Common Application System - Secondary schools

Mango Joe

Hi All - I am just beginning to research this as our oldest is starting in 6th class this year and I am completely clueless on the intricacies and 'gotchas' involved.

For instance I have no clue re. deadlines and heard also that if you pick an over subscribed 1st choice and do not get it you are left in some sort of limbo/lottery/random allocation (not sure how true this is?)

I did find a previous thread on here but I think its very out of date now.

Could someone kindly advise how I may properly get up to speed here, thinking of boards threads, official websites or anything else at all including personal thoughts or your own family's experience - any help would be very much appreciated.

juneg

Boy or a girl and are you in the catchment area for any school?

judeboy101

Every school is legally obliged to have a detailed admissions policy. Make sure you read it that way no surprises. If not on website request a copy.

naughtysmurf

Generally speaking, every Secondary School has an entry & enrollment policy, usually if an applicant falls into one of the following categories they will get their first choice

If they have a sibling currently attending or a sibling who previously attended the school

If your family is a permanent resident of the same Parish as the school

The son or daughter of a staff member

The son or daughter of a past pupil

If your child doesn't fall into any of the above, it can become a bit of a lottery as regards where you are offered a place

You will get the best information from your child's current Principal, the school open nights will be in September & October, the dates will be in the local press, your current school will also probably supply these dates to you

From memory, the application form must be returned to your first choice school in January, not sure of exact date for 2018 again your current primary school should give you this information, don't miss the latest date for returning your application

skirteen

I've just been through this system, my child starts secondary school next week. An info pack will be given to all 6th class students before the end of September. It will explain the application system, give deadlines for applications and also a list of open nights for schools in the Common Application system. Most of the open nights take place in October, but keep an eye on the Leader and Post for a list in case your child's school is late giving out the info.
At the moment the only schools in Limerick with 'catchment areas' are Castletroy College and the new school in Mungret. County schools in areas like Kilmallock and Hospital must be applied to directly.
You must choose 9 schools even if you have no intention of sending your child to the school you put at 7, 8 or 9. Your child is not guaranteed their first choice, my child got third choice. You submit your application form to your first choice school, if they don't accept your child they will forward the application to the second choice and so on. Even if the child does not get their first choice you should accept the place offered and you can work on getting them their first choice, this is what we did. Otherwise your child has no school and you have to approach schools individually. They are under no obligation to accept your child if they have been offered a school and turned it down.
If you have a particular school in mind for your child my advice is to pursue it to the best of your ability. I have heard of parents submitting a portfolio of their child's reports, projects, references and standardised test results with the application.
Best of luck, it's a horrible system, especially if your child doesn't get their first choice.

waggs

The system is puportedly random but that's rubbish. Why would a school principal make time to meet with hundreds of potential parents if it wasn't to vet the students. Some schools definitely do this although some don't - simply because the demand is so high (I think it's very hard to get a meeting at the Comp but I believe they have their own way of selecting their students - donations and rugby skills are a great help).
If you favour a particular school then do your very best to make personal contact with the principal and meet with them in person.

I know the year my child went to secondary - the only two girls in her school not to get a place in Laurel Hill were also the only two whose parents had not met with the principal.

Unfortunately you have to lick ass if you want to be sure to get your first choice.

HurlingRanker

There's a particular school in the city where a proficiency at certain sports significantly enhances your chances of being "randomly" selected.

Mango Joe

Hi All,

Just wanted to say thanks for all of the help here - Will go over this in detail and hopefully all goes well.

- For the record I know of a few kids living a stones-throw from the Crescent Comprehensive who didn't get in and ended up on buses to Croom, Pallaskenry etc. which is so, so wrong on so many levels.....

Also for the record I know if plenty of ex-pupils who hated the school with a thorough passion due to perceived issues around snobbery, elitism etc so there you go.

ShatterProof

Is there anybody that oversees this system?

Can anybody point me in the direction of a website that might show all the open night together rather than having to visit each school site in the hope that they have pasted the information.

I've just found out the Gaelcholsaiste Luimnigh is Thursday night, don't wan to miss any.

Thanks.

juneg

It will be in the Limerick Post and the Limerick Leader. It will be posted to the primary schools. Your child should be given a photocopy of the list in school.
I checked the LCETB website. ( Marshall House , Dooradoyle ) They oversee the application process.
The list does not seem to be there. Might not be fully compiled yet?

Mango Joe

Can someone please fact-check something for me?

In this particular system it seems there's a very serious flaw that makes the whole lot very precarious - This is hard to explain but I'll try

Obviously there are popular and over subscribed choices due to status and location - If you have a first choice you need to, obviously, select it as number one.

However (and bear with me please!) sometimes you will pretty much know that you have a very slim chance of getting your idealistic first choice - Reasons including - too many applications, feeder schools, catchment area and so on.

But the catch is that for certain schools if you don't select them as first choice preference then you are guaranteed not to get them due to their selection criteria and volume of applications.

This ultimately has the very serious effect that your safety-net 2nd choice does not exist for practical purposes, it is just written off - In our case this means if we pick the ideal 1st choice school as no. 1, knowing there's only a small chance of getting in, then we are almost guaranteeing our child won't get into their local, nearby school - the logical option 2 - as this school is only taking in all of the number 1 choices submitted and so then the poor child ends up on a bus to a school miles away with none of their friends or former classmates for the next 6 years!!!

db

That is the dilemma everyone faces if they don't have right of entry to a school. It's up to you whether you take that risk with your child. It is very unlikely you will get your second choice school unless you put it down no 1 so you will end up in the school noone else want to go to.

Mango Joe

Yeah - But isn't it just a very primitive, crude and rudimentary system.

You would think that given that its in the academic sphere in the first place we could rise to a more refined, measured and capable means of getting this job done.

- At the very least and in all fairness the people who conceived of this mess and run it annually deserve all credit and recognition for their stupidity

juneg

Yup. That about sums it up. That is the reason why a new secondary school was set up in mungret last year. The children who live in the locality will have right of entry. There will be a new school in castletroy as well apparently. This will surely help to take the pressure off.

juneg

Mango Joe wrote: »

Yeah - But isn't it just a very primitive, crude and rudimentary system.

You would think that given that its in the academic sphere in the first place we could rise to a more refined, measured and capable means of getting this job done.

- At the very least and in all fairness the people who conceived of this mess and run it annually deserve all credit and recognition for their stupidity

This system was instigated by Noel Dempsey when he was Minister for education. There were a number of boys who didn't get a secondary school place( mainly because they hadn't applied for any!) and this was introduced to make sure everyone was offered a place somewhere. It was all over RTE that Summer. Educational disadvantage and elitism in Limerick schools etc. Previously you'd apply to all the schools separately and get a few offers, one offer or no offers. Children had to sit an entrance exam before, yes before they were allocated a place. This CAO was originally only for the city schools but after a few years they pulled in pallaskenry and croom as well. That's the original story.

naughtysmurf

Mango Joe wrote: »

But the catch is that for certain schools if you don't select them as first choice preference then you are guaranteed not to get them due to their selection criteria and volume of applications.

Pretty much, last year, if you put St Munchins, Ard Scoil, Ard Scoil Mhuire, Laurel Hill, Castletroy College or Crescent Comp as your second choice, the chances of getting a place would have been slim, there may be a better chance now with Crescent & Laurel Hill with the opening of Mungret

I know of a case personally where a parent bombarded a principal with calls & got her child into her first choice school two months into the school year after getting a place in Croom, refused to accept that, got the child started in another city school first, then into first choice so got there in the end but the system is beyond terrible

mom2

Can someone advise me on this, my son has applied for his first choice school but has changed his mind what is the process to change it? Do i just apply to the new school and ask to withdraw the form from the previous school. ?

juneg

mom2 wrote: »

Can someone advise me on this, my son has applied for his first choice school but has changed his mind what is the process to change it? Do i just apply to the new school and ask to withdraw the form from the previous school. ?

Pretty much. You have to request the form back from your first choice school and re apply to your new first choice school

mom2

juneg wrote: »

Pretty much. You have to request the form back from your first choice school and re apply to your new first choice school

Thanks, do i need to inform the new school that we originally had applied to a different school. ?

naughtysmurf

mom2 wrote: »

Thanks, do i need to inform the new school that we originally had applied to a different school. ?

I'd just request the form back, correct it & submit it to your new first choice school, you're not required to do anything else

mom2

naughtysmurf wrote: »

I'd just request the form back, correct it & submit it to your new first choice school, you're not required to do anything else

Thanks all sorted now waiting game 😯