Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

Mitch Connor

bangkok wrote: »

Keeping it realistic.

Massive game for us

So Tottenham are really good, will be a really tough game and we should all be totally gutted if we don't win?

bangkok

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So Tottenham are really good, will be a really tough game and we should all be totally gutted if we don't win?

If we lose its the end of our title chances imo

VW 1

Nalz wrote:

Is that a question without a question mark?

Well played sir.

Lord TSC

Kane has scored 13 of Spurs 27 goals this season, just under half. Alli has 5 and Erikson has three. Those two are dangerous, but it still doesn't change the fact Spurs without Kane are significantly weaker. I'd be much more confident against them now than before. Mark Alli out of the game and they are significantly weaker.

bennyineire

bangkok wrote: »

If people are happy with a draw tomorrow at home to spurs, we can forget about a title challenge

Eh regardless of the result tomorrow you can forget about a title challenge.

But in all fairness is there anything in Mourinho's history to suggest that he won't play for a draw ?

bangkok

bennyineire wrote: »

Eh regardless of the result tomorrow you can forget about a title challenge.

But in all fairness is there anything in Mourinho's history to suggest that he won't play for a draw ?

Lol

pjohnson

bennyineire wrote: »

Eh regardless of the result tomorrow you can forget about a title challenge.

But in all fairness is there anything in Mourinho's history to suggest that he won't play for a draw ?

Some clubs could only dream of being able to draw with Tottenham.

Giggsy11

bucketybuck wrote: »

And if we do? If its Darmian in defence and the grafters in midfield again? If its level at 60 mins and we see the game out is that acceptable?

I'm just curious what people expect and demand, because the before and after seemed to change for many people when it came to the Liverpool match.

At home against Spurs who are missing Harry Kane I would demand that United bring the game to them, focus on actually scoring goals rather than playing tight and hoping that one falls their way. Of course I expected the same against Liverpool who were in horrible form and who had an atrocious defence, but some people seemed to think after the fact that that was unrealistic.

What if Darmian plays? Does that automatically means it's defensive?

We have only 2 fit midfielders, Matic and Herrera, so we don't even have any other options.

I expect 3 points and anything apart from 3 points is a disappointing result. I don't know what or whom you are talking about, before Liverpool game I said draw is a good result. Spurs, City trashing Liverpool doesn't change anything as it was home game for Spurs and City.

We can only go by what we have seen already, we haven't played any game defensively at home in the league, not even under Jose. So I don't have any reason to believe tomorrow that will change.

DM_7

What is wrong with grafters anyway?

This weekend I want to see the team graft, cut off spaces, stop runs, dominate the contact part of the game. That should all be there v Spurs. A team working hard does not mean they only sit deep and let the other team attack them at will, give them easy ball.

Grafters can also be the reason a side wins the ball high up the field or in midfield, a strong defender can quickly win it when the other team try to get forward at pace.

bucketybuck

Giggsy11 wrote: »

What if Darmian plays? Does that automatically means it's defensive?

You know well what it means, you are no fool and we have seen plenty of examples of it.

We had a great run of form and some great attacking football. We had Young playing at left back and getting himself forward and we had both Mata and Mkhitaryan in midfield providing creativity. Then the lineup for Liverpool was announced and the first thing I said in here was that it worried me, because I could what was coming a mile away. Darmian was there to be more defensively solid than Young, and Young was now in midfield to be more defensively solid than Mata. We had been great offensively and they had been abject defensively, the opportunity was there act on that but instead we had ceded that advantage before a ball was even kicked.

Darmian has repeatedly been brought in when Jose wants to keep things tighter at the back, the likes of Young or Lingard repeatedly play ahead of Mata or Martial when he values workrate ahead of creativity in midfield. It never guarantees a bus is being parked but it certainly informs us as to his mindset.

StringerBell

Can't see Jose setting up overly defensive at home. If this was away obviously I'd be expecting a safety first hit them on the break tactical approach, but at home I would be surprised.

adox

Kane missing is a massive boost for Utd. Of course they aren’t a one man team but it’s huge for both teams really. Let’s hooe we can take full advantage.

Bret Hart

https://www.google.ie/amp/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-5024793/amp/Manchester-United-two-time-world-club-champions.html

2 times,la.

Lukker-

StringerBell wrote: »

Can't see Jose setting up overly defensive at home. If this was away obviously I'd be expecting a safety first hit them on the break tactical approach, but at home I would be surprised.

Prepare for a surprise. (Not sure if it's possible :P)

Giggsy11

bucketybuck wrote: »

You know well what it means, you are no fool and we have seen plenty of examples of it.

We had a great run of form and some great attacking football. We had Young playing at left back and getting himself forward and we had both Mata and Mkhitaryan in midfield providing creativity. Then the lineup for Liverpool was announced and the first thing I said in here was that it worried me, because I could what was coming a mile away. Darmian was there to be more defensively solid than Young, and Young was now in midfield to be more defensively solid than Mata. We had been great offensively and they had been abject defensively, the opportunity was there act on that but instead we had ceded that advantage before a ball was even kicked.

Darmian has repeatedly been brought in when Jose wants to keep things tighter at the back, the likes of Young or Lingard repeatedly play ahead of Mata or Martial when he values workrate ahead of creativity in midfield. It never guarantees a bus is being parked but it certainly informs us as to his mindset.

Still you are missing home and away. We were away to Liverpool so Jose went for defensive game. At home we won't.

Also playing Darmian doesn't mean defensive football. You can nullify one threat by playing defensive player and still play attacking football. Also Spurs played with 3 CBs, 2 wingbacks, 2 defensively strong players still played attacking football. Sometimes you can play defensive player to give more stability to attacking players.

Liam O

bucketybuck wrote: »

You know well what it means, you are no fool and we have seen plenty of examples of it.

We had a great run of form and some great attacking football. We had Young playing at left back and getting himself forward and we had both Mata and Mkhitaryan in midfield providing creativity. Then the lineup for Liverpool was announced and the first thing I said in here was that it worried me, because I could what was coming a mile away. Darmian was there to be more defensively solid than Young, and Young was now in midfield to be more defensively solid than Mata. We had been great offensively and they had been abject defensively, the opportunity was there act on that but instead we had ceded that advantage before a ball was even kicked.

Darmian has repeatedly been brought in when Jose wants to keep things tighter at the back, the likes of Young or Lingard repeatedly play ahead of Mata or Martial when he values workrate ahead of creativity in midfield. It never guarantees a bus is being parked but it certainly informs us as to his mindset.

United lost to Huddersfield last week with the attacking maestro Young playing LB. I don't think anyone other than Rashford has played over Martial this season in their position and Lingard has started one league game as far as I remember. Young has also only played one game in midfield.

Jose has and always will play defensively in tough away games. Some of the stuff above is bollocks though.

secman

A huge amount of united fans had and still have reservations about Mourinho tactics and its also bollocks to suggest otherwise. We just have to see how his stint pans out. The tactics against Liverpool were pathetic and sad to watch from my and many many other united fans point of view.
I'll always love united but I'll most likely always dislike Mourinho for various reasons too.
Anyways I'm hoping we play well today and get the win and without parking a bus .

Lord TSC

I'm sorry, but no one is going to convince me the tactics were wrong against Pool, on paper. Liverpools entire Plan A revolves around teams letting them counter attack, letting their speed murder them. They struggle with "negative" teams who hit THEM on the counter.

The issue came when he players couldn't launch a proper counter attack; Mkhi went missing, Lukaku got isolated and the wingers weren't able to get going at all. Because they weren't able to launch a proper counter on the field, they never tested Pools ****ty defence.

Anyone who wants points at Pool this year will go with a tight back line and a counter attack system. That's how Pool will get muddled in mid table this year.

The tactics were correct for that game. The issue was failures on the players parts, compounded by a missing midfield as well.

Big game, big match thread required!

bucketybuck

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Still you are missing home and away.

I'm not missing anything about home and away, I just don't believe that things are as simplistic as home=good, away =bad. People keep saying "but we were away" as if it means far more than it should.

Lord TSC wrote: »

I'm sorry, but no one is going to convince me the tactics were wrong against Pool, on paper.

My complaint about that game has actually been far more about the mentality and attitude imparted to those players, than it has the tactics. I believe that the manager took a team in good attacking form and metaphorically put the brakes on them. I believe his selections and instructions to be more defensively conscious resulted in a team of weak characters being far more cautious than they needed to be, that it disrupted their form and style of play and that they didn't know how to get it going again.

Liam O wrote: »

Some of the stuff above is bollocks though.

Nice.

And yet from the minute it happened United's play in that game and subsequent games went into the ****ing toilet. Just coincidence right?

Lord TSC

bucketybuck wrote: »

My complaint about that game has actually been far more about the mentality and attitude imparted to those players, than it has the tactics. I believe that the manager took a team in good attacking form and metaphorically put the brakes on them. I believe his selections and instructions to be more defensively conscious resulted in a team of weak characters being far more cautious than they needed to be, that it disrupted their form and style of play and that they didn't know how to get it going again.

But again then, that to me says more about the players than the manager. If a manager asks you to adjust to suit the opposition you're facing, and you shut down as a result and become too scared to counter properly, that's on you, not the manager.

Again I say, away to Pool, you have to be more defensively cautious. Thats not to say "park the bus", btw (not aimed at you here, just in general). Being cautious should not mean an inability to get a counter attack going, and being cautious is absolutely the path you have to take against Klopp's mad style of attacking football.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

My complaint about that game has actually been far more about the mentality and attitude imparted to those players, than it has the tactics. I believe that the manager took a team in good attacking form and metaphorically put the brakes on them. I believe his selections and instructions to be more defensively conscious resulted in a team of weak characters being far more cautious than they needed to be, that it disrupted their form and style of play and that they didn't know how to get it going again.


Nice.

And yet from the minute it happened United's play in that game and subsequent games went into the ****ing toilet. Just coincidence right?

I have asked you multiple times to address the form of both Miki and Herrera here being a contributing factor, you cannot simple boil it down to Jose suddenly switching tactics and both those players suddenly playing turgid awful football because of it.

Both players have not been playing well for multiple games now, going as far back as when Pogba and fellani became unavailable for selection

This was in games where we still won with high scores but those scores glossed over their individual performances, more specifically Miki

bucketybuck

Lord TSC wrote: »

But again then, that to me says more about the players than the manager. If a manager asks you to adjust to suit the opposition you're facing, and you shut down as a result and become too scared to counter properly, that's on you, not the manager.

But he needs to know his players and he should have known to be very careful about disrupting that vein of form that the players had found. Its not like they haven't struggled like this before, the last third of last season being a perfect example. We have a weak squad of players but we knew that two weeks ago and so I don't accept that the manager has no influence on the **** show that followed. The players were dirt, but the genesis of that dirt came from the lineup and team talk, in my opinion.

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I have asked you multiple times to address the form of both Miki and Herrera here being a contributing factor, you cannot simple boil it down to Jose suddenly switching tactics and both those players suddenly playing turgid awful football because of it.

You have asked me multiple times? Directly?

I'm not sure I could have posted any more of my opinions on our players to be honest, its only a few months since people had an issue with me saying that we needed to ship another 6/7 of them out the door. I have repeatedly pointed out that Martial goes missing in games, that Mata is a weak character who never stepped up and led the team during the dark Moyes/Van Gaal days. That Lingard will never be more than solid and that Young has next to zero end product. That Valencia ****s up our attacking proficiency on the right and that we have nothing from the left. That Mkhitaryan is just another Mata, waiting for somebody else to do the heavy lifting. That Rashford is a long way from being a finished article and still doesn't have the productivity that we need from or first team attackers.

No, I am well aware of the deficiencies in our squad and I have spoken of them dozens of times. I don't need to point out the obvious when it came to that game. I'd rather ask why the manager created a situation where those weak characters who struggle to adapt and take control of games had to adapt their game and then couldn't get control back.

Giggsy11

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'm not missing anything about home and away, I just don't believe that things are as simplistic as home=good, away =bad. People keep saying "but we were away" as if it means far more than it should.

Yeah, after watching football all these years you still think there isn't a big difference playing at home and away?

secman

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Yeah, after watching football all these years you still think there isn't a big difference playing at home and away?

Against 80% of teams in PL it's irrelevant

Mr.Crinklewood

Bailly back.

xtal191

https://twitter.com/ManUtd/status/924221758105968640

Giggsy11

secman wrote: »

Against 80% of teams in PL it's irrelevant

It's not. Also Liverpool doesn't come in that 80%.

secman

Looks a decent line up, hopefully positive attitude prevails

Trigger

I have no idea what is going on in that line up either it’s 352 or 4231 with Bailly rb and Valencia LB

Giggsy11

astradave wrote: »

I have no idea what is going on in that line up either it’s 352 or 4231 with Bailly rb and Valencia LB

I think it's obvious 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2

adox

Miki a lucky man to be picked. Guess he’s lucky his main competition Mata hasn’t been up to much.

I’m always confident against Spurs at home. Delighted to see Bailly back. Would be worried about the midfield though. Hopefully three at the back to compensate somewhat.

Nalz

6 at the back. 3 at the front of the back. Lukaku driving the bus and it's live!

What?

wanderer100

Miki Ryan has got to turn up today. Feel Lingard or Martial deserve his spot on the team more right now

Mitch Connor

wanderer100 wrote: »

Miki Ryan has got to turn up today. Feel Lingard or Martial deserve his spot on the team more right now

Lingard maybe, but the formation will see Miki central I guess so martial wouldn't fit there.

Given we don't have Pogba, fellaini, Carrick and we didn't get the full back Jose wanted I'm not sure what other formation and selections Jose could have gone for this week.

S.M.B.

Giggsy11 wrote: »

I think it's obvious 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2

I'm hoping it's the later with Rashford playing a lot closer to lukaku and not having to spend so much time in his own half defending like at anfield.

Mitch Connor

Giggsy11 wrote: »

I think it's obvious 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2

On paper yiu could maybe argue it will be 3412, but given history I would guess it will look a lot closer to 5212, like vs Liverpool.

I worry the ball carrying and ball playing from the back 3 is too poor to play this formation.

Quandary

Herrera will need a big performance today if we are to do well I feel. We need to see a return to last years performance levels from him. Mkhitaryan too will need a massively improved performance for us to have any joy here.

we are very very fortunate that Kane is out injured.

Here hoping we can get 3 points, although the pessimist in me keeps my hopes low.

Probably a dour 1-1 draw.

wanderer100

Feel like we really need to win this if we are serious about a title challenge. Lose today and we could be 3rd and possibly 8 points behind City

0gac3yjefb5sv7

I'd rather go for it and lose than draw today. No points is as good as 1 at stage of the season.

Pheonix10

Pheonix10 wrote: »

I'd rather go for it and lose than draw today. No points is as good as 1 at stage of the season.

Things have changed if this is the mentality lads!
The Liverpool thread is > way

0gac3yjefb5sv7

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Things have changed if this is the mentality lads!
The Liverpool thread is > way

It's Spurs at home. City will beat them at the Etihad we need 3 points. Difference is Liverpool are **** and try it every week.

Quandary

Getting a win here would be great and all, but we seriously need to start seeing some of our players stepping up to the plate and producing at the very very least a competent performance.

After his recent run of abysmal performances, starting Mkhitaryan is a huge show of faith by Mourinho in his player. I hope he produces for us because it's like we are playing with 10 men when he goes missing n games.

Lord TSC

Pheonix10 wrote: »

I'd rather go for it and lose than draw today. No points is as good as 1 at stage of the season.

Disagree with the sentiment, given his is a six pointer no matter when it's played...

S.M.B.

S.M.B. wrote: »

I'm hoping it's the later with Rashford playing a lot closer to lukaku and not having to spend so much time in his own half defending like at anfield.

Rashford gets onto flick on from a long ball up to lukaku. Happy with that.

Lord TSC

Good start, gotten inside twice, just missing that final killer ball.

J. Marston

Such a difference between Young and Valencia there.

Young takes on one of the best fullbacks in the league and skins him, ball goes over to Valencia, who pauses and passes it backwards.

Who was the minutes silence for? Listening on 5 Live and missed out who it was for!

RobbingBandit

Crowd is quiet

Lord TSC

zorro2566 wrote: »

Who was the minutes silence for? Listening on 5 Live and missed out who it was for!

Think they said it's the last game at OT this side of rememberence day so did the silence today for it.