Drone damaged by firmware update

ballsymchugh

bought a DJI Phantom 3 off amazon just over a year ago. Every so often there's a firmware upgrade to do, usually with no hassle. However, about 3 weeks ago i was prompted to do the latest one, and ended up with a camera like this, completely dysfunctional and overheating.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpO3R5INw_A

went on the DJI website to see what could be done, and they said that it needs to be sent back, to the Netherlands. they've since sent me a quote for over €250 to replace the camera completely, over half the price of the whole drone.

They're refusing to accept any responsibility as the drone is out of warranty, but I'm contending that their recommended firmware update was dodgy and they should repair it at no cost to me.
any idea what my options are now? I'd sooner tell them to shove the drone up their hoop than pay for it, but they'd probably just refurb it and sell it on again.

Amalgam

There's a lot of solutions/results offered by YouTube alongside the video you placed in your post, have you tried any of them?

..it seems to be a physical misalignment, with the drone's gimbal trying to overcompensate.

Not trying to be smart, it's just that people are approaching this from more than one angle, physical, alongside the firmware. It was interesting to browse suggested videos, branching off from the video you posted.

ballsymchugh wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpO3R5INw_A

Good luck, it's a frustrating situation to be in.

ballsymchugh

i had already tried the other videos first, i came across that one through them.

i think the ones that offer a straight forward repair have been slightly damaged in falls, putting the thing that keeps the camera level off centre, so it's always tilted, whereas my camera was just going nuts.

ED E

Was amazon the retailer or just fulfilled by them?

indeq

Once upon a time upgrades were just that, now they're a crook of sh1te, never upgrade.

ballsymchugh

ED E wrote: »

Was amazon the retailer or just fulfilled by them?

amazon marketplace, just fulfilled by them.

indeq wrote: »

Once upon a time upgrades were just that, now they're a crook of sh1te, never upgrade.

i'm beginning to think if i've ever been 100% happy with any friggin upgrade i've ever done, even basic phone firmware upgrades annoy me for ages afterwards!

what's just infuriating is that this has happened before to other people, and they are just flat out refusing to acknowledge it in my case. all they are saying is that because it is out of warranty, their hands are tied. there is no mention at all about the firmware in their messages.

Dear xxxx,

There is a clear period in which you can make a claim to warranty and that period has passed hence why we have billed you for this service. If this is unsatisfactory we can cancel the RMA case and have it returned unrepaired for you if you wish it.

Whatever the reason may or may not be this case will not turn to warranty as per our warranty policy.

Kind Regards,

DJI Support EU

L1011

Considering DJI are forcing firmware updates on some units, they aren't in a great place here.

Their "warranty policy" doesn't over-ride consumer rights. I'd approach Amazon next as the effective retailer.

CeilingFly

L1011 wrote: »

Considering DJI are forcing firmware updates on some units, they aren't in a great place here.

Their "warranty policy" doesn't over-ride consumer rights. I'd approach Amazon next as the effective retailer.

In terms of Marketplace, Amazon would not be the retailer - same as Liffey Valley wouldn't be the retailer for the shops there.

But a warranty is in addition to your rights and any software upgrade must be suitable for purpose and if their own upgrade damages the machine they are entirely repsonsible.

L1011

CeilingFly wrote: »

In terms of Marketplace, Amazon would not be the retailer - same as Liffey Valley wouldn't be the retailer for the shops there.

But a warranty is in addition to your rights and any software upgrade must be suitable for purpose and if their own upgrade damages the machine they are entirely repsonsible.

Fulfilled by products involve Amazon taking the payment themselves and shipping the item - rather complicated to argue that they aren't the retailer there.

P. Breathnach

L1011 wrote: »

Fulfilled by products involve Amazon taking the payment themselves and shipping the item - rather complicated to argue that they aren't the retailer there.

I agree that they take the payment, but I don't think that they ship the item. If you purchase Amazon-supplied items and third-party items in the one transaction, they are not delivered in one package. But I still agree with the general argument: if Amazon take the order, they can be argued to be the seller.

There is, however, another complication: it's probable that neither Amazon nor their contracted supplier forced the firmware update. That's down to the manufacturer.

L1011

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I agree that they take the payment, but I don't think that they ship the item. If you purchase Amazon-supplied items and third-party items in the one transaction, they are not delivered in one package. But I still agree with the general argument: if Amazon take the order, they can be argued to be the seller.

There is, however, another complication: it's probable that neither Amazon nor their contracted supplier forced the firmware update. That's down to the manufacturer.

Amazon Fulfilled items are shipped by Amazon, plain Amazon Marketplace (non Fulfilled) are not.

ballsymchugh

i am fully in the thinking that this is between myself and DJI. the fact that it was bought on amazon i don't think is here nor there.

kathleen37

Have you tried downgrading (removing) that firmware update?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evYMw0eiGkw

Though this looks like the 4 rather than the 3 you have

Have you posted on the forum?

https://forum.dji.com/thread-106299-1-1.html

Seems like those guys will be able to help??

ballsymchugh

kathleen37 wrote: »

Have you tried downgrading (removing) that firmware update?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evYMw0eiGkw

Though this looks like the 4 rather than the 3 you have

Have you posted on the forum?

https://forum.dji.com/thread-106299-1-1.html

Seems like those guys will be able to help??

i didn't. at the moment, my drone is with DJI in Netherlands. I just saw this story tweeted by Adrian Weckler though.
https://petapixel.com/2017/08/22/dji-will-disable-spark-drone-dont-update-firmware/

i know it's not my drone, but i'm trying to remember if the app would open properly without me upgrading.

i'm also presuming that if i'm registered with DJI as being in ireland, then the firmware would have come from their european server, so is it worth trying the european consumer centre (http://www.eccireland.ie/)?

kathleen37

Apologies, I didn't realise they had it.

Looks like they are deleting posts on their forums too, in relation to downgrading their firmware on the Phantom, so they defo seem to be going with the "It wasn't the fireware" and then deleting posts relating to problems with it.

I think it would be worth looking through the posts as there really seem to be some experts on there. PM them rather than posting(as it will be deleted) and ask if they have any thoughts?

It could be that if you get it returned, you still may be able to resolve the issue by downgrading the firmware. You'll just then need to wait for the new version, which will fix the bugs of the current version.

Unless you think that the firmware could have caused it to run and damage itself?

It's ridiculous that something which is so expensive, that the company is being an ass when you are just outside a year's warranty period. Surely the expectation is that is should run for more than a year?

Good luck

ballsymchugh

kathleen37 wrote: »

Apologies, I didn't realise they had it.

Looks like they are deleting posts on their forums too, in relation to downgrading their firmware on the Phantom, so they defo seem to be going with the "It wasn't the fireware" and then deleting posts relating to problems with it.

I think it would be worth looking through the posts as there really seem to be some experts on there. PM them rather than posting(as it will be deleted) and ask if they have any thoughts?

It could be that if you get it returned, you still may be able to resolve the issue by downgrading the firmware. You'll just then need to wait for the new version, which will fix the bugs of the current version.

Unless you think that the firmware could have caused it to run and damage itself?

It's ridiculous that something which is so expensive, that the company is being an ass when you are just outside a year's warranty period. Surely the expectation is that is should run for more than a year?

Good luck

thanks. i'll have a look if i get it back, but i think the gimbal mechanism was pretty fecked by the pretty mad movement.

i'd completely accept if something fell off after the warranty or whatever, but it was completely fine before the firmware upgrade that they pushed and they are not acknowledging that at all.

ozmo

I used have a Phantom 3 S - I remember reading a fix for something that looks very like this - a little screw you need to make sure is tight. Maybe the new firmware is more affected by the screw being loose. I never upgraded mine as the newer firmwares had bad side effects on many peoples p3s.

Found a link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgeodPGqoaI&t=0s

ballsymchugh

thanks for that ozmo, if i get it back i'll have a look.

in the meantime, i got this reply this morning.

Hi there,

I have asked the Engineer and he says there was little you could have done to prevented it. He says that it is a manufacturers defect, he would have provided warranty were it not for the unfortunate localization issue.

If you have any other question I would be happy to assist.

Kind Regards,

DJI Support EU

baxtards.

L1011

They've admitted to a manufacturing defect there. I'm fairly certain the UK has two years protection for manufacturing defects?

ballsymchugh

L1011 wrote: »

They've admitted to a manufacturing defect there. I'm fairly certain the UK has two years protection for manufacturing defects?

they're saying that the drone is originally from the US. something i didn't know until they informed me. I had just bought it from Amazon's marketplace. in any case, it's utter sh!t that they won't fix a manufacturer's defect because of warranty issues.

L1011

You need to deal with the retailer on Amazon then - or Amazon themselves if it was fulfilled

ballsymchugh

L1011 wrote: »

You need to deal with the retailer on Amazon then - or Amazon themselves if it was fulfilled

I'm going to chance my arm with their north american support and if that fails, then amazon. out of interest, how would this be the problem of the retailer? it was in perfect working order before the last firmware update.

L1011

ballsymchugh wrote: »

I'm going to chance my arm with their north american support and if that fails, then amazon. out of interest, how would this be the problem of the retailer? it was in perfect working order before the last firmware update.

Retailer is the point of contact for consumer law in most territories. Additionally, they sold the US domestic market product to you here.

Additionally, Amazon are known for their customer care quality.

ED E

Its Amazon Marketplace - CS is the seller not Amazon.


The firmware update is a complex one. Not sure if youd find any case law on it. Not a DJI owner but AFAIK:
- Firmware updates are eventually mandatory
- The user has little interaction in the process

So under what would be considered "Normal Usage" firmware updates are day to day and goods should be designed to last for their designed use. Its not like you flashed it 200x.

The fact that the fora show only a small % of drones bricking would indicate to me that its a NAND failure. That weakness would be from the parts manufacture and thus would be present at the time of sale. A certain failure rate is normal so when a firmware update is pushed to 500k devices you'll normally see a thousand or so die.

Recourse with the seller is correct as they can return it to their distributor as dead and be refunded.

ballsymchugh

just an update on this. got the drone back from DJI unrepaired.

contacted the seller through amazon, turns out it was a chinese seller with a north american drone, and he has little to no interest in it. amazon weren't too bothered either, just asking if i'm happy with the replies from the seller.

so anyway, today i downgraded the firmware as Kathleen37 suggested, and straightened the gimbal as ozmo said, and it seems to be working fine!! hopefully it'll work fine when flying.

thanks for the suggestions.

kathleen37

Hope it's all ok.

lot of money to pay for such a rubbish service...

daheff

ballsymchugh wrote: »

just an update on this. got the drone back from DJI unrepaired.

contacted the seller through amazon, turns out it was a chinese seller with a north american drone, and he has little to no interest in it. amazon weren't too bothered either, just asking if i'm happy with the replies from the seller.

so anyway, today i downgraded the firmware as Kathleen37 suggested, and straightened the gimbal as ozmo said, and it seems to be working fine!! hopefully it'll work fine when flying.

thanks for the suggestions.

seems like its the firmware then

Be sure to get back to amazon to tell them and stick it on the other forum that was mentioned...even if its eventually deleted.