Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

S.M.B.

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

We've thrown money and the most successful managers in the world at it and nothing much has changed since Fergie left. People might say give Jose's plan time but clubs with the money we have usually don't need time. I did wonder about Jose's transfer policy this summer; he seemed to think the squad needed tinkering, like you would do to freshen an already title-winning squad. It clearly needed more.

Money isn't always enough and even though we have spent it over teams have been able to outspend us.

It's difficult to know how Fergie would be handling things given the current competition.

There's clearly issues with the squad and it's hard to tell if José is getting the most out of the players but things are still better than they were 18/24 months ago.

Maybe José isn't going to be the one who brings another era if success to united but I don't see any problems continuing as long as he's moving things in the right direction.

Lord TSC

bangkok wrote: »

Wouldnt be surprised if bookies paid out on title now. League is over

Usually I'd have to pay for Pornhub Premium to see the level of fellatio on the display that some have in here for City....

Is there not enough to discuss today without the City Love-in you are so desperate to present.

castletownman

Rashford's corners are like Kevin Spacey in a bar.

Always drift towards the first man

Scandalous

Rossi IRL

astradave wrote: »

Thank **** for Call of Duty

It's the only this to cure it........ Are the servers back up?

Rossi IRL

Rossi IRL wrote: »

It's the only this to cure it........ Are the servers back up?

Yep

pjohnson

Rekop dog wrote: »

You've scored the most goals from set pieces this season and conceded the second least from them. But yeah awful lol.

Ah thats because you rely on statistics. Did you actually watch the game or rely on whoscored to tell you whats going on?

IamtheWalrus

pjohnson wrote: »

Well we are relying on De Gea not to suddenly have a bad season? Most clubs in the league rely on certain key players not to suddenly turn to sh*te. How many clubs expect thier player of the year to suddenly forget how to play? Did you?

It may not be expected but you cover all eventualities. We're not talking about a Ronaldo-bracket player here. It would be a lame excuse to lose a title based on a injured goal keeper.

limnam

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Don't worry about it. Sure if you just remove the goals and points City got today then not much has changed for us.

Clever.

If you remove stones. DeB and aguero

Are they where they're now?

No.

That's what we're dealing with currently.

pjohnson

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

It may not be expected but you cover all eventualities. We're not talking about a Ronaldo-bracket player here.

So do you think we should sign maybe Lloris to cover in case De Gea gets injured? Just saw your edit. You do think that. Right. Football Manager Galacticos indeed.

pjohnson

Lord TSC wrote: »

Usually I'd have to pay for Pornhub Premium to see the level of fellatio on the display that some have in here for City....

Is there not enough to discuss today without the City Love-in you are so desperate to present.

They were waiting for this moment.

Rekop dog

pjohnson wrote: »

Ah thats because you rely on statistics. Did you actually watch the game or rely on whoscored to tell you whats going on?

What?? You came out with a ludicrously inaccurate statement. But continue, don't let reality get in the way of a good rant.

deaddonkey15

limnam wrote: »

Clever.

If you remove stones. DeB and aguero

Are they where they're now?

No.

That's what we're dealing with currently.

Are you mocking yourself here? Because it looks like it.

Lithium93_

bangkok wrote: »

Wouldnt be surprised if bookies paid out on title now. League is over

Oh would you PLEASE SHUT THE **** UP ABOUT MANCHESTER ****ING CITY.

S.M.B.

limnam wrote: »

Clever.

If you remove stones. DeB and aguero

Are they where they're now?

No.

That's what we're dealing with currently.

Are we missing the entire spine of our team through injury? Or you mean "remove" as in some of our players are plays are playing so poorly you may as well remove them?

irishfeen

I know the loss is sickening but we are still in 2nd with Chelsea (A), Spurs, Liverpool (A) all played.

Next 5 - with the international break hopefully Pogba, Rojo, Fellani will all be back fit and raring to go.

Newcastle (H)
Brighton (H)
Watford (A)
Arsenal (A)
City (H)

pjohnson

Rekop dog wrote: »

What?? You came out with a ludicrously inaccurate statement. But continue, don't let reality get in the way of a good rant.

Your stats tell you United are the best in the league at set pieces. Anyone who watched United will know that repeatedly corners have failed to beat the first man.

limnam

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Are you mocking yourself here? Because it looks like it.

I saw what you did.

It was funny.

Now.

We're missing our best mid. One of our best defenders of last year.

our top scorer last year.

If you remove the same from the city side, are they where they're now?

No they're most likely not.

This is what united are dealing with right now.

It's been put to you all ready, when the manager played a way he felt we could get points. You and a few others whine about it.

When they try to go out more attacking and get beat, you whine about it.

You're dutch rudder with city is bloody tiring.

pjohnson

limnam wrote: »

I saw what you did.

It was funny.

Now.

We're missing our best mid. One of our best defenders of last year.

our top scorer last year.

If you remove the same from the city side, are they where they're now?

No they're most likely not.

This is what united are dealing with right now.

It's been put to you all ready, when the manager played a way he felt we could get points. You and a few others whine about it.

When they try to go out more attacking and get beat, you whine about it.

You're dutch rudder with city is bloody tiring.

Basically we should put on a blue jersey. That'll cheer them up.

limnam

S.M.B. wrote: »

Are we missing the entire spine of our team through injury? Or you mean "remove" as in some of our players are plays are playing so poorly you may as well remove them?

We're missing our strongest mid. Pogba

Our top goal scorer of last season Ibra

and one of our best defenders of last year. Rojo

I'm making the point to the city love-in if city lost the same, would they be where they're now?

Unlikely.

Rekop dog

pjohnson wrote: »

Your stats tell you United are the best in the league at set pieces. Anyone who watched United will know that repeatedly corners have failed to beat the first man.

It's a fine line to get the correct trajectory. But they've done it more than anyone in the league and your assertion that they're awful at them is hilariously wrong. But keep on digging.

pjohnson

Rekop dog wrote: »

It's a fine line to get the correct trajectory. But they've done it more than anyone in the league and your assertion that they're awful at them is hilariously wrong. But keep on digging.

Its really not but might be beyond you. We may score more than others but since you like stats run on now and find out the set piece conversion rate and you might understand. Good lad.

castletownman

Lads can choose to ignore all they want, and they are entiled to, but jaysus how anyone can't see that City are a different gravy than United right now are deluded. Playing catch up already. Those in denial probably currently have the Owen winner on loop while listening to Stone Roses.

But I would not be surprised to advance further than them in the Champs League now that the PL already looks unattainable.

Trigger

Rossi IRL wrote: »

It's the only this to cure it........ Are the servers back up?

Never been down for me

castletownman

castletownman wrote: »

Lads can choose to ignore all they want, and they are entiled to, but jaysus how anyone can't see that City are a different gravy than United right now are deluded. Playing catch up already. Those in denial probably currently have the Owen winner on loop while listening to Stone Roses.

But I would not be surprised to advance further than them in the Champs League now that the PL already looks unattainable.

who has said city aren't playing better then us?

People are just sick to the back teeth of a few people constantly bringing them up in here.

castletownman

And City are missing possibly their best ever centre-back (to admittedly persistent injury. Sound familiar?), and a left back signed for big bucks that looked the real deal last year and impressed in his brief appearances so far.

And Gundongan isn't fully fit yet either

Red tinted glasses should be removed

deaddonkey15

limnam wrote: »

I saw what you did.

It was funny.

Now.

We're missing our best mid. One of our best defenders of last year.

our top scorer last year.

If you remove the same from the city side, are they where they're now?

No they're most likely not.

This is what united are dealing with right now.

It's been put to you all ready, when the manager played a way he felt we could get points. You and a few others whine about it.

When they try to go out more attacking and get beat, you whine about it.

You're dutch rudder with city is bloody tiring.

Come on. Ibrahimovic wasn't even a United player when the season started. Most would agree that Lukaku is our first choice. No way does Mourinho play them both away to teams like Chelsea and Liverpool. We're hardly missing him. Although we are probably missing his moments of magic and ability to get a goal from nowhere since none of our other players seem capable of doing that either individually or as a unit lately. If Aguero isn't scoring for City (and he hasn't even started some games) then Jesus, de Bruyne, Sterling will.

Rojo was crucified in here for ages. It was only towards the end of last season that he started playing out of his skin. No guarantee we'd be any better with him this season, especially when defending for the most past isn't really what's causing us problems. If Stones is out for City, Kompany, Danilo, Mangala can slot in.

Of course we are missing Pogba. City were missing Gundogan for a bit too. Maybe not quite as important for them, but an injury to deal with nonetheless.

There was no shortage of games last season in which Pogba played and we were poor and failed to win. But as always, absence makes the heart grow fonder.

I wouldn't say we were more attacking today, apart from the first 10 or 15 minutes. We had two shots on target. Chelsea had 8 - that's what I'd call attacking.

Lithium93_

Only 11 league games in, 27 more to go, in 2nd place, only 8 points behind City, it's not the end of the world/season, though reading some here who are gagging hard on City, you'd think the season was over.

Plenty of time to turn it around.

limnam

castletownman wrote: »

And City are missing possibly their best ever centre-back (to admittedly persistent injury. Sound familiar?), and a left back signed for big bucks that looked the real deal last year and impressed in his brief appearances so far.

And Gundongan isn't fully fit yet either

Red tinted glasses should be removed

Ah.

Your saying that losing their left back is the equivalent to llosing Kevin DeB?

or losing Augero for the first 7 months?

I like the cut of your jib.

Stick around.

Cantona's Collars

Our play today looked like we had 3 different sections of a team with nothing joining them together.
We do miss Pogba because at the moment we have nobody to run the play.Mikhi is too light to play in there and dictate things. Hazard is a similar build but to look at him holding a player off compared to Mikhitryan getting knocked down with every bump is damn annoying.
Neville was right today, Chelsea were making things happen while we were playing the ball up to the 3 lads up front and hoping they'd get a break.

Lord TSC

Conte on handshake, "It's not important, you have to earn respect on the pitch, not outside of it."

Could you imagine the press if Jose won and then refused a handshake like that...

limnam

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Come on. Ibrahimovic wasn't even a United player when the season started. Most would agree that Lukaku is our first choice. No way does Mourinho play them both away to teams like Chelsea and Liverpool. We're hardly missing him. Although we are probably missing his moments of magic and ability to get a goal from nowhere since none of our other players seem capable of doing that either individually or as a unit lately. If Aguero isn't scoring for City (and he hasn't even started some games) then Jesus, de Bruyne, Sterling will.

Rojo was crucified in here for ages. It was only towards the end of last season that he started playing out of his skin. No guarantee we'd be any better with him this season, especially when defending for the most past isn't really what's causing us problems. If Stones is out for City, Kompany, Danilo, Mangala can slot in.

Of course we are missing Pogba. City were missing Gundogan for a bit too. Maybe not quite as important for them, but an injury to deal with nonetheless.

There was no shortage of games last season in which Pogba played and we were poor and failed to win. But as always, absence makes the heart grow fonder.

I wouldn't say we were more attacking today, apart from the first 10 or 15 minutes. We had two shots on target. Chelsea had 8 - that's what I'd call attacking.

We "tried" to be attacking, there's a huge difference.

By trying we were open.

We were just not good enough today it was nothing to do "parking the bus" we tried and failed.

Huge difference.

How you can say we wouldn't miss our top goal scorer and one of the best strikers in the world.

Tiring.

limnam

Lord TSC wrote: »

Conte on handshake, "It's not important, you have to earn respect on the pitch, not outside of it."

Could you imagine the press if Jose won and then refused a handshake like that...

I thought he didn't shake when I saw him out on the pitch then I thought I must of missed it.

He shook his hand at the start seems strange he would refuse it at the end.

Cantona's Collars

limnam wrote: »

I thought he didn't shake when I saw him out on the pitch then I thought I must of missed it.

He shook his hand at the start seems strange he would refuse it at the end.

Jose shook hands with any Chelsea staff around,he was waiting for Conte who instead walked out onto the pitch to congratulate the players.It didn't seem like he blanked him on purpose

limnam

castletownman wrote: »

Lads can choose to ignore all they want, and they are entiled to, but jaysus how anyone can't see that City are a different gravy than United right now are deluded. Playing catch up already. e.

No one is saying they're not. we're just not ejaculating all over this thread about them.

There's a thread just for that very thing if it floats your boat.

uncleoswald

Lord TSC wrote: »

Conte on handshake, "It's not important, you have to earn respect on the pitch, not outside of it."

Could you imagine the press if Jose won and then refused a handshake like that...

Jose does it to himself, and for many many years has been given a free pass by a fawning press.

Tylerdurex

I can't see Zlatan not getting back into that team. I wonder is there any chance lukaku could play in one of the wide positions? The problem we have is that our forwards aren't good enough. I really don't get the praise rashford gets. He's a decent young player but he doesn't deserve the praise he gets.and we shouldn't be relying on him . Compare him to Michael Owen at the same age and it outs things into perspective Jose.is trying to create a team like his first Chelsea team but lukaku rashford and martial are no where near the quality of Drogba Robben and Duff. Even with pogba back we still lack a creative midfielder like verratti or kroos

limnam

Tylerdurex wrote: »

Jose.is trying to create a team like his first Chelsea team but lukaku rashford and martial are no where near the quality of Drogba Robben and Duff. Even with pogba back we still lack a creative midfielder like verratti or kroos

Duff? You're kidding right?

pjohnson

Aww it seems I scared Rekop Dog away. Ah well he seems to have realised his utter tripe was showing. Anywho I did this thinking he wouldn't hide but anyway I'll stivk it up. I only used sides that who scored said scored 4 or more set piece goals this year. The number of corners taken was from the Premier League site. While Rekop believes because United scored 6 goals we are automatically the best team at set pieces the actual statistics prove that we are not. Most people who actually watch football rather than rely on statistics would have known this already. Even from my limited sample its clear United are far from being the "best" set piece attackers in the league.

Team Goals (Corners) Conversion %

Stoke 5 (46) 10.87 %
Watford 5 (49) 10.2%
Leicester 5 (50) 10%
United 6 (73) 8.22%
Arsenal 5 (67) 7.46%
Chelsea 4 (58) 6.90%
Tottenham 5 (80) 6.25%
City 4 (73) 5.48%


Can we agree that if people are gunna try to use statistics can they at least try to use them competently?

PhlegmyMoses

uncleoswald wrote: »

Jose does it to himself, and for many many years has been given a free pass by a fawning press.

This just isn't true. Probably the most hated manager in football by fans and press alike. Has done many ****ty things in his career, but he does not get away with it.

It has been like going through the looking glass as a United fan and being privy to the Jose narrative. People can't discuss his career honestly.

S.M.B.

limnam wrote: »

We're missing our strongest mid. Pogba

Our top goal scorer of last season Ibra

and one of our best defenders of last year. Rojo

I'm making the point to the city love-in if city lost the same, would they be where they're now?

Unlikely.

I really don't want to be banging on about City as I get that its frustrating but I don't feel that's like for like.

The KdB for Pogba is probably a valid comparison but I don't agree with the others.

pjohnson

The above mini table does show how wasteful we are. With the height of our team and the amount of corners we should be reaping much more benefits.

Tylerdurex

limnam wrote: »

Duff? You're kidding right?

No I'm not . Do you even remember duff playing for Chelsea. He was class

deaddonkey15

limnam wrote: »

We "tried" to be attacking, there's a huge difference.

By trying we were open.

We were just not good enough today it was nothing to do "parking the bus" we tried and failed.

Huge difference.

I never said anything about parking the bus. 2 shots on target, only 1 of those came after we went behind. In form attackers kept on the bench whilst a woefully out of form and ineffective attacker starts. Over hit balls over the top to Rashford long balls to an isolated Lukaku. Yeah we really tried.

limnam wrote: »

How you can say we wouldn't miss our top goal scorer and one of the best strikers in the world.

Tiring.

Because he was fit and missing sitters in plenty of our 0-0s last season. Because if he was fit he'd likely have started on the bench. Because if he had somehow started today he would just have replaced Lukaku as our isolated striker feeding off low quality scraps and poor corners and handicapped by playing in front of Mkhitaryan.

Cantona's Collars

limnam wrote: »

Duff? You're kidding right?

Duff back then was a brilliant attacking player.

We have a midfield of destroyers but without a functional link to our attack the whole thing falls down. Bakayoko was meant to be this DM at Chelsea but seemed to be playing as a number 10 for large parts of the game today. Even our wide play was piss poor, getting into position and delaying so long we ended up going into traffic or losing the ball. Lukaku had decent movement but when did anyone deliver a decent cross that he could attack? Also, not once did our full backs create an overlap or 2 on 1 situation.

Tylerdurex

https://youtu.be/nsuEyYfeEJ0

S.M.B.

pjohnson wrote: »

Aww it seems I scared Rekop Dog away. Ah well he seems to have realised his utter tripe was showing. Anywho I did this thinking he wouldn't hide but anyway I'll stivk it up. I only used sides that who scored said scored 4 or more set piece goals this year. The number of corners taken was from the Premier League site. While Rekop believes because United scored 6 goals we are automatically the best team at set pieces the actual statistics prove that we are not. Most people who actually watch football rather than rely on statistics would have known this already. Even from my limited sample its clear United are far from being the "best" set piece attackers in the league.

Team Goals (Corners) Conversion %

City 4 (73) 18.25%
Tottenham 5 (80) 16%
Chelsea 4 (58) 14.5%
Arsenal 5 (67) 13.4%
United 6 (73) 12.17%
Leicester 5 (50) 10%
Watford 5 (49) 9.8%
Stoke 5 (46) 9.2 %


Can we agree that if people are gunna try to use statistics can they at least try to use them competently?

I must be missing something here or those figures don't add up.

How do we have a lower conversion rate than city when we scored more from the same amount of corners?

Edit: Apologies, bit of a brain fart from me I think. I'm just confused by the use of "conversion %". Assume it's score every X corners.

limnam

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

I never said anything about parking the bus. 2 shots on target, only 1 of those came after we went behind. In form attackers kept on the bench whilst a woefully out of form and ineffective attacker starts. Over hit balls over the top to Rashford long balls to an osilated Lukaku. Yeah we really tried.

I'm finding it hard to judge if it's your basic lack of understanding of what's been discussed, or you do it on purpose.

We're missing a key player who can fix most of the issues you're talking about above.

So you get this right? The player that can play the ball to Luka/rashford etc. who can link defense to the strikers.

You understand that he's not on the pitch? he's out? right?

Who's in form? martial ?

Every game he's started he was shocking....

Lindagrd?

Every game he's started everyone on here wanted him off the pitch?

Who are we talking about?

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Because he was fit and missing sitters in plenty of our 0-0s last season. Because if he was fit he'd likely have started on the bench. Because if he had somehow started today he would just have replaced Lukaku as our isolated striker feeding off low quality scraps and poor corners and handicapped by playing in front of Mkhitaryan.

And still managed to score a load of goals before getting injured.
Even when he was missing "sitters" he was linking up the play beautifully.
He has a winning mentality on the pitch he brings loads to the team

And again see above re pogba.

limnam

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Duff back then was a brilliant attacking player.

Sorry my memory was mostly of him beating a load of players and falling over.

Similar to marital then I guess. :pac:

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

We have a midfield of destroyers but without a functional link to our attack the whole thing falls down. Bakayoko was meant to be this DM at Chelsea but seemed to be playing as a number 10 for large parts of the game today. Even our wide play was piss poor, getting into position and delaying so long we ended up going into traffic or losing the ball. Lukaku had decent movement but when did anyone deliver a decent cross that he could attack? Also, not once did our full backs create an overlap or 2 on 1 situation.

Pogba is the link.

We've no replacment for him bar carrick and he's injured?

All the issues your describing IMO have nothing to do with mourhino's desicion on tactics

Players didn't perform today

Miki was rubbish and when mata's replaced him, he's been rubbish.

What do you do?

Play more defensivley and try a bit of countering?

No? why?

because the head of the fan club will want a word with you :rolleyes:

pjohnson

S.M.B. wrote: »

I must be missing something here or those figures don't add up.

How do we have a lower conversion rate than city when we scored more from the same amount of corners?

Edit: Apologies, bit of a brain fart from me I think. I'm just confused by the use of "conversion %". Assume it's score every X corners.

Arsebollocks. Excel code entered wrong way around. :pac:

deaddonkey15

limnam wrote: »

I'm finding it hard to judge if it's your basic lack of understanding of what's been discussed, or you do it on purpose.

We're missing a key player who can fix most of the issues you're talking about above.

So you get this right? The player that can play the ball to Luka/rashford etc. who can link defense to the strikers.

You understand that he's not on the pitch? he's out? right?

Who's in form? martial ?

Every game he's started he was shocking....

Lindagrd?

Every game he's started everyone on here wanted him off the pitch?

Who are we talking about?

Both of those players are more in form than Mkhitaryan.

limnam wrote: »

And still managed to score a load of goals before getting injured.
Even when he was missing "sitters" he was linking up the play beautifully.
He has a winning mentality on the pitch he brings loads to the team

And again see above re pogba.

We finished 6th with Ibrahimovic and Pogba regularly playing last season. You are going to be disappointed if you think a 36 year old just back from ACL reconstruction is going to win us games like today.