer, but he seems either unwilling or unable to tackle the long-standing issues with defence, which is worrying.

We've been lucky so far, we weren't on Saturday. And we cant always rely on being lucky.

My post was not to defend the man to the death. He has flaws and I agree with you, as my most recent post suggests similar.

awec

Mr.H wrote: »

Really????? So coaching doesnt work???

A good defensive coach (they can be part of the coaching staff. I wouldnt want the manager to be that coach) can "coach" players into what to do in certain situations. For example a good defensive coach would be showing TAA this week videos of the City game and showing him that at times he was too tight to his man. Allowing the man to pull away from him. A good coach would suggest ways of dealing with that type of attacker and more importantly how to deal with the throw in situations where he felt he had no man on. Maybe he could have taken it quicker or got someone else to take it. A good coach would tell him that.

With Klaven he was dragged out to full back at times because Moreno was gone forward. Now I am not blaming Moreno as I thought he had a good game. But a good coach would suggest to Klaven how he could have dealt with situations better.

Every great golfer needs a good tactical coach to help them be better. Just because you have the talent to make it at the very top doesnt mean you cant get advice to help you optimise those talents.

We badly need a defensive coach to help our team. Our current coaching system seems to be looking at making the most of our attacking side. But would it kill our system to have an expert "coach" our defenders a couple of sessions a week?

That's not what I said.

But the talent has to be there in the first place. A good coach will bring out the best in a player, but every player has a ceiling. Klavan is 31, he is not going to get any better than he is right now.

5starpool

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

After more than a year of ongoing defensive ****ups, I'm not entirely convinced if their ability to fix it.

I didn't say that I have confidence they'll fix it, I said that it's not like they would hire a defence coach if only the idea would occur to them.

Lex Luthor

Soarer wrote: »

Apologies for the quality. It's a grab from Sky Sports last night.

One red, one yellow.

This is what I'd be using to appeal.

it was also discussed on Sky with a panel....grounds for appeal alright.

Mr.H

Knex. wrote: »

The whole defensive coach thing I don't really get, to be honest. It just doesn't seem remotely feasible.

What could they actually do to change anything? They'd have to convince Klopp to set up differently, have his defensive line deeper, play a dedicated DM, make his players taller to cope with set pieces. None of these things are realistic.

A coach won't be able to come in and stamp a Mourinho style defensive plan on a team that Klopp wants to adhere to his style. We need better players, or Klopp himself has to make adjustments to counter the players limitations. Nothing else is really a practical or realistic solution.

A defensive coach doesnt need to alter our tactics.

A defensive coach may advise on the best tactics in defensive set pieces. They may also coach players on how best to deal with particular opponents (much the same way a goalkeeping coach would advise keepers on the opposing strikers of the next game. Do they blast the ball or do the chip the ball or do they like to shoot from distance. Things like that).

Lets not fool ourselves. Wes Morgan isnt the best defender in the league but he was unbelievable for Leicester in their title winning season. That is coaching!!!

Being a defender you do not need any skill (obviously you need some level of talent, which if any player didnt have it they wouldnt be at the level they are at whether you agree their talent or not). Ask Carra how much skill he has. Richard Dunne maybe???

You need two things. You need to be willing to do anything to stop your opponent scoring and you need tactical awareness.

The first one cant be thought but the second CAN be coached.

awec wrote: »

That's not what I said.

But the talent has to be there in the first place. A good coach will bring out the best in a player, but every player has a ceiling. Klavan is 31, he is not going to get any better than he is right now.

Defenders get better with age because the most important thing about being a defender is tactical awareness. That is only something you can learn from experience or be coached in.

Carra got better with age as did big Sami

Mr.H

We dont appeal then we are without Mane for Burnley at home, Leicester away in the cup and away again in the league.


We appeal we could lose Mane for the Newcastle game aswell.


I feel it was also harsh but it was a 50/50 imo. If he wasnt sent off we would be sitting here saying he could have easily been sent off. I think let it go and just give the lad a rest. He can play Wednesday night in the CL and have 2 weeks to relax and take it easy before the next CL game.

Burnley at home we start with Salah Firmino and Sturridge up front. Bring Coutinho on it the second half for Danny.

The cup game we can start with a 2nd team. Solanke Woodburn and I would choose Markovic or Coutinho (to regain match fitness)

The league game then we can have Coutinho Firmino and Salah starting.

After that we can start bringing Coutinho back into midfield.

Riesen_Meal

I really don't think we should appeal it and I think Klopp said as much, interesting to see what happens...

spoonerhead

I don't know if there is really a point appealing either. I taught as soon as I seen it, red card. It's a strange one because it's a complete accident, but it's the laws of the game unfortunately. If he's out for three games, so be it. Need to get on with things from here.

I'm more worried that Karius is starting tomorrow apparently. Sevilla have some big lads on set plays, which Karius struggles with

Utopia Parkway

Luis21 wrote: »

Saturday showed again what a unresponsive manager Klopp is.

No Plan B.

Will be another see-saw season with no trophies.

Im starting to believe my mate who always said "Klopps a spoofer"

When you're down to 10 men and 2-0 down at half-time away to maybe the best attacking team in the league I'm not sure there is any Plan B really other than damage limitation.

The only thing I'd blame Klopp for is he really needed to have an alternative to VVD. He's definitely been negligent in that area.

Tusky

Has anyone been disappointed with Salah's final ball/finishing? Great pace and positioning but rarely seems to do the right thing. Hopefully he's still finding his feet.

Grayditch

5starpool wrote: »

Do people honestly think that it has just never occurred to Klopp or the lads to bring in a defensive coach? They obviously feel they are happy with the current coaching setup. Lads on a forum saying to bring in a coach will fix stuff is just mad.

I don't know what the root of the problem is, but I'm sure those lads are better placed than anyone here to evaluate things.

So you honestly don't think a defensive coach could help this situation... because we're lads on a forum saying it?

There is some pretty basic defensive stuff not being addressed at the back, not to mention positions being neglected during the transfer window.

I'm 100% not on the Be Grand side. And a result like Saturday happened a lot quicker than I expected, actually.

rob316

It's a red card by the letter of the law but Mane was only doing what I'd expect any player to do. I don't think he was reckless, if anything I think the keeper was the reckless one, he launched himself at Mane.
Keepers get too much protection though its a known fact.

eyerer

I'm a bit concerned but according to the stats Salah scored enough for Roma last season, so hoping it's just a blip in his finishing. The goals he has scored this season came after he missed good chances. Against Man City he didn't get enough chances before the red card where he would have eventually scored. So far not clinical enough. This will cost us in the games where chances are few. I hope he's still settling is all it is.

Utopia Parkway

rob316 wrote: »

It's a red card by the letter of the law but Mane was only doing what I'd expect any player to do. I don't think he was reckless, if anything I think the keeper was the reckless one, he launched himself at Mane.
Keepers get too much protection though its a known fact.

I think any player would be expected to go for that ball. Would have got pelters had he bottled out. Obviously thought he would nick it past and tap it into the net. Probably wasn't expecting the keeper to rush out so quickly and duck down slightly to head it away.

citytillidie

shamrock55 wrote: »

Lads where's the best pub for atmosphere before a game,id normally just go to the park or albert,but the craic can be a bit dead depending on who we playing,i know its only burnley on sat so is there somewhere else where there will be plenty singing

Bag of tins at the Esso :P:D

Harry Palmr

Tusky wrote: »

Has anyone been disappointed with Salah's final ball/finishing? Great pace and positioning but rarely seems to do the right thing. Hopefully he's still finding his feet.

We've been talking about it yes. Should have 100 goals by now.

Crash Bang Wall

5starpool wrote: »

If Mane was going for a ball at knee height and caught a player there, no one would be suggesting it wasn't a red. Ridiculous that people are saying it shouldn't be red in this case. Almost no bad fouls are intentional.

For me, if Manes was a red, then so should Bellerins and Ritchies. The dangerous/wreckless element of the challenge is not the contact, its the high foot.

Otherwise, its like saying you only get sent off if you swing a punch and connect rather than swinging and missing.

mosstin

awec wrote: »

What is a defensive coach going to do with Klavan? The coaches are not miracle workers, if the quality isn't in the squad they can't do much about that.

I imagine he'd have him put down.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Tusky wrote: »

Has anyone been disappointed with Salah's final ball/finishing? Great pace and positioning but rarely seems to do the right thing. Hopefully he's still finding his feet.

I don't know, tbh.

I was always expecting him to take till Christmas to settle so I'm delighted he has got on so well up till now. As fans, we tend to have very high expectations for new players.

I would almost give a new player a season to settle and get the rhythm of the way we play and where other players can be located in different situations and what they are likely to do.

sword1

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

I don't know, tbh.

I was always expecting him to take till Christmas to settle so I'm delighted he has got on so well up till now. As fans, we tend to have very high expectations for new players.

I would almost give a new player a season to settle and get the rhythm of the way we play and where other players can be located in different situations and what they are likely to do.

Once he is getting the chances the rest will follow. Suarez didn't score much his first season, Coutinho was missing loads for a couple of seasons. It might be a week or it might be a year but when more of those chances are scored and his confidence rises he could be the highest scoring midfielder in the league

Grayditch

Yeah, Salah is just calibrating.

Umaro

https://twitter.com/_pauljoyce/status/907272751685292032

ricero

Hopefully common sense prevails and its either recinded or a 1 game ban. No way is he deserving of a 3 game ban

Harry Palmr

Presumably they'll cite the non sending off in the Swansea v Newcastle match