Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2017/2018

Turtyturd

Could be. It's more likely that he just over reacts and his dramatic side comes out like most posters here.

Still baffling that people are claiming a manager who has gotten us to a European final and back into the CL in less than two years hasn't improved us.

Vicxas

Turtyturd wrote: »

Could be. It's more likely that he just over reacts and his dramatic side comes out like most posters here.

Still baffling that people are claiming a manager who has gotten us to a European final and back into the CL in less than two years hasn't improved us.

People want us smashing up the league and pissing all over the CL.

That's not going to be us for a while, it'll take time to rebuild. And the signs (despite the blinkers for CB) are encouraging.

Osmosis Jones

I'd be more worried about this result if Sevilla weren't the "best" team in the group, we have to do worse than 2 of Sevilla, Spartak, and Maribor to not qualify so we should be safe. First place could come down to whoever wins the reverse fixture.

Pepp1989

Thought it was clear that Karius had been told not to mess around with the ball and get rid of it.

NukaCola

Zak Flaps wrote: »

No he's not. Do you know what "literally" means?

"used in an exaggerated way to emphasize a statement or description that is not literally true or possible"

Seems like he does.

MD1990

We drew against Sevilla not the end of the world.

Sevilla's goals were individual errors as well. This time last season we were actually looking good at the back. But Matip is badly off form & Lovren is back to his error prone level.

murpho999

Turtyturd wrote: »

Could be. It's more likely that he just over reacts and his dramatic side comes out like most posters here.

Still baffling that people are claiming a manager who has gotten us to a European final and back into the CL in less than two years hasn't improved us.

Of course we have improved, especially going forward. However defensively you have to ask questions. Are we any better than when he took over?

I appreciate he had a rebuild on his hands but they look totally disorganised and I hope he sorts it out soon.

I think he can organise defences as his league winning Bundesliga side only conceded 47 goals over 2 seasons. 34 Games which translates to 0.72 goals conceded per game.

I just don't get what he sees in Moreno and how he has him back in the side.

54and56

MD1990 wrote: »

We drew against Sevilla not the end of the world.

Sevilla's goals were individual errors as well. This time last season we were actually looking good at the back. But Matip is badly off form & Lovren is back to his error prone level.

Next two windows have to be all about getting a commanding CB and a GK for me. Moreno looks to be maturing a bit. He's not an instinctive defender, if he was he'd have anticipated the ball getting through when Lovern missed it last night. The Seville attacker anticipated the mistake by Lovern, Moreno didn't but he's not diving in as much as will hopefully continue to improve his positional discipline whilst continuing to be lethal going forward. Having him and Mane/Salah on the left is a nightmare for any team to defend and having Robertson competing for the LB place will provide decent cover.

Lovern looks to have lost any shred of confidence he may have had. He'll be ok as 3rd or 4th choice if Gomez can step up later in the year but we need a clear #1 to partner Matip who is good but isn't a leader or communicator.

Karius and Mingolet are both good keepers but not #1's if you want to be competing for the PL and latter stages of the CL. Tom Heaton, Fraser Forster (Southampton again!!) or Jack Butland (if he regains his pre injury form) are the "PL proven" candidates and I'd throw Kasper Schmeichel into the mix also.

Surely one of them can be poached. They'd all improve the GK position and provide a lot more stability to the defence.

If Klopp doesn't seriously address the defence in the next two windows (it's hard to do anything serious as Xmas other than perhaps VVD if he's still on strike at Southampton and they decide to cash in) it will be the undoing of him which would be a great shame because I can only imagine what the team would be like to watch and what they could achieve if there was a solid defence behind the lethal attack we now have.

rob316

Rekop dog wrote: »

Didi is a shambles of a person who's in massive debt due to losing enormous amounts of money on having very poor opinions on football outcomes. It's why he does every TV show going.

Bit harsh. After shouting "oh digger" pissed drunk at him and his mrs on the Las Vegas strip and him delighted to talk to me and not tell me **** off he'll always be alrite in my eyes. Top bloke with the supporters 100%. He's a bad gambler it's an addiction he probably needs help.

J Mysterio

Karius shouldnt have started that game.
1. He is ****.
2. He didnt earn it, Mignolet did.

Lovren is still ****, no surprise.

murpho999

Mr.H wrote: »

Can was utter sh1te tonight. His body movement was just completely off. There were a few times where he just seemed to run at half speed back to intercept balls going to an opposition forward. Complete joke.

What ever about Moreno. He played some amazing attacking stuff tonight and created a few great chances. For me Can and Lovren were to blame for tonight. Lovren ok was caught out of position but Can should didnt look like he was even trying to defend from midfield. Wjini and Hendo made some great tackles but Can was a disgrace. He needs to be dropped after tonight.

Maybe he is too busy thinking about contract stuff. Maybe he needs to be taken away from the spotlight for a bit. I dont know the reason and I dont care. Other players will come in and give a lot more effort than he did tonight.

Again people making excuses for Moreno. His primary role is to defend and he does that badly. His ability to cross the ball does not make up for it.

BoardsMember

The teams that win trophies have good defenders, they also have a setup that helps these good defenders so that the team as a whole defends well. We have neither of these, we have poor defenders, and we have an irresponsible setup that favours attacking with 6 players over providing defensive cover and solidity. What we saw last night has been happening since Klopp arrived, and we have no reason to think that it is going to change, unless the approach changes.

And we're looking at a fresh team, not a knackered team, that has spent all season pressing.

Signing VVD would change very little. The setup/system has to be right. And it isn't. And we need more than one additional central defender, or else we need to starting picking Robertson or Milner at full back, someone competent in the basics of the position. This latter is what concerns me most about Klopp, he does not seem to be able to see how vulnerable the team is with Moreno in it. Milner is one of our few natural leaders, the team needs more leaders/

NukaCola

Lovren kicks the ball for the first or Firmino converts the penalty and we are fine and the defensive frailty can be papered over. Our biggest problem was not signing a CB and our current defensive setup. Thats on Klopp.

You can give out until your face turns blue but we are going to see this over and over again. Lovren does stupid things that has nothing to do with the system. If Moreno plays we are going to struggle defensively down the left and intelligent attackers will exploit his inability to see danger. If Karius plays he's not going to get you out of jail with a good save.

One/two things need to be considered if we are to be successful. Find a way to change the system so our defence doesn't get so exposed but still have that attacking threat, probably a very difficult thing to do. And/or get in players that can cope with that level of exposure, and/or have a good ability to not stupid mistakes, also probably difficult. No easy answers but whatever we are doing is not working.

Harry Palmr

Spartak could be playing in front of the away support only in two weeks, flare thrown at the ref last night.

Watching the U19s yesterday, I was struck by the demeanour of Steven Gerrard, he seems to have been studying Zen - hardly blinked all game. Never got riled and offered wise council on the sideline to Rafael Camacho I think it was after he was fouled late and got a bit angry. Probably saved him a yellow. Unexpected and good to see. Was expecting him to be kicking water bottles across Prenton Park

TitianGerm

J Mysterio wrote: »

Karius shouldnt have started that game.
1. He is ****.
2. He didnt earn it, Mignolet did.

Lovren is still ****, no surprise.

Karius did nothing wrong at all last night. He came and cleared a few high balls well.

He couldn't do anything about either goal. Both were mistakes in front of him and the second was a nice finish.

54and56

NukaCola wrote: »

Find a way to change the system so our defence doesn't get so exposed but still have that attacking threat, probably a very difficult thing to do. And/or get in players that can cope with that level of exposure, and/or have a good ability to not stupid mistakes, also probably difficult. No easy answers but whatever we are doing is not working.

Kieta should help there. He's not a DM but wouldn't have been strolling around doing nothing like Can was for the 2nd goal last night. That was pure laziness.

54and56

emmetkenny wrote: »

Karius did nothing wrong at all last night. He came and cleared a few high balls well.

He couldn't do anything about either goal. Both were mistakes in front of him and the second was a nice finish.

With the counter attacking speed we have I actually like to see the GK (whoever it is) come and punch like that, it will frequently start an attack without giving the opponents any time to reset. If we make it a standard play for GK's it'll make opponents think twice about swarming forward for free kicks and corners.

not yet

As a red of 45 years I don't think Lovern should ever, ever wear a that shirt again..

I know Klopp is saying one player will not sort out our defence but a decent CB and Robertson at LB would save LFC 20 goals this season.

yourdeadwright

Can looked injured form about 30 minutes on , you could see he was struggling to run ,I don't know how the bench didn't;t see that,
I know Lovern isn't great but he made a very bad mistake last night and one he won't make again in a whole season plus Bobby missed a peno, We should have won but lets not forget its not a terrible result and we should still top our group ,
I think Klopp for his own good should start the same back 4 for as long as possible, He is putting unneeded pressure on himself by changing it every week ,
For the people making Didi comments so what if his private life isn't perfect a lot of peoples aren't he was a super servant of the club we all love and we should have respect for that, I think he has a good eye for the game and 90% of the time he makes good calls about games,
For people to bring up his private life is low and it has nothing to do with his opinion on a football match,

NukaCola

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I know Lovern isn't great but he made a very bad mistake last night and one he won't make again in a whole season

He'll make a similar mistake in his next game, but probably will get away with it. He is prone to a lot of mistakes.

Vicxas

Is there anything to be said about having Gomez at CB and TAA at RB, Gomez cut his teeth at Charlton in CB didnt he?

Agent Coulson

Sh1t I'd have Milner playing CB instead of Lovren at this stage.

gafferino

J Mysterio wrote: »

Karius shouldnt have started that game.
1. He is ****.
2. He didnt earn it, Mignolet did.

Lovren is still ****, no surprise.

I actually don't agree with the criticism of Karius in here.

He has played 2 games this season and hasnt dont a lot wrong. He got caught a couple of times with the ball at his feet against Arsenal but seems to have learned his lesson there. He will grow with confidence in time with this.

Granted he hasnt had to do a huge amount but when he has been called on I think he has done well. He comes for high balls with more confidence than Mignolet and has cleared his lines when he needs to. Couldnt have done anything for those two goals last night. He needs time to settle in there which he hasnt really had yet.

Long term Mignolet just isnt the answer in my opinion. Karius could be and I think Klopp thinks so too.

yourdeadwright

I worry about Trent playing right back again any time soon ,he got destroyed against City and other teams will have looked at it and noticed his positioning is very poor so he'll be a target,
 Especially now with the media all over it he could have a mare,
Id like to see Klopp use Robertson left back and Milner right back, Milner done ok a left back and he'd surely be even better suited to the right side , gives experience and can score a peno

J Mysterio

emmetkenny wrote: »

Karius did nothing wrong at all last night. He came and cleared a few high balls well.

He couldn't do anything about either goal. Both were mistakes in front of him and the second was a nice finish.

First goal was Lovrens fault but he could have been nippy off his line to dive on it.

Second goal, he was dreadful. Again, defensive mistakes, but he didnt make himself big and basically sprinted out and missed the challenge.

TitianGerm

Vicxas wrote: »

Is there anything to be said about having Gomez at CB and TAA at RB, Gomez cut his teeth at Charlton in CB didnt he?

I'd say we will see Gomez given a chance at CB soon. I'd expect Clyne to go back in at RB when he's fit.

J Mysterio

gafferino wrote: »

I actually don't agree with the criticism of Karius in here.

He has played 2 games this season and hasnt dont a lot wrong. He got caught a couple of times with the ball at his feet against Arsenal but seems to have learned his lesson there. He will grow with confidence in time with this.

Granted he hasnt had to do a huge amount but when he has been called on I think he has done well. He comes for high balls with more confidence than Mignolet and has cleared his lines when he needs to. Couldnt have done anything for those two goals last night. He needs time to settle in there which he hasnt really had yet.

Long term Mignolet just isnt the answer in my opinion. Karius could be and I think Klopp thinks so too.

He didnt deserve the start is my main point. Mignolet was basically no.1 all last season and through the qualifiers. He earned his place in the CL.

If Karius needs games to find form or whatever, let him play in the FA/ League cup. How is it fair for him to start thr first CL game at Anfield?

TitianGerm

J Mysterio wrote: »

First goal was Lovrens fault but he could have been nippy off his line to dive on it.

Second goal, he was dreadful. Again, defensive mistakes, but he didnt make himself big and basically sprinted out and missed the challenge.

Nobody would have expected Lovern to miss that ball. It was moving at a snails pace across the ground, the fact he misses it is a disgrace. If that happened at an Under 10 the CB would be crucified. Moreno or Karius should have no blame in that goal.

The second goal was an excellent finish. Karius made himself big and the ball was curled around him. Again he should have no blame there.

Knex*

Cool photo from before the game last night (too big to embed)

https://i.imgur.com/f25caPe.jpg

gafferino

J Mysterio wrote: »

He didnt deserve the start is my main point. Mignolet was basically no.1 all last season and through the qualifiers. He earned his place in the CL.

If Karius needs games to find form or whatever, let him play in the FA/ League cup. How is it fair for him to start thr first CL game at Anfield?

I think Klopp sees him (and would prefer him) as 1st choice. He said the other day they are both training really well so he wants to give Karius games. Theres not enough games in the cups realistically. Its fairly similar to what alot of top teams across Europe do (play a different keeper in Europe and cups).

Mignolet has done well, but I think in most of our minds that just means he hasnt ****ed up too bad. He is not going to be the presence we need and want in there long term IMO.

rob316

I'd put Gomez in at CB over Lovren TBH, Lovren isn't going to improve, its been 3 seasons of **** up after **** up. Gomez looks to have the tools to play there and I think we should start easing him in. Matip has lost all confidence playing next to that clown aswell. There is no competition for the CB's none, Lovren knows he'll be first choice week in week out as the alternative is ****ing Klavan.

Klopp needs to stick with 1 goalkeeper, disrupting an already shaky backline is not helping.

For the love of Christ play someone as a dedicated DM, who will protect the centre backs.

Oh and drop Moreno, wonderful he can run up the wing and creates chances but he cancels it all out by the brainless defending he does every game. Robertson deserves a chance.

dogbert27

Vicxas wrote: »

Is there anything to be said about having Gomez at CB and TAA at RB, Gomez cut his teeth at Charlton in CB didnt he?

We signed him to be a CB. Then got played at left back by Rodgers and now right back by Klopp.

I really would love to know why Robertson has only featured in 1 game so far this season. In that one game he was one the best players on the pitch.

He's done well on International duty too scoring a goal along the way.

Surely a better defender and efficient in attack.

Knex*

This is Sevilla's 2nd goal from last night. You can slow this down (right click on the vid and press half speed) and you get a harrowing sense of how badly positioned we were for the entire thing.

The knock on effect from Can not following his man, and then how our CBs get caught in a no mans land a little. Its just all very poor. An excellent goal from Sevilla, for sure, but there's some really poor organisational stuff here from our perspective. As a unit we just are not drilled well in defensive scenarios, outside of that initial high press.

https://streamable.com/tqzkw

dogbert27

Knex. wrote: »

This is Sevilla's 2nd goal from last night. You can slow this down (right click on the vid and press half speed) and you get a harrowing sense of how badly positioned we were for the entire thing.

The knock on effect from Can not following his man, and then how our CBs get caught in a no mans land a little. Its just all very poor. An excellent goal from Sevilla, for sure, but there's some really poor organisational stuff here from our perspective. As a unit we just are not drilled well in defensive scenarios, outside of that initial high press.

https://streamable.com/tqzkw

Henderson should have clipped the legs of the first man on the ball from the throw. That's what a Gerrard, Keane or Viera would have done.

rob316

Against Burnley this is what I would like to see

Milner - Matip- Gomez - Robertson

It cant do any worse than having Moreno and Lovren in there.

dogbert27

rob316 wrote: »

Against Burnley this is what I would like to see

Milner - Matip- Gomez - Robertson

It cant do any worse than having Moreno and Lovren in there.

It will be TAA or Gomez for right back. Milner won't be played there.

Could possibly be put in midfield in place of Can with Coutinho starting in place of Mane.

The midfield is badly missing Lallana's energy.

Crash Bang Wall

Knex. wrote: »

This is Sevilla's 2nd goal from last night. You can slow this down (right click on the vid and press half speed) and you get a harrowing sense of how badly positioned we were for the entire thing.

The knock on effect from Can not following his man, and then how our CBs get caught in a no mans land a little. Its just all very poor. An excellent goal from Sevilla, for sure, but there's some really poor organisational stuff here from our perspective. As a unit we just are not drilled well in defensive scenarios, outside of that initial high press.

https://streamable.com/tqzkw

No...... both goals were all Morenos fault. Dunphy wouldnt say it if it wasnt true

Crash Bang Wall

Osmosis Jones wrote: »

Their analysis is akin to the lads talking down at the pub, they just talk enough to fill the time and then collect their pay.

Proper analysis would take too much time....easier fo find the scapegoat. Im not a Moreno fan, Id rather have Robertson at LB but there is no way he and he alone, was at fault for the 2 goals last night

theoneeyedman

rob316 wrote: »

I'd put Gomez in at CB over Lovren TBH, Lovren isn't going to improve, its been 3 seasons of **** up after **** up. Gomez looks to have the tools to play there and I think we should start easing him in. Matip has lost all confidence playing next to that clown aswell. There is no competition for the CB's none, Lovren knows he'll be first choice week in week out as the alternative is ****ing Klavan.

Klopp needs to stick with 1 goalkeeper, disrupting an already shaky backline is not helping.

For the love of Christ play someone as a dedicated DM, who will protect the centre backs.

Oh and drop Moreno, wonderful he can run up the wing and creates chances but he cancels it all out by the brainless defending he does every game. Robertson deserves a chance.

All of this is correct.

Re:goalkeeper, we know for sure that Mignolet isn't good enough long term, we don't know for sure yet about karius. As there isn't much between them, I'd pick karius.

Lovren is septic.

yourdeadwright

I don't see the problem with Mignolet to be fair, he has improved and has been one of the better keepers in the league for 10 months, I think people are judging him on previous season's
Second goal last night is the midfields fault totally switched off ,I believe it was Can who just didn't bother getting into position ( he was struggling with his hip/leg after 40 minutes) but Henderson should have seen the danger and clipped Luis Mureil and conceded the free,

marklazarcovic

It's infuriating how lethal other teams are against us given the amount of chances created for and against,I almost expect the opposition to score at each decent attack or corner.

gafferino

gafferino wrote: »

I think Klopp sees him (and would prefer him) as 1st choice. He said the other day they are both training really well so he wants to give Karius games. .....................

theoneeyedman wrote: »

All of this is correct.

Re:goalkeeper, we know for sure that Mignolet isn't good enough long term, we don't know for sure yet about karius. As there isn't much between them, I'd pick karius.

..............

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I don't see the problem with Mignolet to be fair, he has improved and has been one of the better keepers in the league for 10 months,.............

Karius has done nothing to show he's any better than Mignolet.

Mignolet hasn't has a nightmare spell for a while, he might be due one admittedly but I don't see why Karius is featuring.

Well I do, Klopp bought him to be our #1 keeper and will doggedly follow that line of thought.

brevity

Knex. wrote: »

This is Sevilla's 2nd goal from last night. You can slow this down (right click on the vid and press half speed) and you get a harrowing sense of how badly positioned we were for the entire thing.

The knock on effect from Can not following his man, and then how our CBs get caught in a no mans land a little. Its just all very poor. An excellent goal from Sevilla, for sure, but there's some really poor organisational stuff here from our perspective. As a unit we just are not drilled well in defensive scenarios, outside of that initial high press.

https://streamable.com/tqzkw

Such a disaster of a goal. No one paying attention.

NukaCola

marklazarcovic wrote: »

It's infuriating how lethal other teams are against us given the amount of chances created for and against,I almost expect the opposition to score at each decent attack or corner.

Yea, seems to be a the norm. 2 goals from 2 shots on target last night wasn't it?

NukaCola

On a seperate note Correa looks a player.....seemed a constant danger with the ball.

Grayditch

Yeah, so we need better defensive coaching...

yourdeadwright

I haven't seen it mentioned but in the build up to there goal the ball was free at the edge of our box about 60/40 in Can's favour and he totally bottled the tackle and then comedy insued for there goal

murpho999

Grayditch wrote: »

Yeah, so we need better defensive coaching...

No, we need better defenders.

Nerdlingr

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I don't see the problem with Mignolet to be fair, he has improved and has been one of the better keepers in the league for 10 months, I think people are judging him on previous season's
Second goal last night is the midfields fault totally switched off ,I believe it was Can who just didn't bother getting into position ( he was struggling with his hip/leg after 40 minutes) but Henderson should have seen the danger and clipped Luis Mureil and conceded the free,

easy to say that after the fact. if that was the case he'd be giving away soft frees every game and would probably play only half of them due to suspension.

Grayditch

murpho999 wrote: »

No, we need better defenders.

At this rate, I don't know if that would get to the root of the problem. That's saying that these guys are being given specific defensive instructions that they're completely ignoring in every game. Yeah that might be the case but...